Agree, games like this usually are busted and forgotten after one month(look at SWTOR and TSW). I want a non-carebear game where I can spend at least 4-5 years of a long journey, epic pvps and drama. This game probably will be Lineage Eternal.
You know you are setting yourself up for a disapointment whenever a new game releases, right? That goal is impossible to achieve.
I don't even think such longterm games are good for the industry. But that is a topic for another thread.
What exactly is "impossible to achieve"? Many players have stayed with one game for 4-5 years.
The last I heard is that Everquest still has over 3,000 items/locations/quests that have yet to be discovered by players.
"I used to think the worst thing in life was to be all alone. It's not. The worst thing in life is to end up with people who make you feel all alone." Robin Williams
Agree, games like this usually are busted and forgotten after one month(look at SWTOR and TSW). I want a non-carebear game where I can spend at least 4-5 years of a long journey, epic pvps and drama. This game probably will be Lineage Eternal.
You know you are setting yourself up for a disapointment whenever a new game releases, right? That goal is impossible to achieve.
I don't even think such longterm games are good for the industry. But that is a topic for another thread.
What exactly is "impossible to achieve"? Many players have stayed with one game for 4-5 years.
The last I heard is that Everquest still has over 3,000 items/locations/quests that have yet to be discovered by players.
Players tend to quit the game because they get bored, not because they've finished it.
EDIT: Unless you have an OCD of some form, that is.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been-Wayne Gretzky
Agree, games like this usually are busted and forgotten after one month(look at SWTOR and TSW). I want a non-carebear game where I can spend at least 4-5 years of a long journey, epic pvps and drama. This game probably will be Lineage Eternal.
You know you are setting yourself up for a disapointment whenever a new game releases, right? That goal is impossible to achieve.
I don't even think such longterm games are good for the industry. But that is a topic for another thread.
What exactly is "impossible to achieve"? Many players have stayed with one game for 4-5 years.
The last I heard is that Everquest still has over 3,000 items/locations/quests that have yet to be discovered by players.
Players tend to quit the game because they get bored, not because they've finished it.
EDIT: Unless you have an OCD of some form, that is.
What percentage of those are bored because they finished?
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own. -- Herman Melville
It's the journey, as far as i'm concerned. I must agree, tho, that endgame content must be good, for a game to be great.
That's why i'll be picky as far as a triple A game goes. I'll restart in one of them where the comunity is big and endgame makes you wanna stay.
Cheers.
Nah .. i would say it is about fun gameplay. If leveling is fun, i will level. If the end-game is fun after leveling, i will play. Otherwise i will move onto other games.
One person has already reached the max-level in GW2 during the 3-day head-start. Granted he skipped through everything he could, undoubtedly exploited whatever he could, and crafted the last 20 levels or so with the help of is friends (they gathered all the mats), how does this make you feel?
Is the lenght of time you have to spend to reach the cap important and why?
How do you feel about games where the cap is practically unreachable (Eve)?
Gratz, he completed the tutorial. Every MMO vet knows the game starts at level cap.
Originally posted by Novusod Originally posted by QuirhidOne person has already reached the max-level in GW2 during the 3-day head-start. Granted he skipped through everything he could, undoubtedly exploited whatever he could, and crafted the last 20 levels or so with the help of is friends (they gathered all the mats), how does this make you feel?Is the lenght of time you have to spend to reach the cap important and why?How do you feel about games where the cap is practically unreachable (Eve)?
Gratz, he completed the tutorial. Every MMO vet knows the game starts at level cap.
Except in this instance, it has been repeated like some mantra that for GW2 in particular the game (endgame in particular) begins at level one. That "MMO vet" knowledge doesn't apply.
Of course it's a concern. It means the game's crap. Trivial and juvenile. It took a year of serious play to reach the level cap in EQ, and for good reason, the game was fun to the core. It wasn't a carrot-and-stick routine for children and the simple-minded. There were few rewards and you played to explore and challenge the world, of which you were only an insignificant part. The slightest mistake and hours of your time or all your things were gone. Guild Wars 2 is a pathetic shell of an RPG--don't forget it. A lesser of two evils? I'll let you grovel in the mud over your pauper's supper.
i hate lengthy leveling games! questing isn't fun to me. i like hitting max level asap so i can experience the better gameplay. that's why i see the want to rush.
No one should care how an individual spends thier time playing a game. To each their own. In fairness, GW2 is not really an MMO in the traditional sense with no monthly fee. If this had a subscription model I would be concerned they simply made the game too easy.
No one should care how an individual spends thier time playing a game. To each their own. In fairness, GW2 is not really an MMO in the traditional sense with no monthly fee. If this had a subscription model I would be concerned they simply made the game too easy.
Its actually harder than most MMOs I've played. Refreshingly so, I might add. But simply the time it takes to reach the cap has nothing to do whether the game is hard or easy, just that it takes time. I never could give any credit to people who had reached the max level in games such as Lineage 2, because I thought those games were mostly about the grind. P2P have an intrinsic motivation to make the game last as long as possible; thus, players are exposed to the maximum amount of grind and timesinks they can endure and still continue playing. In practice, everything is watered down.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been-Wayne Gretzky
No one should care how an individual spends thier time playing a game. To each their own. In fairness, GW2 is not really an MMO in the traditional sense with no monthly fee. If this had a subscription model I would be concerned they simply made the game too easy.
Its actually harder than most MMOs I've played. Refreshingly so, I might add. But simply the time it takes to reach the cap has nothing to do whether the game is hard or easy, just that it takes time. I never could give any credit to people who had reached the max level in games such as Lineage 2, because I thought those games were mostly about the grind. P2P have an intrinsic motivation to make the game last as long as possible; thus, players are exposed to the maximum amount of grind and timesinks they can endure and still continue playing. In practice, everything is watered down.
Glad to hear GW2 is giving you a challenge. I agree time is not the only factor that decides if something is easy or hard. That would be silly. You would be hard pressed to say that EQ was harder than say WOW just because of time. My point is that MMO's of the first generation were more difficult in overall gameplay/features, not just time. Most MMO's are watered down to the lowest common denominator to maximize profits. With today's MMO's designed around the solo player & not groups, the social aspect is missing from today's game design philosophy. Luckily there are a few companies who are trying to break the formula and bring back this important element back. /cheers to you in GW2.
On a side note:
This blog sums up my thoughts and many verteran MMOGamers alike.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
It matters. If power gamers can do it in 3 days then casual players will be finished too quick - although the crafting aspect of this may be distorting the perception. GW2 has multiple races and distinct classes so that will partially compensate as people try out the options but still. I'm trying to remember how fast raid guilds on new EQ servers could level. It was pretty fast iirc but nothing like 3 days even when they were levelling in shifts but my memory may be off.
One person has already reached the max-level in GW2 during the 3-day head-start. Granted he skipped through everything he could, undoubtedly exploited whatever he could, and crafted the last 20 levels or so with the help of is friends (they gathered all the mats), how does this make you feel?
Is the lenght of time you have to spend to reach the cap important and why?
How do you feel about games where the cap is practically unreachable (Eve)?
Gratz, he completed the tutorial. Every MMO vet knows the game starts at level cap.
Perhaps every MMO Vet post-WoW, but not in general.
Many of us who started in games that took months to hit cap, playing aggressively, know that the *journey* should be the important part of the game.
Somewhere along the line (post-WoW) this was lost. And MMORPGs are making it increasingly easy to make it to level cap, and then offering very little in regard to progression.
A good, solid, core system was lost ~ that did not feel like a grind. It was a journey. I know it was as much the people playing the games as it was the games themeselves.
I don't know. We veered off into left field and can't seem to find our way back. IMHO of course.
Comments
The last I heard is that Everquest still has over 3,000 items/locations/quests that have yet to be discovered by players.
Players tend to quit the game because they get bored, not because they've finished it.
EDIT: Unless you have an OCD of some form, that is.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
What percentage of those are bored because they finished?
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own.
-- Herman Melville
It's the journey, as far as i'm concerned. I must agree, tho, that endgame content must be good, for a game to be great.
That's why i'll be picky as far as a triple A game goes. I'll restart in one of them where the comunity is big and endgame makes you wanna stay.
Cheers.
I mean, really, does everyone remember the guys that got to max level first in WoW, in Rift, and in TSW?
yeah me either
The above is my personal opinion. Anyone displaying a view contrary to my opinion is obviously WRONG and should STHU. (neener neener)
-The MMO Forum Community
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None
Nah .. i would say it is about fun gameplay. If leveling is fun, i will level. If the end-game is fun after leveling, i will play. Otherwise i will move onto other games.
Gratz, he completed the tutorial. Every MMO vet knows the game starts at level cap.
Except in this instance, it has been repeated like some mantra that for GW2 in particular the game (endgame in particular) begins at level one. That "MMO vet" knowledge doesn't apply.
Of course it's a concern. It means the game's crap. Trivial and juvenile. It took a year of serious play to reach the level cap in EQ, and for good reason, the game was fun to the core. It wasn't a carrot-and-stick routine for children and the simple-minded. There were few rewards and you played to explore and challenge the world, of which you were only an insignificant part. The slightest mistake and hours of your time or all your things were gone. Guild Wars 2 is a pathetic shell of an RPG--don't forget it. A lesser of two evils? I'll let you grovel in the mud over your pauper's supper.
i hate lengthy leveling games! questing isn't fun to me. i like hitting max level asap so i can experience the better gameplay. that's why i see the want to rush.
No one should care how an individual spends thier time playing a game. To each their own. In fairness, GW2 is not really an MMO in the traditional sense with no monthly fee. If this had a subscription model I would be concerned they simply made the game too easy.
Its actually harder than most MMOs I've played. Refreshingly so, I might add. But simply the time it takes to reach the cap has nothing to do whether the game is hard or easy, just that it takes time. I never could give any credit to people who had reached the max level in games such as Lineage 2, because I thought those games were mostly about the grind. P2P have an intrinsic motivation to make the game last as long as possible; thus, players are exposed to the maximum amount of grind and timesinks they can endure and still continue playing. In practice, everything is watered down.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
Glad to hear GW2 is giving you a challenge. I agree time is not the only factor that decides if something is easy or hard. That would be silly. You would be hard pressed to say that EQ was harder than say WOW just because of time. My point is that MMO's of the first generation were more difficult in overall gameplay/features, not just time. Most MMO's are watered down to the lowest common denominator to maximize profits. With today's MMO's designed around the solo player & not groups, the social aspect is missing from today's game design philosophy. Luckily there are a few companies who are trying to break the formula and bring back this important element back. /cheers to you in GW2.
On a side note:
This blog sums up my thoughts and many verteran MMOGamers alike.
http://www.wolfsheadonline.com/mmos-were-originally-designed-to-be-shared-social-experiences/#d739a
Let's look at Darkfall. It's a failure. Your point is fininshed.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
It matters. If power gamers can do it in 3 days then casual players will be finished too quick - although the crafting aspect of this may be distorting the perception. GW2 has multiple races and distinct classes so that will partially compensate as people try out the options but still. I'm trying to remember how fast raid guilds on new EQ servers could level. It was pretty fast iirc but nothing like 3 days even when they were levelling in shifts but my memory may be off.
Perhaps every MMO Vet post-WoW, but not in general.
Many of us who started in games that took months to hit cap, playing aggressively, know that the *journey* should be the important part of the game.
Somewhere along the line (post-WoW) this was lost. And MMORPGs are making it increasingly easy to make it to level cap, and then offering very little in regard to progression.
A good, solid, core system was lost ~ that did not feel like a grind. It was a journey. I know it was as much the people playing the games as it was the games themeselves.
I don't know. We veered off into left field and can't seem to find our way back. IMHO of course.