Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
A sad state of affairs at Blizzard.....
Dru998
Member CommonPosts: 85
I was thinking of coming back to the game after I read the Under development page. It seemed like there was going to finally be some non-raid endgame content. That someone with a life could play HAH! read this
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?FN=wow-realm-test&T=87936&P=1.
It's just sad really. Such potential, tons of cash to work with and yet unoriginal monotone horse manure. Maybe one day Blizzard might hire someone with a brain to run their game
.
_____________________________________________________________________________________
Science has never proven that what we see in front of us is in fact real.
Comments
Agreed, I'm not too thrilled with this 'clarification'. I too was under the impression that added solo content was coming.
Don't get me wrong, I still really enjoy the 5, 10, 20, 40 member raid content, but there are plenty of times that I'd rather go off and play by myself. I'd contend that the majority of the playerbase don't belong to large raid guilds that can easily put together groups. There should be alternatives for the solo player.
Ico
Oh, cruel fate, to be thusly boned. Ask not for whom the bone bones. It bones for thee.
Well, if my calculations are correct, the speed with which Blizzard works should place new solo content to be released in early 2007.............
But let me assure you that content is on the way /em sighs at Blizzard
You're missing the point, Bama.
Even casual players have been able to max out a character or two by now, and yet the only content that Blizzard seems to be adding is aimed at large raid groups. The expansion isn't scheduled to be out until the game is two years old... that's an extraordinary amount of time for a successful MMO to go without a major addition of new content.
People might gripe about SOE's expansion flow, but it's hard to argue that it doesn't keep fresh content and something interesting always available for their games. WoW players might gripe about having to buy an expansion (they still gripe about having to pay to play), but it's what retains customers in an MMO. By the time their fresh content comes around there will be 2-3 more major releases of games to pull people away from WoW.
It's bad strategy to freely let those people go and hope you can lure them back in a year with an expansion.
It's really too bad that Blizzard has decided to make WoW a carbon copy of EQ. Yeah, that's right, EQ. Yep, it is better than EQ, but in the end the game is the same. Get enough of x faction, point, favor, whatever, then complete x quest(s), and then you and your raid can access Uber_Mob_01. Welcome to WoW's version of Scars of Velious. Yeap, SoV was a great expansion for EQ, but hey come on that was what? 2001?
I really wish WoW had evolved more than it looks like it is going to. It really is a great game, but spending the time and effort on things I did 4 years ago in EQ no longer interests me.
Did you read the thread posted at the top of the page? Nine pages of responses from people angry that there isn't more solo/casual content is a pretty strong and valid point, if you ask me. Consider that most casual players don't bother posting to forums, either, and that's a pretty serious issue that definitely matters.
The expansion is expected late 2006, which is what I believe they said when they announced that they were making one and is something I've seen reiterated in other places since. That's roughly November of next year, or two years after release.
There's nine pages of level 60 casual players in that thread who want more content for their level, and it's not forthcoming. That's after just less than a year... what's going to keep them there for another year?
I'm not a market strategist. I am a casual/solo player, though, and one that was reading this stuff to try and see if I wanted to go back and play this game or if something new was added. Most of these people are saying the same thing I was months ago... if something fun comes along as an alternative, well, it's not hard to see what I was suggesting in my first post.
You can't lure casual and solo players in with the casual/solo experience they were looking for and then expect them to raid and do something they never wanted to begin with just because that's what is there. The game is popular because of hype that it's fun and different; when it stops being fun and different and starts being a different EQ raiding game...
They've got something special. I think they'd be surprised at just how much of a positive response they'd get if they showed just how much could be done for solo/casual players in an MMO. So would a lot of other developers, if they just freaking tried it; WoW is a lot of people's first MMO, which would suggest that that is because they didn't do what every other one did before it... yet, that's where they're headed with all the new content.
It does matter. Having 4 million customers is incredible, but keeping them would be absolutely insane. They're not going to this way (except in Asia, they've shown they love this stuff more than we do).
Did you read the thread posted at the top of the page? Nine pages of responses from people angry that there isn't more solo/casual content is a pretty strong and valid point, if you ask me. Consider that most casual players don't bother posting to forums, either, and that's a pretty serious issue that definitely matters.
The expansion is expected late 2006, which is what I believe they said when they announced that they were making one and is something I've seen reiterated in other places since. That's roughly November of next year, or two years after release.
There's nine pages of level 60 casual players in that thread who want more content for their level, and it's not forthcoming. That's after just less than a year... what's going to keep them there for another year?
I'm not a market strategist. I am a casual/solo player, though, and one that was reading this stuff to try and see if I wanted to go back and play this game or if something new was added. Most of these people are saying the same thing I was months ago... if something fun comes along as an alternative, well, it's not hard to see what I was suggesting in my first post.
You can't lure casual and solo players in with the casual/solo experience they were looking for and then expect them to raid and do something they never wanted to begin with just because that's what is there. The game is popular because of hype that it's fun and different; when it stops being fun and different and starts being a different EQ raiding game...
They've got something special. I think they'd be surprised at just how much of a positive response they'd get if they showed just how much could be done for solo/casual players in an MMO. So would a lot of other developers, if they just freaking tried it; WoW is a lot of people's first MMO, which would suggest that that is because they didn't do what every other one did before it... yet, that's where they're headed with all the new content.
It does matter. Having 4 million customers is incredible, but keeping them would be absolutely insane. They're not going to this way (except in Asia, they've shown they love this stuff more than we do).
You obviously didnt follow much of what I wrote. First off My response was to the OP to begin with. And second he called this game basically trash and the guys at Bliz retards. So that being said, my response was to his statement. The game is not trash and the guys at blizz arent idiots. They do know what they are doing.
Anyways that being said....yeah you could add some solo content or blah blah blah. Im sure in time they will. If they dont the game is still good overall.....and that was MY point.
Did you read the thread posted at the top of the page? Nine pages of responses from people angry that there isn't more solo/casual content is a pretty strong and valid point, if you ask me. Consider that most casual players don't bother posting to forums, either, and that's a pretty serious issue that definitely matters.
The expansion is expected late 2006, which is what I believe they said when they announced that they were making one and is something I've seen reiterated in other places since. That's roughly November of next year, or two years after release.
There's nine pages of level 60 casual players in that thread who want more content for their level, and it's not forthcoming. That's after just less than a year... what's going to keep them there for another year?
I'm not a market strategist. I am a casual/solo player, though, and one that was reading this stuff to try and see if I wanted to go back and play this game or if something new was added. Most of these people are saying the same thing I was months ago... if something fun comes along as an alternative, well, it's not hard to see what I was suggesting in my first post.
You can't lure casual and solo players in with the casual/solo experience they were looking for and then expect them to raid and do something they never wanted to begin with just because that's what is there. The game is popular because of hype that it's fun and different; when it stops being fun and different and starts being a different EQ raiding game...
They've got something special. I think they'd be surprised at just how much of a positive response they'd get if they showed just how much could be done for solo/casual players in an MMO. So would a lot of other developers, if they just freaking tried it; WoW is a lot of people's first MMO, which would suggest that that is because they didn't do what every other one did before it... yet, that's where they're headed with all the new content.
It does matter. Having 4 million customers is incredible, but keeping them would be absolutely insane. They're not going to this way (except in Asia, they've shown they love this stuff more than we do).
Oh also, none of Blizzards numbers have gone down in any country. SO saying they arent heading in the direction to keep these customers is also an overstatement. Its Blizz....they got something in there back pocket and you can bet your ass its the expansion which gets unveiled on Oct 28th.
Your response to the OP? The OP did NOT call the game trash, that's a completely different thread. As for the OP calling the devs retards, he actually implied that the people running the game have no brains. This is a pertinent point. It is often the case that the dev team that makes the game will move on when it is finished, and new people take over. Spending 4-5 years on just ONE project can be draining, and devs often move on to something completely fresh. Several games have done this. Just because Blizzard MADE a great game does not mean the will be GREAT at running it. I have seen an argument that SOE did a worse job at producing EQ2 than Blizz did with WoW, but a better job of improving it since.
Secondly. Blizzard aren't idiots? Well, you must qualify that. I would would say that SOE are NOT idiots too, but that doesn't mean they can maintain a great game. Look at EQ. They were good at running a business, releasing expansions with "must have" options to force the EQ junkies into buying them, and maintaining for a time a stable player base. But they alienated a LOT of the core EQ gamers too.
Blizzard made smart business choices when they made WoW. Casual/solo content, PvP, extreme ease of use, excellent marketing. Combined with a large existing fan base from warcraft and Diablo they have a huge current hit. But Simon Cowell knows how to make big hits, doesn't mean he can make great music, in fact he never has, and all his products are a flash in the pan. So your points about subscriber numbers only tell part of the story. Sure, 4 million doesn't mean NOTHING, but it does not mean EVERYTHING either.
Thirdly. You flamed the OP, simply because you disgreed with him/her. Yet the main points in the OP remain valid. For several months now players have been posting, on the official forums, about the lack of decent endgame content at level 60, apart from the endless grind of doing instances. WoW was a heavily quest-based game, but at 60 that stops. It just becomes a grind for cash, or a major timesink to get blue or purple gear, endlessly running the same few instances until you get your drops. Even if you have a guild you will not be jumping straight into raid groups and fighting within 2 minutes of logging in. Unless you tailor your life around the game. On numeroous occasions I waited for up to an hour before a raid group finally was ready to go, and that was for the "easy" instances. MC and above are even worse. During that wait you have down time. Grind some cash or twiddle your thumbs.
Even when you do get a group/raid you'll need another 2-3 hours to complete your goals, unless you can somehow fasttrack it. Sure, if you play for 4-5 hours per night, you'll have no problem, but 2-3? Login for 2 hours, waste the first setting up a raid in IF, hang round trying to get a preist, now you have an hour left. PvP is even worse. I have queued for ALL the BGs the entire length of my play session, in the end I gave even trying to raise my rank, or even keep it.
So, the OP raised the valid point that Blizzard had announced that they were ADDING some new solo content for the casual, less-hours-per-day-player, including quests. Now it seems they have back-tracked, since they wrongly worded their previous announcements, and mislead many casual gamers into thinking it was worth staying for the new solo/small group quests. Now it seems "small" actually meant 20 man raid; you can see how easy it was to mistake the two.
To summarise. Blizzard is not full of retards. It is full of businessmen. The game is great. But it has an achilles heal. They targeted the vast casual crowd but underestimated the speed with which they would reach the end game, or assumed they'd hook them in and keep them anyway. I have browsed numerous game forums, including some in the works, and a LOT of people tried WoW but quit it, a LOT. Blizzard are not slow to announce their success, but it's been a long time since they did. Has the sub base declined? Who knows, certainly no-one here. But blizzard wouldn't admit it even if it does.
Does not really matter to me. I thought the game was great; 1-60. I played an alt until my sub ran out. The proposed solo content had me thinking of resubbing when the patch goes live. Now I'll not bother. If they DO release content, expansion or not, for solo, small group, for my level 60 toon, I'll go back, if not....
Your response to the OP? The OP did NOT call the game trash, that's a completely different thread. As for the OP calling the devs retards, he actually implied that the people running the game have no brains. This is a pertinent point. It is often the case that the dev team that makes the game will move on when it is finished, and new people take over. Spending 4-5 years on just ONE project can be draining, and devs often move on to something completely fresh. Several games have done this. Just because Blizzard MADE a great game does not mean the will be GREAT at running it. I have seen an argument that SOE did a worse job at producing EQ2 than Blizz did with WoW, but a better job of improving it since.
Secondly. Blizzard aren't idiots? Well, you must qualify that. I would would say that SOE are NOT idiots too, but that doesn't mean they can maintain a great game. Look at EQ. They were good at running a business, releasing expansions with "must have" options to force the EQ junkies into buying them, and maintaining for a time a stable player base. But they alienated a LOT of the core EQ gamers too.
Blizzard made smart business choices when they made WoW. Casual/solo content, PvP, extreme ease of use, excellent marketing. Combined with a large existing fan base from warcraft and Diablo they have a huge current hit. But Simon Cowell knows how to make big hits, doesn't mean he can make great music, in fact he never has, and all his products are a flash in the pan. So your points about subscriber numbers only tell part of the story. Sure, 4 million doesn't mean NOTHING, but it does not mean EVERYTHING either.
Thirdly. You flamed the OP, simply because you disgreed with him/her. Yet the main points in the OP remain valid. For several months now players have been posting, on the official forums, about the lack of decent endgame content at level 60, apart from the endless grind of doing instances. WoW was a heavily quest-based game, but at 60 that stops. It just becomes a grind for cash, or a major timesink to get blue or purple gear, endlessly running the same few instances until you get your drops. Even if you have a guild you will not be jumping straight into raid groups and fighting within 2 minutes of logging in. Unless you tailor your life around the game. On numeroous occasions I waited for up to an hour before a raid group finally was ready to go, and that was for the "easy" instances. MC and above are even worse. During that wait you have down time. Grind some cash or twiddle your thumbs.
Even when you do get a group/raid you'll need another 2-3 hours to complete your goals, unless you can somehow fasttrack it. Sure, if you play for 4-5 hours per night, you'll have no problem, but 2-3? Login for 2 hours, waste the first setting up a raid in IF, hang round trying to get a preist, now you have an hour left. PvP is even worse. I have queued for ALL the BGs the entire length of my play session, in the end I gave even trying to raise my rank, or even keep it.
So, the OP raised the valid point that Blizzard had announced that they were ADDING some new solo content for the casual, less-hours-per-day-player, including quests. Now it seems they have back-tracked, since they wrongly worded their previous announcements, and mislead many casual gamers into thinking it was worth staying for the new solo/small group quests. Now it seems "small" actually meant 20 man raid; you can see how easy it was to mistake the two.
To summarise. Blizzard is not full of retards. It is full of businessmen. The game is great. But it has an achilles heal. They targeted the vast casual crowd but underestimated the speed with which they would reach the end game, or assumed they'd hook them in and keep them anyway. I have browsed numerous game forums, including some in the works, and a LOT of people tried WoW but quit it, a LOT. Blizzard are not slow to announce their success, but it's been a long time since they did. Has the sub base declined? Who knows, certainly no-one here. But blizzard wouldn't admit it even if it does.
Does not really matter to me. I thought the game was great; 1-60. I played an alt until my sub ran out. The proposed solo content had me thinking of resubbing when the patch goes live. Now I'll not bother. If they DO release content, expansion or not, for solo, small group, for my level 60 toon, I'll go back, if not....
I read the first 2 paragraphs from you and gave up. Im sorry, horse maure pretty much implies trash to me and no brains pretty much implies retard or idiots. I mean seriously I dont know what you are reading? Flaming the OP.....that is far from a flame in response to something as unintelligent as his last paragraph about Blizzard in his post.
Maybe you need to go back to the Original Post and read the WHOLE thing.
I'm quoting you Finduilas not because your right (or wrong) but because you said this part the clearist, thanks
I would like to point out something to you all. The end game of WoW is lvl 60. Period. At this time there is no hint that it will ever move beyond 60. What does that mean? That means that when you get bored playing your lvl 60 character, solo, Blizzard expects you to evolve into a raiding guild and try the raiding. If you can't or won't raid, well, then, you've experienced all the high end content. Time to reroll and try a different class.
----------------------------------------
My dog barks some. Mentally you picture my dog, but I have not told you the type of dog which I have. Perhaps you even picture Toto, from "The Wizard of Oz." But I warn you, my dog is always with me.
Finduilas and disturbed1 got what I meant perfectly. Bama I believe you misunderstood. I am talking in the context of the 1.8 patch that is going to be released. I don't remember implying that the entire game was crap? If you read the post I linked(maybe thats where you went wrong Bama). Yes I think the game could be run better. Why not maximize your consumer base? Would that not increase profits and player membership while increasing player moral? Rather than just cater to one specific group of people(eg. hardcore). Alienating most of the playerbase.
Actually I loved the game from lvl 1-59.9 I thought it was great. I only wish the talent that made that content could make the new content(endgame). The only reason I am even posting is because I was a huge fan of Warcraft games and I wished that they would improve WoW's direction
. I think I am not the only one who feels this way.
_____________________________________________________________________________________
Science has never proven that what we see in front of us is in fact real.
I have finished WoW, will not come back until they add more solo content along with further character advancement. Raiding is boring even in a hardcore guild. Raiding = lack of high level game design. I have done the whole make an alt thing, and guess what, u end up in the same situation again, just a month or so later. Waiting 2-3 hours to form a group, if you are lucky, to do an instance, then nothing dropping, or you do not win the roll, is not fun, and that is why i cancelled my account.
60 shaman/60 Hunter/60 Rogue/57 Druid/45 Warlock/40 Priest/22 Warrior/14 Mage
Play today.
Die tomorrow.
Play today.
Die tomorrow.
There is an alternative for the solo player...its called single player games.
Thanks rocket.
I'm not talking about entirely playing a solo game, but having some alternatives. From lvl 1 - 59, you can solo quite a bit with viable rewards, so I don't see why this has to stop at lvl 60.
Ico
Oh, cruel fate, to be thusly boned. Ask not for whom the bone bones. It bones for thee.
I personaly havent even reached 60 so im not bothered much by lack of solo content at this point. However, this is a very tricky point becuase from one side, you have all these casual people (myself included) who want some nice gear but dont have time and patience to raid for it, and from another hand, other people who have time and patience to raid it. If u satisfy one, then the other will not be happy. If you can raid solo and get purple items of the same value then those who raid for it then why raid if u can get it solo?
I hear stories about how long people have to raid in groups to get purple items, so if it takes that long to get a purple item, then Bliz would have to multiply that time by perhaps 5 so that it takes 5 times as long to obtain raid type item as a soloer. Then that would be .. ridiculously high. I sympathize Bliz, they have a tough decision to make - make soloers happy at the raider expence or the other way around. Hard to find just the right balance. Good luck Bliz
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
Having been in large raiding guild, I understand that hard collective work should be rewarded. On the other hand, players shouldn't be relegated to having to be in such a guild to enjoy end-game content.
I'm sure a creative solution can be found to satisfy casual players. Perhaps a set of extended quests. As stated previously, we have this environment for lvls 1 - 59. I see no reason why this should abrubtly stop at lvl 60.
Ico
Oh, cruel fate, to be thusly boned. Ask not for whom the bone bones. It bones for thee.