Different playing field now. Will the game be better than WoW? Depends on who you ask.
Assuming the project actually lives up to the potential we're all hoping it has at this point, it will certainly be 'better than' WoW in the eyes of the niche it is being designed for.
Obviously it will not be 'better than WoW' to the pve raiding crowd, etc.
Edit: 'lol'd hard at asking the source for a source
So, can Camelot Unchained actually out-do the game that killed it's predecessor, DAoC?
DAoC subscriber cap was 250k in 2004, before it fell. WoW released in 2004, not to beat a dead horse.
No, and they are not even trying. Jacobs himself said they are targetting a niche...and seeing as how they dont even want PvE, its a niche in a niche...and DaoC was already a small niche at that.
He already knows that pure PvP is a small market and seems more than willing to target a smaller chunck of that. Small focus = greater chance of meeting a goal of profit, however small it may be.
I am glad MJ is being up front about all that. Still people want to project things onto this game that just won't happen.
Also, IIRC TOA killed DOAC not wow.
There was a shift in loyalty, yes, if that is what you are getting at.
But WoW was a major factor. Jacobs acknowledges this. DAoC wasn't as good as WoW (vanilla), at that timeframe.
Later expansions of DAoC were targeting the WoW crowd to bring them back. Isn't that what pissed fans off? Be honest.
Sub numbers peaked after SI, held for a nice amount of time and then declined slowly. ToA brought back more subs (like XP packs have done for every MMO) but then WoW hit us for 30% when it came out+.
But no, I'm not sure why you would think CU will have any instances in it since I've said from day 1, no instances.
I'll politely ask for a source on no instances then.
Are apples better than oranges? (note: not trying to be rude, please keep reading)
WoW is not nor has it ever been a PvP focused game. The more appropriate question would probably be:
Will this game warrant enough short term and long term support for both a successful launch and to stick around afterwards?
And the answer to many of us is:
God I hope so!
The audience CU is attempting to grab is not the WoW audience, though there are likely many who have played WoW at one point or another in the target audience. Being "as good as WoW" in vanilla or not is not a factor. Blizzard's target audience was pretty much any person who had played any of the titles in any of their 3 insanely popular franchises as well as anybody interested in a fantasy MMO, so really not the same thing here.
2) TM vs SS (just like GW2 WvW) was fun for about a week or two. People got bored of it though as there was no progression, just back and forth mindless zerging. WoW having good PvP is a ridiculous statement and can only be taken as trolling.
Did WoW even have pvp when it launched? I remember for months there was nothing to do in that game because there was no content over level 40 and you couldn't pvp. I played DaoC for years. I played the WoW beta and then left WoW after 3 months because of boredom.
Most DaoC player didn't become WoW players, they moved on to other PvP games like Shadowbane, Lineage 2 and guild wars. There was probably some overlap, but honestly most WoW players were carebears and kids playing their first mmo, not diehard pvpers and old school players from UO, DaoC, AC and before.
2) TM vs SS (just like GW2 WvW) was fun for about a week or two. People got bored of it though as there was no progression, just back and forth mindless zerging. WoW having good PvP is a ridiculous statement and can only be taken as trolling.
(1) Misinformation. Mark Jacobs even invalidates your assertion.
(2) You only validate claims about DAoC stinking. Some were worse than others. And some were a WoWification. Get over that.
2) TM vs SS (just like GW2 WvW) was fun for about a week or two. People got bored of it though as there was no progression, just back and forth mindless zerging. WoW having good PvP is a ridiculous statement and can only be taken as trolling.
(1) Misinformation. Mark Jacobs even invalidates your assertion.
(2) You only validate claims about DAoC stinking. Some were worse than others. And some were a WoWification. Get over that.
So if Joe Blow feels that TOA ruined DOAC somehow MJ can override that? Odd.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
2) TM vs SS (just like GW2 WvW) was fun for about a week or two. People got bored of it though as there was no progression, just back and forth mindless zerging. WoW having good PvP is a ridiculous statement and can only be taken as trolling.
(1) Misinformation. Mark Jacobs even invalidates your assertion.
(2) You only validate claims about DAoC stinking. Some were worse than others. And some were a WoWification. Get over that.
So if Joe Blow feels that TOA ruined DOAC somehow MJ can override that? Odd.
I hate instances. I like some pve, but instances killed this genre by taking meaningful gameplay from the world, scripting it, and forcing us to repeat it like hamsters.
Indeed. MJ poped in to say no instances, BUT .. Is no instances in the CU manifesto? Seems like it should be..
I could guess that it is not mentioned so it would not be legally bindable with kickstarter. If it were mentioned then no instances must go in ... but no mention leaves more for blog promises and afterthoughts? :P
I hate instances. I like some pve, but instances killed this genre by taking meaningful gameplay from the world, scripting it, and forcing us to repeat it like hamsters.
Indeed. MJ poped in to say no instances, BUT .. Is no instances in the CU manifesto? Seems like it should be..
I could guess that it is not mentioned so it would not be legally bindable with kickstarter. If it were mentioned then no instances must go in ... but no mention leaves more for blog promises and afterthoughts? :P
"Okay, I lied. How about another question? What if we don’t want to RvR that day but still want to have fun in the game?” Well, that is where housing, crafting and other systems will come into play. As a RvR-focused game, players will need all sorts of items and the crafters will have to supply them. Whether it is arrows, armor, gold for the mint, etc., there’s always going to be somebody who needs something and that’s where crafting comes in. And if you don’t feel like crafting, well, the housing/buildings system are waiting for you. And if that isn’t enough there will be RvR missions that you can undertake that won’t involve sacking a keep but could still involve some RvR (in an open world, not instanced, k thx bye) if you get unlucky. And if that is not enough, well, we will have some other things that you can do but we are an RvR-focused game and if you are not feeling it that night and nothing we have interests you, well, it’s time to take a break, just like any other game. I cannot promise you that CU will meet all your needs for an MMO. It cannot be all things to all people but it can be a great RvR-focused game with your help, feedback, support and involvement. If on some nights it isn’t what you are looking for, well, that’s okay, your realm’s enemies will be still waiting for you when you get back.
If you looking for a game that captures the spirit, challenge and excitement of RvR, you have come to the right place. Oh, did I forget to mention territorial control, RvR leaderboards, extremely limited “normal” instances (special events, special unlocks, etc.) and most importantly, getting to know and hate your enemies with a passion and being rewarded for doing so? And no Virginia, cross-realm characters on a server is a no-no and of course, we will have multiple servers but there is a Santa Claus N.O.ME., at least in March on Oz.
-- Day to day combat will be uninstanced. Just left the door open for special events, or perhaps dungeons like DF. Take it as you will.
Considering that DAoC was already pretty old when WoW came out, its not really a fair comparison in my oppinion.
DAoC had better and more meaningfull PvP, wow had more fluid combat and better graphics and such, but hey the technology improved a lot since DAoC was made. However even WoW had its "slideshow" momnets, thats for damn sure.
Had DAoC launched in the same time frame as WoW, instead of warhammer, DAoC might have been the big boy on the block here.
I hate instances. I like some pve, but instances killed this genre by taking meaningful gameplay from the world, scripting it, and forcing us to repeat it like hamsters.
Indeed. MJ poped in to say no instances, BUT .. Is no instances in the CU manifesto? Seems like it should be..
I could guess that it is not mentioned so it would not be legally bindable with kickstarter. If it were mentioned then no instances must go in ... but no mention leaves more for blog promises and afterthoughts? :P
"Okay, I lied. How about another question? What if we don’t want to RvR that day but still want to have fun in the game?” Well, that is where housing, crafting and other systems will come into play. As a RvR-focused game, players will need all sorts of items and the crafters will have to supply them. Whether it is arrows, armor, gold for the mint, etc., there’s always going to be somebody who needs something and that’s where crafting comes in. And if you don’t feel like crafting, well, the housing/buildings system are waiting for you. And if that isn’t enough there will be RvR missions that you can undertake that won’t involve sacking a keep but could still involve some RvR (in an open world, not instanced, k thx bye) if you get unlucky. And if that is not enough, well, we will have some other things that you can do but we are an RvR-focused game and if you are not feeling it that night and nothing we have interests you, well, it’s time to take a break, just like any other game. I cannot promise you that CU will meet all your needs for an MMO. It cannot be all things to all people but it can be a great RvR-focused game with your help, feedback, support and involvement. If on some nights it isn’t what you are looking for, well, that’s okay, your realm’s enemies will be still waiting for you when you get back.
If you looking for a game that captures the spirit, challenge and excitement of RvR, you have come to the right place. Oh, did I forget to mention territorial control, RvR leaderboards, extremely limited “normal” instances (special events, special unlocks, etc.) and most importantly, getting to know and hate your enemies with a passion and being rewarded for doing so? And no Virginia, cross-realm characters on a server is a no-no and of course, we will have multiple servers but there is a Santa Claus N.O.ME., at least in March on Oz.
-- Day to day combat will be uninstanced. Just left the door open for special events, or perhaps dungeons like DF. Take it as you will.
Thats not a manifesto.
"And if that isn’t enough there will be RvR missions that you can undertake that won’t involve sacking a keep but could still involve some RvR (in an open world, not instanced, k thx bye) if you get unlucky."
Actually it doesn't make much sense if you read the sentence without the ()'s ... or if you ponder the k thx bye comment. It's nonsense.
Without the parenthesis it reads:
"And if that isn’t enough there will be RvR missions that you can undertake that won’t involve sacking a keep but could still involve some RvR if you get unlucky."
The parenthesis read:
(in an open world, not instanced, k thx bye)
This is just some blog entry, not legally binding to kickstarter. Blogs are not binding and can be changed. So basically there is no mention that the game won't be instanced (tied to kickstarter promises)?
2) TM vs SS (just like GW2 WvW) was fun for about a week or two. People got bored of it though as there was no progression, just back and forth mindless zerging. WoW having good PvP is a ridiculous statement and can only be taken as trolling.
(1) Misinformation. Mark Jacobs even invalidates your assertion.
(2) You only validate claims about DAoC stinking. Some were worse than others. And some were a WoWification. Get over that.
So if Joe Blow feels that TOA ruined DOAC somehow MJ can override that? Odd.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
I had to register to this site just to say this because comparing WoW to this... omg:
WoW had the "new" factor in it. Thats why people played it. It didnt offer anything in end-game.That plus the fact that ToA alienated the gamers was enough to make it go downhill. Really, WoW was a huge dissappointment to me. Ive played a lot of MMO games afterwards but been let down for the lack of true endgame. I play LoL now because it is endgame and its very challenging. I play skyrim for great adventures when im SOLO I dont want multiplayer games giving me storylines and then leaving me to run the same instances over and over again. WoW vanilla endgame was just really bad instances, griefing noobs etc. LoL or any other Dota-copy is way better in "instance" -type gameplay + its much much more challenging.
EVE Online is one of the best games ive played after DAoC, but playing it demands very very much out of you and your time for it to be rewarding (controlling market, 0.0 area controlling, guard duties .. GATE CAMPIINGGG) now what im hearing is I could get RvR like it should be, 3 realms, a great community(why? because they are not all 10-years old), market/crafting system to be a bit like EVE(ok not as complicated, but sandy? at least from what ive read there will be sand, meaby not in a box but somewhere?) and it all happening in the way I like, with blood and steel
All in all, I dont feel Camelot Unchained to be "good" as WoW vanilla which I, and a lot of ex-daoc players, left after a few months. I hope its nothing like WoW at all. I hope it will be even better than what DAoC / SI was. I feel confident from reading the foundation principles that it will be the game I have been waiting for years.
I dont feel the lack of PVE being bad, there will be NPC's and from what ive read im pretty sure thats where a lot of our crafting materials are being generated. So when im gathering resources I might get attacked.. ok I can live with that, i've played EVE. If I want to hang out with friends, we can go to a keep and meaby create sieging equipment / repair or create new defences for it etc. Why was DAoC so good back then? the community was really good, people talked with each other. There was time to bond in keep defences/sieges etc. In DAoC the keeps mattered, the relic raids had been planned for weeks if not months(we were a small realm). When you lost you saw it, the way back was long and if you had been defending a keep you could see it. This sense of pride and the feeling of a true community was better than anything ive experienced after.
EVE Online is one of the best games ive played after DAoC, but playing it demands very very much out of you and your time for it to be rewarding (controlling market, 0.0 area controlling, guard duties .. GATE CAMPIINGGG) now what im hearing is I could get RvR like it should be, 3 realms, a great community(why? because they are not all 10-years old), market/crafting system to be a bit like EVE(ok not as complicated, but sandy? at least from what ive read there will be sand, meaby not in a box but somewhere?) and it all happening in the way I like, with blood and steel
EVE will always have a special place in my heart but dear god. Finding out you let your training queue empty makes you feel like the last X # of hours/days have been wasted and that you are now suddenly losing some sort of war. Almost nothing I have found in any full PvP game (Shadowbane, Darkfall and Mortal Online included) compares to the experience of 0.0 or wormhole space. But gate camping was either ridiculous fun when you did it to pick a large fight or a gut wrenching feeling when you loaded into someone's bubble piloting your favorite ship only to be podded after a prolonged negotiation that was never a negotiation at all. I doubt any economic system will be anywhere near as in depth as EVE's is for quite awhile and that includes the many types of crafting and economy based skills available.
That being said, I will still always hope for one.
that's not really true, at least not the way you're presenting it.
DAOC tanked because of the introduction of forced PvE ( trials of atlantis). WoW was merely the excuse to finally leave after the root of DAOC changed so much due to that PvE.
edit: essentially, the DAOC playerbase moved away to show Mythic just how displeased they were for that forced PvE. and no, WoW wasn't worth staying for either, as that DAOC playerbase moved on from WoW long ago.
Marc has acknowledged old frontiers was the best time most of us DAOCers had = large, open world where roaming, keep fighting, and 500+ player relic raids made the game.
basically wow got it'S attention because "BLIZZARD" was written all over it
this time it will say "mark jacobs!", might work
To be fair, I think WoW gots its attention because it was and probably still is a great MMORPG - I can admit it if others cannot. Blizzard's name may have helped, but people stayed for the game, not the company.
I have not played it in years, but I am not about to turn around a jump on the hate train, either. It had high production values and was entertaining, and I sunk a few years into it. 9M, 10M, 11M, or whatever it is players still think it is entertaining.
I hate instances. I like some pve, but instances killed this genre by taking meaningful gameplay from the world, scripting it, and forcing us to repeat it like hamsters.
Indeed. MJ poped in to say no instances, BUT .. Is no instances in the CU manifesto? Seems like it should be..
I could guess that it is not mentioned so it would not be legally bindable with kickstarter. If it were mentioned then no instances must go in ... but no mention leaves more for blog promises and afterthoughts? :P
"Okay, I lied. How about another question? What if we don’t want to RvR that day but still want to have fun in the game?” Well, that is where housing, crafting and other systems will come into play. As a RvR-focused game, players will need all sorts of items and the crafters will have to supply them. Whether it is arrows, armor, gold for the mint, etc., there’s always going to be somebody who needs something and that’s where crafting comes in. And if you don’t feel like crafting, well, the housing/buildings system are waiting for you. And if that isn’t enough there will be RvR missions that you can undertake that won’t involve sacking a keep but could still involve some RvR (in an open world, not instanced, k thx bye) if you get unlucky. And if that is not enough, well, we will have some other things that you can do but we are an RvR-focused game and if you are not feeling it that night and nothing we have interests you, well, it’s time to take a break, just like any other game. I cannot promise you that CU will meet all your needs for an MMO. It cannot be all things to all people but it can be a great RvR-focused game with your help, feedback, support and involvement. If on some nights it isn’t what you are looking for, well, that’s okay, your realm’s enemies will be still waiting for you when you get back.
If you looking for a game that captures the spirit, challenge and excitement of RvR, you have come to the right place. Oh, did I forget to mention territorial control, RvR leaderboards, extremely limited “normal” instances (special events, special unlocks, etc.) and most importantly, getting to know and hate your enemies with a passion and being rewarded for doing so? And no Virginia, cross-realm characters on a server is a no-no and of course, we will have multiple servers but there is a Santa Claus N.O.ME., at least in March on Oz.
-- Day to day combat will be uninstanced. Just left the door open for special events, or perhaps dungeons like DF. Take it as you will.
Thats not a manifesto.
"And if that isn’t enough there will be RvR missions that you can undertake that won’t involve sacking a keep but could still involve some RvR (in an open world, not instanced, k thx bye) if you get unlucky."
Actually it doesn't make much sense if you read the sentence without the ()'s ... or if you ponder the k thx bye comment. It's nonsense.
Without the parenthesis it reads:
"And if that isn’t enough there will be RvR missions that you can undertake that won’t involve sacking a keep but could still involve some RvR if you get unlucky."
The parenthesis read:
(in an open world, not instanced, k thx bye)
This is just some blog entry, not legally binding to kickstarter. Blogs are not binding and can be changed. So basically there is no mention that the game won't be instanced (tied to kickstarter promises)?
Mark believes that every great game starts with a great foundation. The Foundational Principles he and Andrew have been laying out are more than simple ideas; they are the bedrock for Camelot Unchained. Over the next 30 days, we will tell you even more through updates and additional Foundational Principles. We think it's important that you understand fully what kind of game we want to create before you decide to back it.
Comments
Different playing field now. Will the game be better than WoW? Depends on who you ask.
Assuming the project actually lives up to the potential we're all hoping it has at this point, it will certainly be 'better than' WoW in the eyes of the niche it is being designed for.
Obviously it will not be 'better than WoW' to the pve raiding crowd, etc.
Edit: 'lol'd hard at asking the source for a source
OK then! ... waiting ... =D
Want a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8NNHmV3QPw&feature=plcp
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.
@OP
Are apples better than oranges? (note: not trying to be rude, please keep reading)
WoW is not nor has it ever been a PvP focused game. The more appropriate question would probably be:
Will this game warrant enough short term and long term support for both a successful launch and to stick around afterwards?
And the answer to many of us is:
God I hope so!
The audience CU is attempting to grab is not the WoW audience, though there are likely many who have played WoW at one point or another in the target audience. Being "as good as WoW" in vanilla or not is not a factor. Blizzard's target audience was pretty much any person who had played any of the titles in any of their 3 insanely popular franchises as well as anybody interested in a fantasy MMO, so really not the same thing here.
1) WoW didn't kill DAoC. ToA and NF killed DAoC.
2) TM vs SS (just like GW2 WvW) was fun for about a week or two. People got bored of it though as there was no progression, just back and forth mindless zerging. WoW having good PvP is a ridiculous statement and can only be taken as trolling.
Did WoW even have pvp when it launched? I remember for months there was nothing to do in that game because there was no content over level 40 and you couldn't pvp. I played DaoC for years. I played the WoW beta and then left WoW after 3 months because of boredom.
Most DaoC player didn't become WoW players, they moved on to other PvP games like Shadowbane, Lineage 2 and guild wars. There was probably some overlap, but honestly most WoW players were carebears and kids playing their first mmo, not diehard pvpers and old school players from UO, DaoC, AC and before.
(1) Misinformation. Mark Jacobs even invalidates your assertion.
(2) You only validate claims about DAoC stinking. Some were worse than others. And some were a WoWification. Get over that.
Want a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8NNHmV3QPw&feature=plcp
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.
So if Joe Blow feels that TOA ruined DOAC somehow MJ can override that? Odd.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
That was nothing which I actually said.
Want a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8NNHmV3QPw&feature=plcp
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.
Indeed. MJ poped in to say no instances, BUT .. Is no instances in the CU manifesto? Seems like it should be..
I could guess that it is not mentioned so it would not be legally bindable with kickstarter. If it were mentioned then no instances must go in ... but no mention leaves more for blog promises and afterthoughts? :P
Want a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8NNHmV3QPw&feature=plcp
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.
What wow did have was a very responsive and fun combat system and fun for the time pve
From Founding Prinicple #2
"Okay, I lied. How about another question? What if we don’t want to RvR that day but still want to have fun in the game?” Well, that is where housing, crafting and other systems will come into play. As a RvR-focused game, players will need all sorts of items and the crafters will have to supply them. Whether it is arrows, armor, gold for the mint, etc., there’s always going to be somebody who needs something and that’s where crafting comes in. And if you don’t feel like crafting, well, the housing/buildings system are waiting for you. And if that isn’t enough there will be RvR missions that you can undertake that won’t involve sacking a keep but could still involve some RvR (in an open world, not instanced, k thx bye) if you get unlucky. And if that is not enough, well, we will have some other things that you can do but we are an RvR-focused game and if you are not feeling it that night and nothing we have interests you, well, it’s time to take a break, just like any other game. I cannot promise you that CU will meet all your needs for an MMO. It cannot be all things to all people but it can be a great RvR-focused game with your help, feedback, support and involvement. If on some nights it isn’t what you are looking for, well, that’s okay, your realm’s enemies will be still waiting for you when you get back.
If you looking for a game that captures the spirit, challenge and excitement of RvR, you have come to the right place. Oh, did I forget to mention territorial control, RvR leaderboards, extremely limited “normal” instances (special events, special unlocks, etc.) and most importantly, getting to know and hate your enemies with a passion and being rewarded for doing so? And no Virginia, cross-realm characters on a server is a no-no and of course, we will have multiple servers but there is a Santa Claus N.O.ME., at least in March on Oz.
-- Day to day combat will be uninstanced. Just left the door open for special events, or perhaps dungeons like DF. Take it as you will.
Considering that DAoC was already pretty old when WoW came out, its not really a fair comparison in my oppinion.
DAoC had better and more meaningfull PvP, wow had more fluid combat and better graphics and such, but hey the technology improved a lot since DAoC was made. However even WoW had its "slideshow" momnets, thats for damn sure.
Had DAoC launched in the same time frame as WoW, instead of warhammer, DAoC might have been the big boy on the block here.
Thats not a manifesto.
"And if that isn’t enough there will be RvR missions that you can undertake that won’t involve sacking a keep but could still involve some RvR (in an open world, not instanced, k thx bye) if you get unlucky."
Actually it doesn't make much sense if you read the sentence without the ()'s ... or if you ponder the k thx bye comment. It's nonsense.
Without the parenthesis it reads:
"And if that isn’t enough there will be RvR missions that you can undertake that won’t involve sacking a keep but could still involve some RvR if you get unlucky."
The parenthesis read:
(in an open world, not instanced, k thx bye)
This is just some blog entry, not legally binding to kickstarter. Blogs are not binding and can be changed. So basically there is no mention that the game won't be instanced (tied to kickstarter promises)?
Want a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8NNHmV3QPw&feature=plcp
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.
I was replying to your 1. DERP.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
Just for the record DAOC was killed by Mythic due to TOA.
The fact that WOW came out as well just rubbed salt into the wound.
I had to register to this site just to say this because comparing WoW to this... omg:
WoW had the "new" factor in it. Thats why people played it. It didnt offer anything in end-game.That plus the fact that ToA alienated the gamers was enough to make it go downhill. Really, WoW was a huge dissappointment to me. Ive played a lot of MMO games afterwards but been let down for the lack of true endgame. I play LoL now because it is endgame and its very challenging. I play skyrim for great adventures when im SOLO I dont want multiplayer games giving me storylines and then leaving me to run the same instances over and over again. WoW vanilla endgame was just really bad instances, griefing noobs etc. LoL or any other Dota-copy is way better in "instance" -type gameplay + its much much more challenging.
EVE Online is one of the best games ive played after DAoC, but playing it demands very very much out of you and your time for it to be rewarding (controlling market, 0.0 area controlling, guard duties .. GATE CAMPIINGGG) now what im hearing is I could get RvR like it should be, 3 realms, a great community(why? because they are not all 10-years old), market/crafting system to be a bit like EVE(ok not as complicated, but sandy?
at least from what ive read there will be sand, meaby not in a box but somewhere?) and it all happening in the way I like, with blood and steel 
All in all, I dont feel Camelot Unchained to be "good" as WoW vanilla which I, and a lot of ex-daoc players, left after a few months. I hope its nothing like WoW at all. I hope it will be even better than what DAoC / SI was. I feel confident from reading the foundation principles that it will be the game I have been waiting for years.
I dont feel the lack of PVE being bad, there will be NPC's and from what ive read im pretty sure thats where a lot of our crafting materials are being generated. So when im gathering resources I might get attacked.. ok I can live with that, i've played EVE. If I want to hang out with friends, we can go to a keep and meaby create sieging equipment / repair or create new defences for it etc. Why was DAoC so good back then? the community was really good, people talked with each other. There was time to bond in keep defences/sieges etc. In DAoC the keeps mattered, the relic raids had been planned for weeks if not months(we were a small realm). When you lost you saw it, the way back was long and if you had been defending a keep you could see it. This sense of pride and the feeling of a true community was better than anything ive experienced after.
Yours,
Achelon of Furn
Enduring Effervescients / Hibernia / Prydwen / EU
EVE will always have a special place in my heart but dear god. Finding out you let your training queue empty makes you feel like the last X # of hours/days have been wasted and that you are now suddenly losing some sort of war. Almost nothing I have found in any full PvP game (Shadowbane, Darkfall and Mortal Online included) compares to the experience of 0.0 or wormhole space. But gate camping was either ridiculous fun when you did it to pick a large fight or a gut wrenching feeling when you loaded into someone's bubble piloting your favorite ship only to be podded after a prolonged negotiation that was never a negotiation at all. I doubt any economic system will be anywhere near as in depth as EVE's is for quite awhile and that includes the many types of crafting and economy based skills available.
That being said, I will still always hope for one.
that's not really true, at least not the way you're presenting it.
DAOC tanked because of the introduction of forced PvE ( trials of atlantis). WoW was merely the excuse to finally leave after the root of DAOC changed so much due to that PvE.
edit: essentially, the DAOC playerbase moved away to show Mythic just how displeased they were for that forced PvE. and no, WoW wasn't worth staying for either, as that DAOC playerbase moved on from WoW long ago.
Marc has acknowledged old frontiers was the best time most of us DAOCers had = large, open world where roaming, keep fighting, and 500+ player relic raids made the game.
basically wow got it'S attention because "BLIZZARD" was written all over it
this time it will say "mark jacobs!", might work
"I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"
To be fair, I think WoW gots its attention because it was and probably still is a great MMORPG - I can admit it if others cannot. Blizzard's name may have helped, but people stayed for the game, not the company.
I have not played it in years, but I am not about to turn around a jump on the hate train, either. It had high production values and was entertaining, and I sunk a few years into it. 9M, 10M, 11M, or whatever it is players still think it is entertaining.
Mark believes that every great game starts with a great foundation. The Foundational Principles he and Andrew have been laying out are more than simple ideas; they are the bedrock for Camelot Unchained. Over the next 30 days, we will tell you even more through updates and additional Foundational Principles. We think it's important that you understand fully what kind of game we want to create before you decide to back it.
The current list of principles can be found on our website (www.camelotunchained.com)
That's from the kickstarter page: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/13861848/camelot-unchained
It's linked off of it as a reference, thus is part of the KS proposal.
Too soon to tell, but maybe =D
Want a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8NNHmV3QPw&feature=plcp
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.
MJ even says WoW killed* DAoC.
It's more likely that DAoC experienced a wowification that players didn't like? like with stealthies and stuff?
*killed meaning ending upward trends
Want a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8NNHmV3QPw&feature=plcp
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.