Apparently there is some concern about a lot of the recent info focusing on crafting to which Mark provided the following comment:
Without crafters, there are no weapons, armor, buildings, etc. They need(ed) the most time to convince. We have almost done that. Look around at how many people are saying that they will now play crafters or how people are worried about having too many crafters. Three weeks ago people thought I was nuts to do a crafter-only class, that a player-driven economy in a game like this wouldn't work, etc. Now look where we are.
Starting tonight begins the RvR push. Now, I've talked about it a lot in bits and pieces but from now on, at least one update a day from me on RvR.
Selling CU was/is a two step process. It needs both crafters and RvRers in order to succeed. Crafters now know how serious I am about their needs. If I have met/meet them, they will back us. The same is true for RvRers beginning tonight.
There's a reason for the path I've chosen to go down. Is it the right one? Who knows. But I bet if you and most people were being honest, I don't think most people would have thought our building/housing/mining systems were going to be as cool. I also think that most of them would have never thought the whole player-driven economy in an RvR-focused game would have worked either. Finally, we have raised almost 1.4M for a niche sub-based game. I know from reading all the forums that I do that fact also surprised a lot of people who were waiting for epic fail (RvR + sub + limited PvE + MJ) and look at where we are. An incredible community who have supported this game with their money, time and affection. I couldn't be prouder.
EDIT :
it was writen in the CSE KS comments, if you want to try and find the original post.
Hurrah! Good Guy Jacobs answers critics in respectful and intelligent manner.
Originally posted by Galiden I was a backer from day one and just recently pulled my pledge, because the lack of rvr updates and the addition of the Depths. I was a huge rvr fan but hated aggromon and darkness falls type areas. I still love the concept of this game but the kickstarter has been terribly unorganized and shortsided. It went off on several tangents, and is down to 7 days and just about ready to talk rvr. It can still win me back. Some of the backers have been just as damaging as the naysayers at this point. Get to the pvp in your pvp game already. I really hope this game funds, but if it doesn't it is nobody's fault but cse. They should have had a better gameplan. This kickstarter was rushed out, and the tier issues are evidence of that.
Agree, couple hours of dedicated thought with a pad of paper outlining day 1 to day 30 would have made a huge difference.
I am backing, and will no matter what other info comes. I don't need to see anything running like others do.
but my guess is most people want to see substance instead of ideas
I don't even need substance. I am more disappointed in the lack or organization. I know he can make a game. I liked DAOC, I liked warhammer, I even liked Dragon's Gate. I feel like the Kickstarter would have faired a whole lot better if this was planned. Everything was done on a wimb and it is pretty obvious. This is honest feedback from a loyal fan of Jacobs. I really hope this project hasn't been blown due to poor project pplanning. I am a design coordinator in a completely different field, but the same principles still apply here.
Edited my poor attempt at writting this on my phone.
why not reveal the meat and potatoes at the start of the kickstarter campaign? it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for, not crappy animation videos about crafting.
I love rvr Dean but I also like crafting and the videos were not crappy.
Originally posted by Galiden I don't even need substance. I am more disappointed in the lack or organization. I know he can make a game. I liked DAOC, I liked warhammer, I even liked Dragon's Gate. I feel like the Kickstarterer would have faired a whole lot better if this was planned. Everything was done on a wimb and it is pretty obvious. This is honest feedback from a loyal fan of Jacobs. I really hope this project has been blown due to poor project pplanning.
lol everyone is a critic, especially the ones who have never created a game.:P
Originally posted by Galiden I don't even need substance. I am more disappointed in the lack or organization. I know he can make a game. I liked DAOC, I liked warhammer, I even liked Dragon's Gate. I feel like the Kickstarterer would have faired a whole lot better if this was planned. Everything was done on a wimb and it is pretty obvious. This is honest feedback from a loyal fan of Jacobs. I really hope this project has been blown due to poor project pplanning.
I respect your criticism here, but I just feel the opposite. I think the KS campaign has been handled very well. Most successful KS projects start out with a bang, expereince a lull and then finish big. This campaign has followed that formula in terms of information reveals. I think the big difference is that this project went to KS in its very infancy, and this changes the type of information that is available and the amount of detail revealed. For some people, it was not timely nor as informative as they hoped.
We will know in about week who was right or wrong. I hope every one is happy in the end. Well, except for some of the hateful trolls, who just want to tear down the work and faith of others rather than be part of building something cool and different.
Originally posted by Galiden I don't even need substance. I am more disappointed in the lack or organization. I know he can make a game. I liked DAOC, I liked warhammer, I even liked Dragon's Gate. I feel like the Kickstarterer would have faired a whole lot better if this was planned. Everything was done on a wimb and it is pretty obvious. This is honest feedback from a loyal fan of Jacobs. I really hope this project has been blown due to poor project pplanning.
lol everyone is a critic, especially the ones who have never created a game.:P
Originally posted by Galiden I don't even need substance. I am more disappointed in the lack or organization. I know he can make a game. I liked DAOC, I liked warhammer, I even liked Dragon's Gate. I feel like the Kickstarterer would have faired a whole lot better if this was planned. Everything was done on a wimb and it is pretty obvious. This is honest feedback from a loyal fan of Jacobs. I really hope this project has been blown due to poor project pplanning.
lol everyone is a critic, especially the ones who have never created a game.:P
Read my edit. My phone blew that post up. This kickstarter screams poor management and planning. Like I said I am a fan of Jacobs, I am a fan of his games. This has nothing the do with that ability, it falls completely on poor management. That is a bit disconcerning when you are putting faith in someone to manage a game throughout the duration of the project. I am a design coordinator in a different field, but the planning process for any project is virtually the same from the management side.
I honesty think they rejigged the schedule on the fly when people started crying about not having an alpha build available. I think, based on other ks projects, they thought ideas+concepts would do it.
why not reveal the meat and potatoes at the start of the kickstarter campaign? it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for, not crappy animation videos about crafting.
why not reveal the meat and potatoes at the start of the kickstarter campaign? it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for, not crappy animation videos about crafting.
please, dont use words like "it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for ..." because you have no idea what everyone wants. for example i am backing CU because of the crafting and dont care about RvR/PvP at all.
why not reveal the meat and potatoes at the start of the kickstarter campaign? it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for, not crappy animation videos about crafting.
please, dont use words like "it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for ..." because you have no idea what everyone wants. for example i am backing CU because of the crafting and dont care about RvR/PvP at all.
Relax,
im sure he is ONLY talking about 95% of the people. And fence sitters
why not reveal the meat and potatoes at the start of the kickstarter campaign? it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for, not crappy animation videos about crafting.
please, dont use words like "it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for ..." because you have no idea what everyone wants. for example i am backing CU because of the crafting and dont care about RvR/PvP at all.
So you're backing this RvR only game for the PvE parts of it? Interesting.
why not reveal the meat and potatoes at the start of the kickstarter campaign? it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for, not crappy animation videos about crafting.
please, dont use words like "it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for ..." because you have no idea what everyone wants. for example i am backing CU because of the crafting and dont care about RvR/PvP at all.
So you're backing this RvR only game for the PvE parts of it? Interesting.
nope, for the crafting part of it (which isnt pve), for the chance to play dedicated crafter char
Look being a blind zealot for this game is not going to help it at all. I'm already concerned he's not going to get the criticism he needs from his backers. That is specifically why he made the it tier as unattractive as possible. This also puts people in a situation where they feel like all the decisions they have made are the right ones. I would imagine he wants around 60 to 100k backers which is pretty accurate looking at the models he based his ks off of. Instead he has close to 9k people that will devote everything they have to make the game be produced, but those 9k can't keep in running. At this point I'm not sure what he needs to do to get backers. The fact still remains thats what he needs.
why not reveal the meat and potatoes at the start of the kickstarter campaign? it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for, not crappy animation videos about crafting.
please, dont use words like "it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for ..." because you have no idea what everyone wants. for example i am backing CU because of the crafting and dont care about RvR/PvP at all.
So you're backing this RvR only game for the PvE parts of it? Interesting.
nope, for the crafting part of it (which isnt pve), for the chance to play dedicated crafter char
Ok, so you are in the small % of people who were foaming at the mouth for a crafter update. My point is, when the game was first announced to be a future kickstarter project....95% of the player base interested in it, were in it for the RvR...not the crafting. This information has been withheld from the largest % of players interested in backing this game until the last days. So any prospecting player who read about this project and was SEMI-interested and not a die hard fan like the rest of us...skimmed the materials and found nothing of interest and moved on. that is my concern....that people read the kickstarter page saw no content relevant to the RvR and will never return for the updates on day 26 of the 30 day project.
why not reveal the meat and potatoes at the start of the kickstarter campaign? it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for, not crappy animation videos about crafting.
please, dont use words like "it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for ..." because you have no idea what everyone wants. for example i am backing CU because of the crafting and dont care about RvR/PvP at all.
So you're backing this RvR only game for the PvE parts of it? Interesting.
nope, for the crafting part of it (which isnt pve), for the chance to play dedicated crafter char
Ok, so you are in the small % of people who were foaming at the mouth for a crafter update. My point is, when the game was first announced to be a future kickstarter project....95% of the player base interested in it, were in it for the RvR...not the crafting. This information has been withheld from the largest % of players interested in backing this game until the last days. So any prospecting player who read about this project and was SEMI-interested and not a die hard fan like the rest of us...skimmed the materials and found nothing of interest and moved on. that is my concern....that people read the kickstarter page saw no content relevant to the RvR and will never return for the updates on day 26 of the 30 day project.
and my point is that you DONT KNOW if it was 95% (it is possible, but you dont know) so please stop throwing "95%" "EVERYONE" etc around. did you asked all the almost 9k backers?
I'm having a bit of a rough time deciding whether to play an RvRer or a crafter. Normally crafting is really boring in MMOs, but it looks like a lot of fun in CU. I guess eventually I'll have a crafter as well as an RvRer, but I don't have the time to focus on both straight off. Which to pick first?
why not reveal the meat and potatoes at the start of the kickstarter campaign? it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for, not crappy animation videos about crafting.
please, dont use words like "it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for ..." because you have no idea what everyone wants. for example i am backing CU because of the crafting and dont care about RvR/PvP at all.
So you're backing this RvR only game for the PvE parts of it? Interesting.
nope, for the crafting part of it (which isnt pve), for the chance to play dedicated crafter char
Ok, so you are in the small % of people who were foaming at the mouth for a crafter update. My point is, when the game was first announced to be a future kickstarter project....95% of the player base interested in it, were in it for the RvR...not the crafting. This information has been withheld from the largest % of players interested in backing this game until the last days. So any prospecting player who read about this project and was SEMI-interested and not a die hard fan like the rest of us...skimmed the materials and found nothing of interest and moved on. that is my concern....that people read the kickstarter page saw no content relevant to the RvR and will never return for the updates on day 26 of the 30 day project.
and my point is that you DONT KNOW if it was 95% (it is possible, but you dont know) so please stop throwing "95%" "EVERYONE" etc around. did you asked all the almost 9k backers?
way to latch on to a random percentage that i threw in the air to get the point across. i am guessing you are the same guy who grammar checks everyone on the forum as well. sorry if 95% is not exactly the correct percentage of backers or potential backers only interested in RvR. you are simply ignoring the fact that a majority of backers and potential backers are in this for the RvR, not the crafting. that being said, the information flow for the kickstarter has been backwards. crafting ideas in CU are unique and are really cool do not get me wrong....but the huge surge of backers at the start came when little to nothing was released about anything crafter related. this money was collected on RvR hype and the potential to become some similar version of DaOC 2.0 (do not take this literally, i know how you are now).
sorry you got offended because you are in the miniority. In the end...no need to be enemies. we are in this together to get this game launched. just try not to ignore the fact that the majority of potential backers for this game NEED and REQUIRE updates on the RvR aspects. these updates should not be at the 11th hour.....
I also think crafters are the minority, but I also think there's more people interested in them than most people would think. But only 1 class on each Realm is a crafter class, so it seems they've also left the majority of the classes in the hands of the RvRers. So it comes across pretty balanced and well thought out.
why not reveal the meat and potatoes at the start of the kickstarter campaign? it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for, not crappy animation videos about crafting.
please, dont use words like "it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for ..." because you have no idea what everyone wants. for example i am backing CU because of the crafting and dont care about RvR/PvP at all.
So you're backing this RvR only game for the PvE parts of it? Interesting.
nope, for the crafting part of it (which isnt pve), for the chance to play dedicated crafter char
Ok, so you are in the small % of people who were foaming at the mouth for a crafter update. My point is, when the game was first announced to be a future kickstarter project....95% of the player base interested in it, were in it for the RvR...not the crafting. This information has been withheld from the largest % of players interested in backing this game until the last days. So any prospecting player who read about this project and was SEMI-interested and not a die hard fan like the rest of us...skimmed the materials and found nothing of interest and moved on. that is my concern....that people read the kickstarter page saw no content relevant to the RvR and will never return for the updates on day 26 of the 30 day project.
and my point is that you DONT KNOW if it was 95% (it is possible, but you dont know) so please stop throwing "95%" "EVERYONE" etc around. did you asked all the almost 9k backers?
way to latch on to a random percentage that i threw in the air to get the point across. i am guessing you are the same guy who grammar checks everyone on the forum as well. sorry if 95% is not exactly the correct percentage of backers or potential backers only interested in RvR. you are simply ignoring the fact that a majority of backers and potential backers are in this for the RvR, not the crafting. that being said, the information flow for the kickstarter has been backwards. crafting ideas in CU are unique and are really cool do not get me wrong....but the huge surge of backers at the start came when little to nothing was released about anything crafter related. this money was collected on RvR hype and the potential to become some similar version of DaOC 2.0 (do not take this literally, i know how you are now).
sorry you got offended because you are in the miniority. In the end...no need to be enemies. we are in this together to get this game launched. just try not to ignore the fact that the majority of potential backers for this game NEED and REQUIRE updates on the RvR aspects. these updates should not be at the 11th hour.....
Go further up and read my post quoting MJ comment.
No matter how you like the game and RvR, if there are not enough crafters to build the keeps and craft our stuff, it'll just be open field fights, so closer to a bad PvP game than RvR.
In short, without crafters the game is doomed.
So stop complaining about MJ trying to get us some of them.
Originally posted by Axxar I'm having a bit of a rough time deciding whether to play an RvRer or a crafter. Normally crafting is really boring in MMOs, but it looks like a lot of fun in CU. I guess eventually I'll have a crafter as well as an RvRer, but I don't have the time to focus on both straight off. Which to pick first?
RvR first and take his crafting up as high as possible to see how you like it
Originally posted by Axxar I also think crafters are the minority, but I also think there's more people interested in them than most people would think. But only 1 class on each Realm is a crafter class, so it seems they've also left the majority of the classes in the hands of the RvRers. So it comes across pretty balanced and well thought out.
Tanks and healer professions, like crafters, are also typically played by a minority of players. Personally I think it's a good thing the game will offer something for more than people wanting to see big numbers on the screen.
Comments
Hurrah! Good Guy Jacobs answers critics in respectful and intelligent manner.
Agree, couple hours of dedicated thought with a pad of paper outlining day 1 to day 30 would have made a huge difference.
I am backing, and will no matter what other info comes. I don't need to see anything running like others do.
but my guess is most people want to see substance instead of ideas
I don't even need substance. I am more disappointed in the lack or organization. I know he can make a game. I liked DAOC, I liked warhammer, I even liked Dragon's Gate. I feel like the Kickstarter would have faired a whole lot better if this was planned. Everything was done on a wimb and it is pretty obvious. This is honest feedback from a loyal fan of Jacobs. I really hope this project hasn't been blown due to poor project pplanning. I am a design coordinator in a completely different field, but the same principles still apply here.
Edited my poor attempt at writting this on my phone.
I love rvr Dean but I also like crafting and the videos were not crappy.
lol everyone is a critic, especially the ones who have never created a game.:P
I respect your criticism here, but I just feel the opposite. I think the KS campaign has been handled very well. Most successful KS projects start out with a bang, expereince a lull and then finish big. This campaign has followed that formula in terms of information reveals. I think the big difference is that this project went to KS in its very infancy, and this changes the type of information that is available and the amount of detail revealed. For some people, it was not timely nor as informative as they hoped.
We will know in about week who was right or wrong. I hope every one is happy in the end. Well, except for some of the hateful trolls, who just want to tear down the work and faith of others rather than be part of building something cool and different.
What did he say that's so bad?
the defensiveness is bordering on zealotry
Read my edit. My phone blew that post up. This kickstarter screams poor management and planning. Like I said I am a fan of Jacobs, I am a fan of his games. This has nothing the do with that ability, it falls completely on poor management. That is a bit disconcerning when you are putting faith in someone to manage a game throughout the duration of the project. I am a design coordinator in a different field, but the planning process for any project is virtually the same from the management side.
In that regard, I would say they did really well.
+1
please, dont use words like "it is what EVERYONE has been waiting for ..." because you have no idea what everyone wants. for example i am backing CU because of the crafting and dont care about RvR/PvP at all.
Relax,
im sure he is ONLY talking about 95% of the people. And fence sitters
So you're backing this RvR only game for the PvE parts of it? Interesting.
nope, for the crafting part of it (which isnt pve), for the chance to play dedicated crafter char
Ok, so you are in the small % of people who were foaming at the mouth for a crafter update. My point is, when the game was first announced to be a future kickstarter project....95% of the player base interested in it, were in it for the RvR...not the crafting. This information has been withheld from the largest % of players interested in backing this game until the last days. So any prospecting player who read about this project and was SEMI-interested and not a die hard fan like the rest of us...skimmed the materials and found nothing of interest and moved on. that is my concern....that people read the kickstarter page saw no content relevant to the RvR and will never return for the updates on day 26 of the 30 day project.
and my point is that you DONT KNOW if it was 95% (it is possible, but you dont know) so please stop throwing "95%" "EVERYONE" etc around. did you asked all the almost 9k backers?
way to latch on to a random percentage that i threw in the air to get the point across. i am guessing you are the same guy who grammar checks everyone on the forum as well. sorry if 95% is not exactly the correct percentage of backers or potential backers only interested in RvR. you are simply ignoring the fact that a majority of backers and potential backers are in this for the RvR, not the crafting. that being said, the information flow for the kickstarter has been backwards. crafting ideas in CU are unique and are really cool do not get me wrong....but the huge surge of backers at the start came when little to nothing was released about anything crafter related. this money was collected on RvR hype and the potential to become some similar version of DaOC 2.0 (do not take this literally, i know how you are now).
sorry you got offended because you are in the miniority. In the end...no need to be enemies. we are in this together to get this game launched. just try not to ignore the fact that the majority of potential backers for this game NEED and REQUIRE updates on the RvR aspects. these updates should not be at the 11th hour.....
Go further up and read my post quoting MJ comment.
No matter how you like the game and RvR, if there are not enough crafters to build the keeps and craft our stuff, it'll just be open field fights, so closer to a bad PvP game than RvR.
In short, without crafters the game is doomed.
So stop complaining about MJ trying to get us some of them.
RvR first and take his crafting up as high as possible to see how you like it
Tanks and healer professions, like crafters, are also typically played by a minority of players. Personally I think it's a good thing the game will offer something for more than people wanting to see big numbers on the screen.