Its not so much the fee to be accredited. To be accredited with the BBB it means you MUST abide by the arbitrators ruling on all complaints. These arbitrators are usually not experienced in all fields, such as Online gaming. So rulings they make would be frivolous at best.
The only reason I know this is because I work for a new home builder. We wont get accredited because the first complaint we receive from an unhappy homeowner, the arbitrator could rule that we purchase the home back from the owner.. Not going to happen.
And yet it seems to work just fine for companies like SOE, ArenaNET, and Turbine because they all have A+ ratings!
I think if a company isn't ready to offer high levels of customer service or can abide by simple standards other people in your same profession can follow. Then perhaps you really don't deserve to be a business.
Heres a homebuilder whos got an A+ no problem. Theres a reason why some small companies stay small.
Seeing as the BBB really has no power, no importance, or anything of substance, I don't see that it matters.
It's about as important as Angie's List.
You do realize how dumb that sounds, did you say this out loud first before you posted that, clearly not...
Most other business that want to deal with other business wont even touch a company that has anything less then a "B" rating.
PWE is the worst company I have ever in my life of living come across, this is something that took to long to come out tbh. I love MMOs I love playing them and I have only spoke negative about 1 other company since gaming so the fact that other large well accredit organizations are saying even worst then I was, is saying a lot. I dont want PWE to burn to the ground but I would be happy if they left the U.S. and band from selling here, they are thieves I would highly recommend against buying any of their related products.
Seeing as the BBB really has no power, no importance, or anything of substance, I don't see that it matters.
It's about as important as Angie's List.
I think it's funny how much power people think the BBB has. This what's going to happen when reported. IF they're actually guilty of the poor quality of service the BBB will down rate them and would most likely just take away their little BBB badge from the company. People need to realize that BBB is just customer service quality assurance.
And if you are a responsible consumer or investor you wouldn't touch anyone with a F rating unless you are ok with having a high likely chance of losing your money. Being a customer quality assurance is power in it self, think about it like this, do the three credit bureaus have power alone, nope, who gives them power the companies that used them.
Seeing as the BBB really has no power, no importance, or anything of substance, I don't see that it matters.
It's about as important as Angie's List.
I think it's funny how much power people think the BBB has. This what's going to happen when reported. IF they're actually guilty of the poor quality of service the BBB will down rate them and would most likely just take away their little BBB badge from the company. People need to realize that BBB is just customer service quality assurance.
And if you are a responsible consumer or investor you wouldn't touch anyone with a F rating unless you are ok with having a high likely chance of losing your money. Being a customer quality assurance is power in it self, think about it like this, do the three credit bureaus have power alone, nope, who gives them power the companies that used them.
BBB is not about QA. They will give anybody an A rating if they pay money.
Now, one does not need to join the BBB to get listed on their site. If you want a good rating however; you need to pay money and reply to the BBB's emails. No guarantee or requirement to fix or honor, just pay money and spend the time to replyto emails from the BBB.
Roses are red Violets are blue The reviewer has a mishapen head Which means his opinion is skewed ...Aldous.MF'n.Huxley
BBB is not about QA. They will give anybody an A rating if they pay money.
Now, one does not need to join the BBB to get listed on their site. If you want a good rating however; you need to pay money and reply to the BBB's emails. No guarantee or requirement to fix or honor, just pay money and spend the time to replyto emails from the BBB.
If all I had to do was pay a $66 dollar fee a month as a company making millions a month the size of PW (110 employees) to get an A rating, I would do it. This is no different then keeping insurance on your business in case you mess up a job that costs thousands.
Think about this: The BBB (a nonprofit organization) spends more then the $66 monthly fee (for 110 employee companies), in postage fees alone to monitor PW each month just for us the consumers. If your a business and your raking in millions and you cant afford to have one employee dedicated to responding to complaints with the BBB and paying the postage of the nonprofit BBB who monitors you, to ensure a good image for your company?
...... THEN YOU DONT BELONG RUNNING OR OWNING A BUSINESS! and at the very least don't get mad at someone who looks at that as lack of customer service.
BBB is not about QA. They will give anybody an A rating if they pay money.
Now, one does not need to join the BBB to get listed on their site. If you want a good rating however; you need to pay money and reply to the BBB's emails. No guarantee or requirement to fix or honor, just pay money and spend the time to replyto emails from the BBB.
If all I had to do was pay a $66 dollar fee a month as a company making millions a month the size of PW (110 employees) to get an A rating, I would do it. This is no different then keeping insurance on your business in case you mess up a job that costs thousands.
Think about this: The BBB (a nonprofit organization) spends more then the $66 monthly fee (for 110 employee companies), in postage fees alone to monitor PW each month just for us the consumers. If your a business and your raking in millions and you cant afford to have one employee dedicated to responding to complaints with the BBB and paying the postage of the nonprofit BBB who monitors you, to ensure a good image for your company?
...... THEN YOU DONT BELONG RUNNING OR OWNING A BUSINESS! and at the very least don't get mad at someone who looks at that as lack of customer service.
Your measuring stick of a good manager is not logical. As an owner, I would look at the bottom line. Is PWE making money, growing its market share, yes it is. Is the BBB going to do anything about that, nope.
You are a believer, that is fine. They are your go to for you when you want to complain, that is fine. YOu are not going to convince anybody and we are not going to change your mind, that is fine. Now, if you can prove that the BBB has any real power or authority to effect change, then I might consider your point as correct.
Roses are red Violets are blue The reviewer has a mishapen head Which means his opinion is skewed ...Aldous.MF'n.Huxley
Don't underestimate the power of the BBB. I filed a complaint against EA (in regards to Battlefield 3 issue) and I received a phone call from a higher up. I forgot his title. I got some free maps and an apology.
I don't know what value that rating has, but from my own experience with their customer support service, I can definitely tell you that I was less than impressed.
It took on average 5 days before they replied to my request or further replies from me. Their replies also didn't help much at all to solve my issue (instead they kept "forwarding" it to higher-ups). Eventually I got a reply saying that it was basically my fault and a solution that was utterly nonsensical when you'd take into account the information I already detailed in my first request. They also immediately flagged my issue as solved because 5 days had passed, even though it was them who took that time before replying.
In general, their replies were also not very professional, especially compared to the formal letter I'd written them. However, I wouldn't say that's a big deal, few people take the time and effort to reply in an equally polite way these days.
In comparison, GW2's customer service was miles ahead. It also took them a long time to reply, but when they did, they offered me an actual solution, further replies were also responded to quickly.
All that was also for a much harder issue (refunds for overcharging my credit card, I received them without bullshit). As such I also offered those guys my gratitude afterwards, it was pleasant dealing with them, can't say the same for perfect world (not that I expected it).
Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!
Obviously, they just don't care. It's stupid for them to waste their time and resources dealing with complaints through the BBB when they can deal with them directly. Furthermore, if they don't wish to pay, and don't wish to respond or waste such resources, they will be given something like an F.
This game and it's company should DEFINITELY not be judged by the BBB. The BBB is a load of dumb horse shit that feigns to make consumers feel better when they bitch.
I am curious, can you rate the BBB on their own site and if so what does their customer satisfaction score sit at.. ? (to early in the morning to go look it up)
I have personally had no problem getting support in NwN up until the scam issue, since then it have been a bit spotty so they might be doing some shuffling of people. Not saying the service is always good but i have at least had service. I would guess that many people have tried to have the effect of the caturday (both the people banned and otherwise effected) reversed and thus PWI get a crap ton of pointless tickets and the BBB get a bunch of in reality baseless complaints that PWI at the moment ignore.
Thus the poor rating... Then again BBB is like Xfire stats... Nice to have but in the end pointless beyond e-peen waving.
I'm not going to weight in on whether PWE has any worse customer service than other gaming companies, but I will say the BBB is a *fantastic* tool for consumers. I'm not saying the ratings are unfair or fair, or anything about them, but in many cases the BBB can get you positive resolution for an issue when no other viable means possibly can.
A personal example: I bought 3 copies of the MMO "APB" for $165 with tax. Two weeks later, with virtually no notice, Realtime Worlds (the developer) and EA (the publisher) announced that the servers would be closing in a few days, and that Realtime Worlds was bankrupt and defunct. The official policy was no refunds, but of course I tried to contact RTW anyway, no dice, company was basically closed immediately, all staff fired.
Now, part of the agreement when you purchased APB as guaranteed by EA in writing was that "30 days notice would be provided before closing the servers" and this did not happen, which left EA in breach of contract and liable. So I contacted them via phone, live chat, and e-mail to request a refund, in all cases it was denied. Next I tried to do a chargeback for fraud, but stupid me, I had paid with a giftcard with no chargeback / antifraud option instead of my usual bank card.
So now I've just had $165 stolen from me and nothing I can do about it, right? Filing an actual lawsuit never happens and what would be the point? Maybe in 8 years once it goes through court I'd be lucky not to end up losing $10,000 in fees.
But then there was the BBB. I contacted them, filed my complaint, showed all my proof of purchase as well as EA's written contract they broke. Within 2 days I had a response from a high up, offering me 3 replacement games from EA. I replied with a thank you for contacting me so quickly, but that wasn't going to be good enough. Eventually, although I didn't get my $165 refund in cash, I did get $200 in credit at the EA store to be used on any product, digital or physical, that they sold.
So from my point of view, as a consumer that got screwed by a big business, I don't care if the BBB is actually just a crack-addict with a laptop in a barn in the woods making up letter grades for companies that don't even exist. Because I got my complaint solved by the BBB when nothing else would have helped, and that's all that really matters.
So from my point of view, as a consumer that got screwed by a big business, I don't care if the BBB is actually just a crack-addict with a laptop in a barn in the woods making up letter grades for companies that don't even exist. Because I got my complaint solved by the BBB when nothing else would have helped, and that's all that really matters.
Indeed, it's good that these kinds of things exist. In the kind of volatile investment climate we live in currently, even a little bit of bad press can cause companies to lose potential investors, regardless of whether the source is highly regarded or not.
In any case, as a consumer it adds to the tools and contacts you can attempt to use.
If you're an EU citizen you can also take online transactions up with the website of the commission for example. Several people I know got refunds off steam that had been previously denied that way.
Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!
Finally, they have a F rating in San Francisco as referenced because they closed 58 of 80 complaints in the last 12 months.
Of these, 18 were resolved but not to the customer's satisfaction. 4 were unanswered.
While I feel they should probably have brought on more staff for Open Beta, frankly the game hasn't officially launched yet.
Hardly a damning indictment considering the massive volume of players in this game.
Note to the wise, if you truly have an issue with a company regarding a product or service and you have a legitimate complaint, contact the State Atty General's Office in that state. They have power.
Comments
And yet it seems to work just fine for companies like SOE, ArenaNET, and Turbine because they all have A+ ratings!
I think if a company isn't ready to offer high levels of customer service or can abide by simple standards other people in your same profession can follow. Then perhaps you really don't deserve to be a business.
Heres a homebuilder whos got an A+ no problem. Theres a reason why some small companies stay small.
http://www.bbb.org/canton/business-reviews/home-builders/schumacher-homes-inc-in-canton-oh-3000602
You do realize how dumb that sounds, did you say this out loud first before you posted that, clearly not...
Most other business that want to deal with other business wont even touch a company that has anything less then a "B" rating.
PWE is the worst company I have ever in my life of living come across, this is something that took to long to come out tbh. I love MMOs I love playing them and I have only spoke negative about 1 other company since gaming so the fact that other large well accredit organizations are saying even worst then I was, is saying a lot. I dont want PWE to burn to the ground but I would be happy if they left the U.S. and band from selling here, they are thieves I would highly recommend against buying any of their related products.
And if you are a responsible consumer or investor you wouldn't touch anyone with a F rating unless you are ok with having a high likely chance of losing your money. Being a customer quality assurance is power in it self, think about it like this, do the three credit bureaus have power alone, nope, who gives them power the companies that used them.
BBB is not about QA. They will give anybody an A rating if they pay money.
Now, one does not need to join the BBB to get listed on their site. If you want a good rating however; you need to pay money and reply to the BBB's emails. No guarantee or requirement to fix or honor, just pay money and spend the time to replyto emails from the BBB.
Roses are red
Violets are blue
The reviewer has a mishapen head
Which means his opinion is skewed
...Aldous.MF'n.Huxley
If all I had to do was pay a $66 dollar fee a month as a company making millions a month the size of PW (110 employees) to get an A rating, I would do it. This is no different then keeping insurance on your business in case you mess up a job that costs thousands.
Think about this: The BBB (a nonprofit organization) spends more then the $66 monthly fee (for 110 employee companies), in postage fees alone to monitor PW each month just for us the consumers. If your a business and your raking in millions and you cant afford to have one employee dedicated to responding to complaints with the BBB and paying the postage of the nonprofit BBB who monitors you, to ensure a good image for your company?
...... THEN YOU DONT BELONG RUNNING OR OWNING A BUSINESS! and at the very least don't get mad at someone who looks at that as lack of customer service.
Your measuring stick of a good manager is not logical. As an owner, I would look at the bottom line. Is PWE making money, growing its market share, yes it is. Is the BBB going to do anything about that, nope.
You are a believer, that is fine. They are your go to for you when you want to complain, that is fine. YOu are not going to convince anybody and we are not going to change your mind, that is fine. Now, if you can prove that the BBB has any real power or authority to effect change, then I might consider your point as correct.
Roses are red
Violets are blue
The reviewer has a mishapen head
Which means his opinion is skewed
...Aldous.MF'n.Huxley
Radix Malorum Est Cupiditas
I don't know what value that rating has, but from my own experience with their customer support service, I can definitely tell you that I was less than impressed.
It took on average 5 days before they replied to my request or further replies from me. Their replies also didn't help much at all to solve my issue (instead they kept "forwarding" it to higher-ups). Eventually I got a reply saying that it was basically my fault and a solution that was utterly nonsensical when you'd take into account the information I already detailed in my first request. They also immediately flagged my issue as solved because 5 days had passed, even though it was them who took that time before replying.
In general, their replies were also not very professional, especially compared to the formal letter I'd written them. However, I wouldn't say that's a big deal, few people take the time and effort to reply in an equally polite way these days.
In comparison, GW2's customer service was miles ahead. It also took them a long time to reply, but when they did, they offered me an actual solution, further replies were also responded to quickly.
All that was also for a much harder issue (refunds for overcharging my credit card, I received them without bullshit). As such I also offered those guys my gratitude afterwards, it was pleasant dealing with them, can't say the same for perfect world (not that I expected it).
Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!
EVERBODY FORGET THE BBB!
I know many people are saying it
The BBB does not matter.
Obviously, they just don't care. It's stupid for them to waste their time and resources dealing with complaints through the BBB when they can deal with them directly. Furthermore, if they don't wish to pay, and don't wish to respond or waste such resources, they will be given something like an F.
This game and it's company should DEFINITELY not be judged by the BBB. The BBB is a load of dumb horse shit that feigns to make consumers feel better when they bitch.
Pardon my low tolerance for stupidity.
I am curious, can you rate the BBB on their own site and if so what does their customer satisfaction score sit at.. ? (to early in the morning to go look it up)
I have personally had no problem getting support in NwN up until the scam issue, since then it have been a bit spotty so they might be doing some shuffling of people. Not saying the service is always good but i have at least had service. I would guess that many people have tried to have the effect of the caturday (both the people banned and otherwise effected) reversed and thus PWI get a crap ton of pointless tickets and the BBB get a bunch of in reality baseless complaints that PWI at the moment ignore.
Thus the poor rating... Then again BBB is like Xfire stats... Nice to have but in the end pointless beyond e-peen waving.
This have been a good conversation
I'm not going to weight in on whether PWE has any worse customer service than other gaming companies, but I will say the BBB is a *fantastic* tool for consumers. I'm not saying the ratings are unfair or fair, or anything about them, but in many cases the BBB can get you positive resolution for an issue when no other viable means possibly can.
A personal example: I bought 3 copies of the MMO "APB" for $165 with tax. Two weeks later, with virtually no notice, Realtime Worlds (the developer) and EA (the publisher) announced that the servers would be closing in a few days, and that Realtime Worlds was bankrupt and defunct. The official policy was no refunds, but of course I tried to contact RTW anyway, no dice, company was basically closed immediately, all staff fired.
Now, part of the agreement when you purchased APB as guaranteed by EA in writing was that "30 days notice would be provided before closing the servers" and this did not happen, which left EA in breach of contract and liable. So I contacted them via phone, live chat, and e-mail to request a refund, in all cases it was denied. Next I tried to do a chargeback for fraud, but stupid me, I had paid with a giftcard with no chargeback / antifraud option instead of my usual bank card.
So now I've just had $165 stolen from me and nothing I can do about it, right? Filing an actual lawsuit never happens and what would be the point? Maybe in 8 years once it goes through court I'd be lucky not to end up losing $10,000 in fees.
But then there was the BBB. I contacted them, filed my complaint, showed all my proof of purchase as well as EA's written contract they broke. Within 2 days I had a response from a high up, offering me 3 replacement games from EA. I replied with a thank you for contacting me so quickly, but that wasn't going to be good enough. Eventually, although I didn't get my $165 refund in cash, I did get $200 in credit at the EA store to be used on any product, digital or physical, that they sold.
So from my point of view, as a consumer that got screwed by a big business, I don't care if the BBB is actually just a crack-addict with a laptop in a barn in the woods making up letter grades for companies that don't even exist. Because I got my complaint solved by the BBB when nothing else would have helped, and that's all that really matters.
Indeed, it's good that these kinds of things exist. In the kind of volatile investment climate we live in currently, even a little bit of bad press can cause companies to lose potential investors, regardless of whether the source is highly regarded or not.
In any case, as a consumer it adds to the tools and contacts you can attempt to use.
If you're an EU citizen you can also take online transactions up with the website of the commission for example. Several people I know got refunds off steam that had been previously denied that way.
Feel free to use my referral link for SW:TOR if you want to test out the game. You'll get some special unlocks!
Really the BBB is a joke.
Companies don't have to resolve issues - They have to address them...
Additionally, the BBB sells the logo..
Here's a pretty good article in Time that discusses why the BBB should give itself a bad grade..
http://business.time.com/2013/03/19/why-the-better-business-bureau-should-give-itself-a-bad-grade/
Finally, they have a F rating in San Francisco as referenced because they closed 58 of 80 complaints in the last 12 months.
Of these, 18 were resolved but not to the customer's satisfaction. 4 were unanswered.
While I feel they should probably have brought on more staff for Open Beta, frankly the game hasn't officially launched yet.
Hardly a damning indictment considering the massive volume of players in this game.
Note to the wise, if you truly have an issue with a company regarding a product or service and you have a legitimate complaint, contact the State Atty General's Office in that state. They have power.
Seaspite
Playing ESO on my X-Box