A problem with MMORPG'S

kInGl)0m · November 2005

MMORPG'S are all pretty much the same in 1 or 2 ways such as: You get exp and level up, weapons require higher you to be a higher lvl to use them, MP and HP and so on.

But 1 bad thing they all have in common is...BOREDOM!

example: You download some random MMORPG with good reviews. You start off lvl 1 in a tutorial and by the end of the day your lvl 10-15. You keep playing non-stop for about a week and get to lvl 30-35. You get some good weapons and then it takes forever to lvl up, i mean you kill a really hard monster and then your exp bar goes up like 1.2%. I mean wheres the fun in that? So getting to the point, all games give about 1 week of fun and then 3 weeks boredom before another 1-2 weeks of fun as your finally lvl 50 and you can do cool stuff. After that basically no fun at all unless you love the game.

So overall most games give 2-3 weeks of fun and then just no fun at all. I think this is a major problem in the way MMORPG'S are made.

Thank you for reading, i'm here till Thursday

Razorback · November 2005

I agree with all of that, but there are 2 main forces at work here.

Firstly the copycat of success factor. Any developer that grew up in this industry around the time of UO/EQ has got it fixed in their head now that the recipe for success is somewhere between those two games, or perhaps more correctly that risk of failure lies outside those two games. This is of course a recipe for sameness and it is a recipe being lovingly prepared in the game kitchens of many game companies as we speak.

Secondly, experienced players are finding that the problem above is causing them to recognise and become bored with new games much faster. So the "churn rate" of title like EQ2 is probably hundreds of times what the churn rate for EQ1 was. Experienced players are now becoming sick of new MMO's in 6 weeks instead of 6 months and the more MMO's you have played the faster you will become sick of the next one.

And the bad news is.... that this is not the bad news. Relatively speaking what I just wrote is the good news lol.... because the bad news is this.

MMO's are only just now (last 6-12 months) entering the realm of "main stream" entertainment. So the largest portion of the market worth appealing to as a new game developer are N00b5. They have never felt the horror of the grind and are more than happy to play a game based on a 7+ year old model, which is what they will be doing in games like DnL and Vanguard.

Yes folks, I said it. DnL and Vanguard will just be new EQ clones, you know, I know it, everyone knows it. They dont have to make them anymore than that, they just have to market them well to the n00b5. So by all means reel off the list of alleged features that will be in these 2 new titles, like interactive GM's, exapnsive environments etc etc etc yada yada yada.... Those of us not born yesterday have heard it all before and it all spells EQ clone.

So what is there to look forward to for experienced MMO gamers ? In my opinion, not a lot...

We have moved from being a group of people that largely drove an industry to the point where it is now. The current industry is already challenging Hollywood for overall income and beating hollywood hands down for income on a title by title basis. I mean which do you think grossed more money, WoW or WoW (war of the worlds or world of the warcrafts)? Now we are a group of largely forgotten people, who even having guided this industry to greatness with our constant forum whining over the last 10 years, will be cast aside in favour of the N00b5. Because the N00b5 outnumber us 10,000 : 1

The only hope we have is that some company, with either some balls, some imagination, some money, or all of the above will go out on a limb and build something new for us. However if hollywood is any indication of the risk taking in modern corporate world, we can look forward to playing World of Warcraft version 2, 3 and 55 and not much else.

tigris67 · November 2005

yah..I sorta agree..but WoW and EQ were 2 games that held my attention for years...

kInGl)0m · November 2005

Well basically all games are only slightly different and mainly all the big games today are EQ clones. I suppose WoW (world of Warcraft) did earn a lot of money ($40 a box with hundreds of millions boxes sold) but a lot more poeple have heard of Wow(war of the worlds) tahn WoW (world of warcraft). Both of them will keep earning money through the years (War of the worlds on DVD and World of Warcraft with expansion etc.) So yes , we will be forgotten.

lunamonster · November 2005

Well all mainstream games are Everquest hybrids but there are less mainstream games trying to break the mould. Not all of them are too succesful though.

kInGl)0m · November 2005

most games are EQ hybrids (like you said) with dream of becoming the next Ragnorak, Runescape etc.

lunamonster · November 2005

Runescape is succesful because it's a good game though it's ok but it's not great. The only reason Runescape was so succesful is because it's so accesible. If people want to make the next Runescape make a good browser based game and add a free version.

Oops drifting off topic sorry ::::21:: . Yeah all it takes is one succesful game that breaks the EQ mould for other people to follow.

kInGl)0m · November 2005

Runescape was the first MMORPG i ever played and i thought it was great! then i downloaded ROSE and played it and wondered why i wasted my time on runescape

. I think Browser based games are a league of their own but nowadays i prefer downloaded ones. I'm thinkin of trying out FlyFF. Do you know if it's any good?

lunamonster · November 2005

Actually I haven't tried it yet.

kInGl)0m · November 2005

I've only heard good things about it. I'd say that it's pretty good.

kInGl)0m · November 2005

Know any good MMORPG'S that aren't EQ hybrids? If FlyFF is no good i won't play any for a while

lunamonster · November 2005

Well EVE Online seems pretty popular although it can be a bit boring.

daeandor · November 2005

Athough powergamers might disagree with me...

You are correct that most MMORPGs follow a very set formula, however I do not believe this is what makes them boring. I believe that what makes them boring is lack of social interaction. If a game does not provide a means of social interaction, then it is destined to become boring. Social interaction can be forced or voluntary. Some popular examples (which will get nitpicked, but oh well):

EQ is a forced interaction game. You are forced through difficulty in reaching the "end game" in joining a guild which then essentially forces you to interact through regular raiding of high end content. This experience can either be extremely exciting in itself or the ultimate form of boredom depending on your personality. This method is proven at being a successful means to create a social atmosphere regardless of whether you like it or not. The subscription numbers alone since its release is proof enough.

SWG (pre-CU) was a voluntary interaction game. You could join a PA (guild) or not, there was no requirement to access high end content, for the most part, within the confines of large raid type activities. SWG also provided several classes which were almost entirely based on social interaction, medic, doctor, and the entertainer classes (up until buff-bots become commonplace). SWG's model obviously did not work. The reasons go beyond social and are too numerous to begin to try and break down here.

Wow is a combination of voluntary and forced interaction. You can successfully achieve "end-game" status entirely through solo play, however there is some content that requires interaction beyond pickup groups / raids. WoW maintains success for the simple reason that although social interaction is not required, most people fall into the late game either getting bored and quiting, or joining (read "being forced") a guild to extend their enjoyable gameplay.

Anyhow, my theory is that without a good means to have players interact with each other, a game is destined to become boring. People interact in different ways so this does not mean there needs to be a cantina in which people gather and their avatars sit and drink or dance or whatever. There just needs to be some means to allow people to feel compelled to socialize, preferrably without feeling actually "forced."

daeandor · November 2005

Originally posted by lunamonster

Well EVE Online seems pretty popular although it can be a bit boring.

EVE is extremely boring unless you get in a good corporation. The bad news is that if you are a true newb to the game, often corporations lure newbs in with promises of cash and equipment, but essentially end up forcing you to become thier corp hauler monkeys. In the end, unless you want to just be someone who hauls stuff from one location to another, you end up making your character with a skillset that is not of your liking. EVE is also notorios for scams on newbs....

The game itself is extremely involved though and has many good parts to it.

kInGl)0m · November 2005

i'm downloading FlyFF right now... I hope it's fun because it has really good feedback,graphics praise etc.

Marauder · November 2005

In response to post #2, DnL will hopefully add on to EQ in that it will have an in-depth PvP system along with "social xp" *IF* everything they say about the game comes around, DnL could be a great game. I have very large doubts of this however, and as time goes by my doubts are only increasing.....Personally, I play a lot of online FPS (not CS, though), so I love the fast-paced and challenging combat. However, I also like to achieve in games. MMORGPs allow me to have more opportunities to achieve, yet they aren't as fast-paced. If I could get a fast-paced, exciting MMORPG that has crap loads of content, I'd be in gaming heaven

Marauder · November 2005

EDIT: ack, double post....sorry....

kInGl)0m · November 2005

I'm hoping my thread will get to 25 posts -.-...

I think i should give EVE a go soon but i'll look at the graphics,storyline etc. before i download of it will be crap.

Razorback · November 2005

Originally posted by Marauder
*IF* everything they say about the game comes around, DnL could be a great game.

Yup the big IF

I agree with, IF they do all that it WILL be a great game.

My problem I guess is that they have already got a list of stuff they are leaving out at launch that is longer than the list of stuff they are putting in. Its the same old same old. Promise a revolutionary new MMO and settle for launching another EQ clone.

I hope Im completely wrong.

Marauder · November 2005

Lol, I hope you're wrong too. As far as the pre-order thing they have going now, I can tell you that I would not buy into it unless you are doing it to donate to the cause of developing DnL. With SoG is going to come a significant amount of heart-ache. The more in-depth knowledge you receive about DnL as time goes by, the more disappointed it seems to make you. It has such a good idea, it just can't seem to follow through. Like it has been said, this is becoming more and more often, and it just gets disappointing in the gaming industry as a whole. Expect little and you won't be disappointed....expect what they say there will be, and you will surely be disappointed.

theanimedude · December 2005

Want to know how to force human interaction? Take out NPC shops... that will make people buy from others. Which will force you to look for others when you need items. Also, that would stop there from only being like 12 recipes in most games... because players would need to be the key, making crafting more fun/needed.

Rikimaru_X · December 2005

Play Anarchy Online. Trust me, you won't see that playing that game

xyklon · December 2005

only reason flyff has gotten som positiv feedback is because its free..

Marauder · December 2005

I love games that have player based economies. However, I think it is essential for the players to be able to market their items without having to stand and shout " Ub3r-1337 Armor 4 sale cheap!!!!

Also, player based economies based on crafting also make the crafting more interesting and fun, so it gives the game more depth.

RadicalMe · December 2005

Know what yo mean... Low gameplay

www.fiction-online.tk

punchline · December 2005

Originally posted by Marauder
I love games that have player based economies. However, I think it is essential for the players to be able to market their items without having to stand and shout " Ub3r-1337 Armor 4 sale cheap!!!!
Also, player based economies based on crafting also make the crafting more interesting and fun, so it gives the game more depth.

i like this idea alot... where you can be talking to some guildies and be like .. wehre do you guys pick up weapons... o yeah i go to marauders shop cuz he has good prices and selection and hes a nice guy..... getting a rep in the economy would be a nice addition to a game def.

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