I love turned base games (currently playing Warhammer Quest, and Xcom Enemy Unknown, which is one of the best games i have played).
But why do we need to make them MMO?
I don't think it adds anything to the fun. Just have a MP mode and a lobby. I don't think making turn based games into MMO will be fun. You don't want to wait for 100 others to finish their turn, do you?
Originally posted by botrytis Sorry no. The reason being it is based on a dice roll (basically what it is) so no, I would rather use my skill to react than base it on luck of the dice roll.
I assume you talking about a specific game rather than turn-based play in general? Because ... chess.
I dislike the waiting since it is a immersion breaker for me. It is all not very realistic.
People keep saying they don't want to feel they are playing a game and then ask for something that will make it feel like a game.
Originally posted by darkhalf357x I would love a turn-based game having grown up with Final Fantasy (1 and up) and DragonQuest. But to be honest I feel the era is dead and the new 'thing' today is twitchy shallow action and then called an RPG. Kids today arent old enough to remember or appreciate the past and companies today are laser focused on profits to invest in a niche market. Not saying it cant happen but dont have high confidence.
Hell, I never understood why ChronoTrigger combat mechanics were NEVER duplicated. That was a fun mix of action and turn-based goodness.
To get my fix Im playing the Kemco RPGs for android. Not as good as the 16bit legends but good enough.
You totally read my mind. I grew up with the same set of games and I feel a sense of loss over this style of game-play. These days, I play lots of twitch-based games, and have a lot of fun with them...but they just can't quite compare to the RPG's of the past. I'd love to see an MMORPG in the tune of Final Fantasy Tactics. Not necessarily made by Squenix, but definitely with a great rendition of the combat mechanics.
You totally read my mind. I grew up with the same set of games and I feel a sense of loss over this style of game-play. These days, I play lots of twitch-based games, and have a lot of fun with them...but they just can't quite compare to the RPG's of the past. I'd love to see an MMORPG in the tune of Final Fantasy Tactics. Not necessarily made by Squenix, but definitely with a great rendition of the combat mechanics.
Why don't you just play tactical RPG then? There is no reason you can't play one unless it is made into a MMO.
In fact, i see little reason to make a tactical RPG into a MMO. You can't do a turn-based game with hundreds (probably not even 10) of players playing at together at the same time.
Originally posted by botrytis Sorry no. The reason being it is based on a dice roll (basically what it is) so no, I would rather use my skill to react than base it on luck of the dice roll.
It's actually more strategic combat in some ways, as your goal is to both predict what the opponent is about to do while planning your own moves.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I'm fond of turn based RPGs which is why I'm looking forward to kickstarter projects like Wasteland 2 etc.
and I had fun with Atlantica Online as a turn based MMORPG for awhile till the cash shop wall hit.Though I ahte to see a MMORPG using turn based combat in large scale PvP or PvE raids with 20+ people.That would be tedious.
You could have some sort of simultaneous turn.
Game is real time, after X seconds, the game is frozen and while the game is frozen (for Y seconds), you can select what to do. Then the game continue for X seconds and the char do what you told him to do, you can control your char while the game is not frozen too.
If Wakfu didn't get so darn grindy I'd probably still be playing it. Thinking about it now does make me want to load it up though. I wish there were more MMO's like it.
You totally read my mind. I grew up with the same set of games and I feel a sense of loss over this style of game-play. These days, I play lots of twitch-based games, and have a lot of fun with them...but they just can't quite compare to the RPG's of the past. I'd love to see an MMORPG in the tune of Final Fantasy Tactics. Not necessarily made by Squenix, but definitely with a great rendition of the combat mechanics.
Why don't you just play tactical RPG then? There is no reason you can't play one unless it is made into a MMO.
In fact, i see little reason to make a tactical RPG into a MMO. You can't do a turn-based game with hundreds (probably not even 10) of players playing at together at the same time.
I do, and have played plenty of tactical RPG's, and I think you've missed the point. Re-read the OP and the thread...there are at least a few turn-based MMO's with, probably, hundreds to thousands of people playing at the same time. The big difference is that these types of games don't play out (with the same game mechanics) like WoW, DAoC, or most of the big names out there. If players are in parties and/or doing pvp, they all (usually) have a time-limit set for each player's turn to prevent griefing (sitting there, not taking turns). There are usually strict limits on party sizes (if any parties are allowed) and heavy uses of instancing, but it HAS been done...just not with a TRPG coat of paint (that I know of). If that's what you meant by "people playing together", then I somewhat agree. Things like raids and large-scale pvp would probably be difficult to pull off, though, I doubt impossible. To each his own.
I'm fond of turn based RPGs which is why I'm looking forward to kickstarter projects like Wasteland 2 etc.
and I had fun with Atlantica Online as a turn based MMORPG for awhile till the cash shop wall hit.Though I ahte to see a MMORPG using turn based combat in large scale PvP or PvE raids with 20+ people.That would be tedious.
You could have some sort of simultaneous turn.
Game is real time, after X seconds, the game is frozen and while the game is frozen (for Y seconds), you can select what to do. Then the game continue for X seconds and the char do what you told him to do, you can control your char while the game is not frozen too.
I could kind of see something like ^this^ being done, too. Also, rather than each player taking their turns in sequential order, maybe each party/team member could possibly take their turns simultaneously, but all with the same time limit. Things like skill/ability/spell combos (amongst players) might have to be done at random, but the results could still be fun.
Originally posted by darkhalf357x I would love a turn-based game having grown up with Final Fantasy (1 and up) and DragonQuest. But to be honest I feel the era is dead and the new 'thing' today is twitchy shallow action and then called an RPG. Kids today arent old enough to remember or appreciate the past and companies today are laser focused on profits to invest in a niche market. Not saying it cant happen but dont have high confidence.
Hell, I never understood why ChronoTrigger combat mechanics were NEVER duplicated. That was a fun mix of action and turn-based goodness.
To get my fix Im playing the Kemco RPGs for android. Not as good as the 16bit legends but good enough.
Chrono Trigger and other square games werent duplicated because the ATB system is patented by square so no one else is legally allowed to use it unless square gives permission and they get payed for it. They did the same thing with the cross-hotbar system for gamepad controls in FFXIV ARR
Chrono Trigger and other square games werent duplicated because the ATB system is patented by square so no one else is legally allowed to use it unless square gives permission and they get payed for it. They did the same thing with the cross-hotbar system for gamepad controls in FFXIV ARR
As much as I loved early Square games, it's not like the ATB system was anything more than a gimmick. It's a real-time combat system where you have a set of options each round for a character -- in that respect it's just a scaled back version of what MMORPG combat typically is anyway (with global cooldowns acting as the same psuedo-turn-based meter.)
Patent or no, people are still making turn-based, psuedo-turn-based, and real-time combat systems with no worries of infringement.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
I'm fond of turn based RPGs which is why I'm looking forward to kickstarter projects like Wasteland 2 etc.
and I had fun with Atlantica Online as a turn based MMORPG for awhile till the cash shop wall hit.Though I ahte to see a MMORPG using turn based combat in large scale PvP or PvE raids with 20+ people.That would be tedious.
You could have some sort of simultaneous turn.
Game is real time, after X seconds, the game is frozen and while the game is frozen (for Y seconds), you can select what to do. Then the game continue for X seconds and the char do what you told him to do, you can control your char while the game is not frozen too.
I could kind of see something like ^this^ being done, too. Also, rather than each player taking their turns in sequential order, maybe each party/team member could possibly take their turns simultaneously, but all with the same time limit. Things like skill/ability/spell combos (amongst players) might have to be done at random, but the results could still be fun.
With my idea, everyone moves (and select their moves) at the same time. Well if you think about it, the game is trully real time, it just froze (for Y seconds) the game every X seconds and ALSO while the game is frozen the players can select what their characters will do.
I dont know how my system could work in a non simultaneous way, at least without thinking about it. Also, the point of it is to mix be really real time but sort of also have turns.
Whats funny is alot of people think "turn based" means easy combat when the opposite is moer true.....I find real time combat much easier because it is dumbed down and simpler usually......I thought ATlantica was a great game but didnt like the way they handled the end game.....THey were on the right track though.
Wartune is as close to turn-base as any MMO can be online without wasting peoples times...
You have until your character perform his action to decide what to do...if you fail to click it in time, your heroe will still perform a basic attack.
Now, the game is simple, yet sooo many ramifications as to how to developp your character and stats to get here, and there, and overthere, and under the brush, and... :P
I quit it however, cannot give it as much time as it would require and I cannot settle for less...bad Padawan I am!
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
as someone who played Myth war 2 for 4-5 years i feel ya i miss true turn based games. Whats sad is games like myth war can be so great but there is a idoit company running the game and don't doing crap with it so it turns out ugly. Altis gates was a amazing turn based game coming out went to open beta had people burning 10k+ usd on it but somehow the company hasn't talked about the game since. There is so many things you can do with combat like that its insane and sad no major company has decided to anything with turn based. sure there is atlantica which is lame cause your controlling your entire party and have to burn cash. I remenber my time on myth war guild war was the best true tactical combat over 200 players in both guilds in straight up 5v5 flag each person burning over 500usd just to be the best. hopefully one company gets smart and gets in on the turn based mmo cause i'd be ready to play pay or w/e for it.
fyi don't play myth war 2 it's dead and horrible now iggs the people who run the game don't do anything with it.
Turn-based MMO's haven't been all that fun or exciting up until now. There's a reason even MMO's that are based on single player games with a turn-based combat system always end up conforming to the real time combat MMO's generally use. Like Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest for example, they both switched up their style when entering the MMO space.
Not to say I'm against the idea, though. If done right, I'd play one, but it would have to be incredibly well done, and I can't even say for certain what that means in terms of gameplay, strategy, etc.
I'd say the best bet for a new turn-based MMO is an indie browser game or something, rather than a full-scale triple-A MMO.
Well community is great ,how does a turn based game support that?I do not see a turn base system working when you have several players involved.Turn based is better in single player mode or maybe duo but even 4 would put it out of place.
I can sort of think of Wiz101,you needed 4 players for some of the content but at the same time,it showed flaws in the system.
How does the game determine who goes next?Imagine you have 3-6 enemies and your healer is randomly picked to go last.So you have say 6 creatures all attack the same player and you have no way to heal him until your Healer's turn,result is dead player.The system would always be flawed like that,sometimes your healers would go first but you haven't been damaged yet lol,so they went for nothing,then the mobs set forth to unleash damage and your all dead.
IMO it is only a single player maybe duo mechanic,it will not work well in a MMO environment,just imagine having 24 players and maybe a dozen enemies.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Wartune is as close to turn-base as any MMO can be online without wasting peoples times...
You have until your character perform his action to decide what to do...if you fail to click it in time, your heroe will still perform a basic attack.
Now, the game is simple, yet sooo many ramifications as to how to developp your character and stats to get here, and there, and overthere, and under the brush, and... :P
I quit it however, cannot give it as much time as it would require and I cannot settle for less...bad Padawan I am!
Eh, nobody's a bad padawan for giving up on a rather shallow game. The turn-based combat was pretty mediocre when it comes to tactical decision-making.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
Comments
I love turned base games (currently playing Warhammer Quest, and Xcom Enemy Unknown, which is one of the best games i have played).
But why do we need to make them MMO?
I don't think it adds anything to the fun. Just have a MP mode and a lobby. I don't think making turn based games into MMO will be fun. You don't want to wait for 100 others to finish their turn, do you?
I dislike the waiting since it is a immersion breaker for me. It is all not very realistic.
People keep saying they don't want to feel they are playing a game and then ask for something that will make it feel like a game.
Makes sense as a reason to avoid such games.
( I sometimes find myself in games that have over a month between turns
)
You totally read my mind. I grew up with the same set of games and I feel a sense of loss over this style of game-play. These days, I play lots of twitch-based games, and have a lot of fun with them...but they just can't quite compare to the RPG's of the past. I'd love to see an MMORPG in the tune of Final Fantasy Tactics. Not necessarily made by Squenix, but definitely with a great rendition of the combat mechanics.
Why don't you just play tactical RPG then? There is no reason you can't play one unless it is made into a MMO.
In fact, i see little reason to make a tactical RPG into a MMO. You can't do a turn-based game with hundreds (probably not even 10) of players playing at together at the same time.
It's actually more strategic combat in some ways, as your goal is to both predict what the opponent is about to do while planning your own moves.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
You could have some sort of simultaneous turn.
Game is real time, after X seconds, the game is frozen and while the game is frozen (for Y seconds), you can select what to do. Then the game continue for X seconds and the char do what you told him to do, you can control your char while the game is not frozen too.
Wizard 101 and Pirate 101 are also turn-based.
Bang Howdy is semi-turn-based, in that it's real-time combat in which each character can only move once every twenty seconds.
Thanks,
Mike
Working on Social Strategy MMORTS (now Launched!) http://www.worldalpha.com
I do, and have played plenty of tactical RPG's, and I think you've missed the point. Re-read the OP and the thread...there are at least a few turn-based MMO's with, probably, hundreds to thousands of people playing at the same time. The big difference is that these types of games don't play out (with the same game mechanics) like WoW, DAoC, or most of the big names out there. If players are in parties and/or doing pvp, they all (usually) have a time-limit set for each player's turn to prevent griefing (sitting there, not taking turns). There are usually strict limits on party sizes (if any parties are allowed) and heavy uses of instancing, but it HAS been done...just not with a TRPG coat of paint (that I know of). If that's what you meant by "people playing together", then I somewhat agree. Things like raids and large-scale pvp would probably be difficult to pull off, though, I doubt impossible. To each his own.
I could kind of see something like ^this^ being done, too. Also, rather than each player taking their turns in sequential order, maybe each party/team member could possibly take their turns simultaneously, but all with the same time limit. Things like skill/ability/spell combos (amongst players) might have to be done at random, but the results could still be fun.
Chrono Trigger and other square games werent duplicated because the ATB system is patented by square so no one else is legally allowed to use it unless square gives permission and they get payed for it. They did the same thing with the cross-hotbar system for gamepad controls in FFXIV ARR
As much as I loved early Square games, it's not like the ATB system was anything more than a gimmick. It's a real-time combat system where you have a set of options each round for a character -- in that respect it's just a scaled back version of what MMORPG combat typically is anyway (with global cooldowns acting as the same psuedo-turn-based meter.)
Patent or no, people are still making turn-based, psuedo-turn-based, and real-time combat systems with no worries of infringement.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
With my idea, everyone moves (and select their moves) at the same time. Well if you think about it, the game is trully real time, it just froze (for Y seconds) the game every X seconds and ALSO while the game is frozen the players can select what their characters will do.
I dont know how my system could work in a non simultaneous way, at least without thinking about it. Also, the point of it is to mix be really real time but sort of also have turns.
Wartune is as close to turn-base as any MMO can be online without wasting peoples times...
You have until your character perform his action to decide what to do...if you fail to click it in time, your heroe will still perform a basic attack.
Now, the game is simple, yet sooo many ramifications as to how to developp your character and stats to get here, and there, and overthere, and under the brush, and... :P
I quit it however, cannot give it as much time as it would require and I cannot settle for less...bad Padawan I am!
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
as someone who played Myth war 2 for 4-5 years i feel ya i miss true turn based games. Whats sad is games like myth war can be so great but there is a idoit company running the game and don't doing crap with it so it turns out ugly. Altis gates was a amazing turn based game coming out went to open beta had people burning 10k+ usd on it but somehow the company hasn't talked about the game since. There is so many things you can do with combat like that its insane and sad no major company has decided to anything with turn based. sure there is atlantica which is lame cause your controlling your entire party and have to burn cash. I remenber my time on myth war guild war was the best true tactical combat over 200 players in both guilds in straight up 5v5 flag each person burning over 500usd just to be the best. hopefully one company gets smart and gets in on the turn based mmo cause i'd be ready to play pay or w/e for it.
fyi don't play myth war 2 it's dead and horrible now iggs the people who run the game don't do anything with it.
Turn-based MMO's haven't been all that fun or exciting up until now. There's a reason even MMO's that are based on single player games with a turn-based combat system always end up conforming to the real time combat MMO's generally use. Like Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest for example, they both switched up their style when entering the MMO space.
Not to say I'm against the idea, though. If done right, I'd play one, but it would have to be incredibly well done, and I can't even say for certain what that means in terms of gameplay, strategy, etc.
I'd say the best bet for a new turn-based MMO is an indie browser game or something, rather than a full-scale triple-A MMO.
Not sure if it was mentioned or not but Wakfu is a Turn-Based game with a FF-Tactics kind of system. It's actually a decent, yet underrated game.
Give it a try sometime, you might be pleasantly surprised.
Well community is great ,how does a turn based game support that?I do not see a turn base system working when you have several players involved.Turn based is better in single player mode or maybe duo but even 4 would put it out of place.
I can sort of think of Wiz101,you needed 4 players for some of the content but at the same time,it showed flaws in the system.
How does the game determine who goes next?Imagine you have 3-6 enemies and your healer is randomly picked to go last.So you have say 6 creatures all attack the same player and you have no way to heal him until your Healer's turn,result is dead player.The system would always be flawed like that,sometimes your healers would go first but you haven't been damaged yet lol,so they went for nothing,then the mobs set forth to unleash damage and your all dead.
IMO it is only a single player maybe duo mechanic,it will not work well in a MMO environment,just imagine having 24 players and maybe a dozen enemies.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Eh, nobody's a bad padawan for giving up on a rather shallow game. The turn-based combat was pretty mediocre when it comes to tactical decision-making.
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver