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Crafting System???
Slavakk
Member Posts: 36
I hope they do keep the Eq2 crafting platform.. still one of the best to date MMO.. On 2 Servers I had every crafter at 90 between 2 accounts... And PvP wise crafting was essential until you got your Fabled w/e.. and the consumables Food/Drink/Pots/Totems/Etc..
Comments
http://www.mmorpg.com/mobile/features.cfm?read=4947&game=6&ismb=1
And that list is bogus, and you keep hanging on Smeds "sandbox" claim.
Well Domino Taylor is on the EQNext team, and she was the tradeskill developer for EQ2.
Personally I hope they take the tradeskill system and make it even deeper. I thought the minigame to craft an item got a bit stale after a while.
EQ2's crafting system was pretty simplistic and bland. If you think that's indicative of "one of the best to date" you haven't looked around much.
Vanguard:SOH, Crafting was it's own game, basically on par with adventuring.
In VG:SOH:
Crafters had their own gear, ranging from common to legendary, and like adventuring gear improves combat power, crafting gear had stats that improved your ability to craft.
The act of crafting itself was a game much like adventuring. You used skills, that you learned more of as you leveled, to combat complications and take advantage of inspirations that happened during the crafting of an item. The better you played your crafting class, the better you did at crafting the item.
Crafters could create materials that were used in not just making adventuring gear, but also houses, guild halls and boats that could be placed in the open world. The larger boats, homes and guild halls were often extremely hard to craft, and required many people working together to make it happen. Crafting a guild hall was almost the equivalent of Raiding in adventuring.
Crafting wasn't just a series of "Skill point +'s", crafting had it's own leveling, from 1-50, just like adventuring.
Crafters could custom make gear to order. Everything from the look of the weapon, the end quality (rarity, blue, yellow, orange, red, etc), the type of stats the item had (You want a sword with +5 str or +5 dex?) and even adding a specific proc to the item (You want it to proc a protection spell or a lighting strike?). The end result was the ability to make highly customizable, personal gear right to order for your customer.
Crafters even had their own quests and epic quests. Quests that sent them traveling across the world to gain big exp, get rare crafting gear, earn money or learn rare recipe's from master crafter NPCs.
Raid monsters dropped raid level gear, but they also dropped Legendary crafting materials. Raid gear was great, but the "Best" gear was crafted by master crafters using legendary materials dropped by raid mobs. Basically, crafting was not trivialized by dropped gear.
You get the point?
Crafting was not a side thought. It wasn't just some tool to harvest consumables or a UI for popping out items once you collected a few materials. Crafting was a complete way to play the game that was just as valuable, challenging and rewarding as adventuring.
I hope EQN is a system like this, but better, and more modern. If it has a crafting system like EQ, EQ2 or Aion, I will be sad lol. I think a lot of sandbox fans would be sad too. But I know they're going to do it right. August 2nd.
Legends of Kesmai, UO, EQ, AO, DAoC, AC, SB, RO, SWG, EVE, EQ2, CoH, GW, VG:SOH, WAR, Aion, DF, CO, MO, DN, Tera, SWTOR, RO2, DP, GW2, PS2, BnS, NW, FF:XIV, ESO, EQ:NL
I'll agree SWG had a good system too.
However.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJ-mcJxvkTk
This is not anything close to what VG crafting system was lol. The guy is just sitting there watching RNG take place.
I don't recall EQ2 having any boats. I also don't recall being able to craft houses or guild halls. Just little items you put in the house.
Allowing crafters to custom make gear is a huge deal.
You had a few quests for EQ2 (at least when I played), but no where near as involved or as many as VG.
The raid dropped materials from VG made unique items. It didn't just enhance some items like EQ2 (at least when I played).
Now admittedly I haven't played EQ2 since VG launched, so they might have added or changed the crafting system. But from what I remember, EQ2's crafting system was a shell compared to VG.
Bottom line. The EQN team has made a crafting system that crafters can be proud of. It's going to be a game in itself and on August 2nd you'll get to see why.
Legends of Kesmai, UO, EQ, AO, DAoC, AC, SB, RO, SWG, EVE, EQ2, CoH, GW, VG:SOH, WAR, Aion, DF, CO, MO, DN, Tera, SWTOR, RO2, DP, GW2, PS2, BnS, NW, FF:XIV, ESO, EQ:NL
Crafting is pretty much pointless when raiding is the main focus of the game which it is in the case of VG and EQ2.
I have to agree. SWG had the most complex crafting . If you put in the time to get the best resources you would craft the best items. Not like the go hit this node and get the same materials as everyone else , rinse and repeat system used by most games. Crafting was it's own game. COPY the SWG crafting ,please!
The crafting should not be a stupid mini game where you can die from the results.
Those systems were the worst ever in games and part of the reason I passed on both.
What we need is a simple start that gets more complex as it goes.
The difficulty and failure rates only dictated by the power and complexity of an item. If failure happens obviously losing valuable items which were difficult to come by should be far enough "mini game" for most.
I am a fan of learning recipes by either finding them off creatures or as quest rewards or by plane old experimenting. Once learned you have them in your crafting book similar to a spell book with the ingredients and even steps taken to ensure success, like only brewing night owl ale at night for success.
This is fun and entertaining. Not some mini-game "Crack" "the saw slipped and you cut yourself for half your life" "Bonk" "the board you were using broke and you suffer another half health"...."you have died, please wait" So annoying that was....
I disagree. It's all about making each of game styles work well together. Good luck building a guild hall or a large boat in VG without any crafters.
VG laid the foundation for a great crafting system and for the most part did a great job especially when it came to end game items. Quite a few items require a raid acquire "legendary components" and it took a master crafter with the recipe to make the item. And the master crafted items were better than the dropped raid gear, so it was worth doing. They weren't just enhancements of raid gear, they were actually unique items, often with unique names, stats, procs, looks, etc.
There should have been something like this for every single character slot in the game. However it was only 2 or 3 pieces per player at most. But still, it showed that it worked and it was nice to not trivialize crafter's work with raid drops.
I know EQN is going to give us something with as much or more depth than VG crafting system. and it's going to play a large roll in the sandbox.
Legends of Kesmai, UO, EQ, AO, DAoC, AC, SB, RO, SWG, EVE, EQ2, CoH, GW, VG:SOH, WAR, Aion, DF, CO, MO, DN, Tera, SWTOR, RO2, DP, GW2, PS2, BnS, NW, FF:XIV, ESO, EQ:NL
SWG
http://sandboxer.org/?p=2377
TLDR?
1. Item Decay
2. Customization
3. Experimentation
4. Resource Variation
5. Automated Harvesting
6. Mass Production
7. Loot Sucks
8. Non-Instanced Housing
I'd say some of those on the list are good, and some are subjective, and some are down right bad.
But I have faith that the dev team has made a worthy crafting system for EQN.
Legends of Kesmai, UO, EQ, AO, DAoC, AC, SB, RO, SWG, EVE, EQ2, CoH, GW, VG:SOH, WAR, Aion, DF, CO, MO, DN, Tera, SWTOR, RO2, DP, GW2, PS2, BnS, NW, FF:XIV, ESO, EQ:NL
If they straight up ripped off SWG gathering/crafting I'd be really torn between EQN and FFXIV....actually, Id probably (begrudgingly at first) play EQN haha
Trying to simplify the similarities between VG crafting and EQ2 crafting is laughable at best. Its like saying the games have classes and quests and maps and trees and skills blah blah blah.
Its how those thinks are implemented that count. And VGs crafting is leaps and bound better then EQ2s crafting. More complex. More in depth. More engaging. and just plain more.
If EQN adopts the EQ2 crafting system, it will a huge reason WHY i don't play it. Or wont play it for long. VG/SWG/A Tale in the Desert/Zsyon. A form of any of these crafting systems should be instituted into EQN.
Or they could just do this
+1
Unless Crafting goes hand in hand with raid drops like it did in VG.
EQ2's crafting "system" feels like Viet Cong POW reeducation.
That crappy whack-a-mole game is SoOoOoOo repetitive a random high-schooler could have designed it better.
The icons have different pictures for the different professions, is that supposed to represent variety??
A lousy progress bar like WoW's would have been vastly better, at least for my mental stability, or better yet a decent minigame like VG diplomacy.
And of the physical items you can make, 95% of them are completely utterly useless, particularly the non-rare weapons and armor, and the furniture.
They COULD have made furniture useful, like say Sims3 style, but instead it's purely decorative... in a house that no one else sees. Oh wait, there's also a pointless rent-reduction.
This made me LOL. i dislike EQ2 crafting as well.
I'm not going crazy right? VG crafting system was way more advanced and interesting than EQ2's was, right?
I didn't craft much in EQ2, and I only played the game from release to about 2006, but I remember it being no where near as good as VG.
Vanguard wasn't perfect, but it did a lot of things right, imo, especially in the crafting department. Combining Raid drops with crafters to make Master Crafted Raid-Level Gear,
The ability to customize the look, stats, magic effect/proc, and quality of the items you're making.
Boats, Houses
Tons of quests and stories that tied in with your profession
Lots of crafting gear that mattered for your character just like adventuring gear
A sort of "Skill system" of abilities you had to use while crafting, some made progress speed up, some increased quality, some combated problems that would randomly pop up, etc.
Any comments on this stuff APOC? My EQ2 memory could be fuzzy, but looking at old videos on EQ2 crafting, I think I'm spot on.
Legends of Kesmai, UO, EQ, AO, DAoC, AC, SB, RO, SWG, EVE, EQ2, CoH, GW, VG:SOH, WAR, Aion, DF, CO, MO, DN, Tera, SWTOR, RO2, DP, GW2, PS2, BnS, NW, FF:XIV, ESO, EQ:NL
Oh I can comment. Ever seen a video where the bar runs out before clicked? BOOOM! Snaaaap! Craaack! Fizzle!! Buuuuzz!!
You guessed it. Death and exp loss tied into some mundane things you have done 200 times before. It's as if the game never trusts that you are good at a craft. This drove me nuts. On top of this there was combining of an item to make a bunch of items to make a bunch of items that eventually combined to make the thing you were trying to make.
This system was preposterous. Whoever thought it up deserved part of the blame for why the game died out. I am fairly dexterous in life and can adapt to new hobbies and work fairly quickly just as most people who have been put to the test have proven. So the real question is "What were they thinking?" Obviously there were some here that found the vanishing completion bar with the click this or that to avoid catastrophic failure thing fun....but for fully grown people it was tedious and like playing a never ending game of Jenga, and not at all like actually being in a crafting profession.
Crafting can be better than EQ2 especially and also better than Vanguard by a fair margin.
I hope they seriously improves it. The mechanics were fine for a themepark back in the days but EQN should be closer to pre-CU SWG than EQ craftingwise.
In themeparks most of the good stuff usually is looted while in a sandbox you are supposed to craft most things.
Personally I think EQ2 and Vanguard both have pretty good crafting systems but SWGs were better and I expect more.
Another thing.
Don't make it like Mortal Online's.
Where you can make 910 crappy versions of something and the other 90 versions are from crap to fairly good. If I run into another system like in a game I have actually put hopes in, it better not have this system. OMG it was horrible.
I prefer vanguards crafting engine all the way, because its not based on timing, but entirely tactical.. much more possibilities.
I am pretty much sure EQN will have a great crafting system as SOE has both these great systems inhouse.
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)