Lol, Your poll is awesome. Here is me hoping that won't be the case.
Not going to climb on the predictive soapbox...but we are talking F2P, right? Ignoring potential profit centers isn't something F2P titles are historically good at.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
I vote yes, so long as long as there wasn't a clear winner that all min-maxers would play 100% of the time.
I'm for there being distinct differences between different races playing the same class, but not for one to be head and shoulders better than it than the rest.
See this is where we both read this differently, if it is a 'major' impact, then it would be head and shoulders better. So I voted no, even though I think it should have some advantages, but not to where it has to be the choice.
The biggest race/class thing I remember form EQ was Ogre Warriors, they were preferred and some say needed for certain encounters because they were immune to frontal stun I think it was, been a while, but I believe that was the case. So when this became a big deal, I knew people that had warriors and started new ones, so they could be the main tank all the time for their guilds. Generally in EQ, it was the way it should be, you could make choices that weren't optimal, but make it work and it wasn't a huge deal (to some it was, as people were min/maxing everything, but generally it wasn't).
So yes, I want differences and some uniqueness to each race, but I also don't want people to be shunned for trying to have a non-optimal choice either.
I vote yes, I know most people are worried "well i really want to be this race and this class but it isn't the "best" choice for that class " everything has its ups and downs with stuff like this and in the end it all comes down to skill (and lets be honest some good gear).
I think race should have a nice impact on how the class plays, but an "Ogre warrior should not be BETTER than other races". It should be Different from other races.
So maybe an Ogre warrior hits a little harder, has immunity or resistance to getting stunned/knocked down.....
But maybe a Gnome warrior runs faster in combat, has a chance to avoid being hit all together, etc.
So race should* play a major role in how that class ends up playing, but Better is not the word I'd use.
Different, but balanced would be better wordage.
Yeah I agree with this. Small races should get better avoidance, big races more resistance / health. Adding slightly modified spells for different races is always cool too, like what they did in Vanguard and in vanilla WoW.
I tend to agree with this view, though I'm not sure that the precise wordage makes much difference if the concept is there. This reminds me of FFXI; there was a big difference in how you played, what weapon you ultimately used, etc., if you played a taru vs a human. You could still play all classes on all races, but there was no single approach that worked best in all situations, and some combinations were certainly bigger challenges than others, adding to the depth of the game in my opinion. I really didn't care for how EQ implemented it; they had the right concept, but personally I think they need to let the player choose the level of challenge. Flat out telling a player no is something that needs to be done carefully, and rarely when it comes to base character creation; making it clear that certain combos are much, much harder, and letting the player make the ultimate choice, is a far better way to go.
Lol, Your poll is awesome. Here is me hoping that won't be the case.
Not going to climb on the predictive soapbox...but we are talking F2P, right? Ignoring potential profit centers isn't something F2P titles are historically good at.
Agreed. There has to be that balance where you aren't charging people for items integral to the game play mechanics (storage being the biggest culprit). But provide enough cosmetic and boost items where they are helpful to the point where you feel the money you spend is worth it.
I think of it this way, they structure a F2P game so that you aren't being tapped monthly for a fee.
Though, my suspicion is, that if you are playing, they expect you to spend $10.00-15.00 on items a month.
The benefit of the F2P model is you can quit at any time, and don't have to worry about being tapped for not playing.
$10.00-15.00 in the cash shop === Monthly subscription fee (they just use a different name).
He felt that his whole life was some kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.
- Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
I vote yes, I know most people are worried "well i really want to be this race and this class but it isn't the "best" choice for that class " everything has its ups and downs with stuff like this and in the end it all comes down to skill (and lets be honest some good gear).
You never watched the Undead Rogue Factory churning them out by the countless thousands? (On second thought, you probably didn't).
In a PVP game (and I'm assuming that's likely, as a sandbox title) there is going to have no end of metagaming and minmaxing. Stab your mother for a .2% advatage? You bet, where is the old broad?
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Originally posted by Gholos Do you think that races characteristics scores and abilities should play an important role on how a class work or not?I think that some races should be more adapt than others to chose a specific class, so for example an ogre warrior should be a better tank than an halfling warrior, have more hp, but an halfling warrior should be more difficult to hit due his little size and so on.So i think that race's characteristic scores and abilities should have a big importance even at higher levels, this mean that item's stats dont have to raise too much characteristics of your PC. I vote: YES
Yes please! I love that and racial abilities.
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
In a PVP game (and I'm assuming that's likely, as a sandbox title) there is going to have no end of metagaming and minmaxing. Stab your mother for a .2% advatage? You bet, where is the old broad?
metagaming and minmaxing is less of an issue when PVP isn't structured like a sport. The biggest mistake I can see EQN making is to have CTF and Control Point like gameplay. It's that crap that brings in the 'pro' PVPers. RVR lakes is about as far as I can see them going with their open world style if they hope to avoid these issues. I'm actually hoping they have a completely new system that we haven't seen before, but who knows.
I never thought Tournament Style gaming fits in a MMORPG. I think MOBA games and the like are better suited for that type of gaming.
do like to have unique stuff for races, so that the choice of race matters, but too much of impact and they could as well class/race lock, which I certainly do not care for..
I voted Yes, I don't mind a disadvantage for race as long as it isn't crippling, or can be compensated for in some other achievable way. It also has the benefit of making my character more uncommon if I play a race that is not min maxed for the class.
I think race should have a nice impact on how the class plays, but an "Ogre warrior should not be BETTER than other races". It should be Different from other races.
So maybe an Ogre warrior hits a little harder, has immunity or resistance to getting stunned/knocked down.....
But maybe a Gnome warrior runs faster in combat, has a chance to avoid being hit all together, etc.
So race should* play a major role in how that class ends up playing, but Better is not the word I'd use.
Different, but balanced would be better wordage.
I havent worded incorrectly, i have intend exactly BETTER, cause an ogre, for me, is supposed to have class restrictions so he should be better in some roles than a race that can play all classes. I think that an ogre should not play, for example, a thief or a wizard but if he could, he have to be less efficient than an halfing thiel or an elf wizard.
I think like a pen and paper rp gamer, so for example if i play a merchant i will prefer to have an ogre bodyguard than an halfling.
I know that my perspective could not fit a MMO game, but i would like to see this approach in EQN.
Again, I already stated why I didn't like the way you worded it.
If you make races absolutely better than other races for the same class play, then you stifle creativity and customization.
An ogre wizard would have, say, less int and there for less effective magic, but if this was balanced with increased resistance to getting interrupted, resistance to getting stunned/knocked down, more HPs, etc...
An Ogre wizard would not be better or worst than a high elf wizard.
One would just have different advantages over the other.
An ogre thief might be detected from stealth easier, but I bet he could backstab a lot harder than a tiny armed little halfing.
See my point? Don't make it so any race is "Better" at a class over other races. Let each race have it's pros and cons and let the player decide how he wants to play.
Originally posted by tkreep No because I like to pick the race I think looks coolest with the class I want and I dont want to be slightly gimped for that.
Depends on what you mean by slightly gimped. There needs to be some kind of difference, otherwise picking a race is literally no more than choosing a the visual model you want to look at, rendering race meaningless. The dffierences can't be game breaking, but having larger races rely more on brute strength and raw toughness while the smaller races rely more on dexterity and finesse is not unreasonable.
Comments
Not going to climb on the predictive soapbox...but we are talking F2P, right? Ignoring potential profit centers isn't something F2P titles are historically good at.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
See this is where we both read this differently, if it is a 'major' impact, then it would be head and shoulders better. So I voted no, even though I think it should have some advantages, but not to where it has to be the choice.
The biggest race/class thing I remember form EQ was Ogre Warriors, they were preferred and some say needed for certain encounters because they were immune to frontal stun I think it was, been a while, but I believe that was the case. So when this became a big deal, I knew people that had warriors and started new ones, so they could be the main tank all the time for their guilds. Generally in EQ, it was the way it should be, you could make choices that weren't optimal, but make it work and it wasn't a huge deal (to some it was, as people were min/maxing everything, but generally it wasn't).
So yes, I want differences and some uniqueness to each race, but I also don't want people to be shunned for trying to have a non-optimal choice either.
I vote yes, I know most people are worried "well i really want to be this race and this class but it isn't the "best" choice for that class
" everything has its ups and downs with stuff like this and in the end it all comes down to skill (and lets be honest some good gear).
I tend to agree with this view, though I'm not sure that the precise wordage makes much difference if the concept is there. This reminds me of FFXI; there was a big difference in how you played, what weapon you ultimately used, etc., if you played a taru vs a human. You could still play all classes on all races, but there was no single approach that worked best in all situations, and some combinations were certainly bigger challenges than others, adding to the depth of the game in my opinion. I really didn't care for how EQ implemented it; they had the right concept, but personally I think they need to let the player choose the level of challenge. Flat out telling a player no is something that needs to be done carefully, and rarely when it comes to base character creation; making it clear that certain combos are much, much harder, and letting the player make the ultimate choice, is a far better way to go.
Agreed. There has to be that balance where you aren't charging people for items integral to the game play mechanics (storage being the biggest culprit). But provide enough cosmetic and boost items where they are helpful to the point where you feel the money you spend is worth it.
I think of it this way, they structure a F2P game so that you aren't being tapped monthly for a fee.
Though, my suspicion is, that if you are playing, they expect you to spend $10.00-15.00 on items a month.
The benefit of the F2P model is you can quit at any time, and don't have to worry about being tapped for not playing.
$10.00-15.00 in the cash shop === Monthly subscription fee (they just use a different name).
He felt that his whole life was some kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.
- Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
You never watched the Undead Rogue Factory churning them out by the countless thousands? (On second thought, you probably didn't).
In a PVP game (and I'm assuming that's likely, as a sandbox title) there is going to have no end of metagaming and minmaxing. Stab your mother for a .2% advatage? You bet, where is the old broad?
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Yes please! I love that and racial abilities.
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
metagaming and minmaxing is less of an issue when PVP isn't structured like a sport. The biggest mistake I can see EQN making is to have CTF and Control Point like gameplay. It's that crap that brings in the 'pro' PVPers. RVR lakes is about as far as I can see them going with their open world style if they hope to avoid these issues. I'm actually hoping they have a completely new system that we haven't seen before, but who knows.
I never thought Tournament Style gaming fits in a MMORPG. I think MOBA games and the like are better suited for that type of gaming.
Survivor of the great MMORPG Famine of 2011
Again, I already stated why I didn't like the way you worded it.
If you make races absolutely better than other races for the same class play, then you stifle creativity and customization.
An ogre wizard would have, say, less int and there for less effective magic, but if this was balanced with increased resistance to getting interrupted, resistance to getting stunned/knocked down, more HPs, etc...
An Ogre wizard would not be better or worst than a high elf wizard.
One would just have different advantages over the other.
An ogre thief might be detected from stealth easier, but I bet he could backstab a lot harder than a tiny armed little halfing.
See my point? Don't make it so any race is "Better" at a class over other races. Let each race have it's pros and cons and let the player decide how he wants to play.
Legends of Kesmai, UO, EQ, AO, DAoC, AC, SB, RO, SWG, EVE, EQ2, CoH, GW, VG:SOH, WAR, Aion, DF, CO, MO, DN, Tera, SWTOR, RO2, DP, GW2, PS2, BnS, NW, FF:XIV, ESO, EQ:NL
Depends on what you mean by slightly gimped. There needs to be some kind of difference, otherwise picking a race is literally no more than choosing a the visual model you want to look at, rendering race meaningless. The dffierences can't be game breaking, but having larger races rely more on brute strength and raw toughness while the smaller races rely more on dexterity and finesse is not unreasonable.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design