Soe tryed that when released eq2,they did say there will never be any pvp in everquest but they soon gave up for the whiners.
Lets just hope they learnd their lesson and wont have any pvp at all in eq next.
So can someone tell me did that pvp change ruin the game? I remember the game being very bad from the beginning, but I beta tested it only for a couple weeks. Basicly everything felt like... clumsy and boring except the crafting system which doesn't help if other aspects of the game are crap.
edit: Just so this isn't completely off the topic I want to say that player based economy is what pve games could really use in my opinion. Put that BoP crap aside completely, implement item degradation in certain cases and let the item farming and boss hunting begin.
Originally posted by Quizzical More than a few games have the PVE side of the game exactly as it would be if there were no PVP, and then PVP tacked on haphazardly in areas that have no effect on PVE and without any real effort at balancing PVP. Is that really any worse than a pure PVE MMORPG?
They seem the same to me, too. LOTRO is something I would consider pure PVE, as the PVP is completely separate gameplay. The same with WOW and, well, most western MMOs out today.
Agreed for LOTRO, but WOW has PvP servers so it's a "bit more" ;-)
So because PVP servers exist, the PVE servers aren't PVE servers?
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Soe tryed that when released eq2,they did say there will never be any pvp in everquest but they soon gave up for the whiners.
Lets just hope they learnd their lesson and wont have any pvp at all in eq next.
Skills in EQ2 changed in PvP combat, sometimes completely changing how the skill works. PvP never had any impact on PvE whatsoever in that game, because the skills were always separate.
Although they did learn their lesson, EQ2 failed compared to WoW because it lacked PvP at launch, now they are integrating it fully into EQN with OWPvP.
There will be no open World pvp in eq-next exept maybe on some separate pvp server. But still loads of pvp-ers will whine for pvp on pve servers for the only fun thing they know is to fight with people that dont want to fight them since they are to much gimps to face real pvp.
I'd love to see a good game that was focused on PvE and had classes that aren't balanced but I don't think it would be popular enough because of the "Class A has to do as much damage as Class B" mentality of many gamers. I'd be tickled pink to play a support character that can keep a party alive but would die horribly solo as long as it was a fun class to play in groups. Or a DPS that was a glass canon. I'm pretty sure I'm in the minority though. And of course some older games actually did this to an extent.
Players now-a-days want to play any class and be able to do any of the content solo and as fast as any other class. And yet they want to feel unique. *sigh*
As for the whole balancing for PvP ruining balance in PvE or vice versa you would think that developers would learn to use two separate sets of skills or have PvP and PvE modifiers in their code that they could tweak that wouldn't affect the other side of the coin. Damage of Ability A is 20. PvE modifier +10, PvP modifier -5. Character in PvE? A (20) + E (10) + P (0) = 30 damage. In PvP? A (20) + E (0) + P (-5) = 15 damage. Metrics show PvP players aren't using Ability A because it doesn't do enough damage? Increase the PvP modifier, don't change the base skill. Now PvP is better and PvE remains the same.
Soe tryed that when released eq2,they did say there will never be any pvp in everquest but they soon gave up for the whiners.
Lets just hope they learnd their lesson and wont have any pvp at all in eq next.
Skills in EQ2 changed in PvP combat, sometimes completely changing how the skill works. PvP never had any impact on PvE whatsoever in that game, because the skills were always separate.
Although they did learn their lesson, EQ2 failed compared to WoW because it lacked PvP at launch, now they are integrating it fully into EQN with OWPvP.
There will be no open World pvp in eq-next exept maybe on some separate pvp server. But still loads of pvp-ers will whine for pvp on pve servers for the only fun thing they know is to fight with people that dont want to fight them since they are to much gimps to face real pvp.
Yeh. They can't turn off a large part of their audience.
As some have agreed, I'm glad I'm not the only one that wishes for a more dynamic PvE game.. I know some have tossed out some names of games, but I played those as well, and the classes all watered down and boring.. As it was in EQ long ago, I played a druid.. Could I heal as good as a cleric? NO.. Did I DD as well as others? NO.. but then I could travel fast and teleport.. Could I tank a mob? NO F'ing way.. but then I didn't need to, HELLO KITING!!.. There were some classes that were invaluable in a group situation, and that should of been addressed but wasn't.. at least not correctly.. However, in general, I want to see a slew of pure classes, and hybrids..
It really is a shame how games become easier and easier.. Pretty soon we'll all be able to log on, press "AUTOPLAY" and come back 10 hours later and train for the new level.. Anyone else miss fletching? Let me guess, most of the MMO player base have no clue what fletching is...... LOL Another prime example how carebear games are becoming.. First went weight allowance, then food and drink, then fletching, then fishing... Is there anything left?
Originally posted by sschrupp I'd love to see a good game that was focused on PvE and had classes that aren't balanced but I don't think it would be popular enough because of the "Class A has to do as much damage as Class B" mentality of many gamers. I'd be tickled pink to play a support character that can keep a party alive but would die horribly solo as long as it was a fun class to play in groups. Or a DPS that was a glass canon. I'm pretty sure I'm in the minority though. And of course some older games actually did this to an extent. Players now-a-days want to play any class and be able to do any of the content solo and as fast as any other class. And yet they want to feel unique. *sigh*
Bright shadow was an online f2p whit exactly those characteristics. and infact the game was close because was not popular enough ^^ not only alot of players escaped riding their prejudices as soon they realize there was not a pvp feature. the game being full pve require a team do do pratically anything, class was unbalanced for working well only in party plus a network for informations between players was necessary. basically an hardcore game that fooled many thanks to the anime style art. istead alot of players tried to clean the content in solo, soon getting frustrated to being unable to do much, and bound theirselves to solo grind non aggro mobs for dozen of levels. in the end they state that the games was badmade. sigh developers often are not rewarded for their work.
As some have agreed, I'm glad I'm not the only one that wishes for a more dynamic PvE game.. I know some have tossed out some names of games, but I played those as well, and the classes all watered down and boring.. As it was in EQ long ago, I played a druid.. Could I heal as good as a cleric? NO.. Did I DD as well as others? NO.. but then I could travel fast and teleport.. Could I tank a mob? NO F'ing way.. but then I didn't need to, HELLO KITING!!.. There were some classes that were invaluable in a group situation, and that should of been addressed but wasn't.. at least not correctly.. However, in general, I want to see a slew of pure classes, and hybrids..
It really is a shame how games become easier and easier.. Pretty soon we'll all be able to log on, press "AUTOPLAY" and come back 10 hours later and train for the new level.. Anyone else miss fletching? Let me guess, most of the MMO player base have no clue what fletching is...... LOL Another prime example how carebear games are becoming.. First went weight allowance, then food and drink, then fletching, then fishing... Is there anything left?
Does that come with auto forum posting? Where do I download?
Comments
So can someone tell me did that pvp change ruin the game? I remember the game being very bad from the beginning, but I beta tested it only for a couple weeks. Basicly everything felt like... clumsy and boring except the crafting system which doesn't help if other aspects of the game are crap.
edit: Just so this isn't completely off the topic I want to say that player based economy is what pve games could really use in my opinion. Put that BoP crap aside completely, implement item degradation in certain cases and let the item farming and boss hunting begin.
So because PVP servers exist, the PVE servers aren't PVE servers?
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
There will be no open World pvp in eq-next exept maybe on some separate pvp server. But still loads of pvp-ers will whine for pvp on pve servers for the only fun thing they know is to fight with people that dont want to fight them since they are to much gimps to face real pvp.
I'd love to see a good game that was focused on PvE and had classes that aren't balanced but I don't think it would be popular enough because of the "Class A has to do as much damage as Class B" mentality of many gamers. I'd be tickled pink to play a support character that can keep a party alive but would die horribly solo as long as it was a fun class to play in groups. Or a DPS that was a glass canon. I'm pretty sure I'm in the minority though. And of course some older games actually did this to an extent.
Players now-a-days want to play any class and be able to do any of the content solo and as fast as any other class. And yet they want to feel unique. *sigh*
As for the whole balancing for PvP ruining balance in PvE or vice versa you would think that developers would learn to use two separate sets of skills or have PvP and PvE modifiers in their code that they could tweak that wouldn't affect the other side of the coin. Damage of Ability A is 20. PvE modifier +10, PvP modifier -5. Character in PvE? A (20) + E (10) + P (0) = 30 damage. In PvP? A (20) + E (0) + P (-5) = 15 damage. Metrics show PvP players aren't using Ability A because it doesn't do enough damage? Increase the PvP modifier, don't change the base skill. Now PvP is better and PvE remains the same.
I remember FFXI being PvE only. Good ol' days. To bad it's economy sucked and game was over run with gold sellers.
Yeh. They can't turn off a large part of their audience.
As some have agreed, I'm glad I'm not the only one that wishes for a more dynamic PvE game.. I know some have tossed out some names of games, but I played those as well, and the classes all watered down and boring.. As it was in EQ long ago, I played a druid.. Could I heal as good as a cleric? NO.. Did I DD as well as others? NO.. but then I could travel fast and teleport.. Could I tank a mob? NO F'ing way.. but then I didn't need to, HELLO KITING!!.. There were some classes that were invaluable in a group situation, and that should of been addressed but wasn't.. at least not correctly.. However, in general, I want to see a slew of pure classes, and hybrids..
It really is a shame how games become easier and easier.. Pretty soon we'll all be able to log on, press "AUTOPLAY" and come back 10 hours later and train for the new level.. Anyone else miss fletching? Let me guess, most of the MMO player base have no clue what fletching is...... LOL Another prime example how carebear games are becoming.. First went weight allowance, then food and drink, then fletching, then fishing... Is there anything left?
Bright shadow was an online f2p whit exactly those characteristics.
and infact the game was close because was not popular enough ^^
not only alot of players escaped riding their prejudices as soon they realize there was not a pvp feature.
the game being full pve require a team do do pratically anything, class was unbalanced for working well only in party plus a network for informations between players was necessary.
basically an hardcore game that fooled many thanks to the anime style art.
istead alot of players tried to clean the content in solo, soon getting frustrated to being unable to do much, and bound theirselves to solo grind non aggro mobs for dozen of levels. in the end they state that the games was badmade. sigh
developers often are not rewarded for their work.
Does that come with auto forum posting? Where do I download?
It does for 30 days at the Cash shop for $0.99. :P
On topic: I for one think the days of 24 hour boss battles (and still fail to kill it; Hello FF11!!!) should go the way of carburetors motors.
Gdemami -
Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
No it isn't, Vanguard is way closer.