Honestly, I think you are letting your rose-colored glasses of nostalgia get in the way of enjoying what is out there. There are still groups, you still build reputations in guilds and guild alliances, there is need for interdependence, and all those other things you say that you believe died and blew away years ago. The issue here is you and your attitude toward what is around you.
You are missing my point.. Its not just about guild rep and guild alliances.. Its about feeling apart of a fantasy world.. being immersed in that world where it does not feel like a arcade themepark/amusement park with a fantasy themed backdrop... All the little things you took for granted in EQ or thought they sucked or didnt care for.. is what I miss about MMOs.. Just because you didnt enjoy it and thought it sucked doesnt mean everyone did...
You like the new themepark formula.. Good for you.. thank god you have plenty of themepark MMOs to play..
When it comes to mmorpgs EQ Next is my last hope.. I started playing mmorpgs with Asherons Call and EverQuest.. With those games it made you feel like you were immersed in a fantasy world.. When I was new to those games there were no NPCs with question marks or exclamation points over their heads.. There were no detailed maps telling you where to go ever step of the way.. You had to figure out all of these things on your own.. You had to explore the world and find/make your own adventure.. There were no private instances and the world was a dangerous place where dying meant something.. Those worlds were exciting to be in...
Now a days mmorpgs are nothing like that.. Now they are dumbed down themepark mmorpgs where you get your hand held from ride to ride.. Where its better to be rude to strangers and stick with a few people.. Today's mmorpgs feel so alien to me.. There is nothing epic about todays mmorpgs. I believe the downfall started with WoW.. Almost all Mmorpgs today are casual friendly dumbed down experiences.. The bad part is devs think they have to stick to this formula in order to make money.. And it doesn't help that there are a lot of casual players (because of WoW) that want that dumbed down experience...
So EQ Next is my last hope.. If it ends up being just a nother casual friendly themepark mmo where everyone is rude to each other and you can solo to level cap then group content with 5 to 10 people, where you move from 1 quest hub to the next and instance to instance, then that's it for me and mmorpgs.. It was my favorite genre but not lately..
Not gonna lie, kinda hope your dreams die. Both games and the playerbases change. You sound more like grandpa screaming "Get off my lawn!" than you do a reasonable consumer.
Im not saying get off my lawn, more so asking if I can have a piece of my lawn back.. At this point I dont have a lawn anymore.. Sorry if you think all mmorpgs should be like WoW and the type I enjoy should die.. I am saying why isnt there room for more? Why cant one mmo be the type I like?
Oh I know about that already... So what you're saying is I can only enjoy an old MMORPG and cant have hopes that a new MMORPG plays like the old MMOs I used to enjoy and have played to death already...
Oh I know about that already... So what you're saying is I can only enjoy an old MMORPG and cant have hopes that a new MMORPG plays like the old MMOs I used to enjoy and have played to death already...
It is Easier to Wear Slippers than to Carpet the Whole of the Earth.
Oh I know about that already... So what you're saying is I can only enjoy an old MMORPG and cant have hopes that a new MMORPG plays like the old MMOs I used to enjoy and have played to death already...
No...he's saying what everyone else here can already see.
What you're asking for only came about due to TWO factors; Ignorance and exclusivity.
The community then was TINY and therefore it was easy to run into the same people because there were 50 servers with thousands of people on each one. On top of that the people that were playing MMORPGs were a much higher average age since gaming computers were almost triple the price that they are now, internet access was more expensive (and less common), and MMORPGs were FAR less known.
The issue has never been features that foster an anti-social behavior, those people have always been there, the only difference is that now you're dealing with a much younger audience (overall) because everyone can afford a gaming machine, on top of that the gaming population overall is MUCH larger so you have a higher saturation of anti-social people.
Sadly this does add up to the answer to your question being YES you can only enjoy old MMORPGs with tiny communities and a niche where the people there genuinely care about the game and the community developing. EQN will NOT be anything like this, it's impossible since it will be F2P. MOST of the players won't care at all about the game since they won't have to invest anything into it if they don't want to, THESE are the players that will be more anti-social, these are the players that will cause you more grief, these are the players you should be complaining about....not the soloists. It seems like maybe you haven't really analyzed much of what games are, were, or are going to be.
Just because every car has similar features doesn't mean that Ferraris are copies of Model Ts. Progress requires failure and refining.
Honestly, I think you are letting your rose-colored glasses of nostalgia get in the way of enjoying what is out there. There are still groups, you still build reputations in guilds and guild alliances, there is need for interdependence, and all those other things you say that you believe died and blew away years ago. The issue here is you and your attitude toward what is around you.
You are missing my point.. Its not just about guild rep and guild alliances.. Its about feeling apart of a fantasy world.. being immersed in that world where it does not feel like a arcade themepark/amusement park with a fantasy themed backdrop... All the little things you took for granted in EQ or thought they sucked or didnt care for.. is what I miss about MMOs.. Just because you didnt enjoy it and thought it sucked doesnt mean everyone did...
You like the new themepark formula.. Good for you.. thank god you have plenty of themepark MMOs to play..
At this point I just feel like you are being needlessly patronizing, so I will back out of this pointless discussion with you.
If you want to leave the MMO genre, hey, go ahead. The games are what you make of them, and it sounds like you've given up anyway.
Again I am not blaming the soloist.. Thats the last time I try to explain that.. Also I guess we will see with EQN.. If its a nother WoW themepark clone then you guys can have the genre.. We Will see this friday...
I think someone said it earlier (sorry I can't comb through this again for a quote) but I really think this is a case where people are just burnt out, and they could not find the magic again. It's been said in the forums, it's been said in this topic, and I believe it to be true.
Look at tactical RPGs for myself. I used to play Final Fantasy Tactics like it was my job when I was younger. Eventually, it lost it's luster, so I went to try other Tactic RPGs. Even recent days with something like the new XCOM I just couldn't feel the same way about what I used to see in FFT, and now FFT doesn't even feel like that anymore.
Point is, I moved on, and I'm still trying to learn to appreciate what I can find nowadays. That doesn't mean you have to be content (you should never be content when playing a game that boasts a 'living' world like an MMO, because until it becomes reality, there's always something to improve), but I think it's more of the idea of accepting the fact something like old school EQ or UO or vanilla WOW just will never come back. It will NEVER come back. The market has matured, the community has grown, the technology has surpassed it's roots. We cannot remake EQ, not even with project 1999, because at it's core, the factors that led to it's production are impossible to recreate.
I'm not putting you or anyone else around here down because you guys want find something you'll be happy playing. It's your right as a gamer and as a person. But I would like to stress that if you are going to put all your eggs in one basket, or decide to make an ultimatum based on one game, you might have given up already. Don't lose hope if EQN isn't what you want it to be, or you might as well have given up hope before it was announced.
Originally posted by Manakar Again I am not blaming the soloist.. Thats the last time I try to explain that.. Also I guess we will see with EQN.. If its a nother WoW themepark clone then you guys can have the genre.. We Will see this friday...
Watch out for that door....it can slam hard and fast!
Just because every car has similar features doesn't mean that Ferraris are copies of Model Ts. Progress requires failure and refining.
Oh I know about that already... So what you're saying is I can only enjoy an old MMORPG and cant have hopes that a new MMORPG plays like the old MMOs I used to enjoy and have played to death already...
Much like you I started MMO back when EQ1 launched. Good old days were awesome but unlike what some are saying here. What I am saying is go back and see if the good old days are really that good. My guess is after a couple of week of seeing some loved places you used to play with friends you soon will be wanting a modern MMO. Maybe I am wrong but I say give it a go and see if I am wrong.
As for getting back what you loved about the good old days of MMOing. As much as I wish the same thing, I dont see it happening. The market has changed to much and so has the world. Its like asking for the world morals to rewind to 1910 when the world was at peace and the modern are was something everyone was looking to, to change their lives for the good. The past is the past but unlike real life you can go back to the good old days of video games and see if they really were what you remembered =-)
I really feel for some of you. The level of expectation for this game is through the roof. I feel like no matter what they announce it wont live up to your dreams of what you want this game to be. I've seen too many announcements like this where the community got so riled up that when they announced what the game actually is, those folks got negative, real quick. Manage your expectations, please. The pedestal this game has been put on is so high that any little diversion from what the community believes it will be will just topple that pedestal to the ground. This website in particular will have a very hard time if that Friday announcement is even slightly off from what people think.
I really feel for some of you. The level of expectation for this game is through the roof. I feel like no matter what they announce it wont live up to your dreams of what you want this game to be. I've seen too many announcements like this where the community got so riled up that when they announced what the game actually is, those folks got negative, real quick. Manage your expectations, please. The pedestal this game has been put on is so high that any little diversion from what the community believes it will be will just topple that pedestal to the ground. This website in particular will have a very hard time if that Friday announcement is even slightly off from what people think.
Ya the mods are gona be busy for the next 2-3 weeks dealing with fan backlash lol. Gona be fun to watch everyone melt down!
Wow...another thread of melodramatic posts from people who clearly need to broaden their horizons and get perspective.EQN is just a game and if your hopes and dreams are all reliant on a game you need help.
The genre hasn't gone the way I want it to and has been disappointing to me too but I keep in touch and watch and wait to see if an MMO I'd enjoy for a long period finally arrives.However if it never does that's fine too,I can accept being in a niche that developers don't see as profitable and have plenty of other gaming and non gaming things I can do.
You missed my point.. If everyone can solo to lvl cap in a mmo how does it make everyone that plays it rude? I am not saying everyone that does solo is rude or even everyone that loves to solo is rude.. WHat I am saying is if you do not need to party/group with people to progress it caters to anti social behaviour and its a breeding ground for people to be rude.. That does not mean you were or will be one of those rude people just because you like to solo..
I am also not saying people that grouped were not rude.. but if they were it got harder and harder for them to find a group/guild that would deal with them... SO they either had to change their attitude or find people that allowed them to be rude to them or others...
The most rude behavior I've seen online where from guilds and people seeking groups. I consider blind group and guild invites to be extremely rude, talk to me first please. These two are also where you find elitists and you can't go more rude than "you're not build X, screw you!".
My best online community award goes to GW2, games lots of people consider to be solo-centric. Lots of helpful players, people co-operating to do content, calling events so people don't miss them, etc. The only low side are all the speed dungeon runners requesting that you use a Zerker builds...because it get them loot/money faster. But there are plenty of none-Zerkers around too.
My worst award goes to SWTOR (at release, so many ninja-looters and it got worst with the group finder tool), Neverwinter come close second. Never played WoW (or EQ, I started with DAoC). Doesn't have anything to do with F2P or P2P or B2P either, Atlantica Online was full of really nice people that gave me free gear and money when I tried it (no idea if it is still like that).
Comments
You are missing my point.. Its not just about guild rep and guild alliances.. Its about feeling apart of a fantasy world.. being immersed in that world where it does not feel like a arcade themepark/amusement park with a fantasy themed backdrop... All the little things you took for granted in EQ or thought they sucked or didnt care for.. is what I miss about MMOs.. Just because you didnt enjoy it and thought it sucked doesnt mean everyone did...
You like the new themepark formula.. Good for you.. thank god you have plenty of themepark MMOs to play..
There is....
http://www.project1999.org/http://www.project1999.org/
Oh I know about that already... So what you're saying is I can only enjoy an old MMORPG and cant have hopes that a new MMORPG plays like the old MMOs I used to enjoy and have played to death already...
It is Easier to Wear Slippers than to Carpet the Whole of the Earth.
No...he's saying what everyone else here can already see.
What you're asking for only came about due to TWO factors; Ignorance and exclusivity.
The community then was TINY and therefore it was easy to run into the same people because there were 50 servers with thousands of people on each one. On top of that the people that were playing MMORPGs were a much higher average age since gaming computers were almost triple the price that they are now, internet access was more expensive (and less common), and MMORPGs were FAR less known.
The issue has never been features that foster an anti-social behavior, those people have always been there, the only difference is that now you're dealing with a much younger audience (overall) because everyone can afford a gaming machine, on top of that the gaming population overall is MUCH larger so you have a higher saturation of anti-social people.
Sadly this does add up to the answer to your question being YES you can only enjoy old MMORPGs with tiny communities and a niche where the people there genuinely care about the game and the community developing. EQN will NOT be anything like this, it's impossible since it will be F2P. MOST of the players won't care at all about the game since they won't have to invest anything into it if they don't want to, THESE are the players that will be more anti-social, these are the players that will cause you more grief, these are the players you should be complaining about....not the soloists. It seems like maybe you haven't really analyzed much of what games are, were, or are going to be.
Just because every car has similar features doesn't mean that Ferraris are copies of Model Ts. Progress requires failure and refining.
At this point I just feel like you are being needlessly patronizing, so I will back out of this pointless discussion with you.
If you want to leave the MMO genre, hey, go ahead. The games are what you make of them, and it sounds like you've given up anyway.
I think someone said it earlier (sorry I can't comb through this again for a quote) but I really think this is a case where people are just burnt out, and they could not find the magic again. It's been said in the forums, it's been said in this topic, and I believe it to be true.
Look at tactical RPGs for myself. I used to play Final Fantasy Tactics like it was my job when I was younger. Eventually, it lost it's luster, so I went to try other Tactic RPGs. Even recent days with something like the new XCOM I just couldn't feel the same way about what I used to see in FFT, and now FFT doesn't even feel like that anymore.
Point is, I moved on, and I'm still trying to learn to appreciate what I can find nowadays. That doesn't mean you have to be content (you should never be content when playing a game that boasts a 'living' world like an MMO, because until it becomes reality, there's always something to improve), but I think it's more of the idea of accepting the fact something like old school EQ or UO or vanilla WOW just will never come back. It will NEVER come back. The market has matured, the community has grown, the technology has surpassed it's roots. We cannot remake EQ, not even with project 1999, because at it's core, the factors that led to it's production are impossible to recreate.
I'm not putting you or anyone else around here down because you guys want find something you'll be happy playing. It's your right as a gamer and as a person. But I would like to stress that if you are going to put all your eggs in one basket, or decide to make an ultimatum based on one game, you might have given up already. Don't lose hope if EQN isn't what you want it to be, or you might as well have given up hope before it was announced.
Aim Small, Miss Small.
Watch out for that door....it can slam hard and fast!
Just because every car has similar features doesn't mean that Ferraris are copies of Model Ts. Progress requires failure and refining.
Much like you I started MMO back when EQ1 launched. Good old days were awesome but unlike what some are saying here. What I am saying is go back and see if the good old days are really that good. My guess is after a couple of week of seeing some loved places you used to play with friends you soon will be wanting a modern MMO. Maybe I am wrong but I say give it a go and see if I am wrong.
As for getting back what you loved about the good old days of MMOing. As much as I wish the same thing, I dont see it happening. The market has changed to much and so has the world. Its like asking for the world morals to rewind to 1910 when the world was at peace and the modern are was something everyone was looking to, to change their lives for the good. The past is the past but unlike real life you can go back to the good old days of video games and see if they really were what you remembered =-)
Catering to casuals is not the problem with these newer games.
Catering to this new ADHD ,moron generation of kids IS !
I'm a casual player but I want EQN to be just as difficult as EQ was.
I don't want raids to be easy , I do want something to do other than raiding at max level though .
Everyone deserves some sort of content . except griefers, they should be scalped:)
I really feel for some of you. The level of expectation for this game is through the roof. I feel like no matter what they announce it wont live up to your dreams of what you want this game to be. I've seen too many announcements like this where the community got so riled up that when they announced what the game actually is, those folks got negative, real quick. Manage your expectations, please. The pedestal this game has been put on is so high that any little diversion from what the community believes it will be will just topple that pedestal to the ground. This website in particular will have a very hard time if that Friday announcement is even slightly off from what people think.
Ya the mods are gona be busy for the next 2-3 weeks dealing with fan backlash lol. Gona be fun to watch everyone melt down!
Wow...another thread of melodramatic posts from people who clearly need to broaden their horizons and get perspective.EQN is just a game and if your hopes and dreams are all reliant on a game you need help.
The genre hasn't gone the way I want it to and has been disappointing to me too but I keep in touch and watch and wait to see if an MMO I'd enjoy for a long period finally arrives.However if it never does that's fine too,I can accept being in a niche that developers don't see as profitable and have plenty of other gaming and non gaming things I can do.
The most rude behavior I've seen online where from guilds and people seeking groups. I consider blind group and guild invites to be extremely rude, talk to me first please. These two are also where you find elitists and you can't go more rude than "you're not build X, screw you!".
My best online community award goes to GW2, games lots of people consider to be solo-centric. Lots of helpful players, people co-operating to do content, calling events so people don't miss them, etc. The only low side are all the speed dungeon runners requesting that you use a Zerker builds...because it get them loot/money faster. But there are plenty of none-Zerkers around too.
My worst award goes to SWTOR (at release, so many ninja-looters and it got worst with the group finder tool), Neverwinter come close second. Never played WoW (or EQ, I started with DAoC). Doesn't have anything to do with F2P or P2P or B2P either, Atlantica Online was full of really nice people that gave me free gear and money when I tried it (no idea if it is still like that).
EQ1-AC1-DAOC-FFXI-L2-EQ2-WoW-DDO-GW-LoTR-VG-WAR-GW2-ESO