Originally posted by tomahawk1930 Firefall was one of several disappointing purchases I've made in the MMO genre.
Boggles seems like disappointing has become the industry standard.
I find it kinda interesting that generally if a game offers a founders pack, or a pay to beta deal, it turns out to be a total and complete piece of crap that seems to have no real development after release, and only minimal customer support.
Guess that is the new business model grab our money during the game hype stage before the game actually releases and people see just how crappy it really is, then bail on the project and move to the next money suck.
Originally posted by tomahawk1930 Firefall was one of several disappointing purchases I've made in the MMO genre.
Boggles seems like disappointing has become the industry standard.
I find it kinda interesting that generally if a game offers a founders pack, or a pay to beta deal, it turns out to be a total and complete piece of crap that seems to have no real development after release, and only minimal customer support.
Guess that is the new business model grab our money during the game hype stage before the game actually releases and people see just how crappy it really is, then bail on the project and move to the next money suck.
Yeah, but as long as people know whats going on, its fine. The fanboys on forums like these who excuse them is the real problem. Were Firefall to say 'we need money, so we're going to start taking money. but we cant promise youll get what you pay for because this product is unfinished' then itd be ok. But they dodge instead, claiming to be in beta so they can excuse construction, and then selling as if they were in production.
The lag issues seem to be mostly resolved. Played last night for four hours with no lag. They are making improvements little by little...really liking this game. Favorite classes are Raptor and Bastion.
Originally posted by avalon1000 The lag issues seem to be mostly resolved. Played last night for four hours with no lag. They are making improvements little by little...really liking this game. Favorite classes are Raptor and Bastion.
Actually, I never had issues till last night. Guess they transferred your lag to my instance.
Hmm I believe ArenaNet sold gems during beta for GW2 but it was still called beta. A lot of games, especially on steam, have taken money for games barely in Alpha. Point being is that I have played for 2 weeks now and have yet to give Red 5 a single dollar. However I plan on it because despite the games issues it is freaking fun!
Peace!
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ANet was testing in-game store transactions and they charged 1$ for purchasing gems from the store. After the beta was over they refunded the 1$ charged and they deleted anything you bought from the game shop as well as all our characters.
THAT was a proper beta. Everything else, where they charge you AND keep the money earned from in game shop during that beta is just as same as releasing the game. You're charging $, then you should be able to provide the service worth that $. Simple enough.
If you decide to hide behind the BETA label it comes with a cost.
"Happiness is not a destination. It is a method of life." -------------------------------
So all these games that aren't even in closed beta yet but take peoples cash for kickstarter programs to fund em... Yep, those are completely finished games in release state... wtf /facepalm. Just because a game has some way for people to help fund it does not mean in any way that it is a final release version. Firefall, and many other games, have even had cash shops and founders programs open during closed betas (not to mention during open betas or before the game was in any form of beta at all). If people are to dense they cant read the clearly present BETA label all over the product thats their own fault. A lot of these games are completely f2p and without any kind of funding they would never even reach a completed release state, thus the presence of founders packs/kickstarters and cash shops. The only thing that taking peoples cash means is that they will not completely wipe the characters and the goods they bought ever again (as with Firefall, was never any character wipes even during closed beta or from closed to open even) or when they do those players will be refunded all of the currency they had accumulated.
As for having only one character slot? With the way Firefall works there is no need, use, or advantage whatsoever to having more than one character. All characters get all of the base frames and a single character can unlock every single frame to switch between whenever they want. Really having a second character would actually be even more work than unlocking everything on one and the only "benefit" at all would be being able to play 2 different genders as being a different gender is the one and only thing an alt could do that a main or other alt could not...
Yeah well this game is not doing a kickstarter, the game is open to the public and has a working cash shop. You can hardly compare this game to something like Star Citizen or Repop; that is just stupid. Calling Firefall beta is just getting them a lot of extra criticism and it's well deserved. I'm getting sick of these games running as a retail but trying to hide behind the term beta. If your game is open to the public, not doing data wipes, and taking money from customers then that is called retail. Enough with this endless beta status BS.
This game has been in development since 2005. It isn't an indie studio either it is owned by the 9 which was the old wow publisher in China. They can't have it both ways on everything. They want the revenue stream of a released game but then they want everyone to cut them slack because the game is clearly in a very rough state. Then they want to play the "we aren't wow" card claiming they don't have the resources of large studios. Well they have money for expensive convention booths, cosplayers, and a whole production team to make stupid videos that have nothing to do with the game. I mean cmon 8 years? It's just a game, not the great pyramid. Welcome to Tabula Rasa 2.0.
Originally posted by mCalvert Theyre selling stuff, thus its production.
Ok. You ignore the big word BETA written everywhere, on the site, on the game login, on the game screen and so on. It's ok. And yet, problems can happen even after a game is released, so nothing strange, it's a problem, they are aware of it and are resolving it...
Neverwinter, being that too a "soft-relese" too, had way more big problems, from item duping to rollback of several hours...
They can call it whatever they want. It has no meaning. Once they start collecting production money, consumers have certain expectations.
Can't agree more. Having an active cash shop and getting money from your customers means your product is in production and no longer in the test phase...
In general, bad things happen to games, even with those long launched. It's only sad that after a week they still don't seem to have found and fixed the issue. Things like this should have highest priority and be fixed within 24hours...
Originally posted by mCalvert Theyre selling stuff, thus its production.
Ok. You ignore the big word BETA written everywhere, on the site, on the game login, on the game screen and so on. It's ok. And yet, problems can happen even after a game is released, so nothing strange, it's a problem, they are aware of it and are resolving it...
Neverwinter, being that too a "soft-relese" too, had way more big problems, from item duping to rollback of several hours...
They can call it whatever they want. It has no meaning. Once they start collecting production money, consumers have certain expectations.
Can't agree more. Having an active cash shop and getting money from your customers means your product is in production and no longer in the test phase...
Where did you find this definition? Link please
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I am surprised people are complaining about paying for the game. Not getting what you paid for? Your character is not purple anymore when you log in? Mine is. : D
Seriously though even on the absolute worst laggiest of nights the gameplay was not affected for me. I couldn't switch frames, or do any of the sin stuff really, but that seems to be run on a completely different server. Shooting, movement, missions, etc were all completely fine.
It seems like people are going out of their way to troll some great games these days. This game is phenomenal, an absolute blast. If you aren't having fun playing this then I imagine it is that you simply don't like fps-mmo hybrids, as this is far and above the best in that genre to come out. It is just plain fun. The enemies are fun to kill, most of the weapons are fun to use, travelling is fun, there is a very real death penalty, game-changing crafting, random quests, nice graphics, good performance... what is here right now is pretty fantastic, I just want more of it.
On top of all that, this is one of the best if not the best use of F2P that I have seen. I have unlocked 3 classes in 10 or so days, am going to unlock another tomorrow or the day after, and the only thing I spent money on was to paint my bastion and my dragonfly (though it came with a cosmetic helmet and a short cooldown glider as well). You can unlock classes by paying but you can still unlock them very quickly without paying... and I definitely prefer the latter. In game you can spend money to buy cosmetic stuff like hats, different armor paint, a fluff pet, a different color motorcycle, etc. The game does give you a few plain selections for armor paint (red, green, blue, etc), and unlockable classes all come colored anyways (default classes are plain white by default). You can get at least one cosmetic head item from achievements, and at least one reusable glider from achievements. You can play everything there is without paying a cent, and you do not have to spend a lot of time unlocking things either.
The only real criticism I can think of is that the game plain old needs more. More of all the things. Of course, that might be a mistake, spreading the population of each server over a larger area might not be a good idea. Maybe adding more missions, more classes, more events, etc.
So all these games that aren't even in closed beta yet but take peoples cash for kickstarter programs to fund em... Yep, those are completely finished games in release state... wtf /facepalm. Just because a game has some way for people to help fund it does not mean in any way that it is a final release version. Firefall, and many other games, have even had cash shops and founders programs open during closed betas (not to mention during open betas or before the game was in any form of beta at all). If people are to dense they cant read the clearly present BETA label all over the product thats their own fault. A lot of these games are completely f2p and without any kind of funding they would never even reach a completed release state, thus the presence of founders packs/kickstarters and cash shops. The only thing that taking peoples cash means is that they will not completely wipe the characters and the goods they bought ever again (as with Firefall, was never any character wipes even during closed beta or from closed to open even) or when they do those players will be refunded all of the currency they had accumulated.
As for having only one character slot? With the way Firefall works there is no need, use, or advantage whatsoever to having more than one character. All characters get all of the base frames and a single character can unlock every single frame to switch between whenever they want. Really having a second character would actually be even more work than unlocking everything on one and the only "benefit" at all would be being able to play 2 different genders as being a different gender is the one and only thing an alt could do that a main or other alt could not...
Kickstarter is a charity campaign, not a sale. They are under no obligation to deliver anything other than what they promise in their rewards.
Re: "Good luck getting new players" They got me! I've been playing MMORPGs since the days of Ultima and EQI. I've gotten bored with most. I've tried GW2 and TSW recently. Meh. To quote another reply "I have played for 2 weeks now and have yet to give Red 5 a single dollar. However I plan on it because despite the games issues it is freaking fun!" Firefall is FREAKING FUN! Why? It's the first true 3D game ever. You zoom in and the map and you see the contour lines. Your tactics have to include 3D positioning and flying around. The world is dynamic. It will only grow. I expect to be able to choose to play either side at some point. I was so impressed that I dropped the $100 for a starter pack. It's been worth it. I have a glider that I can take with me anywhere, and a motorcycle. Freaking Fun!
Originally posted by onerioi Re: "Good luck getting new players" They got me! I've been playing MMORPGs since the days of Ultima and EQI. I've gotten bored with most. I've tried GW2 and TSW recently. Meh. To quote another reply "I have played for 2 weeks now and have yet to give Red 5 a single dollar. However I plan on it because despite the games issues it is freaking fun!" Firefall is FREAKING FUN! Why? It's the first true 3D game ever. You zoom in and the map and you see the contour lines. Your tactics have to include 3D positioning and flying around. The world is dynamic. It will only grow. I expect to be able to choose to play either side at some point. I was so impressed that I dropped the $100 for a starter pack. It's been worth it. I have a glider that I can take with me anywhere, and a motorcycle. Freaking Fun!
Pretty much agree with all of this. Only been in the game for about 4 hours but having a blast. Looking forward to more!
Comments
Boggles seems like disappointing has become the industry standard.
I find it kinda interesting that generally if a game offers a founders pack, or a pay to beta deal, it turns out to be a total and complete piece of crap that seems to have no real development after release, and only minimal customer support.
Guess that is the new business model grab our money during the game hype stage before the game actually releases and people see just how crappy it really is, then bail on the project and move to the next money suck.
I may not agree with what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it
--Voltaire
Yeah, but as long as people know whats going on, its fine. The fanboys on forums like these who excuse them is the real problem. Were Firefall to say 'we need money, so we're going to start taking money. but we cant promise youll get what you pay for because this product is unfinished' then itd be ok. But they dodge instead, claiming to be in beta so they can excuse construction, and then selling as if they were in production.
Agreed. Only allowing one character in a beta isn't really that uncommon even if most games still allow multiple chars.
You are supposed to test the game by playing it and report in issues, not play a finished game. No need for more than one character for that.
If they still only allow one character when the game releases, then we can discuss this.
Actually, I never had issues till last night. Guess they transferred your lag to my instance.
You believe... and you're believing it wrong...
ANet was testing in-game store transactions and they charged 1$ for purchasing gems from the store. After the beta was over they refunded the 1$ charged and they deleted anything you bought from the game shop as well as all our characters.
THAT was a proper beta. Everything else, where they charge you AND keep the money earned from in game shop during that beta is just as same as releasing the game. You're charging $, then you should be able to provide the service worth that $. Simple enough.
If you decide to hide behind the BETA label it comes with a cost.
"Happiness is not a destination. It is a method of life."
-------------------------------
So all these games that aren't even in closed beta yet but take peoples cash for kickstarter programs to fund em... Yep, those are completely finished games in release state... wtf /facepalm. Just because a game has some way for people to help fund it does not mean in any way that it is a final release version. Firefall, and many other games, have even had cash shops and founders programs open during closed betas (not to mention during open betas or before the game was in any form of beta at all). If people are to dense they cant read the clearly present BETA label all over the product thats their own fault. A lot of these games are completely f2p and without any kind of funding they would never even reach a completed release state, thus the presence of founders packs/kickstarters and cash shops. The only thing that taking peoples cash means is that they will not completely wipe the characters and the goods they bought ever again (as with Firefall, was never any character wipes even during closed beta or from closed to open even) or when they do those players will be refunded all of the currency they had accumulated.
As for having only one character slot? With the way Firefall works there is no need, use, or advantage whatsoever to having more than one character. All characters get all of the base frames and a single character can unlock every single frame to switch between whenever they want. Really having a second character would actually be even more work than unlocking everything on one and the only "benefit" at all would be being able to play 2 different genders as being a different gender is the one and only thing an alt could do that a main or other alt could not...
Yeah well this game is not doing a kickstarter, the game is open to the public and has a working cash shop. You can hardly compare this game to something like Star Citizen or Repop; that is just stupid. Calling Firefall beta is just getting them a lot of extra criticism and it's well deserved. I'm getting sick of these games running as a retail but trying to hide behind the term beta. If your game is open to the public, not doing data wipes, and taking money from customers then that is called retail. Enough with this endless beta status BS.
This game has been in development since 2005. It isn't an indie studio either it is owned by the 9 which was the old wow publisher in China. They can't have it both ways on everything. They want the revenue stream of a released game but then they want everyone to cut them slack because the game is clearly in a very rough state. Then they want to play the "we aren't wow" card claiming they don't have the resources of large studios. Well they have money for expensive convention booths, cosplayers, and a whole production team to make stupid videos that have nothing to do with the game. I mean cmon 8 years? It's just a game, not the great pyramid. Welcome to Tabula Rasa 2.0.
Can't agree more. Having an active cash shop and getting money from your customers means your product is in production and no longer in the test phase...
In general, bad things happen to games, even with those long launched. It's only sad that after a week they still don't seem to have found and fixed the issue. Things like this should have highest priority and be fixed within 24hours...
Where did you find this definition? Link please
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I am surprised people are complaining about paying for the game. Not getting what you paid for? Your character is not purple anymore when you log in? Mine is. : D
Seriously though even on the absolute worst laggiest of nights the gameplay was not affected for me. I couldn't switch frames, or do any of the sin stuff really, but that seems to be run on a completely different server. Shooting, movement, missions, etc were all completely fine.
It seems like people are going out of their way to troll some great games these days. This game is phenomenal, an absolute blast. If you aren't having fun playing this then I imagine it is that you simply don't like fps-mmo hybrids, as this is far and above the best in that genre to come out. It is just plain fun. The enemies are fun to kill, most of the weapons are fun to use, travelling is fun, there is a very real death penalty, game-changing crafting, random quests, nice graphics, good performance... what is here right now is pretty fantastic, I just want more of it.
On top of all that, this is one of the best if not the best use of F2P that I have seen. I have unlocked 3 classes in 10 or so days, am going to unlock another tomorrow or the day after, and the only thing I spent money on was to paint my bastion and my dragonfly (though it came with a cosmetic helmet and a short cooldown glider as well). You can unlock classes by paying but you can still unlock them very quickly without paying... and I definitely prefer the latter. In game you can spend money to buy cosmetic stuff like hats, different armor paint, a fluff pet, a different color motorcycle, etc. The game does give you a few plain selections for armor paint (red, green, blue, etc), and unlockable classes all come colored anyways (default classes are plain white by default). You can get at least one cosmetic head item from achievements, and at least one reusable glider from achievements. You can play everything there is without paying a cent, and you do not have to spend a lot of time unlocking things either.
The only real criticism I can think of is that the game plain old needs more. More of all the things. Of course, that might be a mistake, spreading the population of each server over a larger area might not be a good idea. Maybe adding more missions, more classes, more events, etc.
Kickstarter is a charity campaign, not a sale. They are under no obligation to deliver anything other than what they promise in their rewards.
Im not so sure of this policy any more.
So any game that has a preorder is considered released.
So you pay 50-60$ and cant play a game at all for a few months, until its released. Best case scenario is that you get into BETA by giving them money.