To the OP, how many more of these pointless threads are you going to make? There is no point in continuing this debate. What's done is done. Short of a miracle, the graphics are here to stay. If they really bother you this much then just don't play the game. Simple as that. Just walk away, calm down, and find something else to play.
I am not sure what ppl are upset about, the landscape(world), the chars or both.
Personally I never felt any EQ version had great graphics.
Looking at WoW then looking at Wildstar kinda gives us an idea of how far along these type of graphics have progressed and what we should expect in EQnext. It is really not that bad and still an improvement over their past graphics.
I'm fine with the landscape, even though it's a substantially different (more plastic) look than EQ1. It reminds me in many ways of the EQ2 look when it comes to the lands, even though they are slightly different styles.
It's really the character art (and mob art) that is so cartoony. I'm going to feel like I'm killing Pete's Dragon (shout out to those old enough to know what I'm talking about) instead of Nagafen. And I have a really hard time stepping into my character's persona when it looks like a Disney toon. I had the same issue with WoW. For some reason it was easier to imagine myself as my EQ1 toon. No idea why.
That doesn't matter whom was the Art director where. She's being TOLD to do this direction by upper management whom are, yet again trying to feed off of WoW's tactics that only work for WoW's specific theme.
She's not the one who made this decision, I promise.
On her twitter she references the stylization of EQ1 and says this new style pays homage to it. If you have seen the early EQ concept art that is part of the EverQuest loading screens, you know what she says is not a stretch at all. I can see how people would be confused though because most people associate Kieth Parkinson's marketing material/box art paintings with Everquest more than the actual concept art, which was not widely shown to the public. @Nazonozonoya EQ characters were actually pretty stylized. I was the AD of EQ, so that's my roots -Im always looking for ways to pay homage! — Rosie Rappaport (@Rosierap)August 5, 2013
Like this one?
That is a pretty good find, and kind of matches the new style very closely.
I for one though the landscape graphics were great, I don't like furry characters at all so I wouldn't care what the cat people looked like, but the lighting and day night cycle were very good for an MMO.
I will reserve final judgement until I see the gnomes of course, upon which all things revolve and all things depend for MMO goodness.
Seriously though I predict, on this 13th day of August, that the next few screen shots released will show a darker character set..probably male necromancers or thieves in gloomy environments just to shut up some of the trolls...which is a shame because all anyone wants to see is the gnomes.
"This pulls it out of the teen demo which has historically been the target for the majority of MMOs and lands it..." The target for MMOs has historically been 18-34.
"This raises the question of how mature can content be, when they know children are watching?" Mature enough that the videos start out with "May contain content that is inappropriate for children" which refers solely to the content in the box and not the online experience.
"That means parents will buy it for them, thinking it’s age appropriate." See above.
"Right now it looks very plausible that 10-year-olds will flock to the game due to the Saturday morning cartoon animation. If SOE knows this and wants this, that means they must game design around it." I don't even know where to start with this subjective, baseless nonsense.
ESRB labels, one of the few things parents actually look at, are at the beginning of every trailer. If there's a box product, it will be on the box. If there's is no box product, the likelihood of a parent buying it for their little kid is greatly reduced.
That was the most misinformed pile of crap on the topic to date.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Who says this art style has to be exclusively for kids? I mean, we are talking about a video game in the end. I remember when video games, for the simple fact of being a video game, was for kids. I will not be made to conform to 'gritty and realistic.!"
No one is asking for "Realistic Graphics". What people are asking for is simply an atompshere that fits within the Everquest franchise as a whole.
Almost anything would be better than Cartoon based graphics, and I say cartoon because the character models they presented at the reveal look EXACTLY like those animated shorts that StarWars was putting out for awhile.
-Thank You /bow
So the EQ character models suck.
The EQ2 character models suck.
The LoN character models were uninspired.
And you think the EQN models suck.
Sounds like it fits in with the franchise pretty well.
I do hope you do find a game where you can battle evil dragons with your magical elf in a way that isn't like childish Star Wars cartoons. That must be infuriating for the graphics to draw attention to the fact that we are playing make-believe . I'm a little saddened that the previous graphics made you feel you were somehow playing something more important than a game based in child-like fantasy.
__________________
On a side note, and I've posted it before:
The first day I loaded up EQ I was completely let down by the graphics and said to my friend - "I wonder if these games will ever get as good as a pixar character".
Seems that day has come and I am utterly confused by the detractors acting as if it is a step backwards or an insult to players by providing the most advanced expressive character models on the market.
Not my personal choice for character models, but the notion that graphics in any way shape or form make EQ EQ is absolutely ridiculous.
People really need to get over this issue. there are far, far more important issues to worry about with EQN right now. Like those stupid red circles on the ground. Id say action combat in general, which is a much bigger divergence from the franchise than the graphics, but I doubt thats going away sadly.
Worry about the stuff we can actually shape EQN with, like fighting to make sure there are unique cities you are born in for each race. Stuff that can still be changed.
And for the love of Karana...if you insist on being a boil on everyone's ass and complain about the graphics...please stop comparing EQN's art style with WoW, the two games look nothing alike.
I just find the EQN graphics lacklustre. I really don't need photorealism, but some more lush and detailled style than this. Granted, we haven't seen much, so it is only based on what we know. Take LOTRO or GW2. THAT is lush and detailled, that is beautiful without being photorealistic at all. EQN is just so cartoony in a not cool way. Like all looks flat and sort of like SWTOR, boring landscapes. *shrug*
"The problem Everquest Next has isn’t that the graphics look highly animated. It’s that it looks like a cartoon. Specifically it looks like cartoons that young children would like." ... "Whom is EQN designed for? What is the target audience? Right now it looks very plausible that 10-year-olds will flock to the game due to the Saturday morning cartoon animation."
EQN looks EXACTLY like a game for 10 year old kids, like Free Realms. And sorry, I am just not 10 years old anymore.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
but but but we have to blame everything we dont like on ps4
like the 8 action slots! Just using the PS3 controller (I have no clue if ps4 will use similar) you can easily make 40+ triggers based off that controller. the 4 buttons. R1 + 4 buttons. r2 + 4 buttons. r1+r2+ 4 buttons. Not to mention the thumbsticks. etc etc. 8 action slots is most definitely not a console limitation.
I won't take anyone serious until they stop calling it childish. If you want to have your opinion respected, then please don't attempt to make anyone who likes the art style seem either immature or a child.
Children and adults like art styles of all different kinds. If you want to call it cartoony or animated, that is fine. But once you start throwing out the "childish" and "it's made for 12yr olds" I'm just not going to care what you say anymore.
Video games used to be considered for children remember.
I won't take anyone serious until they stop calling it childish. If you want to have your opinion respected, then please don't attempt to make anyone who likes the art style seem either immature or a child.
Children and adults like art styles of all different kinds. If you want to call it cartoony or animated, that is fine. But once you start throwing out the "childish" and "it's made for 12yr olds" I'm just not going to care what you say anymore.
Video games used to be considered for children remember.
Right behind you on this...+1
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Originally posted by tedgp It amazes me how many people fail to understand that the graphics in game are LATE ALPHA place holder graphics. They arent the ones that will be in release. SOE pretty much said this at the presentation.
Yes, exactly. Anything can and quite possibly will change between now and the time that this game gets anywhere near a playable state.
Also, I find it hilarious that people are trying to tell the company that created EQ what EQ is supposed to look like. The original look of EQ wouldn't have existed without the same devs that are being crucified now for wanting to take their game in a different direction.
The art direction they're going does NOT fit Everquest.
Er, no. It doesn't fit some people's idea of what EverQuest is.
The developers obviously disagree, and they're the ones that created the original game in the first place. If they want to experiment with their own franchise and their own game world and take it in a new direction, then players have two choices: play it or don't.
"This pulls it out of the teen demo which has historically been the target for the majority of MMOs and lands it..." The target for MMOs has historically been 18-34.
"This raises the question of how mature can content be, when they know children are watching?" Mature enough that the videos start out with "May contain content that is inappropriate for children" which refers solely to the content in the box and not the online experience.
"That means parents will buy it for them, thinking it’s age appropriate." See above.
"Right now it looks very plausible that 10-year-olds will flock to the game due to the Saturday morning cartoon animation. If SOE knows this and wants this, that means they must game design around it." I don't even know where to start with this subjective, baseless nonsense.
ESRB labels, one of the few things parents actually look at, are at the beginning of every trailer. If there's a box product, it will be on the box. If there's is no box product, the likelihood of a parent buying it for their little kid is greatly reduced.
That was the most misinformed pile of crap on the topic to date.
I didn't see the problems you have with the article. For one most MMOs are T for Teen aren't they? That puts it at 13+ not 18. I actually thought the game does kind of look like a kids game. Just didn't think about it the way the author did, but I see the point. It pays to advertise and the graphic style is advertising a kids game. sorry if you don't like the truth.
"This pulls it out of the teen demo which has historically been the target for the majority of MMOs and lands it..." The target for MMOs has historically been 18-34.
"This raises the question of how mature can content be, when they know children are watching?" Mature enough that the videos start out with "May contain content that is inappropriate for children" which refers solely to the content in the box and not the online experience.
"That means parents will buy it for them, thinking it’s age appropriate." See above.
"Right now it looks very plausible that 10-year-olds will flock to the game due to the Saturday morning cartoon animation. If SOE knows this and wants this, that means they must game design around it." I don't even know where to start with this subjective, baseless nonsense.
ESRB labels, one of the few things parents actually look at, are at the beginning of every trailer. If there's a box product, it will be on the box. If there's is no box product, the likelihood of a parent buying it for their little kid is greatly reduced.
That was the most misinformed pile of crap on the topic to date.
I didn't see the problems you have with the article. For one most MMOs are T for Teen aren't they? That puts it at 13+ not 18. I actually thought the game does kind of look like a kids game. Just didn't think about it the way the author did, but I see the point. It pays to advertise and the graphic style is advertising a kids game. sorry if you don't like the truth.
I disagree that cartoon animation automatically means 'for kids'.
Beavis and Butthead, South Park, The Simpsons, Futurama, Family Guy, American Dad - Adult Swim.
At most, I would say it 'can' mean 'family friendly':
Toy Story, Wall-E, The Incredibles, Looney Tunes (the original movie shorts) and most Disney movies are specifically written to entertain kids and adults alike.
I get as excited about Pixar as a kid does. Dumbo pulls at your heart strings dammit.
It is utterly rediculous to say that EQN is targetting the same crowd as Dora the Explorer just because they are both cartoons.
Go watch some Ren and Stimpy for God's sake people.
And get over your 'grown-up' adult self - you are fighting mystical dragons with magical elves for crying out loud.
I have no problem with the GFX what so ever. They stated they were going to take EQ next in a different direction and not gut the other EQ games. I really don't see what the big deal is.
A new generation is growing up and this might appeal to them. I also think it'll allow the game to run on low spec systems.
Mindcraft has sold millions of copy's and its not because of the GFX. So if EQ next has great game play the GFX will take a back seat.
Couldn't have said it better. I'm very excited about EQN. I've played EQ,EQ2 and plan to play EQN. I like the fact that EQN doesn't look like a high res version of EQ2. Its something new and exciting.
"This pulls it out of the teen demo which has historically been the target for the majority of MMOs and lands it..." The target for MMOs has historically been 18-34.
"This raises the question of how mature can content be, when they know children are watching?" Mature enough that the videos start out with "May contain content that is inappropriate for children" which refers solely to the content in the box and not the online experience.
"That means parents will buy it for them, thinking it’s age appropriate." See above.
"Right now it looks very plausible that 10-year-olds will flock to the game due to the Saturday morning cartoon animation. If SOE knows this and wants this, that means they must game design around it." I don't even know where to start with this subjective, baseless nonsense.
ESRB labels, one of the few things parents actually look at, are at the beginning of every trailer. If there's a box product, it will be on the box. If there's is no box product, the likelihood of a parent buying it for their little kid is greatly reduced.
That was the most misinformed pile of crap on the topic to date.
I didn't see the problems you have with the article. For one most MMOs are T for Teen aren't they? That puts it at 13+ not 18. I actually thought the game does kind of look like a kids game. Just didn't think about it the way the author did, but I see the point. It pays to advertise and the graphic style is advertising a kids game. sorry if you don't like the truth.
I disagree that cartoon animation automatically means 'for kids'.
Beavis and Butthead, South Park, The Simpsons, Futurama, Family Guy, American Dad - Adult Swim.
At most, I would say it 'can' mean 'family friendly':
Toy Story, Wall-E, The Incredibles, Looney Tunes (the original movie shorts) and most Disney movies are specifically written to entertain kids and adults alike.
I get as excited about Pixar as a kid does. Dumbo pulls at your heart strings dammit.
It is utterly rediculous to say that EQN is targetting the same crowd as Dora the Explorer just because they are both cartoons.
Go watch some Ren and Stimpy for God's sake people.
And get over your 'grown-up' adult self - you are fighting mystical dragons with magical elves for crying out loud.
I've gotta agree.
Not to mention games like psychonauts, Grim Fandango, Secret of Monkey Island, Journey, just to name a few. All with cartoony graphics, but were fun, fairly mature (though monkey island did have low-brow humor) games enjoyed by many adults. That doesn't even get into some of the animated things that have come out. Aion Flux, Cat Soup, there's quite a few 'cartoons' that are more mature than a lot of their non-illustrated counter parts.
It's a stylistic choice, nothing more. Cartoons may have been for kids 20-50 years ago. Those kids have since grown up.
Sorry, but it seems to me some people don't even WANT to understand the critique. They just brush it off with the most stupid replies. You don't have to SHARE the critique, but it would decend if you didn't purposefully misunderstand it.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
I disagree that cartoon animation automatically means 'for kids'.
Beavis and Butthead, South Park, The Simpsons, Futurama, Family Guy, American Dad - Adult Swim.
At most, I would say it 'can' mean 'family friendly':
Toy Story, Wall-E, The Incredibles, Looney Tunes (the original movie shorts) and most Disney movies are specifically written to entertain kids and adults alike.
I get as excited about Pixar as a kid does. Dumbo pulls at your heart strings dammit.
It is utterly rediculous to say that EQN is targetting the same crowd as Dora the Explorer just because they are both cartoons.
Go watch some Ren and Stimpy for God's sake people.
And get over your 'grown-up' adult self - you are fighting mystical dragons with magical elves for crying out loud.
Love this post. You are exactly the kinda player I wanna group with in an MMO. You too get that this is fantasy. Not a simulator for wanna be warriors and warlocks.
Comments
EQNext is an evolution of an established style led by the same art director.
There is a lot more of theses in your EQ UI/default/loadscreens folder. They are quite charming and nostalgic.
I'm fine with the landscape, even though it's a substantially different (more plastic) look than EQ1. It reminds me in many ways of the EQ2 look when it comes to the lands, even though they are slightly different styles.
It's really the character art (and mob art) that is so cartoony. I'm going to feel like I'm killing Pete's Dragon (shout out to those old enough to know what I'm talking about) instead of Nagafen. And I have a really hard time stepping into my character's persona when it looks like a Disney toon. I had the same issue with WoW. For some reason it was easier to imagine myself as my EQ1 toon. No idea why.
Like this one?
That is a pretty good find, and kind of matches the new style very closely.
I for one though the landscape graphics were great, I don't like furry characters at all so I wouldn't care what the cat people looked like, but the lighting and day night cycle were very good for an MMO.
I will reserve final judgement until I see the gnomes of course, upon which all things revolve and all things depend for MMO goodness.
Seriously though I predict, on this 13th day of August, that the next few screen shots released will show a darker character set..probably male necromancers or thieves in gloomy environments just to shut up some of the trolls...which is a shame because all anyone wants to see is the gnomes.
Seriously, until the gnomes are unveiled, there is no ground for judgment.
Interesting take on the graphics discussion.
http://joysticklove.wordpress.com/2013/08/13/everquest-next-it-could-be-a-kids-game-whether-soe-likes-it-or-not/
That was the most misinformed pile of crap on the topic to date.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
So the EQ character models suck.
The EQ2 character models suck.
The LoN character models were uninspired.
And you think the EQN models suck.
Sounds like it fits in with the franchise pretty well.
I do hope you do find a game where you can battle evil dragons with your magical elf in a way that isn't like childish Star Wars cartoons. That must be infuriating for the graphics to draw attention to the fact that we are playing make-believe . I'm a little saddened that the previous graphics made you feel you were somehow playing something more important than a game based in child-like fantasy.
__________________
On a side note, and I've posted it before:
The first day I loaded up EQ I was completely let down by the graphics and said to my friend - "I wonder if these games will ever get as good as a pixar character".
Seems that day has come and I am utterly confused by the detractors acting as if it is a step backwards or an insult to players by providing the most advanced expressive character models on the market.
Why the gimped graphics ?
Sony owns Playstation
Playstation will play EQN
PS users get Playstation graphics
So like Planetside 2 graphics?
Here are some PS4 graphics
Not my personal choice for character models, but the notion that graphics in any way shape or form make EQ EQ is absolutely ridiculous.
People really need to get over this issue. there are far, far more important issues to worry about with EQN right now. Like those stupid red circles on the ground. Id say action combat in general, which is a much bigger divergence from the franchise than the graphics, but I doubt thats going away sadly.
Worry about the stuff we can actually shape EQN with, like fighting to make sure there are unique cities you are born in for each race. Stuff that can still be changed.
And for the love of Karana...if you insist on being a boil on everyone's ass and complain about the graphics...please stop comparing EQN's art style with WoW, the two games look nothing alike.
I agree with Master BearKnight. Well said.
I just find the EQN graphics lacklustre. I really don't need photorealism, but some more lush and detailled style than this. Granted, we haven't seen much, so it is only based on what we know. Take LOTRO or GW2. THAT is lush and detailled, that is beautiful without being photorealistic at all. EQN is just so cartoony in a not cool way. Like all looks flat and sort of like SWTOR, boring landscapes. *shrug*
This article really says it well, too.
"The problem Everquest Next has isn’t that the graphics look highly animated. It’s that it looks like a cartoon. Specifically it looks like cartoons that young children would like." ... "Whom is EQN designed for? What is the target audience? Right now it looks very plausible that 10-year-olds will flock to the game due to the Saturday morning cartoon animation."
EQN looks EXACTLY like a game for 10 year old kids, like Free Realms. And sorry, I am just not 10 years old anymore.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
but but but we have to blame everything we dont like on ps4
like the 8 action slots! Just using the PS3 controller (I have no clue if ps4 will use similar) you can easily make 40+ triggers based off that controller. the 4 buttons. R1 + 4 buttons. r2 + 4 buttons. r1+r2+ 4 buttons. Not to mention the thumbsticks. etc etc. 8 action slots is most definitely not a console limitation.
I won't take anyone serious until they stop calling it childish. If you want to have your opinion respected, then please don't attempt to make anyone who likes the art style seem either immature or a child.
Children and adults like art styles of all different kinds. If you want to call it cartoony or animated, that is fine. But once you start throwing out the "childish" and "it's made for 12yr olds" I'm just not going to care what you say anymore.
Video games used to be considered for children remember.
Right behind you on this...+1
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Yes, exactly. Anything can and quite possibly will change between now and the time that this game gets anywhere near a playable state.
Also, I find it hilarious that people are trying to tell the company that created EQ what EQ is supposed to look like. The original look of EQ wouldn't have existed without the same devs that are being crucified now for wanting to take their game in a different direction.
Er, no. It doesn't fit some people's idea of what EverQuest is.
The developers obviously disagree, and they're the ones that created the original game in the first place. If they want to experiment with their own franchise and their own game world and take it in a new direction, then players have two choices: play it or don't.
LOL, I think there was another vote earlier that liked it. So that's 2 votes for and no votes against.
I personally don't mind it, Probably prefer something a bit less exaggerated, but otherwise, the art style doesn't really put me off.
Edit: But that doesn't mean I won't poke fun at it if the opportunity arises.
I didn't see the problems you have with the article. For one most MMOs are T for Teen aren't they? That puts it at 13+ not 18. I actually thought the game does kind of look like a kids game. Just didn't think about it the way the author did, but I see the point. It pays to advertise and the graphic style is advertising a kids game. sorry if you don't like the truth.
I disagree that cartoon animation automatically means 'for kids'.
Beavis and Butthead, South Park, The Simpsons, Futurama, Family Guy, American Dad - Adult Swim.
At most, I would say it 'can' mean 'family friendly':
Toy Story, Wall-E, The Incredibles, Looney Tunes (the original movie shorts) and most Disney movies are specifically written to entertain kids and adults alike.
I get as excited about Pixar as a kid does. Dumbo pulls at your heart strings dammit.
It is utterly rediculous to say that EQN is targetting the same crowd as Dora the Explorer just because they are both cartoons.
Go watch some Ren and Stimpy for God's sake people.
And get over your 'grown-up' adult self - you are fighting mystical dragons with magical elves for crying out loud.
Couldn't have said it better. I'm very excited about EQN. I've played EQ,EQ2 and plan to play EQN. I like the fact that EQN doesn't look like a high res version of EQ2. Its something new and exciting.
I've gotta agree.
Not to mention games like psychonauts, Grim Fandango, Secret of Monkey Island, Journey, just to name a few. All with cartoony graphics, but were fun, fairly mature (though monkey island did have low-brow humor) games enjoyed by many adults. That doesn't even get into some of the animated things that have come out. Aion Flux, Cat Soup, there's quite a few 'cartoons' that are more mature than a lot of their non-illustrated counter parts.
It's a stylistic choice, nothing more. Cartoons may have been for kids 20-50 years ago. Those kids have since grown up.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Love this post. You are exactly the kinda player I wanna group with in an MMO. You too get that this is fantasy. Not a simulator for wanna be warriors and warlocks.