Blizz won't go back in time and give vanilla WoW. They did the best they could: Warlords of Draenor. Just start at 90 and enjoy the ride like if the previous expansions never happened. For the Horde!
I have no idea what this hate talk is all about. When people are trying bring new ideas into the world they get spit upon, crucified and thrown to jail... No big deal. When someones says he doesn't like the game, I wouldn't jump too deep into that thought. I think more annoying are the haters who hate dislikers! Duh!
Played wow for 7 years, so probably nothing is gonna save it for me. I think I've already seen it. I'm looking for something different, though there are some elements in wow what you don't see in any other game, and the biggest difference is something that is hard to put into words, but it's clearly there with peak of 12 mil.
Talking about games where thousands of players exist simultaneously in a single instance and mechanics related to such games.
On a side note, I'd love to see either full scaling of characters to zones, just like Gw2, or get rid of levels altogether. The latter would be hard for many people to stomach, but scaling toons to zone levels would be awesome and could open up some amazing open world pvp and just plain fun to play through old content.
Level scaling, would make the whole world a viable place for action. Now you just get huddled through zones, only to never go there again because you ouotleveled it and can't gain any xp there anymore. That would probably be a big change to the game, maybe too big.
Impossible to fix at this point. First off its simply to old to get a fresh grab of players with a fresh feeling.
But to fix it means they would have to go back to talent trees and possibly even expand on the idea. Bring back difficulty in dungeons and raids, make leveling much slower. They need to kill the pvp mentality of everyone is equal to everyone else. PvP is not meant as a solo ideal and will always hurt the game as long as they attempt to balance. Balance is had through the simple fact each side could have the same class's. Not by making all class's equal.
But its a hopeless cause. They would have to virtually go back to Vanila ideals which would piss off the casuals who are already quitting in mass and the hardcore crowd wouldn't come back anyways to such an old game. Best thing to do with WoW is end it while its still biggish to keep the name while putting out a new MMO by blizzard with similiar ideals of Vanilla.
Originally posted by sportsfan You might as well ask the anti christ to fix the catholic church.I mean this site has spread WoW hate to unseen proportions in the past that it doesn't even make sense.People will love WoW for certain periods of their lives.Learn to live with it.Also:Blizzard introduced some MMO techniques other companies can only dream of. It is a waste of energy to even explain these things on the web, let alone on the MMORPG "I hate everything" forums.They just added Garrisons: construct your own settlements with barracks, mines, inn, armories, towers etc. Interiors that can be decorated and the placement can be visited with friends taking a beer at your own personal inn...You have to recruit workers, tanks, dps'ers ... all NPC's that can be send on missions for days, into dungeons even.All seamless. And what do you get in here: just the next blurb of a non finished garbage "new" mmorpg that will be dry of players 6 weeks after launch.Welcome to mmorpg.com where even the head forum watchdog just recently admitted he was a avid WoW hater for years.Grow up.
And welcome to the world where there are people with different opinions. There are people that love WoW, there are people that like WoW, there are people who have left for one small gripe or another, and of course there are people who dislike and hate WoW yes. But come into this world, and welcome yourself to other people's opinions.
maybe I should have read the OP doh. Yes disgruntled player.
That doesn't negate that people have opinions on how WoW could be improved. People will have opinions WoW is doing great for them- and that's good. But with any game, people will have opinions, and thoughts. Whether negative or positive.
No i don't personally care if it dies or not,i don't give Blizzard any of my money for 1990's tech.
As to what it would take?"
Well for a simple start,HD graphics,higher end textures,lose the linear questing,instead make questing have a purpose that is more realistic than giving XP.
stop copying the bad ideas SOE started,become your own creative game with your own ideas.
Perhaps best of all,LOSE the instancing end game gimmick,that is NOT MMORPG gaming.
Problem is this is a fix for my selfish self,Blizzard went the easier hand holding linear game style because they believed it made for an easy entry level game for all those MILLIONS of new DSL online gamer's.They were obviously correct in their marketing assessment,but make no mistake,it is not a quality game,just a popular design that favored NEW gamer's.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
"Many view it as a sort of plague that has infected the genre, and I am quick to agree with those people."
This makes no sense. It is not World of Warcrafts Fault that other developers want to take keys from it. To that end would EQ be the plaque and wow simply a victim of it. Or go even further back to what inspired the choices of EQ. Simply because you dont like a game anymore doesnt mean it "Plagues" the genre.
I think the thing that plagues the MMO genre is its players. World of warcraft itself is a good game but comes with so much hate nowadays people are misguided on it. Why is it that they can do a Call of duty game the same way for 6 games and we dont hear a peep, but if an mmo decides to stick to a proven method from wow its a plague? I think wow continues to bring new things to the MMO field that if a game didnt have nowadays the players would hate it. (LFG anyone?, Cross server questing?) The fact that blizzard is still pumping inot the game means they still think of it as a project. Next November will be wow 10th anneversary, and we could very well see some big news for it. So stop refering to wow as a plague with out it the MMO genre would have faded long ago and we wouldnt even be having this conversation.
Ps sorry about grammer and spelling United States Pupblic school system
Even Blizzard wants it to die... if it wasn't making them so much money still. The engine is so old there is just no saving it (unless you rebuild the thing).
Kind of an odd statement. The engine and graphics is part of the reason it was such a huge success and why it continues to be. The game runs on practically anything and the stylized graphics helped it hold up longer as technology progressed.
Originally posted by sportsfan You might as well ask the anti christ to fix the catholic church.
I mean this site has spread WoW hate to unseen proportions in the past that it doesn't even make sense.
People will love WoW for certain periods of their lives.
Learn to live with it.
Also:
Blizzard introduced some MMO techniques other companies can only dream of. It is a waste of energy to even explain these things on the web, let alone on the MMORPG "I hate everything" forums.
They just added Garrisons: construct your own settlements with barracks, mines, inn, armories, towers etc. Interiors that can be decorated and the placement can be visited with friends taking a beer at your own personal inn...
You have to recruit workers, tanks, dps'ers ... all NPC's that can be send on missions for days, into dungeons even.
All seamless.
And what do you get in here: just the next blurb of a non finished garbage "new" mmorpg that will be dry of players 6 weeks after launch.
Welcome to mmorpg.com where even the head forum watchdog just recently admitted he was a avid WoW hater for years.
Grow up.
And welcome to the world where there are people with different opinions. There are people that love WoW, there are people that like WoW, there are people who have left for one small gripe or another, and of course there are people who dislike and hate WoW yes. But come into this world, and welcome yourself to other people's opinions.
Opinions don't make great games. Promoting duds and hyping non existent technology is even worse.
That's exactly what happened to WoW and this industry over the past 8 years.
Guys like that Wizardry above have no clue, so they post and post and post without even considering any technological constraints.
Remember the fortresses you would build in AoC, the PvP siege mechanics in various games, the "endless open worlds" : all faked hype and based on technology that never could support it.
There is a difference between what people dream up and the implementation of it all.
By not supporting the industry's leader and have "opinions" not in accordance with what is technological feasable, you create a frustrated audiance.
Frankly this site and the industry as a whole missed the opportunity to educate people along the technological limits of on line play. Instead of stating: look the game you like is not feasable, they instead promoted thin air to promote sales with all consequences included.
Frustration and head banging against the reference as a result. MMO's are irrelevant these days, even the WoW makers are tired of it all.
Fixing is not even an option when you think you can walk to the moon.
Now, the next closest game only needs 7 million more subscribers and they'll catch up.
WoW's record lows are every other games unobtainable ceiling.
What does that have to do with anything, we all know that already. But comparing Vanilla WOW and BC era WOW to current WOW is like comparing old Mike Tyson to the new Mike Tyson who has a glass jaw and races pigeons. If they release WOW today with all the changes GC has put in it would be just another also ran. UO used to be great as well but given the choice most UO players would prefer a pre Evocare rollback.
Originally posted by Schnizle Vanilla servers or just make it more of a challenge.
Well I would have said the exact same thing a few days back... Introduce more solo challenge in an MMORPG like WoW...
Like the early D3 solo inferno difficulty etc ...
But the problem is ... I returned to WoW and dinged finally on lvl 90 and frankly ... Timeless Isle is way above my healing Paladin...
I can just beat normal mobs and they give me 2 tokens where I need ... a thousand of these to complete a quest ... Not even talking about the masses of Elites 91 that kill me instantly...
So the end result is that unless my brother and a few friends are on line I don't even bother ... I rather play a few rounds of Hearthstone.
So extreme solo challenge doesn't work in MMO's or you simply quit...
Now, the next closest game only needs 7 million more subscribers and they'll catch up.
WoW's record lows are every other games unobtainable ceiling.
Mid 2006 - in full Vanilla swing /pre TBC period - and being considered the "real cult" period WoW had just 6 million players btw.
So far the myth WoW Vanilla had more players. Anyone stating back then that WoW would still have 7.6 million actively paid subscriptions more than 7 years later would be laughed at.
On the contrary I remember posts from 2007 that WoW would be down to 1 million subs by 2009 because of all these new and superior subscription based MMO's with incredible challenging PVE, PVP and utterly fantastic game play ...
---
They all dissapeared from the subscription market ... or were shut down by 2012 ...
How many times since 2008 has the staff of mmorpg.com burned itself that WoW would no longer be the top dog ...next year ?
The last few times they even managed to state player number don't "really" count to stop the obvious embarassement.
And how many times will they repeat that same mistake in the future ?
---
It is odd that people ignore the term subscriptions when talking about other MMO's these days. Well apart from EvE, all of them hide behind walls of accounts created and vague 200% more activity ...
My bet is that none even have 500 K active subscriptions after 3 months launch. N O N E.
Comments
gameplay > graphics
I have no idea what this hate talk is all about. When people are trying bring new ideas into the world they get spit upon, crucified and thrown to jail... No big deal. When someones says he doesn't like the game, I wouldn't jump too deep into that thought. I think more annoying are the haters who hate dislikers! Duh!
Played wow for 7 years, so probably nothing is gonna save it for me. I think I've already seen it. I'm looking for something different, though there are some elements in wow what you don't see in any other game, and the biggest difference is something that is hard to put into words, but it's clearly there with peak of 12 mil.
Record lows for a 10 year old game, lol,
Level scaling, would make the whole world a viable place for action. Now you just get huddled through zones, only to never go there again because you ouotleveled it and can't gain any xp there anymore. That would probably be a big change to the game, maybe too big.
ignore sorry
Impossible to fix at this point. First off its simply to old to get a fresh grab of players with a fresh feeling.
But to fix it means they would have to go back to talent trees and possibly even expand on the idea. Bring back difficulty in dungeons and raids, make leveling much slower. They need to kill the pvp mentality of everyone is equal to everyone else. PvP is not meant as a solo ideal and will always hurt the game as long as they attempt to balance. Balance is had through the simple fact each side could have the same class's. Not by making all class's equal.
But its a hopeless cause. They would have to virtually go back to Vanila ideals which would piss off the casuals who are already quitting in mass and the hardcore crowd wouldn't come back anyways to such an old game. Best thing to do with WoW is end it while its still biggish to keep the name while putting out a new MMO by blizzard with similiar ideals of Vanilla.
And welcome to the world where there are people with different opinions.
There are people that love WoW, there are people that like WoW, there are people who have left for one small gripe or another, and of course there are people who dislike and hate WoW yes. But come into this world, and welcome yourself to other people's opinions.
maybe I should have read the OP doh.
Yes disgruntled player.
That doesn't negate that people have opinions on how WoW could be improved. People will have opinions WoW is doing great for them- and that's good. But with any game, people will have opinions, and thoughts. Whether negative or positive.
No i don't personally care if it dies or not,i don't give Blizzard any of my money for 1990's tech.
As to what it would take?"
Well for a simple start,HD graphics,higher end textures,lose the linear questing,instead make questing have a purpose that is more realistic than giving XP.
stop copying the bad ideas SOE started,become your own creative game with your own ideas.
Perhaps best of all,LOSE the instancing end game gimmick,that is NOT MMORPG gaming.
Problem is this is a fix for my selfish self,Blizzard went the easier hand holding linear game style because they believed it made for an easy entry level game for all those MILLIONS of new DSL online gamer's.They were obviously correct in their marketing assessment,but make no mistake,it is not a quality game,just a popular design that favored NEW gamer's.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Says who?
"Many view it as a sort of plague that has infected the genre, and I am quick to agree with those people."
This makes no sense. It is not World of Warcrafts Fault that other developers want to take keys from it. To that end would EQ be the plaque and wow simply a victim of it. Or go even further back to what inspired the choices of EQ. Simply because you dont like a game anymore doesnt mean it "Plagues" the genre.
I think the thing that plagues the MMO genre is its players. World of warcraft itself is a good game but comes with so much hate nowadays people are misguided on it. Why is it that they can do a Call of duty game the same way for 6 games and we dont hear a peep, but if an mmo decides to stick to a proven method from wow its a plague? I think wow continues to bring new things to the MMO field that if a game didnt have nowadays the players would hate it. (LFG anyone?, Cross server questing?) The fact that blizzard is still pumping inot the game means they still think of it as a project. Next November will be wow 10th anneversary, and we could very well see some big news for it. So stop refering to wow as a plague with out it the MMO genre would have faded long ago and we wouldnt even be having this conversation.
Ps sorry about grammer and spelling United States Pupblic school system
Kind of an odd statement. The engine and graphics is part of the reason it was such a huge success and why it continues to be. The game runs on practically anything and the stylized graphics helped it hold up longer as technology progressed.
Opinions don't make great games. Promoting duds and hyping non existent technology is even worse.
That's exactly what happened to WoW and this industry over the past 8 years.
Guys like that Wizardry above have no clue, so they post and post and post without even considering any technological constraints.
Remember the fortresses you would build in AoC, the PvP siege mechanics in various games, the "endless open worlds" : all faked hype and based on technology that never could support it.
There is a difference between what people dream up and the implementation of it all.
By not supporting the industry's leader and have "opinions" not in accordance with what is technological feasable, you create a frustrated audiance.
Frankly this site and the industry as a whole missed the opportunity to educate people along the technological limits of on line play. Instead of stating: look the game you like is not feasable, they instead promoted thin air to promote sales with all consequences included.
Frustration and head banging against the reference as a result. MMO's are irrelevant these days, even the WoW makers are tired of it all.
Fixing is not even an option when you think you can walk to the moon.
Plummeting them all the way down to #1.
Now, the next closest game only needs 7 million more subscribers and they'll catch up.
WoW's record lows are every other games unobtainable ceiling.
What does that have to do with anything, we all know that already. But comparing Vanilla WOW and BC era WOW to current WOW is like comparing old Mike Tyson to the new Mike Tyson who has a glass jaw and races pigeons. If they release WOW today with all the changes GC has put in it would be just another also ran. UO used to be great as well but given the choice most UO players would prefer a pre Evocare rollback.
Well I would have said the exact same thing a few days back... Introduce more solo challenge in an MMORPG like WoW...
Like the early D3 solo inferno difficulty etc ...
But the problem is ... I returned to WoW and dinged finally on lvl 90 and frankly ... Timeless Isle is way above my healing Paladin...
I can just beat normal mobs and they give me 2 tokens where I need ... a thousand of these to complete a quest ... Not even talking about the masses of Elites 91 that kill me instantly...
So the end result is that unless my brother and a few friends are on line I don't even bother ... I rather play a few rounds of Hearthstone.
So extreme solo challenge doesn't work in MMO's or you simply quit...
It doesn't function as such in an mmorpg.
Go back to the end of TBC and make it right from there.
With the release of WoTLK a big part of WoW died, it got more casual.
Mid 2006 - in full Vanilla swing /pre TBC period - and being considered the "real cult" period WoW had just 6 million players btw.
So far the myth WoW Vanilla had more players. Anyone stating back then that WoW would still have 7.6 million actively paid subscriptions more than 7 years later would be laughed at.
On the contrary I remember posts from 2007 that WoW would be down to 1 million subs by 2009 because of all these new and superior subscription based MMO's with incredible challenging PVE, PVP and utterly fantastic game play ...
---
They all dissapeared from the subscription market ... or were shut down by 2012 ...
How many times since 2008 has the staff of mmorpg.com burned itself that WoW would no longer be the top dog ...next year ?
The last few times they even managed to state player number don't "really" count to stop the obvious embarassement.
And how many times will they repeat that same mistake in the future ?
---
It is odd that people ignore the term subscriptions when talking about other MMO's these days. Well apart from EvE, all of them hide behind walls of accounts created and vague 200% more activity ...
My bet is that none even have 500 K active subscriptions after 3 months launch. N O N E.
How about "fixing" them first...