Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
Every MMO is the same.
SwampRob
Member UncommonPosts: 1,003
I really hope I'm wrong in my title.
When I see a new MMO coming out, I immediately look for two things:
1. How PvE-focused is it?
2. How group-oriented is it?
= = = = =
1. I care nothing for PvP. I come from a world of tabletop RPGs and I've no desire to compete in one in any way, PvP, ladders, etc. I don't mind if a game has some of that, but if it negatively impacts the PvE experience (I'm looking at you damage charts), it sours it for me.
2. Group oriented, by which I mean group only. I don't want to start a debate on the merits of group vs solo play. Let's just say that for the way I like to play, if I HAVE to group up in order to maximize progression (read: earn the best possible gear), then I'm out before I start.
So what happens over and over is that there is always a lot of content I'll never see (raids, large group, pvp), and I have to play knowing that I'll never be able to max my character out in terms of gear. I've done this for numerous MMOs in the past, and I just can't do it anymore.
Now I GET that lots of people enjoy both 1 and 2. Nothing wrong with that. But it seems like EVERY. SINGLE. MMO. follows this format. I just watched a video on Elder Scrolls Online and it's the same as every other MMO. Can't some of them, maybe 20%, not uset this pattern?
Are MMOs simply done for me? Is there no hope at all that I'll ever get to play in a consistent world, filled with life (other players), and not be limited to the content I can see and the progression I can make?
Comments
regarding your criticism that every new mmo is solo friendly
it's true but i don't see that as a bad thing
EQ2 fan sites
Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen
http://www.rerolled.org/showthread.php?3460-Pantheon-Rise-of-the-Fallen
https://twitter.com/Aradune
Keep and eye out for the kickstarter soon.
You pose some good questions, and questions I don't see answered by developers much, if at all.
If a player puts time in on something in the game that appeals to him/her, why can't they excel at it, instead of being forced to follow the herd? And if the "road less traveled" is what developers want, why is it so discouraged to pursue for a new shiny?
What's discouraging for me is seeing so much wasted content left to hang dry, but that content is rarely updated to remain interesting in later expansions. Great examples are the cities in WoW, as soon as new one is made, the other is abandoned like an empty strip mall (and it's surrounding zones/continent is as barren).
.:| Kevyne@Shandris - Armory |:. - When WoW was #1 - .:| I AM A HOLY PALADIN - Guild Theme |:.
When you start playing computer games in general - not just MMOs / MMORPGs - PvE is great.
However, with experience you begin to realise how repetitive PvE becomes. (SWTOR is one of the worst offenders - NPCs have the AI of a house brick and are just as static).
With experience, you begin to prefer PvP because a human opponent is far more versatile than a computer could ever be.
This is why MMOs tend to have PvE and PvP - they are hedging their bets.
Having said all that, the OP is absolutely correct - every MMO is very similar.
Generally speaking, it's very hard to find a game that is different.
They seem the same because of how many of them followed the clone line of EQ to DaoC to WoW.
You really have to look for an MMO that isnt lacking in innovation with the same cheap bland play style those games brought to the genre.
"People who tell you youre awesome are useless. No, dangerous.
They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/
It's because I think modern MMOs are designed by business school graduates who've never played an MMO in their life. They just look at "well X game did that and succeeded" (usually WoW) "so let's just put that in our game!" and "Oh, maybe we need one new twist that other games don't have for our marketing! Let's get the intern downstairs on it!" Maybe they run some focus groups too but no one at the top of the company have an actual vision of the type of game they want to make. I really hope some of these crowdfunded MMOs explode in popularity just to encourage more innovation in the industry as a whole.
It's sad the state of corporate MMOs now.
"EVE is likely the best MMORPG that you've never really understood or played" - Kyleran
Play ARPGs. You can get everything in the game solo-ing, and you can even group with others if you so desire.
A more careful reading of the OP and not just replying to the title of the thread might be warranted.
OP is saying that every MMO he sees these days follow similar design in terms that to achieve maximum progression, in terms of either gear or whatever, it requires him/her to group up to obtain it, and he's looking for a game that let's soloers obtain the same gear as the raiders.
He also doesn't want the PVP design to impact the PVE experience, and since few modern MMORPG's come out without PVP, which almost always influences PVE design somehow he isn't finding the type of MMO he's looking for.
Strangely enough, he could totally play EVE solo and with enough time train up to fly or craft the the best ships and gear all the while soloing, and have high level skills in many areas. (heck with enough ISK, he could buy a maximum level character, which some have done)
I've met several EVE players who live totally on their own in wormholes and have more wealth than most people can dream of. One had his own fleet of dreadnaughts and carriers which to mine or help defend his wormhole/station
But I suspect EVE's PVP "interference" on PVE activities would be a non-starter for the OP so it won't work out.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
MMO, massively multiplayer online. That alone tells me what these games should be all about; to play with (or against) other people.
I'm not a big fan of PvP, and i believe there could be MMOs with no PvP what so ever, but gearing up your toon only for PvE encounters becomes old pretty fast. And, if the game is mmorpg and not moba or similar pvp lobby game, your strength in pvp should depend on gear coming from PvE.
Grouping is also a two-edged sword. On one hand, there has to be group content in MMO (see above), and it has to be rewarding to take part on it, but on the other hand everyone has moments when you want to play on your own, even in MMO. Sadly, most modern MMOs are almost single-player games these days, and therefore i gotta agree with OP they really are the same.
You are being too literal. There are lots of games classified as MMO that i can enjoy solo, without interacting with anyone.
Why do you need to earn the best possible gear if you choose not to fight content that requires a group?
If you wish to limit yourself to solo content only, then you just need to find out what gear is available via solo only content and set the best as your objective. It won't be best in the game, but it will be best in YOUR game.
To show off? To rub his gearscore on someone else? To rank high on some toon ranking website? To feel good about getting the best gear?
Don't tell me you think people only acquire things (virtual or real) that they need to use.
They do share a common pedigree though: little solo content that isn't just centered around questing, which rewards are lackluster and soon forgettable.
EQII was the only MMO I played that I could solo/raid/dungeon/grind for a nice piece of game gear at level, or could go back and solo it -- that beautiful Cloak of Flames. The one item in all the MMOs that I cherish upon cherish...because there were options, challenging enough, and memorable enough to keep me working for it for a year (4 months just killing Kobolds for a page). HQ quest line is A+++.
.:| Kevyne@Shandris - Armory |:. - When WoW was #1 - .:| I AM A HOLY PALADIN - Guild Theme |:.
Oh really?
Just how much tabletop RPG have you done solo?
So you want the experience of playing a Tabletop RPG, but you want to experience that alone?
What you want is an immersive single player RPG, not an MMORPG.
He put the tabletop RPG conditional in there to explain he's not into PvP, and doesn't want to play PvP.
And even if he did play RPGs like that, people can play solo in MMOs (I think it'll become the biggest trend in MMOs, especially as the "communities" tend to be more and more less desired, and devs can't give us enough /ignore slots for the trash that pollute games...all of WoW, millions of players, and only 50 ignore slots!). -_-
.:| Kevyne@Shandris - Armory |:. - When WoW was #1 - .:| I AM A HOLY PALADIN - Guild Theme |:.
May be he is sick of talking to other people while gaming?
Many MMORPGs *are* single player RPG now. I play many as such. There is no reason why he cannot do that too.
"If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor
@swamprob If you find a pve-focused game that doesn't push you to group play, let me know, that's what I want too. Preferably with a pretty world too, not one of these grimy broken undead-populated or war-torn depressing violent worlds. Every time I think I've found a game like this, mainly crafting-sandbox type MMOs, it turns out that the crafting itself requires group play. Yuck. x_x
@jdnyc Maybe you might try to figure out what people think is unique about soloing in an MMO vs. playing a single-player RPG. They are really NOT the same, and do not satisfy the same type of play urges.
I wouldn't say that every MMO fits that description. I'm not sure that I'd even say that most of them do.
Try Uncharted Waters Online. It fits what you claim to be looking for, but it's a very weird game, so you have to give it a month or so or else you'll have given up before you have any clue what's going on.
You could also try A Tale in the Desert as proof that not every MMORPG is the same. For starters, it doesn't have combat. At all.