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What advice would you give this MMO - Developer ?
Ulorik
Member UncommonPosts: 179
Lets say you had just completed a closed Beta weekend and you would have been able to present a game to your testers that:
- was based on a strong IP and was able to stay fairly true to this IP
- had gorgeous graphics and a beautifully realised world
- ran smoothly and with said gorgeous graphics on a 2.5 year old system
- had intelligent quests and was almost completely voiced over with excellent voice acting (second only to TSW)
- had a massive world to explore and a decent 3 faction pvp system
...but still on forums such as this would get a lot of hate, by people who obviously hadn't played the game, but for some strange reason think it is flavor of the month to spout all sorts of negative comments and predictions about this very game.
What would you do as developer and publisher in this situation?
- Lift NDA to give all those who absolutely love the game a chance to give their opinion?
- Explain that a game with a strong open PvP element has to be subscription based in order to avoid p2w
- other?
Also, what would be thinking if throughout the Beta of this game some low level testers in chat would come up with the very same comments (and always referring to the same XXX game):
I'm in the Beta of XXX, XXX is so much better
At level 5 or so: Thats it, I had enough, I'm logging off to play XXX
I'm not going to buy this game, I have only money for one game and I will be buying XXX
strange or what?
Comments
Is this just a very clever way of saying you like ESO without breaking the NDA?
Anyway I'd say don't worry about it, let them deal with it.
No, this is actually not what I'm saying.
What motivated me to make this post is that there is a game in development that imho is going to be very strong and it puzzles me that I see the developers/publishers of this game sitting on their hands, while in danger that a self-fulfilling prophecy is being created based on a FotM Hate campaign against this game.
Get off your arse guys !
Releasing too much information about a game before it hits the shelves tends to deflate the excitement at release. It also hasn't really seemed to help other games, so why do it? Besides, MMORPGs are huge undertakings. If it's late in the development cycle, core features of the game aren't going to change, and it might be better to let the game release rather than get people all bent out of shape about things that, while implemented correctly, anger a small, vocal minority of people.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
Name that game or stop playing forum games.
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
Strange how? I would take a serious look at the game then and try to figure out why all these players dislike it.
Based on the description, it doesn't sound familiar, not anything I've heard of.
I guess tell them to ignore the hate. If it's good, it makes money. If not, it'll still make money. So in the end, who cares?
My advice to developers who're experiencing constant hate throughout the MMORPG community? I would say, "Just be honest and call your game a Co'op... not a MMO."
If SWTOR labeled itself as a co'op game, it would've been readily accepted for what it is. It's like Richard Simmons fans calling themselves MMA fighters after their "step 'n punch" workouts.
I'm pretty sure this is about TESO, after playing MMO's for over 20 years I don't even need to try the game out to judge if the game is good or not. I mean c'mon now, we all know these types of MMO's are almost all alike and the only thing we hope for is when TESO does release, it releases with as much features as possible and not bring up future content in a "expansion" excuse. What kills a MMO now a days is not the fact that they look a lot like WoW, it's the fact that they release in a Alpha stage. I can guarantee you one thing right now, no matter how successful TESO ends up to be, it won't beat, or come any where close, to the numbers of Maple Story or Minecraft. And as great of a franchise Elder Scrolls is, you'd expect nothing less but the best, but in TESO's case it will not deliver. The only major crowd TESO will gather are those that left FF14, and I already feel sorry for them.
On a side note, I noticed MMORPG.com has about 2.6 million users , roughly 3000 online users but only 6 million posts? Do the math. Most of the 2.6mil users post once every 4 years like the world cup. Just goes to tell you that you should never believe any hype what so ever. You can trust me when I say don't waste your cash on TESO, let a friend buy it and check it out yourself. Or go buy it but please don't come crying on how much the game sucks and doesn't meet expectations because then you'll feel my wrath!
As a designer and developer, you just continue forward with what your team has built up to that point. You have to understand that people are entitled to their opinions, even if they are against your product. You might be able to flag the user that takes things a bit to far and then not invite that person to the next beta test, but realistically there is not much that should happen.
The advice that I would give the developer is to just keep on doing what they were doing and allow the game to stand on its own merits at release.
One thing is for sure, just because you have the internet it does not make you smart. Therefore pretty much anybody can say anything and it doesn't mean much. If a game is good it will get played, even by the same people who shot it down in the beginning.
Opinions on games are just what they are, opinions. There is no qualifier as to who's opinion you can trust and who's opinion you can't trust and so there is no reason to think that anything you hear is anything other than one persons personal statement about what they like and what they do not like.
It's like movie critics. How many people thought that Inception was like "the best thing ever!!!" when Leonardo DiCaprio released almost the EXACT same plot in a movie he made RIGHT BEFORE he made Inception?
People don't know dude. Better you not involve yourself in their BS.
That's the advice I'd give.
I would say:
That sounds like every other AAA MMO in past 9 years... Got anything special and unique up your sleeve? If not get ready to be dissapointed...
became a game developer only if your passionate by gaming or by creating virtual universes at some point we are gods of new virtual creation. Be perfectionist don't stop on a minimal requirement try doing it perfect. Often small detail make game amazing. Gamers spend a lot of time playing and small details are easily spotted like a 2004 animation in a 2014 game.
Honestly, take a few minutes and do a headcount of all the haters of this game...its like 9 people: About half of em hate every mmo, period. Out of the 4 or 5 that only hate this game, half of those are fresh accounts, most likely alts created for the sole purpose of trolling. So in the end theres maybe 2 or 3 unique little angry snowflakes for this particular game. Who gives a shit.
Trying to belittle those players, me included, who are not getting what the IP (purposely chosen) promises, does nothing except show your true colors.
We in Tamriel? Check.
Is there mouse click fighting? Check.
Quests? Check.
Magic? Check.
Skills? Check.
10 Player Races? Nope, but we do have 9 of them. Sorry Imperial fans.
Player Housing? Maybe... Later... In the future... In an expansion...
Anything else it does that screams TES? I don't see it. As for the above, with the exception of the setting (including specific races), MANY MMOs offer the same exact features.
Play on. Enjoy. Just accept that there are players who disagree. I don't "hate" the game. I am just disappointed that "what could have been" is so far from "what is." No hate involved.
I am sure some posters "hate" the game, but just because some disagrees with *your opinion* does NOT automatically make them a hater. Get a grip. I save my hate for things that matter, not video games.
As far as advice goes? Do what your vision is. I lost respect for the devs when they caved in to the "explorable other faction lands." That never was their vision. I think it pissed off more PvP players then appeased the whining "exploration" players. Listen to comments that are not MAJOR changes to the original concept, but rather tweaks to systems already in place. Above all, take every comment with a grain (or a full sack) of salt
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.- FARGIN_WAR
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
I would give to such developers one quote. An old internet-proverb:
Do not feed the trolls!
Haters gonna hate no matter what, they would always explain you did not tell this or that and so on. No need to lift NDA, unless non-lifting would mean disaster. I would tell to developer - "do not try to explain yourself as if you was guilty. You are not guilty, this is not court 'gamers vs producer'. Go on with your project. If haters have something rational - use it, but do not tell you used it".
That would be mine advice. There would always be haters, doomsayers - persons that won't listen to anything but hate.
http://www.mmoblogg.wordpress.com
Trying to belittle those players, me included, who are not getting what the IP (purposely chosen) promises, does nothing except show your true colors.
We in Tamriel? Check.
Is there mouse click fighting? Check.
Quests? Check.
Magic? Check.
Skills? Check.
10 Player Races? Nope, but we do have 9 of them. Sorry Imperial fans.
Player Housing? Maybe... Later... In the future... In an expansion...
Anything else it does that screams TES? I don't see it. As for the above, with the exception of the setting (including specific races), MANY MMOs offer the same exact features.
Play on. Enjoy. Just accept that there are players who disagree. I don't "hate" the game. I am just disappointed that "what could have been" is so far from "what is." No hate involved.
I am sure some posters "hate" the game, but just because some disagrees with *your opinion* does NOT automatically make them a hater. Get a grip. I save my hate for things that matter, not video games.
As far as advice goes? Do what your vision is. I lost respect for the devs when they caved in to the "explorable other faction lands." That never was their vision. I think it pissed off more PvP players then appeased the whining "exploration" players. Listen to comments that are not MAJOR changes to the original concept, but rather tweaks to systems already in place. Above all, take every comment with a grain (or a full sack) of salt
I was responding to the topic of the thread, which is what advice would I give an mmo dev that is seeing a lot of hate coming from these forums. If you want to turn it into a personal attack on your opinion of some game, thats on you. I dont know you, or feel the need to attack you personally, and I dont really care about what game or games you dont like. To be honest, I dont really care about this game. But I do know the negativity that follows upcoming titles on these forums, so my response was in that context. Sorry if you were offended, I did not aim my response to anyone directly.
This.
I also believe there is no need for hiding behind all these NDA's in a genre that is known for misleading consumers. Read my Sig people!!!!
When people are not as hyped about the game, they can come into it with their expectations in check, which leads to people being more exceptable about issues with the game.
i believe all that hype that Vanguard and Warhammer doomed it. Because you see other buggy games and bad design games that had little hype, dont get much negative talk. Look at Darkfall.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
I would let fans like the OP bully dissent out of the community as much as possible. It's usually a lot cheaper than fixing any actual issues the haters may have identified. A small, loyal community that will accept anything you feed them is much better than a larger community with people demanding improvement and expansion. It helps too if you can get the moderators at popular gaming sites on your side to quickly shut down any such negativity and produce reviews placing your game in the GOAT discussion.
But seriously, I believe honesty is the best policy. That usually means avoiding nonsense like "We had to do it this way" and owning up to design and businesses model choices: "We made this decision for this and that reason, and while we recognize that not all players will be happy with it, we believe this is the best for the long-term health of the game and/or its community." I'm not a fan of NDA's in late-stage betas to begin with, so yeah, sure... drop it if you think you get something out of doing so. Professional developers are perfectly capable of making that decision, though. While I feel I should be able to voice my opinion in support or against, they (hopefully) don't actually need me to tell them how to run and market their game.