Reading this article after taking a little break from ESO makes me kind of tempted to come back and play this. I'm at a time in my life that I'd rather play something more casually and focus on increasing workflow and getting more projects done. I did like ESO's core system and seiging mechanics much better than GW2's (I.E. having to repair keeps and maintain them, preventing the musical keeps that happen in GW2 and actual meaningful world bonuses to make people KEEP territory.) but some things I don't exactly enjoy about ESO such as taking supply lines require much more players and discourage low man roam groups and the combat does feel a little cumbersome at times and I feel much more effective being bolstered in GW2 than I do in ESO due to poor resource management forcing you to level which just feels so slow :P.
Leveling in RvR on Guild wars 2 is also a lot more possible if there are things going on v.s. ESO after they nerfed RvR quest returns. The greatest thing to me is GW2 is free to play and fully accessible to me so in the end I think I will have to cave Not to mention more enjoyable classes/mechanics and just the sheer options you have in terms of character building. Granted this is my opinion, plz don't hurt me ESO fanboys :<. Some things that were a major turnoff for GW2 that made me ultimately quit was how you can pick and choose what skills you have on your character. My warrior was pretty much done for me at level 15 and being bolstered in PvP just made me question what I was playing for, granted this was before RvR progression. One of the biggest nails on the coffin for me however was that the game had no base player cap for RvR lakes. Each zone had its own cap and this just influenced zerging at the extreme level. If each zone had a INDIVIDUAL and possibly LOWER player cap it would force the more RvR active servers to divide and conquer. Because this was not the case (unless it was changed) the higher population server could just cap on all 3 maps and just dominate the other servers which was a MAJOR turnoff for me.
In closing I wish they gave more incentive to run lower man groups (more exp per player kill based on active players within x proximity) and the lesser lootbags could be addressed with better bonuses like WAR had AAO (against all odds) system where as order we would hide from the destro zerg and ambush stragglers and get fat rewards/loot. For those that can give me an update on some of the concerns I had and maybe suggest me some very active RvR servers .
There is room for lots of skill in a Guild Wars 2 WvW battle, whether you are in a zerg or not.
If it were purely about numbers, then 20 people should never, ever, EVER be able to push back 40. Yet I've been in groups that have done it. How? Proper use of CC, aoe conditions, lots of water fields and blasting, stacking tightly and pushing them back. And communication, communication, communication.
Anything that you could think of doing in actual warfare you can do in a WvW battle. Scouting enemy troops and fortifications, drying out their supplies by using siege to pressure a point, causing distractions so that another force can take a keep or tower unhindered. If you think it's all about numbers, then I feel sorry for you because you probably haven't fought alongside skilled commanders or run in small groups with skilled players.
GW2 for about 2 years now. Everyone's gonna have different opinions, I love the GW franchise, but the WvW has not aged well and stacking trumps skill. Of course there will be outlying fights where occasionally a smaller force will win, but it doesn't happen often enough to say that GW2 WvW is anything but a karma train past the GvG fights people set up.
As I said, Anet has been making some promising changes so they might get around to fixing WvW and making the meta something beyond numbers, it just isn't true right now imho.
Go to youtube. search for WvW beat zerg and see the videos of smaller groups of people who are outnumbered winning over zergs when they are outnumbered significantly.
If you're not winning you need to find a home world that has better players. The people you play with make all the difference.
GW2 for about 2 years now. Everyone's gonna have different opinions, I love the GW franchise, but the WvW has not aged well and stacking trumps skill. Of course there will be outlying fights where occasionally a smaller force will win, but it doesn't happen often enough to say that GW2 WvW is anything but a karma train past the GvG fights people set up.
As I said, Anet has been making some promising changes so they might get around to fixing WvW and making the meta something beyond numbers, it just isn't true right now imho.
Go to youtube. search for WvW beat zerg and see the videos of smaller groups of people who are outnumbered winning over zergs when they are outnumbered significantly.
If you're not winning you need to find a home world that has better players. The people you play with make all the difference.
Originally posted by Crusades I've had some epic moments retreating and managing to escape 30 to 40 people rushing after my theif. It felt like an action movie where the hero is trying to escape waves of bad guys. You break because you think you're safe only to blink once and watch the sea of enemy zeroes still coming.
If a single thief can escape 30-40 players.... then the jobs mechanics is seriously broken.
Originally posted by Crusades I've had some epic moments retreating and managing to escape 30 to 40 people rushing after my theif. It felt like an action movie where the hero is trying to escape waves of bad guys. You break because you think you're safe only to blink once and watch the sea of enemy zeroes still coming.
If a single thief can escape 30-40 players.... then the jobs mechanics is seriously broken.
your logic is very bad, play gw2 and see the fun of profession machanics. its more based on players skill, not just armors gears.
Go to youtube. search for WvW beat zerg and see the videos of smaller groups of people who are outnumbered winning over zergs when they are outnumbered significantly.
If you're not winning you need to find a home world that has better players. The people you play with make all the difference.
Agreed, smaller groups can beat larger even if there is a limit to how many players one player can beat... I can take 3 bad players myself, or 1 good. A great player will beat me(and some good that have builds that works against me).
But there is always room for improvement. Some new WvW skills wouldn't hurt (particularly some more that is useful when you are the underdog against a zerg)and I wouldn't mind some more terrain that is sneak friendly for us evil solo assassins.
Originally posted by Crusades I've had some epic moments retreating and managing to escape 30 to 40 people rushing after my theif. It felt like an action movie where the hero is trying to escape waves of bad guys. You break because you think you're safe only to blink once and watch the sea of enemy zeroes still coming.
If a single thief can escape 30-40 players.... then the jobs mechanics is seriously broken.
In any game where you can get faster than average speed and a few seconds stealth that can happen, but there are plenty of skills you can use to trap the escaper, like the warrior skill "bola" (a favorite of mine) and it is far from easy to outrun a zerg.
Of course many players suck and often are zergs focused on running somewhere else so they rarely bothers to hunt a single player or their real objectives might fail. Killing a single player might waste important seconds when you can break a siege or take an important objective.
The thing with zergs is that they're created from simplistic game design. Big battles are awesome, but they become the norm when there's a bad map size to player pop ration, whichi think GW2 suffers from a abit, but mainly when sending a large group of people is highly effective.
In RTS games, zerging is usually possible when there's a faction/race/whatever that can create units at incredible speeds and/or amass large amounts of weaponry. In GW2's case, while siege weapons are important, there's so easy to get by the average players, and so simple to operate and set up, that it doesn't cretae the gap it should.
In the end, the only way to make small/medium size guerrilla groups the majority of play would be to make it so that preparing an attack on control point locations, aka castles and keeps, would take alot of time and coordinations. It would be like having an ARMA version of WVW, and general rvr, to the current Battlefield-like version. Sadly, that'd mean alieanating the majority of players. Zergs always winning might be wrong, but it is true that it's consist of 90% of the tactics by 90% of the players. Thank god for pvp guilds.
Originally posted by Crusades I've had some epic moments retreating and managing to escape 30 to 40 people rushing after my theif. It felt like an action movie where the hero is trying to escape waves of bad guys. You break because you think you're safe only to blink once and watch the sea of enemy zeroes still coming.
If a single thief can escape 30-40 players.... then the jobs mechanics is seriously broken.
your logic is very bad, play gw2 and see the fun of profession machanics. its more based on players skill, not just armors gears.
YOUR LOGIC IS BAD.... i never once mentioned armor or gear..... And yes I play gw2 and everybody is complaining about thiefs.... or just stealth in general, not just me,
Because every time I see one I scream in team speak BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGZ
a zerg is just loot okey... why?
well because they never can drop the right fields at the right moment there is no co ordination they just rush you...
while if you run 25-35 focused crew with everyone got a job GG easy win as long as you play smart.
bagz much bagz.
Btw my suggestion is not to go to youtube and check for 4-5 guys beating a damn stupid commander and his zone blob.
My suggestion is that you go for some sort of gw2GvG center or something(if its still up)
or try to google for gw2 Guilds find a good one check it out on youtube and you will probably see 25-28 guys farming a zone blob with co ordinated attacks hammerstuns water fields lighting fields everything.....
peoples who say running a blob 60+ is fun well they really need a hobby because there is tons upon tons of guilds out there still farming(even now when gw2 officially dead for the hardcore WvW players) pug blobs so yh you should go youtube check a guild or two and check the team speak conversations while raiding 99% of the guilds screaming when they see a blob BAAGZ because that is what a blob is.... bagz with no co ordination.....
Comments
Reading this article after taking a little break from ESO makes me kind of tempted to come back and play this. I'm at a time in my life that I'd rather play something more casually and focus on increasing workflow and getting more projects done. I did like ESO's core system and seiging mechanics much better than GW2's (I.E. having to repair keeps and maintain them, preventing the musical keeps that happen in GW2 and actual meaningful world bonuses to make people KEEP territory.) but some things I don't exactly enjoy about ESO such as taking supply lines require much more players and discourage low man roam groups and the combat does feel a little cumbersome at times and I feel much more effective being bolstered in GW2 than I do in ESO due to poor resource management forcing you to level which just feels so slow :P.
Leveling in RvR on Guild wars 2 is also a lot more possible if there are things going on v.s. ESO after they nerfed RvR quest returns. The greatest thing to me is GW2 is free to play and fully accessible to me so in the end I think I will have to cave
Not to mention more enjoyable classes/mechanics and just the sheer options you have in terms of character building. Granted this is my opinion, plz don't hurt me ESO fanboys :<. Some things that were a major turnoff for GW2 that made me ultimately quit was how you can pick and choose what skills you have on your character. My warrior was pretty much done for me at level 15 and being bolstered in PvP just made me question what I was playing for, granted this was before RvR progression. One of the biggest nails on the coffin for me however was that the game had no base player cap for RvR lakes. Each zone had its own cap and this just influenced zerging at the extreme level. If each zone had a INDIVIDUAL and possibly LOWER player cap it would force the more RvR active servers to divide and conquer. Because this was not the case (unless it was changed) the higher population server could just cap on all 3 maps and just dominate the other servers which was a MAJOR turnoff for me.
In closing I wish they gave more incentive to run lower man groups (more exp per player kill based on active players within x proximity) and the lesser lootbags could be addressed with better bonuses like WAR had AAO (against all odds) system where as order we would hide from the destro zerg and ambush stragglers and get fat rewards/loot. For those that can give me an update on some of the concerns I had and maybe suggest me some very active RvR servers
.
There is room for lots of skill in a Guild Wars 2 WvW battle, whether you are in a zerg or not.
If it were purely about numbers, then 20 people should never, ever, EVER be able to push back 40. Yet I've been in groups that have done it. How? Proper use of CC, aoe conditions, lots of water fields and blasting, stacking tightly and pushing them back. And communication, communication, communication.
Anything that you could think of doing in actual warfare you can do in a WvW battle. Scouting enemy troops and fortifications, drying out their supplies by using siege to pressure a point, causing distractions so that another force can take a keep or tower unhindered. If you think it's all about numbers, then I feel sorry for you because you probably haven't fought alongside skilled commanders or run in small groups with skilled players.
Go to youtube. search for WvW beat zerg and see the videos of smaller groups of people who are outnumbered winning over zergs when they are outnumbered significantly.
If you're not winning you need to find a home world that has better players. The people you play with make all the difference.
Solo half the zerg yorself:
Hahaha good times! Can't wait until my Necro gets to lvl 80:)
If a single thief can escape 30-40 players.... then the jobs mechanics is seriously broken.
http://medias.luna-atra.fr/gw2/char_tool/CT_imageGenerator.php?pseudo=Centurion Mikal&lang=EN&code=&code=TSwtLDUsLSw2LC0sMjksOSwyMiwyMywyNCwtLDEwMiwzNiw4MSw4NCw4OQ==
your logic is very bad, play gw2 and see the fun of profession machanics. its more based on players skill, not just armors gears.
Agreed, smaller groups can beat larger even if there is a limit to how many players one player can beat... I can take 3 bad players myself, or 1 good. A great player will beat me(and some good that have builds that works against me).
But there is always room for improvement. Some new WvW skills wouldn't hurt (particularly some more that is useful when you are the underdog against a zerg)and I wouldn't mind some more terrain that is sneak friendly for us evil solo assassins.
In any game where you can get faster than average speed and a few seconds stealth that can happen, but there are plenty of skills you can use to trap the escaper, like the warrior skill "bola" (a favorite of mine) and it is far from easy to outrun a zerg.
Of course many players suck and often are zergs focused on running somewhere else so they rarely bothers to hunt a single player or their real objectives might fail. Killing a single player might waste important seconds when you can break a siege or take an important objective.
The thing with zergs is that they're created from simplistic game design. Big battles are awesome, but they become the norm when there's a bad map size to player pop ration, whichi think GW2 suffers from a abit, but mainly when sending a large group of people is highly effective.
In RTS games, zerging is usually possible when there's a faction/race/whatever that can create units at incredible speeds and/or amass large amounts of weaponry. In GW2's case, while siege weapons are important, there's so easy to get by the average players, and so simple to operate and set up, that it doesn't cretae the gap it should.
In the end, the only way to make small/medium size guerrilla groups the majority of play would be to make it so that preparing an attack on control point locations, aka castles and keeps, would take alot of time and coordinations. It would be like having an ARMA version of WVW, and general rvr, to the current Battlefield-like version. Sadly, that'd mean alieanating the majority of players. Zergs always winning might be wrong, but it is true that it's consist of 90% of the tactics by 90% of the players. Thank god for pvp guilds.
YOUR LOGIC IS BAD.... i never once mentioned armor or gear..... And yes I play gw2 and everybody is complaining about thiefs.... or just stealth in general, not just me,
http://medias.luna-atra.fr/gw2/char_tool/CT_imageGenerator.php?pseudo=Centurion Mikal&lang=EN&code=&code=TSwtLDUsLSw2LC0sMjksOSwyMiwyMywyNCwtLDEwMiwzNiw4MSw4NCw4OQ==
I love gw2 BLOB ZERGS too why?
Because every time I see one I scream in team speak BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGZ
a zerg is just loot okey... why?
well because they never can drop the right fields at the right moment there is no co ordination they just rush you...
while if you run 25-35 focused crew with everyone got a job GG easy win as long as you play smart.
bagz much bagz.
Btw my suggestion is not to go to youtube and check for 4-5 guys beating a damn stupid commander and his zone blob.
My suggestion is that you go for some sort of gw2GvG center or something(if its still up)
or try to google for gw2 Guilds find a good one check it out on youtube and you will probably see 25-28 guys farming a zone blob with co ordinated attacks hammerstuns water fields lighting fields everything.....
peoples who say running a blob 60+ is fun well they really need a hobby because there is tons upon tons of guilds out there still farming(even now when gw2 officially dead for the hardcore WvW players) pug blobs so yh you should go youtube check a guild or two and check the team speak conversations while raiding 99% of the guilds screaming when they see a blob BAAGZ because that is what a blob is.... bagz with no co ordination.....