PVP was the notion that players would introduce a sense of real danger and risk into an otherwise pre-programmed environment. You can identify the pathing patterns of mobs and literally avoid them if you want, with little or no effort. With players however, the dynamic of unpredictability comes into play. They don't behave by a set of rules, thus it requires an ever changing set of tactics to either defeat them or avoid them. You know, actual game play.
Players complain about mobs that are linked that have very large aggro ranges. They feel they should be able to either pick them off one by one amano-amano or be so powerful as to mow them all down without much effort. In reality, if you put your face into a wasps nest, it's not gonna be a pretty sight. Now if an area is dangerous and requires a group to pass through, you seek out a group to help you... you know... that community thing you all keep clammoring about. You know friends, guildmates, and the like.
PVP is no different. You're out in the world and someone is say, "ganking" you. You can log off and pout or you can get your friends, yes, that community thing again, to come help you. You can turn the tide in your favor. He might do the same thing. Then you have a small skirmish at your hands. Wait, a skirmish, it sounds a lot like you having to deal with a group of mobs linked together with a very large aggro range. Sounds like game play yo me.
So in a nutshell, without PVP there can be no community. PVP brings players together. It gives them a reason to have a friends list, a guild. It adds a new dynamic to the game that no programmer could ever program for. You want an immersive world that is alive? You have to have PVP.
What you call "ganking" is all part of the game. It can only be abused if you allow it to be. Avoiding PVP isn't making the game better, it's merely making it easier.
Well, is not Landmark supposed to be the precursor to EQ next? well see!
Back to the PVP......
Occasionally in Aion we'd be grouped and one of us would get attacked by a ganker......as soon as the others of us came running over to help.....the Ganker would run like a baby! as soon as they realized the odds were NOT in their favor....No PVP for them! Whole different story it seemed!
I do agree the real gankers are probably NOT the majority of PVP'ers. Yet, they will surely ruin this game if some balance is not achieved.
I cant believe anyone enjoys being ganked.
Perhaps Wow's "dueling" had it right......ask me to PVP........plenty of folks were always dueling!
To be totally redundant.....This game appears to have so much promise. We have had nothing but Bombs and broken promises for so long now.
I have no doubt the game will open to a tremendous success.
I just fear as us lambs continue to get slaughtered well see the same old same old mass exodus.
So true that no one wants to be the gankee!
Enough already.....seems we have all expressed our opinions adequately.
This is the most stupid idea Ive seen on this forum. AA is all about PvP, ganking and clan wars. There is literally ZERO PvE content on cap. What you gonna do on PvE server? Do mining and grow trees all days long?
and if it is a VITAL component to the games design, I can live with it.
JUST DON'T ALLOW THE MISMATCHES.......
If Im at level 30 and want to make a run......no toon over 30 can attack me........gimme a chance guys!
Now I did read a very interesting post....not sure if it's true or not. It simply said, if your grouped and get attacked.....your group CANNOT aid you.........thats interesting, if true and perhaps a start.
Again......it's just the ganking that concerns me. at level 30, if your a 40.......I simply can't win!
I liked the post about slaughtering sheep......let you wolves go fight more wolves!
Is the concept of fair play so repugnant to you PVP'ers? Just even the odds is all I desire.
ok so going to max lvl is kinda fast in this game , but if we put that aside and think about what you are asking.
What will stop people from making tons lvl 10 chars and take trade packs and just fleet the over and gain insane amount of gold?
If there are enemys or pirates in the way they cant do anything as they are lvl 50.
Mind.....your obviously a ganker and will be at cap on day one. Good luck to you sir! I hope your supply of gankee's survives past day 60 if no changes are made.
Outta curiosity.....of all you kind folks who have taken the time to post on this thread, how many of you have a LOSING record in PVP? Or are you all winners?
Mind.....your obviously a ganker and will be at cap on day one. Good luck to you sir! I hope your supply of gankee's survives past day 60 if no changes are made.
Outta curiosity.....of all you kind folks who have taken the time to post on this thread, how many of you have a LOSING record in PVP? Or are you all winners?
I'll wager not a single one?
What exactly are you looking in a game that is all about grind, ganking and clan wars?
Mind.....your obviously a ganker and will be at cap on day one. Good luck to you sir! I hope your supply of gankee's survives past day 60 if no changes are made.
Outta curiosity.....of all you kind folks who have taken the time to post on this thread, how many of you have a LOSING record in PVP? Or are you all winners?
I'll wager not a single one?
I am a huge loser in PvP matches. I live in Barrow Alaska.... my ping is 600+ no matter what game i play. As i have stated before though.... i need the PvP aspect in this game in order to enjoy its original intent.
Do i enjoy getting ganked? NO. of course not, but it leads me to learn, leads to being better prepared, and teaches me to not be solo.
So i win yer wager then ?
Oh, and considering there are "Peace" times, the game is not a true Open World PvP game.
Yes. You are. That's like going into WoW and removing the entire raiding system from the game. What's left? Quests? Psh. Pet battles? Ok... sure...
You cannot take the spine out of a human and have the human still perform. You cannot take PvP out of Archeage and have it still perform. Sorry. That's literally taking a pillar out from under it's foundation. Won't work. Making it work means Archeage turns into WoW with boats and houses. Fun!!!! Oh wait. Just wait until WoD. Sheesh.
And yet another post from that other thread that says it all....
Indeed. Open world PvP is like a parasite, it is a burden to its host. Only when the host dies, it dies too.
Wolves hunting the sheep is unsustainable as a metagame. Eventually, wolves drive out the sheep and hunting other wolves is not so much fun because:
there aren't many wolves out there and...
it would require competition (which open world PvPers don't want)
That's a really bad example. Look at EVE, the majority of power struggles are PvP corps fighting PvP corps, wormhole politics are WH corps vs WH corps, a lot of low sec is pirates catching anybody passing through which includes null seccers.
There are obviously a lot of non PvPers that get tricked into PvP, get caught in low sec / wormholes etc but they are miniscule number compared to the PvP vs PvP corps.
The problem with most games is there are bad mechanics and a lack of things worth holding and fighting for.
I've been waiting for a game like this for some time now.
What ppl are complaining about is exactly why I want to play this game. Want to do politics and deals and strategies? u can do that. Want to be a 1 man hero? You can do that. Want to pvp on boats all day? You can do that.
You can see where I'm going with that. Without the pvp aspect, this game would be just another generic mmo with not much to show for it. Just like EVE online without it's freedom would be just another generic mmo in space.
Somebody please just sticky the safe/peace/war time zone stuff so we can stop having the same discussion.
BTW, just out of real curiousity, not trolling. If you made a no pvp server, how would it have more longevity than other themepark mmorpgs?
That sticky would be nice but it works both waysas 2 hours of peace time aren't exactly invalidating the concerns of pve-oriented players(and mmo players tend to have the intention to advance their chars and not stay below lvl 30).
I don't know the lenght of the times, so i can't comment on it. Was just simply trying to inform the OP that's it's not a complete owpvp game, where it can happen anywhere.
To your question: For a pve-only server it would be all about the quality of the pve-activities and the mechanics like sailing, housing, farming. Right now other game has that mix at a comparable quality-level but if you ask me i wouldn't want a server completely without pvp. For me a better solution would be to introduce consensual-pvp(players flag themselves for pvp, auto-flag for traderuns might be an addition) and keeping the northern continent for a faction v.s faction type of pvp. This should make a lot of the pvp and pve players happy. The only real unhappy ones are thoose pvp-players that don't want a challange but victims.
IMO, it's better if Trion focuses on making sure the pvp mechanics, being it peace/war times, ship damage, rewards for castle sieging, faction balance, etc, are taken care off so pvp can acttually work out in Archeage.
OP, you and many keep asking for a pve server, so i'll simply ask this question:
How does the game benefit from a pve server?
It's not that it can't happen, just that others already pointed out that AA is built with pvp in mind, and if you remove all those mechanics, who knows the balancing nightmare Trion would have to work out with potential exploits.
Also, many pvp guilds would abandon pvp servers since pve servers would be easier to exploit do to the lack of enemy players. This isn't an atack on pvp'ers, just that mmo players tend to prefer teh easy road.
Also, it's been told many times the game doesn't have either the quantity or the quality PVE content compared to other AAA themeparks.
So that's where my question comes in. If you remove the pvp (nobody flags themselves in pve servers), and the pve is too little, how will Archeage keep players interested for the long run compared to those other mmos anyway? Sure, griefers can become a problem, but i'm not seeing how a different ruleset server would provide a solution for the game, compared to actually try to balance it for the overall population, instead of spliting everyone up.
And regarding your points about how you enjoy fishing, farming, etc, if that's what you mainly enjoy, awesome. You strike me as a roleplayer, which i love myself. But here's the thing. From my experience, most mmorpg players want combat, character development related to combat, and combat related content, being it PVE or PVP.
IMHO, the people who want to play a game to just farm, fish, or whichever of those activities, are probably not going to play an mmorpg. I'd wager those players, like RP'ers, are an even smaller minority than pvp'ers, even owpvp'ers. And i like those players myself.
Thing is, all a pve server AA would have in the end would be owning a house, a boat and a farm. But i don't see Rift drawing massive numbers because of it's Housing. And i don't see Wildstar keeping subs because of it either, not to meantion it as a deeper housing system and hoverboards.
Comments
PVP was the notion that players would introduce a sense of real danger and risk into an otherwise pre-programmed environment. You can identify the pathing patterns of mobs and literally avoid them if you want, with little or no effort. With players however, the dynamic of unpredictability comes into play. They don't behave by a set of rules, thus it requires an ever changing set of tactics to either defeat them or avoid them. You know, actual game play.
Players complain about mobs that are linked that have very large aggro ranges. They feel they should be able to either pick them off one by one amano-amano or be so powerful as to mow them all down without much effort. In reality, if you put your face into a wasps nest, it's not gonna be a pretty sight. Now if an area is dangerous and requires a group to pass through, you seek out a group to help you... you know... that community thing you all keep clammoring about. You know friends, guildmates, and the like.
PVP is no different. You're out in the world and someone is say, "ganking" you. You can log off and pout or you can get your friends, yes, that community thing again, to come help you. You can turn the tide in your favor. He might do the same thing. Then you have a small skirmish at your hands. Wait, a skirmish, it sounds a lot like you having to deal with a group of mobs linked together with a very large aggro range. Sounds like game play yo me.
So in a nutshell, without PVP there can be no community. PVP brings players together. It gives them a reason to have a friends list, a guild. It adds a new dynamic to the game that no programmer could ever program for. You want an immersive world that is alive? You have to have PVP.
What you call "ganking" is all part of the game. It can only be abused if you allow it to be. Avoiding PVP isn't making the game better, it's merely making it easier.
Well, is not Landmark supposed to be the precursor to EQ next? well see!
Back to the PVP......
Occasionally in Aion we'd be grouped and one of us would get attacked by a ganker......as soon as the others of us came running over to help.....the Ganker would run like a baby! as soon as they realized the odds were NOT in their favor....No PVP for them! Whole different story it seemed!
I do agree the real gankers are probably NOT the majority of PVP'ers. Yet, they will surely ruin this game if some balance is not achieved.
I cant believe anyone enjoys being ganked.
Perhaps Wow's "dueling" had it right......ask me to PVP........plenty of folks were always dueling!
To be totally redundant.....This game appears to have so much promise. We have had nothing but Bombs and broken promises for so long now.
I have no doubt the game will open to a tremendous success.
I just fear as us lambs continue to get slaughtered well see the same old same old mass exodus.
So true that no one wants to be the gankee!
Enough already.....seems we have all expressed our opinions adequately.
Let's end this one and go play!
This is the most stupid idea Ive seen on this forum. AA is all about PvP, ganking and clan wars. There is literally ZERO PvE content on cap. What you gonna do on PvE server? Do mining and grow trees all days long?
ok so going to max lvl is kinda fast in this game , but if we put that aside and think about what you are asking.
What will stop people from making tons lvl 10 chars and take trade packs and just fleet the over and gain insane amount of gold?
If there are enemys or pirates in the way they cant do anything as they are lvl 50.
The point of AA is politics and wars, Trion has already stated there will not be pure PVE servers because that is not XL Games vision with the game.
ArcheAge is not for soloers and un sociables, join a guild and get protection if you don't want to fight. And play smart.
Any mmo worth its salt should be like a good prostitute when it comes to its game world- One hell of a faker, and a damn good shaker!
Mind.....your obviously a ganker and will be at cap on day one. Good luck to you sir! I hope your supply of gankee's survives past day 60 if no changes are made.
Outta curiosity.....of all you kind folks who have taken the time to post on this thread, how many of you have a LOSING record in PVP? Or are you all winners?
I'll wager not a single one?
And yet another post from that other thread that says it all....
Indeed. Open world PvP is like a parasite, it is a burden to its host. Only when the host dies, it dies too.
Wolves hunting the sheep is unsustainable as a metagame. Eventually, wolves drive out the sheep and hunting other wolves is not so much fun because:
What exactly are you looking in a game that is all about grind, ganking and clan wars?
heres the pvp
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATTzLSajydo
enjoy
Wow, that was a fine gank.
Those poor lowbies xD
I am a huge loser in PvP matches. I live in Barrow Alaska.... my ping is 600+ no matter what game i play. As i have stated before though.... i need the PvP aspect in this game in order to enjoy its original intent.
Do i enjoy getting ganked? NO. of course not, but it leads me to learn, leads to being better prepared, and teaches me to not be solo.
So i win yer wager then ?
Oh, and considering there are "Peace" times, the game is not a true Open World PvP game.
Lolipops !
My humble apologies V!
I was WRONG!
Yes. You are. That's like going into WoW and removing the entire raiding system from the game. What's left? Quests? Psh. Pet battles? Ok... sure...
You cannot take the spine out of a human and have the human still perform. You cannot take PvP out of Archeage and have it still perform. Sorry. That's literally taking a pillar out from under it's foundation. Won't work. Making it work means Archeage turns into WoW with boats and houses. Fun!!!! Oh wait. Just wait until WoD. Sheesh.
RAWR
That's a really bad example. Look at EVE, the majority of power struggles are PvP corps fighting PvP corps, wormhole politics are WH corps vs WH corps, a lot of low sec is pirates catching anybody passing through which includes null seccers.
There are obviously a lot of non PvPers that get tricked into PvP, get caught in low sec / wormholes etc but they are miniscule number compared to the PvP vs PvP corps.
The problem with most games is there are bad mechanics and a lack of things worth holding and fighting for.
/thread
I don't want them to change anything.
I've been waiting for a game like this for some time now.
What ppl are complaining about is exactly why I want to play this game. Want to do politics and deals and strategies? u can do that. Want to be a 1 man hero? You can do that. Want to pvp on boats all day? You can do that.
You can see where I'm going with that. Without the pvp aspect, this game would be just another generic mmo with not much to show for it. Just like EVE online without it's freedom would be just another generic mmo in space.
not lowbies these are lvls 45-50 :P
IMO, it's better if Trion focuses on making sure the pvp mechanics, being it peace/war times, ship damage, rewards for castle sieging, faction balance, etc, are taken care off so pvp can acttually work out in Archeage.
OP, you and many keep asking for a pve server, so i'll simply ask this question:
How does the game benefit from a pve server?
It's not that it can't happen, just that others already pointed out that AA is built with pvp in mind, and if you remove all those mechanics, who knows the balancing nightmare Trion would have to work out with potential exploits.
Also, many pvp guilds would abandon pvp servers since pve servers would be easier to exploit do to the lack of enemy players. This isn't an atack on pvp'ers, just that mmo players tend to prefer teh easy road.
Also, it's been told many times the game doesn't have either the quantity or the quality PVE content compared to other AAA themeparks.
So that's where my question comes in. If you remove the pvp (nobody flags themselves in pve servers), and the pve is too little, how will Archeage keep players interested for the long run compared to those other mmos anyway? Sure, griefers can become a problem, but i'm not seeing how a different ruleset server would provide a solution for the game, compared to actually try to balance it for the overall population, instead of spliting everyone up.
And regarding your points about how you enjoy fishing, farming, etc, if that's what you mainly enjoy, awesome. You strike me as a roleplayer, which i love myself. But here's the thing. From my experience, most mmorpg players want combat, character development related to combat, and combat related content, being it PVE or PVP.
IMHO, the people who want to play a game to just farm, fish, or whichever of those activities, are probably not going to play an mmorpg. I'd wager those players, like RP'ers, are an even smaller minority than pvp'ers, even owpvp'ers. And i like those players myself.
Thing is, all a pve server AA would have in the end would be owning a house, a boat and a farm. But i don't see Rift drawing massive numbers because of it's Housing. And i don't see Wildstar keeping subs because of it either, not to meantion it as a deeper housing system and hoverboards.
dude lol he two shotted them and they wiped half the group.