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This game should have been an instanced game like GW1
Yamota
Member UncommonPosts: 6,593
I have been playing the game, on and of, for about a month and it is quite enjoyable. However I dont understand why it is an MMO, people actually make it less fun to play by swarming solo dungeons and bosses and ruin your immersion by running the exact same quest right next to you, spawning multiple cloned NPCs.
Did they seriously thought that this would work? Why didn't they just go B2P and done private instances like GW 1? The game would have been so much better and probably sold a lot more copies.
Anyway, I am still playing the game but entirely as a single player game, really haven't seen much point in engaging in either group dungeons or Cyroodil PvP (although I tried both). They made a serious misstake, releasing it as traditional MMO.
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I'm thinking its very possible that they're planning to go the "buy-box-with-cosmetics-shop" route like TSW did. It certainly would improve the sales when they open up to console.
Of course this depends on how well the game is doing over the next few months: if retention and sales would plummet, they might even cancel the console release, since its several months away. And yes, I know I'm a doom-and-gloom cynic, its just the way I am.
Edit: And yes, it might have actually improved the experience if you could exclude most people from your "phase" and just play with a few friends. Maybe they'll beef up the phasing system eventually?
"If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor
Yeah but that does not answer the question where this game lies? Is it a single player game or an MMO. Obviously it is marketed as an MMO but 90% of it plays like a single player game, and at the very most a limited multiplayer game with small groups. There are no raids or similar that requires tons of people and Cyroodil PvP is an odd ball as it has little relation with the rest of the game.
Overall I think the design of this game is just confusing. But I still think it is a good single player game so they did something right. I actually rather they just cut out the multiplayer aspect completely, it adds nothing to the game.
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What they should have done is picked a direction.
Either make it a heavily scripted singleplayer game with optional COOP, or make it a proper MMO.
It seems they were going towards MMO, but then the whining Skyrim fans convinced the publishers to jerk it in the other direction, resulting in this clunky mix.
Of course, it should have been an MMO, not instanced, as those instanced games like SWTOR don't last. People eat the content and then leave. It's not sustainable.
This game should have been all about grouping, huge public dungeons, and the RvR, like DAoC before it. Not the shitty dungeons we have now, pseudo singleplayer crap, and half implemented RvR.
Don't blame the Skyrim fans here, Zenimax tried to make everyone happy instead of focusing on a specific target group and that never end as well as focusing on one group and giving them exactly what they want.
I'll have to agree with the OP, ESO plays very well as a single player game, and the MMO elements seem very awkward and out of place.
As mentioned, other players are rarely a welcome sight, besides ruining the immersion of the quest content, they are competitors for resource gathering, lock picking, and even when crafting, they are just in the darn way of the forge or bank npc's.
It's stuck in a weird place, not a great MMORPG, and not a great single player game, truey is a classic example of how awkward things can get when you try to cater to all demographics, almost a poster child in this case.
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I tried to make it a single player by ignoring every one. That was impossible though. I wish they made a ignore all button. Your right there is zero reason for this to be multiplayer. There is no reason to trade, no reason to talk to any one. No reason to group, and when you do see people, they just make the game worse. They should of made it single player, where you could go to a npc and they would tele port you to pvp cyroldil. Then when your done go back to single player.
I won't ever be returning to this junk game. All other games beat this on every level. There is nothing this does right. Sky rim oblivion and morrowind are 100 times better single player games. Eq,eq2,wild star, swtor, and even wow which I hate. Are much better mmos, with eq eq 2 and star wars are all free. I regret 100 percent wasting 60 bucks on this garbage, that will never be a good single player, or a good Mmo.
now that they did this to me also, making this garbage, I won't be buying any more zenimax games.
I ultimately blame the publisher, of course. But the publishers were reacting to very short sighted objections from singleplayer game fans about what should and shouldn't be in an MMO.
I really wasn't trying to answer that question. Though the only answer I can think of has been answered by others in this thread already. ZOS basically just tried to please everyone while cashing in on a well established IP. I mean I guess it was worth a shot and not saying that a company shouldn't try to milk its assets. However, they should have put more thought into its design instead of just going for a Hail Mary. There is a reason why Todd Howard never pushed for a MMO version of the Elder Scrolls and I bet we are seeing exactly why with ESO.
"If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor
i would do this if there was no subscription. Playing ESO as a single player game would give me a lot less to do than Skyrim so why even bother? I just stepped away from the game when my free month was up. Not planning on subbing for now. I'll do when its worth it or just replay Skyrim instead with even more mods.
Valuable discussion taking place here.
Valid points for sure -- I remember reading countless threads of how it was insane of them to make it P2P since the franchise sold the most on consoles, and they weren't used to renting their games as we are in this genre. I'd imagine that they are in a certain mode in which to fix bugs and help it transition into a Buy to Play mode for when the console version finally comes out. In that light, it will be likely they will get 12-15 million additional purchases considering how much the last game sold for when under those conditions (granted, most of those purchases were made when it was on sale).
Most "evidence" shows that the game did not sell very well, and that retention is incredibly low due to the many issued that have popped up over time. Getting that crowd in that are used to DLC and not monthly fees will be a life-saver for this game. Though the sensational media has already black marked this game for a lot of people; significant changes will have to made to the game and it's payment model for this to happen. In addition, there will also be the "Is it a single player game or a multiplayer" question, unless remedied.
My guess for why they didn't put in Guild Wars 1 instancing in this game? Money. They wanted to be able to justify a monthly fee, and a lobby game just won't cut it in most circumstances in today's market.
First immersive MMORPG since several years for me but I understand the solo quest issue.
I still use my imagination allot when gaming and getting immersed so I just think to myself the mission needed more then just me.
But I do think this could have been translated into the game into the quest text so it would be like: Thanks for helping out, we have to keep sending in more people/troops to really defeat the enemy, that way it's more understandable to see other people around when returning to the quest giver . Or put phasing into use when you really defeated some grand end boss or saved a town/city and then when you return to your quest giver it singles you out not seeing others.
I do feel the phasing techniek used in ESO is far more complex then phasing already seen in a few other MMORPG's. To me it makes me feel far more connected to that ingame world then any themepark MMORPG has ever given me. It has it's issue's but as a experiance gamer I might be more forgiven towards new things being worked on in this genre.
I definitly wouldn't want ESO to be more instanced, if you think you read many complaints already you should expect allot more if they would have made a ES game full instanced.
When I said i had "time", i meant virtual time, i got no RL "time" for you.
I actually think an Elder Scroll MMO would be possible if they made it a sandbox. Basically use Skyrim as a blueprint but get rid of all single player aspects of the story. So for example, have quests to make you a vampire but only in a way that makes sense in an MMO setting. The dragons would work as well, requiring a team of player to take one down.
It would not be easy, but making a good sandbox never is, but I think the Elder Scrolls franchise would make an excellent sandbox MMO, specially with the skill based system it has, or rather the single player game had.
The current ThemePark mold is pretty terrible though. Makes for a decent single player game but the MMO aspects are pretty bad.
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Yeah I am sure it was for the money but I think it is a miscalculation on their part. The game would have most likely sold many more units without the sub. fee and now with it, I doubt the retention of this game is very high. There is simply not enough MMO features to warrant a sub. fee and a couple of months is enough for most casual players to cap their character and move on.
As for the game selling 10+ millions on the consoles, I strongly doubt it. The single player game is pretty good but Skyrim was better so it wont sell nearly as well.
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I blame Firor. When he said that everything already been done in MMOs in an interview I got the feeling that he shouldn't be the lead designer.
A lot of what people complain have been planned from the start. They wanted to make everyone happy but that just brings a so-so experience to all players instead of an amazing experience for your main target.
The game isn't entirely bad but it could have been so much more, now it is a compromise that really shouldn't have been made.
You can't combine single player feeling, open world and RvR in a good way, if they had focus on one thing the game would have been great.
Wow! He said everything has already been done in MMOs? And he is/was a lead designer?!
Man, where do they find these people?
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If only it was DAoC 2 with an ES skin, then it would have been a good MMO.
They worked hard to kill the DAoC feel though, by shoving instances and singleplayer quests all over the place to the point where other people are a hassle instead of a benefit.
I don't see how, sky rim has better graphics better quests, better everything,but what ever. You obviously never played dark age of Camelot, if u think this is daoc 2.
Saying CORPG is like swearing in church isn't it? The, it's not a "real MMO" even though a B2P Skyrim Online would probably have sold around Skyrim numbers easily. They could have forgotten about the sub and just made a game where you can play the Elder Scrolls Online with your friends.
That would have been hugely successful, but no, they had to go and f*ck it up.
Devs are looking at WoW subs and drooling all over the place, we have to do that, oh and that needs to be in there as well, oh and let's not forget this either. All the while forgetting Skyrim, and basically the Elder Scrolls. Sad, and they ruined the "Elder Scrolls Online" title as well.
WoW's success has really ruined the market for years and will remain doing so until game leads wisen up.