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Real talk- WoW and WildStar
Chrisbox
Member UncommonPosts: 1,729
Since wildstars beta, many people have begun to throw out invalid statements about the game, and about the game where the devs came from, WoW. Which is common whenever a new MMO is released it must be compared to WoW, however this situation is much different. This is also due to carbines absurd attitude with their game. "Best freakin MMO ever made" ...
So anyway, what exactly are people saying?
"Wildstar is the hardest themepark ever"
"All you do in WoW is stand there and press buttons 1-5, no skill"
"Wildstar is every hardcore players dream"
"WoW is dated and everyone dominates it now, wildstar will take its place"
These statements that I read here on the forums make my head spin, and should make yours too.
WoW's philosophy behind difficulty, and the reason they are so successful financially, is that all difficult and skill based content is behind gates, that the player must choose to go after. If not, they will reside in the easier areas of the game which many people enjoy doing and many people don't enjoy doing. The people that say things like the quotes above, are the people that played WoW and did not enter the gates of difficulty but still they actually believe they know what they're talking about. Take note of how heroic progression guilds and high rated pvp groups don't say the game is easy. The majoriy of people that have played WoW haven't experienced the difficulty WoW offers, and it makes sense why they think wildstar is so hard. Wildstar structures their game in a way that by level 20, you at least need to have 1 eyeball on the screen so you can dodge and not get pwned while pressing a handful of buttons to kill your target. It forces you into semi difficult scenarios almost off the get-go much like dark souls, that grow in difficulty by the time you hit level 50. That being said, wildstar is seriously lacking in the class skill department compared to WoW which will cause problems for some.
The structure of WoW's class design has a moderately high number of core abilities for every class spec I've played that one must use to deal as much damage, as much healing, or as much mitigation in a given moment and your skill alone will determine that number. This is followed by an even more extensive number of situational cooldowns: offensives, defensives, support skills and CC's that require precision timing and skill to land on whatever target you need to land it on, while wildstar has rotations, CC, and a few support skills, the scale of it all is so much more approachable and limiting to the player because of the design behind having only 8 combat skills. That being said, many people will enjoy it and there is a place for non tab-target themeparks in the industry. Aiming with the telegraph system in wildstar even while questing at times, you will find yourself rotating your character just as much as you would in a WoW arena match, or top tier raid boss and for similar reasons. Wildstar utilizes a dodge button which works very well with 2 charges, where as WoW gives class specific skills for mobility such as blink, disengage, charge, burning speed, etc. You won't see a big blue triangle in WoW, but for both games you need to stay in the line of sight, and field of view of your target no matter what role you are playing, period. Take a quick look at any 2400+ arena streamer play a couple matches or A heroic progression raiders UI setup and then watch them play. The mobility in both games is pretty solid, however by design, the skill cap is raised significantly with the vastly larger amount of required skill usage at precise times and depth WoW presents in its hard content on top of dealing with mechanics and/or other players. This is also the reason behind the current issue "Button bloat" which they are addressing in warlords.
Any current high end WoW player is also well aware that WoW's age doesn't make it any less engaging, mechanics have only evolved over the years. Had all WoW players taken part or in or even researched more recent expansions heroic progression fights such as Al'akir, Rag, Elegon, Sha of fear, malk, garrosh, they would clearly see there is an absurd amount of stuff you need to avoid that will instagib you or your group, and thats of course ontop of very strategic non dodging concerned mechanics that WoWs raiding is known for. The whole "wildstar makes you pay attention WoW doesn't!" arguement is worthless and once again due to the person saying it hasn't experienced WoW's difficulty.
If your mind is dead set on the belief that WoW is standing in one spot spamming buttons 1-5 on a single target , then again I will say you haven't truly played it all and I encourage you to one day do so. If you believe thats how the leveling experience and LFR is played, then I'd say you're pretty spot on. I will restate, The structure of the game leads many to believe its a casual experience, WoW's level 1-89 experience and even at max level does not force a single player into this difficulty I speak of, this is fact. Wildstar on the other hand forces you into some difficulty during leveling in the form of dodging and group mechanics which I was very fond of during my run through stormtalon's lair, and obviously at max level wildstar forces you into the only raid content because they lack a multi-difficulty system.
To conclude, comparisons on this game should be made with the hardest content available for both games in mind, not just what you or others experienced or what you think content is like. I have yet to see very realistic views on this topic and its a shame. I hope you guys decide which game you want to make your home for summer but for the right reasons and most of all, because its fun to you.
Played-Everything
Playing-LoL
Comments
Please point me in the direction of anyone saying these highlighted things.
The Deep Web is sca-ry.
Hi, and welcome to the internet.....
Played-Everything
Playing-LoL
Great post; spot on!
Prepare for the fanboi hate though!
Citizen: Preach your filth elsewhere!
There was a thread where someone posted a conversation where Carbine themselves made the comparison and talked about how many developers worked on both games. It was in another wildstar thread.
I am not sure that counting the hardest part in the game for how difficult it is... if 95% of the game is easy then saying that the game is hard just don't sound right to me.
You can say that raiding in Wow is hard, that is true (it is time consuming as well) but the game is not hard if you count the average content.
And many Wow players never raid or even do heroics. The difficulty of a game is not really easy to say since they have a different difficulty for open world content, dungeons raids and in some cases for instanced personal story content.
Setting a single difficulty on a game is not fair at all, you need at least 3 values (in Wows case: Open world easy, dungeons average, raids hard) and comparing even rather similar games like Wow and WS demands that you more or less played all the content in both games.
My join date doesn't dictate what games I've played, however I wouldn't bring EQ onto my post because I don't think you can draw solid comparisons between EQ and modern themeparks because of how absurdly different EQ was in combat and overall design. Granted, I kind of miss dying having a little more meaning. Its also worth noting, mechanics that are present now would never be present back then because of how much the industry has evolved.
Played-Everything
Playing-LoL
I agree with most of this. If someone saying WoW's leveling and LFR is easy and mindless then like I said I'd agree, but too many people judge it as one package instead of including the hardest available content because they haven't experienced said content.
Played-Everything
Playing-LoL
Raiding after vanilla has been way more difficult, boss mechanics have advanced and class rotations are way more complex . The reason why people think vanilla was hard is because it was new to most players. Unless you played a mmo like EQ the raiding play style was fresh, now everyone who raids has been around for awhile and we know what to expect, Don't stand in fire, GTFO out of lazer beams, Use CDs on boss mechanics to survive, and addons that give everyone timers on what the boss does makes the game so much more easy. If you took away the players experience in raiding and addons the game would become %100 more difficult.
Also i played a holy paladin in vanilla, all i did was buff people and keep the buffs going and maybe toss some heals around, it got me all the way to patchwork before i quit raiding because of school. The game was not hard.
So you guys couldn't get past the gear check and quit huh? Not hard? The fact that, even for the top end raid guilds, a number of the bosses came down to being lucky and not getting bad rolls in the encounter (while executing everything flawlessly for 10+ minutes... loatheb i'm looking at you) is fairly telling. There was a reason only a handful of guilds worldwide even made it to saph / KT, let alone killed them.
I was 14 and failing a class or 2 so my parents forced me to stop playing, my guild cleared naxx.
I think the main reason so many vanilla vets say its "easier" now its because of the reduced grind to get into raiding content. But in fact like loltacolol stated, boss mechanics have evolved every single expansion along with the overall way the game is played. With the experience we have now + timers, most raiders would clear out classic content very very quickly. Its also worth noting though, organizing 40 people on the same page is not an easy task in itself, though back then it spread responsibility very thin vs. todays raid sizes+mechanics.
Played-Everything
Playing-LoL
Uh....only 3-5 guilds in the entire world ever cleared Nax 40man. This was because 4horsemen was designed to where you needed 8 (yes 8) tanks to get past it, which very few guilds were able to accomplish.
As someone who has raided in every expansion.....to say that todays raids are harder than past raids.... To say todays raids were harder than cthun, twin emps, 40man Heigan, pre-nerf Mu'ru, ect....
You sir, are 100% lying threw your teeth.
Also, who do you think made the mods? The UI fairies? The couple guilds that managed to clear to the end of Naxx (at level 60) had no bossmods or anything like that because they were so far ahead of the curve that none of the modders, save those in the actual guilds themselves, could make them in time.
What guild were you in that cleared naxx 40 in vanilla by the way? I'm curious to know.
Quoted for truth!
/end thread
As I thought, he got nothing.
Boobs are LIFE, Boobs are LOVE, Boobs are JUSTICE, Boobs are mankind's HOPES and DREAMS. People who complain about boobs have lost their humanity.
thing is, op, ur comparing arenas and raids to wildstars regular play. wow is easy just killing in open world. u do just stand there and spam 1-5 in open world and most dungeons. yes raids r harder but u cant compare wow raids to wildstars. watch the videos. i played wow since vanilla and it just got worse and worse. pandas killed it for me. wildstar has brought back that old wow feeling that wow can no longer give.
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