In all honesty the skill grind it self is not the biggest problem. It is more about the demoralising feeling of having your stuff taken by people who only take your stuff to make your life as miserable as it can be.
If you can press past that feeling, the game get half-decent after a while (2-3 months depending on your dedication level... therapy bills not included) and in a few months more you will be one of the charming creature that roam the game to make the life of new players a living hell... after all only the strong survive.
But to answer the question....
The game have AFK gridning...That should tell you all you need.
This brings me back.......I remember being excited when I first started, I soon joined a major Guild, and asked how much prowes do I need to venture out......Answer ?.....6000. Not even close, at 6000 I asked again. Now they tell me 12000. I get to 12000 still worthless.
I spent a weeks vacation mindless farming in the sewers to yield close to nothing. By the way a weeks vacation didn't get me to 12000, a month and a half did. .....Unless your un employed, forget about this game !
The grind is mostly optional. If something has magnitude, you need to raise it at 100. Your main stat must be high enough to wear all level of armor your playstyle provide.
When i had 25k prowess, i was good enough to kill a 75k player that i encountered and i was the one who got jumped at a spawn. The gap is minimal and the grind is not bad at all coz it has not been one month yet and i'm at 65k.
What i did when i started was raising all my magnitude skills at 100, transfers and self heal at 50-75 and eventually higher. The other 2 stats, i raise them to get better stats pool only.
If you're a warrior, you generally need STR+DEX, but all possibilities are good; you can be a STR based warrior wtih magic as well instead of a bow. You can be yourself or you can follow a guide. By far, based on all the recent pvp videos i've seen, i can tell that all possibilities are good unless you try something retarded.
This is by far the best game I've played. It is an mmo so you do have to grind for gear and mats but truthfully it's not that bad. If you get with a good clan they can boost you really quick and donate you gear. Also the new daily and weekly feats should be a new player focus as that is the best way to gain prowess, mats and gold. I've seen 20k prowess players kill 80k prowess players this week. I take low prowess players out with me all the time to pvp, pve, siege, etc... I have never had an issue getting gear either. There will be days you lose all your gear bags then the next day you get lots of gear bags. The combat is intense which I love. I sometimes leave our clan city nude with 100 arrows and roam for pvp just to see what gear I can get. It's so much fun! My play time is probably broken into 80% pvp and 20% grinding for mats. If you know what your doing you could gain enough prowess to be effective in under 2 weeks. I promise you that.
I only think its a grind AFTER you are like over 100k and done all the best feats. and you only need more than if you want to play every "class".
if I badly wanted respec and they didn't sell it, Id be tempted just to delete my char and start again - I dont think getting the first 100k takes long at all.
but right now 160k with all best feats done, yeah it does feel super grindy.
I only think its a grind AFTER you are like over 100k and done all the best feats. and you only need more than if you want to play every "class".
if I badly wanted respec and they didn't sell it, Id be tempted just to delete my char and start again - I dont think getting the first 100k takes long at all.
but right now 160k with all best feats done, yeah it does feel super grindy.
I'm at about 215K prowess. I never grind. If I'm low on a mat, I will try to farm some mobs. I try and finish some of the weekly and daily feats. I will run maps, turn in keys. Trade off stuff I don't need. Prowess keeps going up.
I think a lot of problems happen for people is when they try to accomplish a large goal in a short period of time try to "grind it out." Sure you will get done a lot quicker but you burn yourself out and it leaves a bad taste in your mouth.
Recently AV adjusted diminishing returns to kick in a lot later.
A famous streamer "Red Beard" reached 55,000 prowess within two weeks. You can follow him in http://www.twitch.tv/teamredbeard . I think the leveling is too fast now. People will all reach end game content too soon before they will learn how to play their char.
People complain that feats take too long and they hate that they have to kill 150 of a mob before moving onto the next... that's dumb.
Do whatever you want, feats will come or they won't... just go and do what you want when you want to do it and you'll earn prowess in no time.
well to be fair (as a Darkfall fan myself) many players come in with no other desire other than to PvP and not only that PvP on a small scale (1:1 etc).
This game really isnt for that.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
People complain that feats take too long and they hate that they have to kill 150 of a mob before moving onto the next... that's dumb.
Do whatever you want, feats will come or they won't... just go and do what you want when you want to do it and you'll earn prowess in no time.
well to be fair (as a Darkfall fan myself) many players come in with no other desire other than to PvP and not only that PvP on a small scale (1:1 etc).
This game really isnt for that.
You're definitely right... That's Quake, Chivalry, etc territory... Darkfall has a lot more to it than just PvP... Though, right now, the PvP has overshadowed the true beauty of the game.. I'm hoping that the coming alignment system coupled with some interesting sandbox tools and content will create some order in the chaotic world of Agon.
In all honesty the skill grind it self is not the biggest problem. It is more about the demoralising feeling of having your stuff taken by people who only take your stuff to make your life as miserable as it can be.
If you can press past that feeling, the game get half-decent after a while (2-3 months depending on your dedication level... therapy bills not included) and in a few months more you will be one of the charming creature that roam the game to make the life of new players a living hell... after all only the strong survive.
But to answer the question....
The game have AFK gridning...That should tell you all you need.
I found that if you talk to people, you can make friends. A lot of times they would only take your gold or some mats. Good players don't go around farming noobs, but sometimes they don't know you're a noob. But if you send a tell and you're not angry and maybe ask for some advice, most of the time people are glad to help out. They sometimes even give you stuff: mounts, better armor than what you had to start with, weapons, etc.
Sometimes you do run into a jerk, but that is the exception. In those cases, if you send them a tell they may not answer you. Maybe they just don't speak English. Or sometimes they try to camp you. But I have found that to be very rare.
The grind is nowhere near as bad thanks to the diminishing returns change. I got a new player as my apprentice about a week and a half ago, after getting him into my clan I took him out trawling every so often but most of the time he did a few of the basic pve feats and habituals. He played for 3-4 hours a day and is now at 40k prowess, enough to be viable in group pvp and if he's lucky or good, solo. If you have someone to help you out with the basics (join a clan) getting prowess early on is not an issue.
Sick of the blatant misinformation people post about this game.
So you let someone trawl before trawling got nerfed to crap and try to sell that as "that's how it is". Quite the blatant misinformation if you ask me. And 3-4h a day is already half a full time job and that only if you ignore that you usually play more on the weekends. What normal person with a job and a family can affort to play 25-30 hours per week?
Did I say that period of time was mandatory? That was the amount of time he played because he was enjoying himself and breaking up the grind by pvp roaming with us. I know people who are "normal" and have families who have been playing this game from launch, on weekends and in the limited time they have in the evening. You can be more than PvP viable playing casually. It will take you longer to level if you only have a limited time to play each day, but in what mmo isn't that the case?
With the recent changes to DR gains, the addition of weekly and daily feats, and the round robin system, the grind is extremely minimal. Casual players can expect to have a competitive toon prowess-wise a few weeks in. Building a bank will take longer, but there are so many ways to do it it doesn't feel grindy at all. AFK trawling and harvesting exist, but the actual gains are minimal compared to actual play.
Then you spend some time crafting, dump some prowess into that.
I got to 7k prowess and quit.
Its a grind fest.
I cannot lie, looking at it that way, yeah it's a grind. Quest are coming so they might fix that.
But the game, the pvp part that is, it's worth it to go throught the grind just to get there.
In one month, i got to 72k thanks to various guide that i followed so based on the amount of time it takes, it's not long at all and i wasnt even grinding everydays or for hours.
I still dislike the fact that everything takes too much time. You're harvesting? It takes time so you must be on youtube while doing that. You want to refine your stuff? Go on youtube and refine your stuff. You want to level your crafting skills? Go on youtube while you craft. your stuff that in total, will take you 20 minutes to complete. What were they thinking?
Everything takes time in this game and they're all boring activities that forces us to go on youtube while we do them. It's the lamest part about DF.
at the end of the day if you dont like playing the game .. leveling up your character getting new gear and so on then the game is not for you.. this is an mmorpg with character development you do not start out as a character ready to fight the best best pvper on the server 1v1.. it takes time to develop your character and thats what mmorpgs should be about..
Now I dont play DF:UW but it takes a hell of a lot less time to get your character to the basic pvp standard than it did in the origional darkfall.
If you dont like the idea of character development then check out planetside 2 or a similar fps style game..
I see character development as an important part of any MMORPG. I just don't agree on the idea that it has to be an excessive boring active PVE grind. Other games showed that you can create character development where you don't need to slap brain dead mobs till your mind goes blank. I still remember botting 24/7 for years in lineage 2, nearly nobody (except for a few more simple minded players, no offense ment) could bear that boredom on the long run.
As for getting basic gear being harder in DF, i wonder about that. My ex DF clan mates told me that in DF it was easier to get basic gear - even though enchanting added some extra grind then. Didn't that game have full gear pieces dropping?
Also I can't imagine why you would want to make basic PVP gear a PVE grind when there's so much non brain dead (aka FUN!) activities in the game that require the gear. In my eyes a full loot title where basic pvp gear is time intensive but really boring to get is a plain dumb idea. Making the best gear really hard to get is a good idea, but the basics? No way.
I'm honestly not trying to be offensive, but have you actually played Darkfall or are you just basing this post off hearsay?
Basic gear is absurdly easy to craft or get in this game. Usable equipment drops off a very large percentage of mobs in the game, from the weakest goblins up to the massive scary Monstrosity/Scourge spawns. Whether or not YOU can use this equipment, or if it happens to be something you need at the time is a different story (random drops etc.)
Crafting a full set of the simplest most basic armor will take you about 10 minutes of harvesting and 5 minutes of crafting. If you spend more like 20 minutes harvesting you can probably make that more efficient and craft 2-3 sets in 5 minutes. It's not very GOOD armor, mind you, but it is easy as balls to craft and can be done entirely within the safezone. Every single harvesting tool, weapon, bow, and scrap of armor you need can be crafted like this. The nicer it is, the more difficult the mats are to acquire and the more time investment you need to put into mastering the associated craft skill.
Since the Economy patch a few months back, afk harvesting has been strongly nerfed and is basically only able to support non-mastery gear (low level gear). Mastery gear now comes almost exclusively from active PvE or harvesting closely controlled city nodes. The benefit from focusing in on this active PvE concept is that players are required to go outside the safezone into the real world, frequently in large groups of fully geared players, in order to farm for the best materials.
This brings players into contact with hostiles, especially other people who are interested in farming the same mats or stealing yours. It's a catch 22, the best materials in the game are the riskiest to go after, and the best places to farm them are hotspots for organic and random PvP encounters. This is no different than ratting/mining 0.0 space in EvE, the best shit is there but it can all be stolen from you if you aren't careful.
That is kind of what makes the game exciting. If PvP / full loot isn't your thing than I understand, but safely grinding away your gear over hours of being afk is not the way to play. The economy patch has now required players to earn their gear with active PvE, and rewards them with better returns / faster farming / more PvP.
Comments
In all honesty the skill grind it self is not the biggest problem. It is more about the demoralising feeling of having your stuff taken by people who only take your stuff to make your life as miserable as it can be.
If you can press past that feeling, the game get half-decent after a while (2-3 months depending on your dedication level... therapy bills not included) and in a few months more you will be one of the charming creature that roam the game to make the life of new players a living hell... after all only the strong survive.
But to answer the question....
The game have AFK gridning...That should tell you all you need.
This have been a good conversation
The game you are looking for requiring no PvE completion where you can just jump into and start mindlessly shooting at people is that way - >>>>
... and it's called an FPS.
The game you are looking for requiring no PvE completion and where you can just jump in and start mindlessly shooting at people is that way - >>>>
... it's called an FPS.
Quit ruining the MMORPG genre with your constant "PvE grind" whines.
This brings me back.......I remember being excited when I first started, I soon joined a major Guild, and asked how much prowes do I need to venture out......Answer ?.....6000. Not even close, at 6000 I asked again. Now they tell me 12000. I get to 12000 still worthless.
I spent a weeks vacation mindless farming in the sewers to yield close to nothing. By the way a weeks vacation didn't get me to 12000, a month and a half did. .....Unless your un employed, forget about this game !
12000 is still only a noob and not even close.
The grind is mostly optional. If something has magnitude, you need to raise it at 100. Your main stat must be high enough to wear all level of armor your playstyle provide.
When i had 25k prowess, i was good enough to kill a 75k player that i encountered and i was the one who got jumped at a spawn. The gap is minimal and the grind is not bad at all coz it has not been one month yet and i'm at 65k.
What i did when i started was raising all my magnitude skills at 100, transfers and self heal at 50-75 and eventually higher. The other 2 stats, i raise them to get better stats pool only.
If you're a warrior, you generally need STR+DEX, but all possibilities are good; you can be a STR based warrior wtih magic as well instead of a bow. You can be yourself or you can follow a guide. By far, based on all the recent pvp videos i've seen, i can tell that all possibilities are good unless you try something retarded.
C:\Users\FF\Desktop\spin move.gif
I only think its a grind AFTER you are like over 100k and done all the best feats. and you only need more than if you want to play every "class".
if I badly wanted respec and they didn't sell it, Id be tempted just to delete my char and start again - I dont think getting the first 100k takes long at all.
but right now 160k with all best feats done, yeah it does feel super grindy.
My blog:
I'm at about 215K prowess. I never grind. If I'm low on a mat, I will try to farm some mobs. I try and finish some of the weekly and daily feats. I will run maps, turn in keys. Trade off stuff I don't need. Prowess keeps going up.
I think a lot of problems happen for people is when they try to accomplish a large goal in a short period of time try to "grind it out." Sure you will get done a lot quicker but you burn yourself out and it leaves a bad taste in your mouth.
Recently AV adjusted diminishing returns to kick in a lot later.
A famous streamer "Red Beard" reached 55,000 prowess within two weeks. You can follow him in http://www.twitch.tv/teamredbeard . I think the leveling is too fast now. People will all reach end game content too soon before they will learn how to play their char.
yes and no.
do you have to get skills up to be viable? yes. but is mob killing over and over in this game fun and engaging? actually yes.
at least that is my opinion
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
People complain that feats take too long and they hate that they have to kill 150 of a mob before moving onto the next... that's dumb.
Do whatever you want, feats will come or they won't... just go and do what you want when you want to do it and you'll earn prowess in no time.
well to be fair (as a Darkfall fan myself) many players come in with no other desire other than to PvP and not only that PvP on a small scale (1:1 etc).
This game really isnt for that.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
You're definitely right... That's Quake, Chivalry, etc territory... Darkfall has a lot more to it than just PvP... Though, right now, the PvP has overshadowed the true beauty of the game.. I'm hoping that the coming alignment system coupled with some interesting sandbox tools and content will create some order in the chaotic world of Agon.
I found it a grind.
You grind out prowess for this.
Grind some more prowess for that.
Then you spend some time crafting, dump some prowess into that.
I got to 7k prowess and quit.
Its a grind fest.
I found that if you talk to people, you can make friends. A lot of times they would only take your gold or some mats. Good players don't go around farming noobs, but sometimes they don't know you're a noob. But if you send a tell and you're not angry and maybe ask for some advice, most of the time people are glad to help out. They sometimes even give you stuff: mounts, better armor than what you had to start with, weapons, etc.
Sometimes you do run into a jerk, but that is the exception. In those cases, if you send them a tell they may not answer you. Maybe they just don't speak English. Or sometimes they try to camp you. But I have found that to be very rare.
I am shocked to hear that a player tried to grind in the safe zone dungeon and quit after 2 weeks.
Knowing the efficient way to get prowess goes a long way. You have to leave safe zone and do more risky spawn for bigger rewards.
Here are a lot of very well written guides
https://forums.darkfallonline.com/forumdisplay.php?97-New-Player-Help-and-Guides
These two are exceptional
Overall Guide
https://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?384230-Another-New-Player-Guide
Efficiency Guide
https://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?393379-Guide-A-New-Players-Efficiency-Guide-to-PvP-viability
Did I say that period of time was mandatory? That was the amount of time he played because he was enjoying himself and breaking up the grind by pvp roaming with us. I know people who are "normal" and have families who have been playing this game from launch, on weekends and in the limited time they have in the evening. You can be more than PvP viable playing casually. It will take you longer to level if you only have a limited time to play each day, but in what mmo isn't that the case?
I cannot lie, looking at it that way, yeah it's a grind. Quest are coming so they might fix that.
But the game, the pvp part that is, it's worth it to go throught the grind just to get there.
In one month, i got to 72k thanks to various guide that i followed so based on the amount of time it takes, it's not long at all and i wasnt even grinding everydays or for hours.
I still dislike the fact that everything takes too much time. You're harvesting? It takes time so you must be on youtube while doing that. You want to refine your stuff? Go on youtube and refine your stuff. You want to level your crafting skills? Go on youtube while you craft. your stuff that in total, will take you 20 minutes to complete. What were they thinking?
Everything takes time in this game and they're all boring activities that forces us to go on youtube while we do them. It's the lamest part about DF.
C:\Users\FF\Desktop\spin move.gif
I'm honestly not trying to be offensive, but have you actually played Darkfall or are you just basing this post off hearsay?
Basic gear is absurdly easy to craft or get in this game. Usable equipment drops off a very large percentage of mobs in the game, from the weakest goblins up to the massive scary Monstrosity/Scourge spawns. Whether or not YOU can use this equipment, or if it happens to be something you need at the time is a different story (random drops etc.)
Crafting a full set of the simplest most basic armor will take you about 10 minutes of harvesting and 5 minutes of crafting. If you spend more like 20 minutes harvesting you can probably make that more efficient and craft 2-3 sets in 5 minutes. It's not very GOOD armor, mind you, but it is easy as balls to craft and can be done entirely within the safezone. Every single harvesting tool, weapon, bow, and scrap of armor you need can be crafted like this. The nicer it is, the more difficult the mats are to acquire and the more time investment you need to put into mastering the associated craft skill.
Since the Economy patch a few months back, afk harvesting has been strongly nerfed and is basically only able to support non-mastery gear (low level gear). Mastery gear now comes almost exclusively from active PvE or harvesting closely controlled city nodes. The benefit from focusing in on this active PvE concept is that players are required to go outside the safezone into the real world, frequently in large groups of fully geared players, in order to farm for the best materials.
This brings players into contact with hostiles, especially other people who are interested in farming the same mats or stealing yours. It's a catch 22, the best materials in the game are the riskiest to go after, and the best places to farm them are hotspots for organic and random PvP encounters. This is no different than ratting/mining 0.0 space in EvE, the best shit is there but it can all be stolen from you if you aren't careful.
That is kind of what makes the game exciting. If PvP / full loot isn't your thing than I understand, but safely grinding away your gear over hours of being afk is not the way to play. The economy patch has now required players to earn their gear with active PvE, and rewards them with better returns / faster farming / more PvP.