Original EQ had the right kind of quests. I played a Monk for most of my time in EQ, so can only reference their quests, but for example they had sash and headband quests which involve traveling to multiple dungeons across the world, finding a mob deep inside that dungeon and killing it for a piece of the quest. That, to me, is more 'quest like', it takes you throughout the world, takes you into dangerous locations that need other peoples help, has you find a specific mob, loot a specific item...
that little bit sounds better than the crappy task collection agency mmos have become. The problem is, how did that dangerous monster got his claws on that item and ended up at the far end of that dark and deadly dungeon? there needs to be a good story behind it. If the item just magically appears there for the sake of making you loot it then thats equally as bad as what we have today.
Well, in the case of the quests I mentioned, which were monk quests, they were sort of like the old sensei has you show your worth by doing these tasks and awards you if you complete them. The sashs and headbands had various colours, just like martial arts belts; white, yellow, red, etc, so each quest you would need the previous sash to be able to complete it. The mobs would have these items because they were proof of ownership rather than an item specifically placed there. Like a Dark Elf necromancer deep in one dungeon would have a specially made twisted dagger, or a Gnoll leader in another would have a necklace of finger bones made from it's numerous kills. It all made sense.
In a CRPG you wander the cities, villages and wilderness areas. Each area has its own set of NPCs. Some NPCs you will meet in different areas (e.g. traveling merchant). Whether or not you talked to each NPC was up to you. Some had little errands for you or bits of rumors and informations. Only for the main story arc you would be guided to certain areas to trigger important events. So the main story arc could be considered as something like a quest chain.
MMOs have "standardized" how quests/ errands are presented to the player. With all the quest tools that have seen the light of day you don't even need to read the conversations with quest givers. You'll see them marked on your automap. You'll see them with additional marks (e.g. exclamation marks floating above). How does questing look now today?
1) go to marked NPC 2) accept quest 3) go to next marked NPC 4) accept quest 5) repeat steps 3) and 4) until your quest log is full or no more quest are available at this quest hub 6) follow the marks of the automap (ideally find an optimal route to finish several quests) 7) return to the quest giver and collect rewards 8) repeat steps 1) to 7) until you've done all quests in the quest hub
Lots of MMOs haven't put much effort into NPCs besides quest givers. And the conversations with quest givers are rather pointless. If at least the dialoges had some quality if there is hardly any choice between accept or decline... Some MMORPGs have tried to offer more story elements, but this still doesn't change the binary nature of such quests.
If you need to farm certain materials (e.g. wolf pelts, ores, tools, etc.) then you don't need a quest as a motivation. Just do it because you need it for crafting.
It's how the quests are presented and the grind disguised that makes a good questing system. I can agree that all games with a questing system use the same generic general thought toward creating the quests, but the devs that can mask it with a different approach at least make it somewhat interesting....GW2 failed with there's, but at least they tried. Id say the best questing system I've been able to play was The Secret World. great modern story, tons of different things assigned to you to do and everything kinda went together in one smooth motion.
The worst experience with questing is any Perfect World game :P
Original EQ had the right kind of quests. I played a Monk for most of my time in EQ, so can only reference their quests, but for example they had sash and headband quests which involve traveling to multiple dungeons across the world, finding a mob deep inside that dungeon and killing it for a piece of the quest. That, to me, is more 'quest like', it takes you throughout the world, takes you into dangerous locations that need other peoples help, has you find a specific mob, loot a specific item... and that's not even mentioning the Epic quests, where you had to raid various planes and hunt down rare spawns.
Modern MMO's the quests are like, "Go ten feet that way to the field of specifically placed wolves, kill ten of the wolves and loot their pelts, then return here and hand the pelts over.". It's incredibly stale and uninteresting. And the whole game is populated by these things. Awful awful design.
I completely agree with you, but you need to remember that EQ2 and WoW came along to cater to the casual gamer and at the time there were a lot of people begging for an easier game. As I've frown older I find that while I loved EQ, I probably wouldn't be bald to play it if it were released today. Simply not enough time.
Originally posted by MMOExposedI see this statement a lot now days that Quest in MMOs are generic.Well I have to ask. What kind of quest entertains you?What quest are not generic?What video game had quest that wasnt generic?And If you want better quest, at lease explain what would make them better.
Spoken like someone who never experienced Asheron's Call. Fortunately for me my first MMO experience was AC. Well I guess it could be more unfortunate for me since I realize another MMO will never go the AC quest route. I could see if I got my start out in WoW or one the millions of clones were quests as they are now called are the norm, but I remember back when Quests were epic, took hours, offered serious challenges, if failed would require a waiting period of up to 30 days to retry, and gave amazing loot and experience. Oh do I wish an MMO would do so again.
Here is an example of some of the walkthroughs required for some of the quests in AC:
Items: Full details here 2 Ancient Mhoire Coins 2 use Legendary Key MMDs: 6 Luminance: 15,000 Max XP: Full details here 1,695,225,700 Titles: Full details here Knight of the Southwest Tower Knight of the Northwest Tower Knight of the Southeast Tower Champion of House Mhoire
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Introduced In: Gaining Ground Updated In: The Risen Princess Balance of Power Spring 2014 Related Quests: Noble Remains Kill Task Guardian Statue Kill Task Kidnapped Handmaiden Oubliette of Mhoire Castle Quest Paragon Weapons
Lord Mhoire's throne, where the Shade of Lord Rytheran appears.
Quest Overview
Access to the floating Mhoire Castle has finally been achieved. Secure the wards of three guardians in Graveyard before entering the castle to complete several trials, after which you are able to enter the Great Hall and confront the Shade of Lord Rytheran. There are also a few miniquests inside the castle. Rewards include Ancient Mhoire Coins, substantial xp, and multiple pulls on a tier 8 loot chest.
Walk Through
Graveyard (Castle Flagging)
Important: This step must be accomplished by everyone in your party individually. 1. Use the Ancient Stones at 66.5S 44.7W to get the Strange Jewel and a lore item. The lore item can be translated by Kuyiza in Zaikhal (optional). The Ancient Stones are located in the "Burning Woods" area of the Graveyard. They are nearby the bunker in that area.
2. The Strange Jewel must be used in 3 locations in the Graveyard to spawn bosses that must be killed in order to collect 3 candle items. Each boss spawns along with some accompanying minions. The minions respawn very quickly, so it is best to focus on attacking the boss. Each boss drops 3 candle items. Each person flagging needs one of each of the candles. So if you have more than 3 people flagging, you will need to kill more than once. There is no indication of where you should use the Strange Jewel. You can use it repeatedly until you find the correct spot. It is easier and recommended to do the flagging during the daytime.
3. Use Strange Jewel near the southwest edge of the Graveyard at 66.6S 45.2W to spawn Lord Hendrel. The location is on the very edge of the "Burning Woods" area of the Graveyard. Lord Hendrel is similar to a Wight Blade Sorcerer and spawns with several Wights.
4. Use Strange Jewel near the southwest bunker of the five bunkers near the GY Colo building at 65.0S 44.2W to spawn Lady Saliane inside the bunker. The bunker is the one directly across from the bunker for Count Phainor's Amulet. Lady Saliane is similar to a Spectral Dread. She spawns with several Corrupted Grave Frosts, which have low HP but are very dangerous when you are cold vuln'd.
5. Use Strange Jewel on the far edge of the Graveyard at 65.1S 45.5W to spawn Lord Trimere. Lord Trimere is similar to a Pyre Champion and spawns with several Pyre Minions.
6. One by one, each person should hand all three items to the left (west) gargoyle statue at 64.6S 44.1W in order (Saliane, Hendrel, and then Trimere). The gargoyle to the right (east) is the one used for GY Colo and will not accept the items.
7. A blue portal will briefly open behind the statue. If you've handed all three items in, enter the portal to continue. Note: This is a permanent flag, anytime in the future you can use the statue to reopen the portal. Tip: Handing in the candles can be repeated each day for xp and a graveyard coin, if desired. 8. The portal will drop you in the ruins of Mhoire Castle up on the hill. There are various portals around the ruins which go to the different towers of the castle. For first timers, the only portal which works is the northeast tower portal. The Defender's Mark of House Mhoire burns with blue flame and you are transported to the Northeast Tower of Mhoire Castle. Lore Note: From the Gaining Ground event until Retributions, the portal transported you to the Mhoire Castle courtyard which floated in the sky. However, as part of the Retributions event, the courtyard fell and was destroyed on the hills below.
Northeast Tower (First Timers Only)
8C03.png
The entire castle is connected by hallways (see map), and the first time you run the quest, you must start in the northeast tower. Once you've completed the quest the first, you can use the individual portals around the castle to access each tower trial quickly. This guide breaks down each trial individually (by tower), and you can complete each of them in any order you choose. Tip: If you plan on using a flame protection rare, it is recommended to complete the Southeast and Southwest trials together, so you can benefit from the rare in both trials. 1. Speak to the Shade of Antemy to begin the quest. He assigns you three trials to complete, one in each of the remaining three towers. 2. [OPTIONAL] Speak to the Shade of Fordroth and the Shade of Ormend to flag for two additional kill tasks. Note: These kill tasks can be repeated every 20 hours for a coin and XP.
Southeast Tower - Flames of Courage 1. From the Northeast tower drop, stick left until you reach a large room; take the SE corner door then stick left into through to another large room; take the NW door then stick left to the first test. 2. Talk to the Guardian of Mhoire statue in the middle of the room to receive a Mhoire Sword of Courage. Note: The room filled with Flame Guardians and high damage Flaming Skulls. If you get hit by one, heal immediately as a 2nd hit will likely kill you. Tip 1: Watch the patterns and you can avoid most Flaming Skulls. Tip 2: If you use an Inferno's Jewel (flame protection rare), the Flaming Skulls will not harm you at all. 3. Once you've received the sword, kill 10 Flame Guardians and loot a Crystallized Blue Flame from each of their corpses. Note: The corpses (indicated by a yellow dot on the map) only last 1 to 3 seconds, so you must loot after each kill. 4. Once you've collected 10 flames, speak to the Guardian of Mhoire Statue to complete the trial: Defender, you have succeeded in the Test of the Southeast Tower. You have been granted the title Knight of the Southeast Tower!
Movie Guide by Xeo (Teresh of MT)
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Northwest Tower - Rite of Wisdom 1. From the northeast tower drop, stick left to a large room and take the NW door then stick left through to another large room; take the SE door and stick left to the next test. 2. For this test you will be harassed by several Guardian Statues that respawn as fast as you can kill them. They spam war magic, so you will need to be quick or have someone else heal you while you solve the puzzle. 3. Talk to the Guardian of Mhoire statue in the middle of the room to receive a block of green text similar to the following (Each clue is different): DJZZKKE FBKV PTJ EKZCABKN MTNK KLZB OJLNE CV TNEKN CD PTJN ZBTNK XBK WCNDX XTJZB FCVED FBKNK WLMZTVD DTLN - Air (West) XBK VKUX BKLN ZNLDBCVO FLHKD TV DBTNK - Water (South) XBK XBCNE DKKQ ELIZCVO WMLIKD XBLX NTLN - Fire (North) XBK MLDX WCVE DXNTVOKDX ITJVXLCV ZTNK - Earth (East) RLVCDBIKVX WTN L ZBTCZK ITDX ATTN DJZZKDD LVE XBKV C ILNQ XBK ETTN 4. Use each of the four stationary statues located around the room that correspond with the clues above. Important: You must use the statues in the order that you read them in your clue. If you use the statues out of order (you will be portaled to the start), or run out of time, simply talk to the statue again and you will be given a new order and the task starts over. Tip: After receiving your clue, run to the side hallway so you can safely identify the order of the statues you need to use. Guardian of Fire is the North statue. Guardian of Water is the South statue. Guardian of Earth is the East statue. Guardian of Air is the West statue.
5. If you use all 4 statues in the correct order, you will receive a message stating that you have completed the task, and awarded the title: Defender, you have succeeded in the Test of the Northwest Tower. You have been granted the title Knight of the Northwest Tower!
Southwest Tower - Flames of Virtue
Guardian of Mhoire Room Flames Map.png 1. From the drop of the northeast tower, stick left to a large room and take the NW door. From here, stick left to another large room; use the SW door then stick left to another large room. Finally, take the NE door and stick left to find the third test. 2. You will enter a room with high damage Flaming Skulls (similar to the Souteast tower). These skulls can one or two hit you, so be careful to avoid them! Tip: If you use an Inferno's Jewel (flame protection rare), you can avoid taking damage from the skulls.
3. Talk to the Guardian of Mhoire statue in the middle of the room to receive a Mhoire Sword of Virtue, and a green message dictating which flame to drop it in. Note: The map (see right) shows the names and locations of the flames.
4. Drop the sword into the flame that corresponds with the message you received. If you're correct, you'll receive yet another message, indicating where to drop the sword next. Note: It is possible to receive the same statue twice in a row.
5. Once you've dropped the sword into a number of correct flames, you will receive a message telling you to bring the sword back to the Guardian of Mhoire statue. Note: If you hand the sword to the wrong statue, simply speak with the Guardian of Mhoire again to get a new sword and start again.
6. Return the sword to the Guardian of Mhoire, and if you've done the test correctly, you will receive a message indicating you have passed the test: Defender, you have succeeded in the Test of the Southwest Tower. You have been granted the title Knight of the Southwest Tower!
Movie Guide by Xeo (Teresh of MT)
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Great Hall - Cleansing the Throne
Important: If you die while fighting the Shade of Lord Rytheran, you will not be able to respawn him on your own. If you speak to the Shade of Antemy, he will tell you that you must abandon the quest and try again in two weeks, or else go with someone else to spawn him. At this point, your best bet is to get someone else to spawn the boss, and simply loot Rytheran's Jeweled Ring when you've killed him. 1. Talk to the Shade of Antemy at the northeast tower drop to flag for the Mhoire Castle Great Hall Portal (across the room from him). 2. Enter the Mhoire Castle Great Hall Portal and you'll be in a series of rooms with various doors. Take the following: 1. South double door 2. NE double door 3. East then North corner 4. NW double door 5. NW double door 6. North then West corner (killable doors) 7. SW double door 8. Head south through the double door (killable doors), and enter the Mhoire Throne Room
3. Use the Ancient Throne to spawn the Shade of Lord Rytheran and a horde of his Wights. 4. Each person in your group must loot a Rytheran's Jeweled Ring (drops 9) from his corpse. Note: For ranged characters this is solo-able, use the Throne and hop onto a pillar. Tip: The Shade of Lord Rytheran (Undead, weak to fire/acid/pierceSB) will spawn along with numerous GY creatures. The various GY creatures will respawn reather quickly in the spot they are killed. Make use of doors in the vicinity as you see appropriate.
5. Head back to the Northeast tower and speak to the Shade of Antemy to receive your rewards and title: Shade of Antemy tells you, "In life I was the Seneschal of House Mhoire. In ancient times I walked these halls and served Lord Cynreft Mhoire." You hand over 10 of your Rytheran's Jeweled Rings. Shade of Antemy tells you, "Well done, champion and defender of House Mhoire. You have cleansed the throne of House Mhoire, and countless spirits within these halls rest peacefully." Shade of Antemy tells you, "You have proven yourself a hundred fold, and I am in your debt. The corruption will remain clear of the throne for some time. Take these items as thanks." You have been awarded the title Champion of House Mhoire! You've earned 1,695,225,700 experience. You've earned 15,000 Luminance. Shade of Antemy gives you 2 Ancient Mhoire Coins. Shade of Antemy gives you Legendary Key. 6. The legendary chests are located with the Sealed Treasury Vaults beyond the Mhoire Throne Room. So you must go back to the Great Hall and beyond the throne to use the keys. Also note that the legendary chests are in separate rooms for each type of chest (Armor, Weapon, Magic).
Movie Guide by Xeo (Teresh of MT)
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Maps
Dungeon Coordinates Wiki Map ACmaps Other Quests Mhoire Castle Courtyard 64.6S 44.1W 462D.png 462D.png -- -- -- Mhoire Castle -- 8C03.png 8C03.png -- -- -- Mhoire Castle Great Hall -- 8C03.png 8C03.png -- -- --
Items
Quest Items Ancient Journal Icon.png Ancient Journal Translated Tomb Writings Icon.png Translated Tomb Writings Strange Jewel Icon.png Strange Jewel Lady Saliane's Brand Icon.png Lady Saliane's Brand Lord Hendrel's Brand Icon.png Lord Hendrel's Brand Lord Trimere's Brand Icon.png Lord Trimere's Brand Mhoire Signet Ring Icon.png Mhoire Signet Ring Ancient Throne Icon.png Ancient Throne Rytheran's Jeweled Ring Icon.png Rytheran's Jeweled Ring Sealed Treasury Vault Icon.png Sealed Treasury Vault
Rewards Ancient Mhoire Coin Icon.png Ancient Mhoire Coin Legendary Key Icon.png Legendary Key
Ancient Stones
Experience Rewards
Note: The brands are 6 day timer, the ring is 13 days.
Task Required Max Experience Percentage & Level Cap Give the three brands to statue. 100,000,000xp Fixed XP
Speak to Antemy after looting Rytheran's Ring. 1,695,225,700xp 50% up to level 275
See Level Costs for per level information.
Title Rewards
Task Required Title Reward Complete Southwest Tower Task Knight of the Southwest Tower
Complete Northwest Tower Task Knight of the Northwest Tower
Complete Southeast Tower Task Knight of the Southeast Tower
Speak to Antemy after looting Rytheran's Ring. Champion of House Mhoire
Items: Full details here Aerfalle's Pallium/Aerfalle's Supreme Pallium/Aerfalle's Mana-infused Pallium Ashbane/Superior Ashbane/Reforged Ashbane Staff of Aerfalle/War Staff of Aerfalle/Mana-infused Acid War Staff of Aerfalle Unreadable Scroll Black Fire Atlan Stone Enhanced Black Fire Atlan Stone Ring of the Watchman Strengthened Mana Forge Key MMDs: Easy: ? Hard: ? Uber: 12 Luminance: Easy/Hard: None Uber: 15,000 Max XP: Full details here Easy: 13,765,337 Hard: 22,879,999 Uber: 125,000,000 Titles: None
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Introduced In: To Raise a Banner of Flame Updated In: Hollow Victory, Hidden Vein, From the Darkness Born, Foolish Ambition, Old Ghosts, The Risen Princess Related Quests: Sword of Lost Light Quest Atlan Weapons Quest Isparian Weapons Quest Menhir Research
Aerfalle Keep Library
Quest Overview
This quest requires lockpick to complete.
The Lady Aerfalle Quest is the major quest associated with Aerlinthe Isle. In order to reach the final dungeon, an extensive set up is required. This is often done by one player (who has lockpick) and then the rest of the group joins before heading to the final dungeon. There are 3 difficulty versions of the quest. Only 9 keys are dropped by Lady Aerfalle, so only 9 people can get rewards per run. The uber version of the quest has an additional dungeon and is limited to a locked fellowship of level 150+ players.
This quest has ties to the Sword of Lost Light Quest, Atlan and Isparian upgrades, and Menhir Research. These portions of the quest are optional.
There is a dispel trap inside of Aerfalle Keep which can dispel all buffs. It is possible to avoid the trap using a jump. If your group contains players who cannot yet fully buff themselves, be aware that you will need someone to rebuff them if they fail to avoid the trap.
One of the largest and oldest quests in the game, the Lady Aerfalle Quest is a true classic and is considered by many to be one of the greatest quests in the history of Asheron's Call.
Walk Through
Part 1: Preparation
These steps can be done alone or with a smaller group, there are no rewards and participation is not essential for being a part of the later sections of this quest. 1. Go to the Crater Caves Dungeon at 66.7N 12.5E. At the bottom of the dungeon near the forges, collect the Pyreal Forge Bellows laying on the ground. Route: See Crater Lake Village for route. Many portal bots often have a portal tie to Crater.
2. Travel to Aerlinthe Isle. If you have done the quest before, use Aerlinthe Recall, otherwise you can get there by handing a D Note to Garaena the Emissary at 87.6S, 65.6W, just east of Candeth Keep. Alternatively, you can hand a C Note to Faladha the Emissary, an undead NPC located inside Chalicmere Castle.
3. From the Aerlinthe drop, follow the inner harbor beach around to the harbor's northwest corner (87.7N 44.4E). Go due west up the slope to 88.0N 43.4E then follow the ledge that wraps around the mountain to the north and enter the Tenkarrdun Foundry at 88.8N 42.8E. 4. Retrieve the Sluice Gate Bar from the Foundry. Lockpick is required. Note: See map for location of the Sluice Gate Bar. You will need to unlock one door and pull a lever to open one door to reach it. The lever door does not stay open for long, so be quick! Tip: The dungeon has several exit portals which drop at different locations. One portal in particular drops at 88.6N 42.4E, near your next destination. This portal is at the very bottom of the dungeon, so you will need to backtrack after getting the bar and pull 2 levers to open the doors to the bottom of the dungeon (see map for details). Alternatively, you can take any exit portal and make a longer run to the next location.
5. Run to the Aerlinthe Reservoir at 85.5N 43.4E. 6. Enter the dungeon and proceed down to the bottom. 7. If you are planning/considering doing the easy version of the quest, you must pick up one Sacrificial Dagger in this dungeon. It is behind a locked door just before you get to the large downward sloping room (see map for details). Only one dagger is needed per run. Note that the dagger is Attuned and Bonded, so whoever loots the dagger must also go on the rest of the quest. 8. At the bottom of the reservoir behind a locked door (322) is a portal to the Aerlinthe Lower Reservoir, use this portal. 9. Run to the bottom of the Lower Reservoir and hand the Sluice Gate Bar to the Repair Golem. The golem appears as an NPC (white dot on the radar). Giving the bar to the golem officially starts the quest and causes the Smithing Golem to spawn in the Tenkarrdun Foundry. Tip: There is an important jump near the end, when you come to a shaft facing west. There is a small grate you need to hit or you'll fall to the very bottom of the shaft and there is no way back except running back to the dungeon from Aerlinthe drop. To hit the grate, jump normally towards the SW corner of the shaft, you'll slide down the corner and hit the grate. Note: If the golem is NOT there, it means the quest is in progress, or someone has killed the watchman within the last 3 hours. You are able to log out in the dungeon, so if the Repair Golem is not there, you can log out and then finish the preparation after he has respawned.
10. After giving the bar to the Repair Golem, jump through the left wall opening to get to the exit portal. 11. Run back to the Tenkarrdun Foundry and head all the way to the bottom of the dungeon. You will need to pull 2 levers and unlock 2 doors to get there. The lever doors do not stay open for long, so be quick! 12. At the very bottom, give the Pyreal Forge Bellows to the Smithing Golem. This causes the Tenkarrdun Hellfire to spawn in the crater on Aerlinthe. It also causes a lava animation to happen near the Smithing Golem. 13. At this point, the entire group should meet up to continue the quest. If desired, use one of the exit portals in the dungeon and then run back to the Aerlinthe drop.
Part 2: Infusions and Relic Town 1. Gather your group and get everyone to Aerlinthe. Run around the harbor and then up the hill to enter the crater to the north. 2. Kill the Tenkarrdun Hellfire located in the crater near 90.3N 46.3E. Killing this Hellfire causes the Relic Watchman to spawn in Relic Town (an undead town on Aerlinthe). It also causes the Mount Esper Firestorm to spawn. [OPTIONAL] Sword of Lost Light upgrades: If you are getting the Sword of Lost Light upgrades, loot a Red Fire Infusion from the corpse of the Tenkarrdun Hellfire (drops 9). If you are doing just the upgrades and not completing the rest of the Lady Aerfalle quest, you can then proceed directly to Crater Lake Village where the Mount Esper Firestorm has spawned. Otherwise, this can be done after completing the Lady Aerfalle quest. Note that if you are not completing the rest of the Lady Aerfalle Quest, it is good practice to proceed to Relic Town and kill the Relic Watchman anyway, so the quest will properly reset for the next group. 1.Head to Crater Lake Village and then go to the middle of the lake and kill the Mount Esper Firestorm. Loot a White Fire Infusion (drops 9). Killing the firestorm causes the Mount Lethe Hellfire to spawn. 2.Head to Mount Lethe in the Direlands and kill the Mount Lethe Hellfire. Loot a Blue Fire Infusion (drops 9). 3.See Sword of Lost Light Quest for details on using the infusions and further upgrades.
3.[OPTIONAL] Near the Tenkarrdun Hellfire is a Behemoth of Tenkarrdun at 90.0N 46.3E. When killed, the Behemoth drops 9 Black Boulders. These can be given to a Stone Collector for a Black Fire Atlan Stone, which can be used to upgrade an Atlan or Isparian Weapon with a Major Stone in it. Note that the Enhanced Black Fire Atlan Stone is part of the reward for the Uber version of the quest. You need both the Black Fire and the Enhanced Black Fire stones to fully upgrade an Atlan/Isparian weapon. 4. After killing the Hellfire, head south again to the bay, and follow the path around the bay to the west. Eventually you will come to Relic Town. 5. In Relic Town it is important to ensure all of your group is present before killing the Relic Watchman. Groups often gather on top of the buildings to avoid the many enemies. It is safest to not kill enemies to avoid the risk of killing the Watchman by mistake. Occasionally it can take a few minutes after killing the Hellfire for the Watchman to spawn.
6. When everyone is ready, kill the Relic Watchman and take the portal to Aerfalle Keep which opens at 86.4N 45.4E. The portal only stays open for a few minutes, so use it quickly!
Part 3: Aerlinthe Keep and Lady Aerfalle 1. Once inside Aerfalle Keep, you have 90 minutes to complete the quest. Lockpick is required. 2. Directly ahead from the drop is a door. Behind the door is a short hallway and another door. Within the hallway is a dispel trap. Use a small jump just inside the first door to avoid it! Anyone who misses the jump will likely need to rebuff. 3. If doing the easy version of the quest, hand the Sacrificial Dagger to the Ghost of Dylaeral (see map for details). This causes the easiest boss to spawn. 4. If doing the hard version of the quest, nothing special needs to be done before proceeding to the end. 5. If doing the uber version of the quest, go to the chest rewards room and get a Nexus-keyed Mana Shard from the altar. Then backtrack and give it to the Ghost of Galaeral. This locks your fellowship and causes the portal to Aerfalle's Sanctum to spawn. 6. Proceed through the Keep using lockpick and levers to open doors (see map for details). All versions of the quest go to the same room where either a boss or a portal is waiting.
Easy Version 1. Kill Aerfalle's Weakened Apprentice and loot an Ashen Key (drops 9). 2. Backtrack to the lever room with the Infernos and use the key on Lady of Aerlinthe's Chest. 3. Loot all the rewards from the chest (loot will pile up if you don't loot it all).
Hard Version 1. Kill Lady Aerfalle's Apprentice and loot an Ornate Ashen Key (drops 9). 2. Backtrack to the lever room with the Infernos and use the key on Lady of Aerlinthe's Ornate Chest. 3. Loot all the rewards from the chest (loot will pile up if you don't loot it all).
Uber Version 1. In the final room there will be a portal to Aerfalle's Sanctum. You must click on the portal to use it. Aerfalle's Sanctum is a "no log" dungeon, so if you log out or disconnect you will be sent to your lifestone and will be unable to rejoin the quest.
2. The enemies in this dungeon are considerably more difficult than the enemies up to this point. Proceed slowly and with caution! There are some rooms which have traps that cause more enemies to spawn. Beware of these and continue moving forward to avoid getting hung up. 3. Proceed through the dungeon, going down whenever possible until you reach a ledge that overlooks Lady Aerfalle. 4. There are several strategies for fighting Lady Aerfalle. If your group is mostly missile weapon and mage characters, it can be safest to simply kill her from the ledge above. Otherwise you can fight her in the throne room below or move into the hallway behind the throne for more protection. 5. Lady Aerfalle has high health and defense, and casts many debuffs. She can also counter-vuln and dispel vulns on herself, so it is generally best to use rended weapons. 6. Kill Lady Aerfalle and loot an Embossed Ashen Key (drops 9), and Lady Aerfalle's Charm (drops 9) from her corpse. 7. [OPTIONAL] Behind the throne is a Menhir ring which is used for part of the Menhir Research quest. The vortex causes massive damage, so be quick if using it. 8. Take the hallway behind the throne and hand Lady Aerfalle's Charm to the Ghost of Galaeral for luminance rewards. Note: Ghost of Galaeral despawns after 5 min so be sure to turn in right away.
9. Use the Embossed Ashen Key to loot the chest behind the Ghost of Galaeral.
Part 4: Rewards 1. Give whichever Token you looted to Kuyiza bint Zayi the Translator in Zaikhal for an experience reward (and Strengthened Mana Forge Key for Uber version). 2. Give the Unreadable Scroll to Kuyiza bint Zayi the Translator as well and she will teach you Aerlinthe Recall (level 6 item spell). 3.[OPTIONAL] The Ashbane sword can be given to Leikotha for an additional small experience reward if desired. Route: Take the Yinar portal in Samsur at 0.9S 18.9E then run west to the supulcher at 10.1S 31.3E. Note: Leikotha portals you to Subway when you hand her the sword.
4. The staff and the robe cannot be turned in for any sort of rewards. They can be kept or given to a Town Crier.
Hard Rewards Aerfalle's Ornate Token Icon.png Aerfalle's Ornate Token Unreadable Scroll Icon.png Unreadable Scroll Aerfalle's Supreme Pallium Icon.png Aerfalle's Supreme Pallium War Staff of Aerfalle Icon.png War Staff of Aerfalle Superior Ashbane Icon.png Superior Ashbane
Uber Rewards Aerfalle's Embossed Token Icon.png Aerfalle's Embossed Token Unreadable Scroll Icon.png Unreadable Scroll Aerfalle's Mana-infused Pallium Icon.png Aerfalle's Mana-infused Pallium Mana-infused Acid War Staff of Aerfalle Icon.png Mana-infused Acid War Staff of Aerfalle Reforged Ashbane Icon.png Reforged Ashbane Enhanced Black Fire Atlan Stone Icon.png Enhanced Black Fire Atlan Stone
Side Rewards Red Fire Infusion Icon.png Red Fire Infusion Blue Fire Infusion Icon.png Blue Fire Infusion White Fire Infusion Icon.png White Fire Infusion Black Fire Atlan Stone Icon.png Black Fire Atlan Stone Ring of the Watchman Icon.png Ring of the Watchman
Quest Items Sluice Gate Bar Icon.png Sluice Gate Bar Pyreal Forge Bellows Icon.png Pyreal Forge Bellows Black Boulder Icon.png Black Boulder Sacrificial Dagger Icon.png Sacrificial Dagger Nexus-keyed Mana Shard Icon.png Nexus-keyed Mana Shard Ashen Key Icon.png Ashen Key Ornate Ashen Key Icon.png Ornate Ashen Key Embossed Ashen Key Icon.png Embossed Ashen Key Lady Aerfalle's Charm Icon.png Lady Aerfalle's Charm Lady of Aerlinthe's Chest Icon.png Lady of Aerlinthe's Chest Lady of Aerlinthe's Ornate Chest Icon.png Lady of Aerlinthe's Ornate Chest Lady of Aerlinthe's Embossed Chest Icon.png Lady of Aerlinthe's Embossed Chest
Untranslated Texts Charred Book Icon.png Charred Book Sheets of Paper (Aerfalle) Icon.png Sheets of Paper (Aerfalle) Singed Note Icon.png Singed Note
Translated Texts Aerfalle's Letter Icon.png Aerfalle's Letter Aerlinthe Record Icon.png Aerlinthe Record Smith's Note Icon.png Smith's Note
Experience Rewards
Task Required Max Experience Percentage & Level Cap Turn in Ashbane to Leikotha 13,765,337xp 20% up to level 100
Turn in Superior Ashbane to Leikotha 13,765,337xp 20% up to level 100
Turn in Reforged Ashbane to Leikotha 50,000,000xp ??% up to level ??
Turn in Aerfalle's Token to Kuyiza bint Zayi the Translator 15,000,000xp ??% up to level ??
Turn in Aerfalle's Ornate Token to Kuyiza bint Zayi the Translator 55,000,000xp ??% up to level ??
Turn in Aerfalle's Embossed Token to Kuyiza bint Zayi the Translator 160,000,000xp ??% up to level ??
But how is this much different from modern day Dungeon objective quest? It come a off as a dungeon quest honestly. What you have to say about that?
In AC1, people needed 2 months to figure out the totality of the Aerfalle quest. Today's gamers would cry like no tomorrow on the forums the second day after the release. That's was non generic questing, requiring a whole community to figure out all the details.
I love it. More of that please!
care to explain how those 2 month quet worked?
did they have cooldown or something?
Nope. It was just complex, and without arrows on a map to show you were to go.
People had to interview NPCs, and then use their brains to figure out what to do, since the NPCs wouldn't just say "go there", but give hints. Forget the "go kill 10 bandits in my courtyard" style modern quests, and imagine it more like a Sherlock Holmes story with many steps.
Not to mention the whole quest is gigantic, they added an entire big island to the game for it, with a huge amount of lore behind it too.
Originally posted by Distopia Having never played AC I'd have to wonder why it was never repeated, as there's always another side to every fan's nostalgic story.
The big difference between the AC1 quests and the EQ quests was that AC1 was all about adventure and figuring out things, while EQ was all about grinding. EQ is the origin of today's quest system.
But these modern day quest use to be just like that as well. In WoW for example, at first it didn't even show you where to go for the quest objectives. A Mod helped with that, and Blizzard later added that Mod's speciality to the game. That doesn't change the fact that it's still the same quest.
In AC1, people needed 2 months to figure out the totality of the Aerfalle quest. Today's gamers would cry like no tomorrow on the forums the second day after the release. That's was non generic questing, requiring a whole community to figure out all the details.
I love it. More of that please!
care to explain how those 2 month quet worked?
did they have cooldown or something?
Nope. It was just complex, and without arrows on a map to show you were to go.
People had to interview NPCs, and then use their brains to figure out what to do, since the NPCs wouldn't just say "go there", but give hints. Forget the "go kill 10 bandits in my courtyard" style modern quests, and imagine it more like a Sherlock Holmes story with many steps.
Not to mention the whole quest is gigantic, they added an entire big island to the game for it, with a huge amount of lore behind it too.
Originally posted by Distopia Having never played AC I'd have to wonder why it was never repeated, as there's always another side to every fan's nostalgic story.
The big difference between the AC1 quests and the EQ quests was that AC1 was all about adventure and figuring out things, while EQ was all about grinding. EQ is the origin of today's quest system.
But these modern day quest use to be just like that as well. In WoW for example, at first it didn't even show you where to go for the quest objectives. A Mod helped with that, and Blizzard later added that Mod's speciality to the game. That doesn't change the fact that it's still the same quest.
In a CRPG you wander the cities, villages and wilderness areas. Each area has its own set of NPCs. Some NPCs you will meet in different areas (e.g. traveling merchant). Whether or not you talked to each NPC was up to you. Some had little errands for you or bits of rumors and informations. Only for the main story arc you would be guided to certain areas to trigger important events. So the main story arc could be considered as something like a quest chain.
MMOs have "standardized" how quests/ errands are presented to the player. With all the quest tools that have seen the light of day you don't even need to read the conversations with quest givers. You'll see them marked on your automap. You'll see them with additional marks (e.g. exclamation marks floating above). How does questing look now today?
1) go to marked NPC 2) accept quest 3) go to next marked NPC 4) accept quest 5) repeat steps 3) and 4) until your quest log is full or no more quest are available at this quest hub 6) follow the marks of the automap (ideally find an optimal route to finish several quests) 7) return to the quest giver and collect rewards 8) repeat steps 1) to 7) until you've done all quests in the quest hub
Lots of MMOs haven't put much effort into NPCs besides quest givers. And the conversations with quest givers are rather pointless. If at least the dialoges had some quality if there is hardly any choice between accept or decline... Some MMORPGs have tried to offer more story elements, but this still doesn't change the binary nature of such quests.
If you need to farm certain materials (e.g. wolf pelts, ores, tools, etc.) then you don't need a quest as a motivation. Just do it because you need it for crafting.
Don't mix up how developers dress up the quest, with what the quest really consist of. I can put a hamburger bun on a hotdog but that doesn't make it a Not a HotDog.
the NPC's at those RPG have certain story elements or events that they trigger, but that's really the same thing that are in MMOs. GW2 proved that! It's just how hey are dressed up. And reality wise, that's not something the MMO PvE community truly enjoys for long periods of time. In Skyrim is make be cool, but that's because people hold RPGs to different standards than MMOs. Want more proof of that statement, just look at how the MMO community reacts to Bugs In the game, and compare it to How the RPG community reacts to Elder Scrolls Bugs. They are more accepting of bugs because they hav different standards. So I don't see why MMO quest get compared to RPG quest when in reality they are the same, and have been the same all along.
In AC1, people needed 2 months to figure out the totality of the Aerfalle quest. Today's gamers would cry like no tomorrow on the forums the second day after the release. That's was non generic questing, requiring a whole community to figure out all the details.
I love it. More of that please!
care to explain how those 2 month quet worked?
did they have cooldown or something?
Check my post above. This was the walkthrough, I remember it taking my Leafcull server 2 months to figure out Aerfalle quest and the Olthoi Queen Hive + Bells quest about 3 months before it was broken (I.e. cracked, solved, figured out). Asheron's Call released quests like this on a monthly basis for 10+ years. Some of them were generic but most were memorable and challenging. Best MMO ever made, hands down.
Everyone's favorite MMO is the best MMO ever made..It usually boils down to whichever one they spent the most time in back then. Speaking on interesting features & content options, I'd have to say SWG was the best MMO ever, hands down.
Having never played AC I'd have to wonder why it was never repeated, as there's always another side to every fan's nostalgic story. As there are plenty to look at in SWG's case on why we don't see it in other games.
I tried SWG but thought it was really bad and poorly done. I remember a quote during SWTOR's development on why SWTOR didn't try the SWG Sandbox model and the quote went something like this: I don't think many people want to play Uncle Owen but prefer to play Luke Skywalker. Which is spot on in my analysis. Not that it made SWTOR any better but the issue remained the same, for people like me who think of combat, character progression and loot acquisition as the core tenets of a good MMO then SWG was a horrible game.
As for why it was never repeated is because Microsoft and later Turbine refused to market and advertise the game so it never gained the following. Plus back then the MMO community was so small that it couldn't grow because it was released 6 months after EQ1 and that game took most customers. If AC1 was released with modern graphics and update combat then it would be a mega hit. As IMO it combined the best aspects of RPG's like questing and character progression as well as the best aspects of Diablo style looting systems. It didn't require you to or force you to group but many of the best quests did.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Originally posted by MMOExposedI see this statement a lot now days that Quest in MMOs are generic.Well I have to ask. What kind of quest entertains you?What quest are not generic?What video game had quest that wasnt generic?And If you want better quest, at lease explain what would make them better.
Spoken like someone who never experienced Asheron's Call. Fortunately for me my first MMO experience was AC. Well I guess it could be more unfortunate for me since I realize another MMO will never go the AC quest route. I could see if I got my start out in WoW or one the millions of clones were quests as they are now called are the norm, but I remember back when Quests were epic, took hours, offered serious challenges, if failed would require a waiting period of up to 30 days to retry, and gave amazing loot and experience. Oh do I wish an MMO would do so again.
Here is an example of some of the walkthroughs required for some of the quests in AC:
Items: Full details here 2 Ancient Mhoire Coins 2 use Legendary Key MMDs: 6 Luminance: 15,000 Max XP: Full details here 1,695,225,700 Titles: Full details here Knight of the Southwest Tower Knight of the Northwest Tower Knight of the Southeast Tower Champion of House Mhoire
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Introduced In: Gaining Ground Updated In: The Risen Princess Balance of Power Spring 2014 Related Quests: Noble Remains Kill Task Guardian Statue Kill Task Kidnapped Handmaiden Oubliette of Mhoire Castle Quest Paragon Weapons
Lord Mhoire's throne, where the Shade of Lord Rytheran appears.
Quest Overview
Access to the floating Mhoire Castle has finally been achieved. Secure the wards of three guardians in Graveyard before entering the castle to complete several trials, after which you are able to enter the Great Hall and confront the Shade of Lord Rytheran. There are also a few miniquests inside the castle. Rewards include Ancient Mhoire Coins, substantial xp, and multiple pulls on a tier 8 loot chest.
Walk Through
Graveyard (Castle Flagging)
Important: This step must be accomplished by everyone in your party individually. 1. Use the Ancient Stones at 66.5S 44.7W to get the Strange Jewel and a lore item. The lore item can be translated by Kuyiza in Zaikhal (optional). The Ancient Stones are located in the "Burning Woods" area of the Graveyard. They are nearby the bunker in that area.
2. The Strange Jewel must be used in 3 locations in the Graveyard to spawn bosses that must be killed in order to collect 3 candle items. Each boss spawns along with some accompanying minions. The minions respawn very quickly, so it is best to focus on attacking the boss. Each boss drops 3 candle items. Each person flagging needs one of each of the candles. So if you have more than 3 people flagging, you will need to kill more than once. There is no indication of where you should use the Strange Jewel. You can use it repeatedly until you find the correct spot. It is easier and recommended to do the flagging during the daytime.
3. Use Strange Jewel near the southwest edge of the Graveyard at 66.6S 45.2W to spawn Lord Hendrel. The location is on the very edge of the "Burning Woods" area of the Graveyard. Lord Hendrel is similar to a Wight Blade Sorcerer and spawns with several Wights.
4. Use Strange Jewel near the southwest bunker of the five bunkers near the GY Colo building at 65.0S 44.2W to spawn Lady Saliane inside the bunker. The bunker is the one directly across from the bunker for Count Phainor's Amulet. Lady Saliane is similar to a Spectral Dread. She spawns with several Corrupted Grave Frosts, which have low HP but are very dangerous when you are cold vuln'd.
5. Use Strange Jewel on the far edge of the Graveyard at 65.1S 45.5W to spawn Lord Trimere. Lord Trimere is similar to a Pyre Champion and spawns with several Pyre Minions.
6. One by one, each person should hand all three items to the left (west) gargoyle statue at 64.6S 44.1W in order (Saliane, Hendrel, and then Trimere). The gargoyle to the right (east) is the one used for GY Colo and will not accept the items.
7. A blue portal will briefly open behind the statue. If you've handed all three items in, enter the portal to continue. Note: This is a permanent flag, anytime in the future you can use the statue to reopen the portal. Tip: Handing in the candles can be repeated each day for xp and a graveyard coin, if desired. 8. The portal will drop you in the ruins of Mhoire Castle up on the hill. There are various portals around the ruins which go to the different towers of the castle. For first timers, the only portal which works is the northeast tower portal. The Defender's Mark of House Mhoire burns with blue flame and you are transported to the Northeast Tower of Mhoire Castle. Lore Note: From the Gaining Ground event until Retributions, the portal transported you to the Mhoire Castle courtyard which floated in the sky. However, as part of the Retributions event, the courtyard fell and was destroyed on the hills below.
Northeast Tower (First Timers Only)
8C03.png
The entire castle is connected by hallways (see map), and the first time you run the quest, you must start in the northeast tower. Once you've completed the quest the first, you can use the individual portals around the castle to access each tower trial quickly. This guide breaks down each trial individually (by tower), and you can complete each of them in any order you choose. Tip: If you plan on using a flame protection rare, it is recommended to complete the Southeast and Southwest trials together, so you can benefit from the rare in both trials. 1. Speak to the Shade of Antemy to begin the quest. He assigns you three trials to complete, one in each of the remaining three towers. 2. [OPTIONAL] Speak to the Shade of Fordroth and the Shade of Ormend to flag for two additional kill tasks. Note: These kill tasks can be repeated every 20 hours for a coin and XP.
Southeast Tower - Flames of Courage 1. From the Northeast tower drop, stick left until you reach a large room; take the SE corner door then stick left into through to another large room; take the NW door then stick left to the first test. 2. Talk to the Guardian of Mhoire statue in the middle of the room to receive a Mhoire Sword of Courage. Note: The room filled with Flame Guardians and high damage Flaming Skulls. If you get hit by one, heal immediately as a 2nd hit will likely kill you. Tip 1: Watch the patterns and you can avoid most Flaming Skulls. Tip 2: If you use an Inferno's Jewel (flame protection rare), the Flaming Skulls will not harm you at all. 3. Once you've received the sword, kill 10 Flame Guardians and loot a Crystallized Blue Flame from each of their corpses. Note: The corpses (indicated by a yellow dot on the map) only last 1 to 3 seconds, so you must loot after each kill. 4. Once you've collected 10 flames, speak to the Guardian of Mhoire Statue to complete the trial: Defender, you have succeeded in the Test of the Southeast Tower. You have been granted the title Knight of the Southeast Tower!
Movie Guide by Xeo (Teresh of MT)
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Northwest Tower - Rite of Wisdom 1. From the northeast tower drop, stick left to a large room and take the NW door then stick left through to another large room; take the SE door and stick left to the next test. 2. For this test you will be harassed by several Guardian Statues that respawn as fast as you can kill them. They spam war magic, so you will need to be quick or have someone else heal you while you solve the puzzle. 3. Talk to the Guardian of Mhoire statue in the middle of the room to receive a block of green text similar to the following (Each clue is different): DJZZKKE FBKV PTJ EKZCABKN MTNK KLZB OJLNE CV TNEKN CD PTJN ZBTNK XBK WCNDX XTJZB FCVED FBKNK WLMZTVD DTLN - Air (West) XBK VKUX BKLN ZNLDBCVO FLHKD TV DBTNK - Water (South) XBK XBCNE DKKQ ELIZCVO WMLIKD XBLX NTLN - Fire (North) XBK MLDX WCVE DXNTVOKDX ITJVXLCV ZTNK - Earth (East) RLVCDBIKVX WTN L ZBTCZK ITDX ATTN DJZZKDD LVE XBKV C ILNQ XBK ETTN 4. Use each of the four stationary statues located around the room that correspond with the clues above. Important: You must use the statues in the order that you read them in your clue. If you use the statues out of order (you will be portaled to the start), or run out of time, simply talk to the statue again and you will be given a new order and the task starts over. Tip: After receiving your clue, run to the side hallway so you can safely identify the order of the statues you need to use. Guardian of Fire is the North statue. Guardian of Water is the South statue. Guardian of Earth is the East statue. Guardian of Air is the West statue.
5. If you use all 4 statues in the correct order, you will receive a message stating that you have completed the task, and awarded the title: Defender, you have succeeded in the Test of the Northwest Tower. You have been granted the title Knight of the Northwest Tower!
Southwest Tower - Flames of Virtue
Guardian of Mhoire Room Flames Map.png 1. From the drop of the northeast tower, stick left to a large room and take the NW door. From here, stick left to another large room; use the SW door then stick left to another large room. Finally, take the NE door and stick left to find the third test. 2. You will enter a room with high damage Flaming Skulls (similar to the Souteast tower). These skulls can one or two hit you, so be careful to avoid them! Tip: If you use an Inferno's Jewel (flame protection rare), you can avoid taking damage from the skulls.
3. Talk to the Guardian of Mhoire statue in the middle of the room to receive a Mhoire Sword of Virtue, and a green message dictating which flame to drop it in. Note: The map (see right) shows the names and locations of the flames.
4. Drop the sword into the flame that corresponds with the message you received. If you're correct, you'll receive yet another message, indicating where to drop the sword next. Note: It is possible to receive the same statue twice in a row.
5. Once you've dropped the sword into a number of correct flames, you will receive a message telling you to bring the sword back to the Guardian of Mhoire statue. Note: If you hand the sword to the wrong statue, simply speak with the Guardian of Mhoire again to get a new sword and start again.
6. Return the sword to the Guardian of Mhoire, and if you've done the test correctly, you will receive a message indicating you have passed the test: Defender, you have succeeded in the Test of the Southwest Tower. You have been granted the title Knight of the Southwest Tower!
Movie Guide by Xeo (Teresh of MT)
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Great Hall - Cleansing the Throne
Important: If you die while fighting the Shade of Lord Rytheran, you will not be able to respawn him on your own. If you speak to the Shade of Antemy, he will tell you that you must abandon the quest and try again in two weeks, or else go with someone else to spawn him. At this point, your best bet is to get someone else to spawn the boss, and simply loot Rytheran's Jeweled Ring when you've killed him. 1. Talk to the Shade of Antemy at the northeast tower drop to flag for the Mhoire Castle Great Hall Portal (across the room from him). 2. Enter the Mhoire Castle Great Hall Portal and you'll be in a series of rooms with various doors. Take the following: 1. South double door 2. NE double door 3. East then North corner 4. NW double door 5. NW double door 6. North then West corner (killable doors) 7. SW double door 8. Head south through the double door (killable doors), and enter the Mhoire Throne Room
3. Use the Ancient Throne to spawn the Shade of Lord Rytheran and a horde of his Wights. 4. Each person in your group must loot a Rytheran's Jeweled Ring (drops 9) from his corpse. Note: For ranged characters this is solo-able, use the Throne and hop onto a pillar. Tip: The Shade of Lord Rytheran (Undead, weak to fire/acid/pierceSB) will spawn along with numerous GY creatures. The various GY creatures will respawn reather quickly in the spot they are killed. Make use of doors in the vicinity as you see appropriate.
5. Head back to the Northeast tower and speak to the Shade of Antemy to receive your rewards and title: Shade of Antemy tells you, "In life I was the Seneschal of House Mhoire. In ancient times I walked these halls and served Lord Cynreft Mhoire." You hand over 10 of your Rytheran's Jeweled Rings. Shade of Antemy tells you, "Well done, champion and defender of House Mhoire. You have cleansed the throne of House Mhoire, and countless spirits within these halls rest peacefully." Shade of Antemy tells you, "You have proven yourself a hundred fold, and I am in your debt. The corruption will remain clear of the throne for some time. Take these items as thanks." You have been awarded the title Champion of House Mhoire! You've earned 1,695,225,700 experience. You've earned 15,000 Luminance. Shade of Antemy gives you 2 Ancient Mhoire Coins. Shade of Antemy gives you Legendary Key. 6. The legendary chests are located with the Sealed Treasury Vaults beyond the Mhoire Throne Room. So you must go back to the Great Hall and beyond the throne to use the keys. Also note that the legendary chests are in separate rooms for each type of chest (Armor, Weapon, Magic).
Movie Guide by Xeo (Teresh of MT)
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Maps
Dungeon Coordinates Wiki Map ACmaps Other Quests Mhoire Castle Courtyard 64.6S 44.1W 462D.png 462D.png -- -- -- Mhoire Castle -- 8C03.png 8C03.png -- -- -- Mhoire Castle Great Hall -- 8C03.png 8C03.png -- -- --
Items
Quest Items Ancient Journal Icon.png Ancient Journal Translated Tomb Writings Icon.png Translated Tomb Writings Strange Jewel Icon.png Strange Jewel Lady Saliane's Brand Icon.png Lady Saliane's Brand Lord Hendrel's Brand Icon.png Lord Hendrel's Brand Lord Trimere's Brand Icon.png Lord Trimere's Brand Mhoire Signet Ring Icon.png Mhoire Signet Ring Ancient Throne Icon.png Ancient Throne Rytheran's Jeweled Ring Icon.png Rytheran's Jeweled Ring Sealed Treasury Vault Icon.png Sealed Treasury Vault
Rewards Ancient Mhoire Coin Icon.png Ancient Mhoire Coin Legendary Key Icon.png Legendary Key
Ancient Stones
Experience Rewards
Note: The brands are 6 day timer, the ring is 13 days.
Task Required Max Experience Percentage & Level Cap Give the three brands to statue. 100,000,000xp Fixed XP
Speak to Antemy after looting Rytheran's Ring. 1,695,225,700xp 50% up to level 275
See Level Costs for per level information.
Title Rewards
Task Required Title Reward Complete Southwest Tower Task Knight of the Southwest Tower
Complete Northwest Tower Task Knight of the Northwest Tower
Complete Southeast Tower Task Knight of the Southeast Tower
Speak to Antemy after looting Rytheran's Ring. Champion of House Mhoire
Items: Full details here Aerfalle's Pallium/Aerfalle's Supreme Pallium/Aerfalle's Mana-infused Pallium Ashbane/Superior Ashbane/Reforged Ashbane Staff of Aerfalle/War Staff of Aerfalle/Mana-infused Acid War Staff of Aerfalle Unreadable Scroll Black Fire Atlan Stone Enhanced Black Fire Atlan Stone Ring of the Watchman Strengthened Mana Forge Key MMDs: Easy: ? Hard: ? Uber: 12 Luminance: Easy/Hard: None Uber: 15,000 Max XP: Full details here Easy: 13,765,337 Hard: 22,879,999 Uber: 125,000,000 Titles: None
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Introduced In: To Raise a Banner of Flame Updated In: Hollow Victory, Hidden Vein, From the Darkness Born, Foolish Ambition, Old Ghosts, The Risen Princess Related Quests: Sword of Lost Light Quest Atlan Weapons Quest Isparian Weapons Quest Menhir Research
Aerfalle Keep Library
Quest Overview
This quest requires lockpick to complete.
The Lady Aerfalle Quest is the major quest associated with Aerlinthe Isle. In order to reach the final dungeon, an extensive set up is required. This is often done by one player (who has lockpick) and then the rest of the group joins before heading to the final dungeon. There are 3 difficulty versions of the quest. Only 9 keys are dropped by Lady Aerfalle, so only 9 people can get rewards per run. The uber version of the quest has an additional dungeon and is limited to a locked fellowship of level 150+ players.
This quest has ties to the Sword of Lost Light Quest, Atlan and Isparian upgrades, and Menhir Research. These portions of the quest are optional.
There is a dispel trap inside of Aerfalle Keep which can dispel all buffs. It is possible to avoid the trap using a jump. If your group contains players who cannot yet fully buff themselves, be aware that you will need someone to rebuff them if they fail to avoid the trap.
One of the largest and oldest quests in the game, the Lady Aerfalle Quest is a true classic and is considered by many to be one of the greatest quests in the history of Asheron's Call.
Walk Through
Part 1: Preparation
These steps can be done alone or with a smaller group, there are no rewards and participation is not essential for being a part of the later sections of this quest. 1. Go to the Crater Caves Dungeon at 66.7N 12.5E. At the bottom of the dungeon near the forges, collect the Pyreal Forge Bellows laying on the ground. Route: See Crater Lake Village for route. Many portal bots often have a portal tie to Crater.
2. Travel to Aerlinthe Isle. If you have done the quest before, use Aerlinthe Recall, otherwise you can get there by handing a D Note to Garaena the Emissary at 87.6S, 65.6W, just east of Candeth Keep. Alternatively, you can hand a C Note to Faladha the Emissary, an undead NPC located inside Chalicmere Castle.
3. From the Aerlinthe drop, follow the inner harbor beach around to the harbor's northwest corner (87.7N 44.4E). Go due west up the slope to 88.0N 43.4E then follow the ledge that wraps around the mountain to the north and enter the Tenkarrdun Foundry at 88.8N 42.8E. 4. Retrieve the Sluice Gate Bar from the Foundry. Lockpick is required. Note: See map for location of the Sluice Gate Bar. You will need to unlock one door and pull a lever to open one door to reach it. The lever door does not stay open for long, so be quick! Tip: The dungeon has several exit portals which drop at different locations. One portal in particular drops at 88.6N 42.4E, near your next destination. This portal is at the very bottom of the dungeon, so you will need to backtrack after getting the bar and pull 2 levers to open the doors to the bottom of the dungeon (see map for details). Alternatively, you can take any exit portal and make a longer run to the next location.
5. Run to the Aerlinthe Reservoir at 85.5N 43.4E. 6. Enter the dungeon and proceed down to the bottom. 7. If you are planning/considering doing the easy version of the quest, you must pick up one Sacrificial Dagger in this dungeon. It is behind a locked door just before you get to the large downward sloping room (see map for details). Only one dagger is needed per run. Note that the dagger is Attuned and Bonded, so whoever loots the dagger must also go on the rest of the quest. 8. At the bottom of the reservoir behind a locked door (322) is a portal to the Aerlinthe Lower Reservoir, use this portal. 9. Run to the bottom of the Lower Reservoir and hand the Sluice Gate Bar to the Repair Golem. The golem appears as an NPC (white dot on the radar). Giving the bar to the golem officially starts the quest and causes the Smithing Golem to spawn in the Tenkarrdun Foundry. Tip: There is an important jump near the end, when you come to a shaft facing west. There is a small grate you need to hit or you'll fall to the very bottom of the shaft and there is no way back except running back to the dungeon from Aerlinthe drop. To hit the grate, jump normally towards the SW corner of the shaft, you'll slide down the corner and hit the grate. Note: If the golem is NOT there, it means the quest is in progress, or someone has killed the watchman within the last 3 hours. You are able to log out in the dungeon, so if the Repair Golem is not there, you can log out and then finish the preparation after he has respawned.
10. After giving the bar to the Repair Golem, jump through the left wall opening to get to the exit portal. 11. Run back to the Tenkarrdun Foundry and head all the way to the bottom of the dungeon. You will need to pull 2 levers and unlock 2 doors to get there. The lever doors do not stay open for long, so be quick! 12. At the very bottom, give the Pyreal Forge Bellows to the Smithing Golem. This causes the Tenkarrdun Hellfire to spawn in the crater on Aerlinthe. It also causes a lava animation to happen near the Smithing Golem. 13. At this point, the entire group should meet up to continue the quest. If desired, use one of the exit portals in the dungeon and then run back to the Aerlinthe drop.
Part 2: Infusions and Relic Town 1. Gather your group and get everyone to Aerlinthe. Run around the harbor and then up the hill to enter the crater to the north. 2. Kill the Tenkarrdun Hellfire located in the crater near 90.3N 46.3E. Killing this Hellfire causes the Relic Watchman to spawn in Relic Town (an undead town on Aerlinthe). It also causes the Mount Esper Firestorm to spawn. [OPTIONAL] Sword of Lost Light upgrades: If you are getting the Sword of Lost Light upgrades, loot a Red Fire Infusion from the corpse of the Tenkarrdun Hellfire (drops 9). If you are doing just the upgrades and not completing the rest of the Lady Aerfalle quest, you can then proceed directly to Crater Lake Village where the Mount Esper Firestorm has spawned. Otherwise, this can be done after completing the Lady Aerfalle quest. Note that if you are not completing the rest of the Lady Aerfalle Quest, it is good practice to proceed to Relic Town and kill the Relic Watchman anyway, so the quest will properly reset for the next group. 1.Head to Crater Lake Village and then go to the middle of the lake and kill the Mount Esper Firestorm. Loot a White Fire Infusion (drops 9). Killing the firestorm causes the Mount Lethe Hellfire to spawn. 2.Head to Mount Lethe in the Direlands and kill the Mount Lethe Hellfire. Loot a Blue Fire Infusion (drops 9). 3.See Sword of Lost Light Quest for details on using the infusions and further upgrades.
3.[OPTIONAL] Near the Tenkarrdun Hellfire is a Behemoth of Tenkarrdun at 90.0N 46.3E. When killed, the Behemoth drops 9 Black Boulders. These can be given to a Stone Collector for a Black Fire Atlan Stone, which can be used to upgrade an Atlan or Isparian Weapon with a Major Stone in it. Note that the Enhanced Black Fire Atlan Stone is part of the reward for the Uber version of the quest. You need both the Black Fire and the Enhanced Black Fire stones to fully upgrade an Atlan/Isparian weapon. 4. After killing the Hellfire, head south again to the bay, and follow the path around the bay to the west. Eventually you will come to Relic Town. 5. In Relic Town it is important to ensure all of your group is present before killing the Relic Watchman. Groups often gather on top of the buildings to avoid the many enemies. It is safest to not kill enemies to avoid the risk of killing the Watchman by mistake. Occasionally it can take a few minutes after killing the Hellfire for the Watchman to spawn.
6. When everyone is ready, kill the Relic Watchman and take the portal to Aerfalle Keep which opens at 86.4N 45.4E. The portal only stays open for a few minutes, so use it quickly!
Part 3: Aerlinthe Keep and Lady Aerfalle 1. Once inside Aerfalle Keep, you have 90 minutes to complete the quest. Lockpick is required. 2. Directly ahead from the drop is a door. Behind the door is a short hallway and another door. Within the hallway is a dispel trap. Use a small jump just inside the first door to avoid it! Anyone who misses the jump will likely need to rebuff. 3. If doing the easy version of the quest, hand the Sacrificial Dagger to the Ghost of Dylaeral (see map for details). This causes the easiest boss to spawn. 4. If doing the hard version of the quest, nothing special needs to be done before proceeding to the end. 5. If doing the uber version of the quest, go to the chest rewards room and get a Nexus-keyed Mana Shard from the altar. Then backtrack and give it to the Ghost of Galaeral. This locks your fellowship and causes the portal to Aerfalle's Sanctum to spawn. 6. Proceed through the Keep using lockpick and levers to open doors (see map for details). All versions of the quest go to the same room where either a boss or a portal is waiting.
Easy Version 1. Kill Aerfalle's Weakened Apprentice and loot an Ashen Key (drops 9). 2. Backtrack to the lever room with the Infernos and use the key on Lady of Aerlinthe's Chest. 3. Loot all the rewards from the chest (loot will pile up if you don't loot it all).
Hard Version 1. Kill Lady Aerfalle's Apprentice and loot an Ornate Ashen Key (drops 9). 2. Backtrack to the lever room with the Infernos and use the key on Lady of Aerlinthe's Ornate Chest. 3. Loot all the rewards from the chest (loot will pile up if you don't loot it all).
Uber Version 1. In the final room there will be a portal to Aerfalle's Sanctum. You must click on the portal to use it. Aerfalle's Sanctum is a "no log" dungeon, so if you log out or disconnect you will be sent to your lifestone and will be unable to rejoin the quest.
2. The enemies in this dungeon are considerably more difficult than the enemies up to this point. Proceed slowly and with caution! There are some rooms which have traps that cause more enemies to spawn. Beware of these and continue moving forward to avoid getting hung up. 3. Proceed through the dungeon, going down whenever possible until you reach a ledge that overlooks Lady Aerfalle. 4. There are several strategies for fighting Lady Aerfalle. If your group is mostly missile weapon and mage characters, it can be safest to simply kill her from the ledge above. Otherwise you can fight her in the throne room below or move into the hallway behind the throne for more protection. 5. Lady Aerfalle has high health and defense, and casts many debuffs. She can also counter-vuln and dispel vulns on herself, so it is generally best to use rended weapons. 6. Kill Lady Aerfalle and loot an Embossed Ashen Key (drops 9), and Lady Aerfalle's Charm (drops 9) from her corpse. 7. [OPTIONAL] Behind the throne is a Menhir ring which is used for part of the Menhir Research quest. The vortex causes massive damage, so be quick if using it. 8. Take the hallway behind the throne and hand Lady Aerfalle's Charm to the Ghost of Galaeral for luminance rewards. Note: Ghost of Galaeral despawns after 5 min so be sure to turn in right away.
9. Use the Embossed Ashen Key to loot the chest behind the Ghost of Galaeral.
Part 4: Rewards 1. Give whichever Token you looted to Kuyiza bint Zayi the Translator in Zaikhal for an experience reward (and Strengthened Mana Forge Key for Uber version). 2. Give the Unreadable Scroll to Kuyiza bint Zayi the Translator as well and she will teach you Aerlinthe Recall (level 6 item spell). 3.[OPTIONAL] The Ashbane sword can be given to Leikotha for an additional small experience reward if desired. Route: Take the Yinar portal in Samsur at 0.9S 18.9E then run west to the supulcher at 10.1S 31.3E. Note: Leikotha portals you to Subway when you hand her the sword.
4. The staff and the robe cannot be turned in for any sort of rewards. They can be kept or given to a Town Crier.
Hard Rewards Aerfalle's Ornate Token Icon.png Aerfalle's Ornate Token Unreadable Scroll Icon.png Unreadable Scroll Aerfalle's Supreme Pallium Icon.png Aerfalle's Supreme Pallium War Staff of Aerfalle Icon.png War Staff of Aerfalle Superior Ashbane Icon.png Superior Ashbane
Uber Rewards Aerfalle's Embossed Token Icon.png Aerfalle's Embossed Token Unreadable Scroll Icon.png Unreadable Scroll Aerfalle's Mana-infused Pallium Icon.png Aerfalle's Mana-infused Pallium Mana-infused Acid War Staff of Aerfalle Icon.png Mana-infused Acid War Staff of Aerfalle Reforged Ashbane Icon.png Reforged Ashbane Enhanced Black Fire Atlan Stone Icon.png Enhanced Black Fire Atlan Stone
Side Rewards Red Fire Infusion Icon.png Red Fire Infusion Blue Fire Infusion Icon.png Blue Fire Infusion White Fire Infusion Icon.png White Fire Infusion Black Fire Atlan Stone Icon.png Black Fire Atlan Stone Ring of the Watchman Icon.png Ring of the Watchman
Quest Items Sluice Gate Bar Icon.png Sluice Gate Bar Pyreal Forge Bellows Icon.png Pyreal Forge Bellows Black Boulder Icon.png Black Boulder Sacrificial Dagger Icon.png Sacrificial Dagger Nexus-keyed Mana Shard Icon.png Nexus-keyed Mana Shard Ashen Key Icon.png Ashen Key Ornate Ashen Key Icon.png Ornate Ashen Key Embossed Ashen Key Icon.png Embossed Ashen Key Lady Aerfalle's Charm Icon.png Lady Aerfalle's Charm Lady of Aerlinthe's Chest Icon.png Lady of Aerlinthe's Chest Lady of Aerlinthe's Ornate Chest Icon.png Lady of Aerlinthe's Ornate Chest Lady of Aerlinthe's Embossed Chest Icon.png Lady of Aerlinthe's Embossed Chest
Untranslated Texts Charred Book Icon.png Charred Book Sheets of Paper (Aerfalle) Icon.png Sheets of Paper (Aerfalle) Singed Note Icon.png Singed Note
Translated Texts Aerfalle's Letter Icon.png Aerfalle's Letter Aerlinthe Record Icon.png Aerlinthe Record Smith's Note Icon.png Smith's Note
Experience Rewards
Task Required Max Experience Percentage & Level Cap Turn in Ashbane to Leikotha 13,765,337xp 20% up to level 100
Turn in Superior Ashbane to Leikotha 13,765,337xp 20% up to level 100
Turn in Reforged Ashbane to Leikotha 50,000,000xp ??% up to level ??
Turn in Aerfalle's Token to Kuyiza bint Zayi the Translator 15,000,000xp ??% up to level ??
Turn in Aerfalle's Ornate Token to Kuyiza bint Zayi the Translator 55,000,000xp ??% up to level ??
Turn in Aerfalle's Embossed Token to Kuyiza bint Zayi the Translator 160,000,000xp ??% up to level ??
But how is this much different from modern day Dungeon objective quest? It come a off as a dungeon quest honestly. What you have to say about that?
Many of the quests were dungeon based, nothing wrong with that. They were not instanced so you could meet people doing those quests or grinding high loot profile mobs. Many of which were interspersed in those dungeons that featured hard quests. The overland areas were more about exploration and loot acquisition or mob camping/grinding. AC1 featured both forms of advancement and because in the early years progression was meaningful yet long and arduous it meant both avenues were required. Grind mobs for XP and quest for upgrades or vice versa.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Dude, it's just a buzzword people like to throw around.
In every thread for every game ever, you'll find a bunch of people lurking and looking to trash the game in question. They then pull from whatever the current popular vernacular might be, words like "bland' or "uninspired". They're usually words that people have read elsewhere and thought they sounded fairly intelligent, witty, or powerful. So they adopt them for their own personal use, and go on to regurgitate them all over the forums until those buzzwords lose all meaning and fade away from the spectrum of pop-lingo, only to be replaced by an inevitable batch of brand new synonym buzzwords.
Either way, they're no use worrying about. All you can do is work to identify them as quickly as possible and then proceed to ignore them and anyone who relies on using them as the meat of their arguments against a game.
I see this statement a lot now days that Quest in MMOs are generic.
Well I have to ask. What kind of quest entertains you?
What quest are not generic?
What video game had quest that wasnt generic?
And If you want better quest, at lease explain what would make them better.
Generic and generic, the problem is more that they are usually short and feel like you already did them a thousand times.
Good quests are long, hard and exiting, EQ2s Heritage quests are a good example, they are long, takes work and give you a nice reward at the end of them. That is fun.
Farmers who constantly needs players help for pestcontrol on the other hand should really consider changing work, maybe to dishwasher at the local tavern or something. I could buy it if a dragon showed up as a rare event or so but any farmer who can't kill bugs and rats really wouldn't survive long.
And then there are the totally worthless quests, like deliver this letter to the guy standing 10 feet from me and I pay you,,, How lazy and incompetent can someone get?
Look on any book or movie, the heroes usually do get a quest but it is not just some menial task, it is something that just a bunch of great heroes can do. That is how quests should be, if you want the rest in call them just "tasks" or "work" and just award money, no XP for them so the rest of us can avoid them.
Dude, it's just a buzzword people like to throw around.
In every thread for every game ever, you'll find a bunch of people lurking and looking to trash the game in question. They then pull from whatever the current popular vernacular might be, words like "bland' or "uninspired". They're usually words that people have read elsewhere and thought they sounded fairly intelligent, witty, or powerful. So they adopt them for their own personal use, and go on to regurgitate them all over the forums until those buzzwords lose all meaning and fade away from the spectrum of pop-lingo, only to be replaced by an inevitable batch of brand new synonym buzzwords.
Either way, they're no use worrying about. All you can do is work to identify them as quickly as possible and then proceed to ignore them and anyone who relies on using them as the meat of their arguments against a game.
Every single game have filler quests, and I bet you also sigh at times when you accept certain quests. We actually don't need quests that tells us to grindkill 20 bears, we could do them without someone telling us.
Complaining when a game throw in a huge bunch of them is fine, in most cases they are just made so they can say that their game have 2000 (or whatever) different quests but it is just pointless grind similar to mobgrinding in older MMOs. And they could put the exact same work into making fewer but longer and more fun quests.
Sure, some people just generally like to whine and complain about even the good quests and that is just stupid, complain about the bad stuff and praise the good if you want a game to improve (or any dev will just rightly ignore you), constructive feedback is good while just complaining helps no-one..
I really think wildstar has the best quests seen in MMO space so far, okay some of it is generic, but what is generic if not everything you ever done more then a couple of times? thinking like that I would say playing games in general is generic, and iv been playing mmos hardcore since pre UO when I did N, N, W, W, S to move around text MUDS.
I see this statement a lot now days that Quest in MMOs are generic.
Well I have to ask. What kind of quest entertains you?
What quest are not generic?
What video game had quest that wasnt generic?
And If you want better quest, at lease explain what would make them better.
Quests not in ESO are boring and generic. ESO questing was great, because Zenimax actually put effort and resources into the writing. This is a tricky subject because you get a lot of people chiming in who skip all quest dialog and then bitch that questing sucks. Of course it does, because when you do that all you're left with are the actual mechanics of the game and you're playing an MMO. So, in short, if you want better questing spend money on developing your quests.
I see this statement a lot now days that Quest in MMOs are generic.
Well I have to ask. What kind of quest entertains you?
What quest are not generic?
What video game had quest that wasnt generic?
And If you want better quest, at lease explain what would make them better.
Honestly, it doesn't really matter either way.
People (for the most part) ignore all quests regardless of how well they are done. And then they complain about them being generic. Which has created a sort of 'chicken and egg' problem.
Most games now have a large amount of standard / generic quests for 2 reasons.
1) With literally 100s of thousands of quests created nowadays (probably even more than that), how many truly unique quests can you actually have. It only makes sense that most of those quests would be similar, if not complete repeats of one another.
2) With most people skipping your content anyway, is it really worth putting the time into making a really deep / involved / interesting quest, that maybe 50 people will actually pay attention to?
So who's at fault? The overexposed gamers who are ignoring the content? or the developer who is tired of wasting ideas on people who aren't paying attention to them in the first place?
Personally, I have witnessed at least 1 good (non generic) quest in every game. If I had to pick one game that jumped out, it would probably be TSW. The reason being that that is one of the few games that actually requires you to pay attention to complete many of their quests. GW2 had some good ones, as did AoC / SWTOR / ESO. But all of these games have also had a lot of generic ones as well.
And that's really the point. All games have a mix of both. It just depends which each individual gamer pay attention to. If they rush through the game, they only see the 'kill X of Y' quests. If they ever stop to pay attention to what they are doing, they may notice the exceptionally well written / thought out quest.
The below suggestions would help be a starter for non generic quests. IMHO some of the quests I liked were in Everquest but wish they built up further on their questing.
Remove the !/? quest indicator altogether.
Make it so any "standard" quest unlocked by level rotates through different locals.
Within the quest mechanic itself do anything outside the kill x number, or kill and collect x numbers, or talk to's. (Go for the better quest mechanics like the escorts, the ones that include some kind of item creation/turn ins, the ones that include some kind of gathers making you do multiple pickups to create something, the ones that make you defend from an onslaught of spawned, things like that.)
Make it so as you do one quest it then unlocks a further quest setting.
Make it so the game has factions and your faction standing gives you your own unique set of quests.
Make it so quests can only be done at certain levels making people that want to do them seek them out or else lose them.
Stop with the quest rewards that don't do anything for you. instead make quests give a token type/currency that can then be turned in for what would benefit you.
Put quest givers in rather obscure places not all have to be sitting in the middle of a village.
Make more multi-quest (epic) storyline quests. Where you do one it opens another and make it a long "side-story" of its own. of course this would then be able to be "molded" based on the characters actions so the final outcome changes based on prior quests successes or failures.
Originally posted by UltorX Agreeing completely on AC recommendation but you people need to stop quoting a huge walls of text multiple times, this is getting ridiculous.
I cut and paste and then quote that wall of text because people now-a-days don't take your word for crap. When someone says AC had amazing quests and don't show it, how will people believe it. But when I show you a quest that takes at a minimum of 1.5 hours to do and will result in more then likely multiple deaths I want to prove just how good AAC quests were. If developers would take a page from AC the MMO genre would be so much better and we wouldn't have this glutton of fed-ex tasks to level up MMO's that bore the shit out of you within the first hour of gameplay.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Luckily, i don't need you to like me to enjoy video games. -nariusseldon. In F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's. -laserit
I see this statement a lot now days that Quest in MMOs are generic.
Well I have to ask. What kind of quest entertains you?
What quest are not generic?
What video game had quest that wasnt generic?
And If you want better quest, at lease explain what would make them better.
The best non-generic ones are the ones you make up yourself in order to survive. Completely unscripted, you have a goal that your guild masters have set on their own and your guild has to figure out completely, start to finish, how to achieve that goal. Most MMOs don't have the in-game tools needed to make any quest like this particularly complicated. Others, however, do, and have led to some of the most logistically awesome and flat-out unexpected challenges I've ever had to overcome.
For any of you that follow my posts regularly, you likely know which game I'm talking about .
Complaining when a game throw in a huge bunch of them is fine, in most cases they are just made so they can say that their game have 2000 (or whatever) different quests but it is just pointless grind similar to mobgrinding in older MMOs. And they could put the exact same work into making fewer but longer and more fun quests.
I agree fully. A game with lots of filler quests has multiple negatives associated to it and I guess it could be argued that devs have used those to skip or avoid sandbox elements, which in general require some more thought processing. No need for lots of thinking, just push players to question mark after question mark. When they run out of question marks, make those question marks reappear every day and input a carrot.
I really would like to see devs putting their time more on sandbox elements and input only large and difficult well thought standard quests. Periodically (long periods, week to month I guess) enabling and disabling more of them combined with large enough events would add to the dynamic feeling of the world while helping with the quest fatique. Some introductory quests are perhaps needed, I guess. There are always people who need them.
I think filler quests hurt the games in the long run as they are more and more a major reason for people to get bored of said games. It might be wishful thinking, but I hope the trend of bigger games e.g. AA, BDO, EQN will make some difference and won't stop there. Each of those appears to have, to my knowledge, at least some thought for more interesting long term play. At the very least, it should be interesting to see how those games fare.
Comments
I like all quests, even the mundane ones.
I find all quests are pretty generic, except the ones that tend to involve lore.
Better quests:
Offer quests based on player actions.
Offer quests that only have one challenger at any given moment.
Offer quests that have many challengers, but the reward is only given once.
Offer quests that have the same goal, but different starting scenerios.
Offer quests that compete players against one another.
Well, in the case of the quests I mentioned, which were monk quests, they were sort of like the old sensei has you show your worth by doing these tasks and awards you if you complete them. The sashs and headbands had various colours, just like martial arts belts; white, yellow, red, etc, so each quest you would need the previous sash to be able to complete it. The mobs would have these items because they were proof of ownership rather than an item specifically placed there. Like a Dark Elf necromancer deep in one dungeon would have a specially made twisted dagger, or a Gnoll leader in another would have a necklace of finger bones made from it's numerous kills. It all made sense.
In a CRPG you wander the cities, villages and wilderness areas. Each area has its own set of NPCs. Some NPCs you will meet in different areas (e.g. traveling merchant). Whether or not you talked to each NPC was up to you. Some had little errands for you or bits of rumors and informations.
Only for the main story arc you would be guided to certain areas to trigger important events. So the main story arc could be considered as something like a quest chain.
MMOs have "standardized" how quests/ errands are presented to the player. With all the quest tools that have seen the light of day you don't even need to read the conversations with quest givers. You'll see them marked on your automap. You'll see them with additional marks (e.g. exclamation marks floating above). How does questing look now today?
1) go to marked NPC
2) accept quest
3) go to next marked NPC
4) accept quest
5) repeat steps 3) and 4) until your quest log is full or no more quest are available at this quest hub
6) follow the marks of the automap (ideally find an optimal route to finish several quests)
7) return to the quest giver and collect rewards
8) repeat steps 1) to 7) until you've done all quests in the quest hub
Lots of MMOs haven't put much effort into NPCs besides quest givers. And the conversations with quest givers are rather pointless. If at least the dialoges had some quality if there is hardly any choice between accept or decline... Some MMORPGs have tried to offer more story elements, but this still doesn't change the binary nature of such quests.
If you need to farm certain materials (e.g. wolf pelts, ores, tools, etc.) then you don't need a quest as a motivation. Just do it because you need it for crafting.
It's how the quests are presented and the grind disguised that makes a good questing system. I can agree that all games with a questing system use the same generic general thought toward creating the quests, but the devs that can mask it with a different approach at least make it somewhat interesting....GW2 failed with there's, but at least they tried. Id say the best questing system I've been able to play was The Secret World. great modern story, tons of different things assigned to you to do and everything kinda went together in one smooth motion.
The worst experience with questing is any Perfect World game :P
MMO Devs applied the wrong term right from the start.
quest
noun kwest
: a journey made in search of something
: a long and difficult effort to find or do something
errand
noun er-end, e-rend
: a short journey that you take to do or get something
Anyone who has ever played Anarchy Online and done the Adonis Quest Ark understands how questing should be done in an MMO.
I completely agree with you, but you need to remember that EQ2 and WoW came along to cater to the casual gamer and at the time there were a lot of people begging for an easier game. As I've frown older I find that while I loved EQ, I probably wouldn't be bald to play it if it were released today. Simply not enough time.
But how is this much different from modern day Dungeon objective quest? It come a off as a dungeon quest honestly. What you have to say about that?
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
But these modern day quest use to be just like that as well. In WoW for example, at first it didn't even show you where to go for the quest objectives. A Mod helped with that, and Blizzard later added that Mod's speciality to the game. That doesn't change the fact that it's still the same quest.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
But these modern day quest use to be just like that as well. In WoW for example, at first it didn't even show you where to go for the quest objectives. A Mod helped with that, and Blizzard later added that Mod's speciality to the game. That doesn't change the fact that it's still the same quest.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
Don't mix up how developers dress up the quest, with what the quest really consist of. I can put a hamburger bun on a hotdog but that doesn't make it a Not a HotDog.
the NPC's at those RPG have certain story elements or events that they trigger, but that's really the same thing that are in MMOs. GW2 proved that! It's just how hey are dressed up. And reality wise, that's not something the MMO PvE community truly enjoys for long periods of time. In Skyrim is make be cool, but that's because people hold RPGs to different standards than MMOs. Want more proof of that statement, just look at how the MMO community reacts to Bugs In the game, and compare it to How the RPG community reacts to Elder Scrolls Bugs. They are more accepting of bugs because they hav different standards. So I don't see why MMO quest get compared to RPG quest when in reality they are the same, and have been the same all along.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
I tried SWG but thought it was really bad and poorly done. I remember a quote during SWTOR's development on why SWTOR didn't try the SWG Sandbox model and the quote went something like this: I don't think many people want to play Uncle Owen but prefer to play Luke Skywalker. Which is spot on in my analysis. Not that it made SWTOR any better but the issue remained the same, for people like me who think of combat, character progression and loot acquisition as the core tenets of a good MMO then SWG was a horrible game.
As for why it was never repeated is because Microsoft and later Turbine refused to market and advertise the game so it never gained the following. Plus back then the MMO community was so small that it couldn't grow because it was released 6 months after EQ1 and that game took most customers. If AC1 was released with modern graphics and update combat then it would be a mega hit. As IMO it combined the best aspects of RPG's like questing and character progression as well as the best aspects of Diablo style looting systems. It didn't require you to or force you to group but many of the best quests did.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Many of the quests were dungeon based, nothing wrong with that. They were not instanced so you could meet people doing those quests or grinding high loot profile mobs. Many of which were interspersed in those dungeons that featured hard quests. The overland areas were more about exploration and loot acquisition or mob camping/grinding. AC1 featured both forms of advancement and because in the early years progression was meaningful yet long and arduous it meant both avenues were required. Grind mobs for XP and quest for upgrades or vice versa.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Dude, it's just a buzzword people like to throw around.
In every thread for every game ever, you'll find a bunch of people lurking and looking to trash the game in question. They then pull from whatever the current popular vernacular might be, words like "bland' or "uninspired". They're usually words that people have read elsewhere and thought they sounded fairly intelligent, witty, or powerful. So they adopt them for their own personal use, and go on to regurgitate them all over the forums until those buzzwords lose all meaning and fade away from the spectrum of pop-lingo, only to be replaced by an inevitable batch of brand new synonym buzzwords.
Either way, they're no use worrying about. All you can do is work to identify them as quickly as possible and then proceed to ignore them and anyone who relies on using them as the meat of their arguments against a game.
Generic and generic, the problem is more that they are usually short and feel like you already did them a thousand times.
Good quests are long, hard and exiting, EQ2s Heritage quests are a good example, they are long, takes work and give you a nice reward at the end of them. That is fun.
Farmers who constantly needs players help for pestcontrol on the other hand should really consider changing work, maybe to dishwasher at the local tavern or something. I could buy it if a dragon showed up as a rare event or so but any farmer who can't kill bugs and rats really wouldn't survive long.
And then there are the totally worthless quests, like deliver this letter to the guy standing 10 feet from me and I pay you,,, How lazy and incompetent can someone get?
Look on any book or movie, the heroes usually do get a quest but it is not just some menial task, it is something that just a bunch of great heroes can do. That is how quests should be, if you want the rest in call them just "tasks" or "work" and just award money, no XP for them so the rest of us can avoid them.
Every single game have filler quests, and I bet you also sigh at times when you accept certain quests. We actually don't need quests that tells us to grindkill 20 bears, we could do them without someone telling us.
Complaining when a game throw in a huge bunch of them is fine, in most cases they are just made so they can say that their game have 2000 (or whatever) different quests but it is just pointless grind similar to mobgrinding in older MMOs. And they could put the exact same work into making fewer but longer and more fun quests.
Sure, some people just generally like to whine and complain about even the good quests and that is just stupid, complain about the bad stuff and praise the good if you want a game to improve (or any dev will just rightly ignore you), constructive feedback is good while just complaining helps no-one..
Herald of innovation, Vanquisher of the old! - Awake a few hours almost everyday!
Quests not in ESO are boring and generic. ESO questing was great, because Zenimax actually put effort and resources into the writing. This is a tricky subject because you get a lot of people chiming in who skip all quest dialog and then bitch that questing sucks. Of course it does, because when you do that all you're left with are the actual mechanics of the game and you're playing an MMO. So, in short, if you want better questing spend money on developing your quests.
Honestly, it doesn't really matter either way.
People (for the most part) ignore all quests regardless of how well they are done. And then they complain about them being generic. Which has created a sort of 'chicken and egg' problem.
Most games now have a large amount of standard / generic quests for 2 reasons.
1) With literally 100s of thousands of quests created nowadays (probably even more than that), how many truly unique quests can you actually have. It only makes sense that most of those quests would be similar, if not complete repeats of one another.
2) With most people skipping your content anyway, is it really worth putting the time into making a really deep / involved / interesting quest, that maybe 50 people will actually pay attention to?
So who's at fault? The overexposed gamers who are ignoring the content? or the developer who is tired of wasting ideas on people who aren't paying attention to them in the first place?
Personally, I have witnessed at least 1 good (non generic) quest in every game. If I had to pick one game that jumped out, it would probably be TSW. The reason being that that is one of the few games that actually requires you to pay attention to complete many of their quests. GW2 had some good ones, as did AoC / SWTOR / ESO. But all of these games have also had a lot of generic ones as well.
And that's really the point. All games have a mix of both. It just depends which each individual gamer pay attention to. If they rush through the game, they only see the 'kill X of Y' quests. If they ever stop to pay attention to what they are doing, they may notice the exceptionally well written / thought out quest.
The below suggestions would help be a starter for non generic quests. IMHO some of the quests I liked were in Everquest but wish they built up further on their questing.
Remove the !/? quest indicator altogether.
Make it so any "standard" quest unlocked by level rotates through different locals.
Within the quest mechanic itself do anything outside the kill x number, or kill and collect x numbers, or talk to's. (Go for the better quest mechanics like the escorts, the ones that include some kind of item creation/turn ins, the ones that include some kind of gathers making you do multiple pickups to create something, the ones that make you defend from an onslaught of spawned, things like that.)
Make it so as you do one quest it then unlocks a further quest setting.
Make it so the game has factions and your faction standing gives you your own unique set of quests.
Make it so quests can only be done at certain levels making people that want to do them seek them out or else lose them.
Stop with the quest rewards that don't do anything for you. instead make quests give a token type/currency that can then be turned in for what would benefit you.
Put quest givers in rather obscure places not all have to be sitting in the middle of a village.
Make more multi-quest (epic) storyline quests. Where you do one it opens another and make it a long "side-story" of its own. of course this would then be able to be "molded" based on the characters actions so the final outcome changes based on prior quests successes or failures.
I cut and paste and then quote that wall of text because people now-a-days don't take your word for crap. When someone says AC had amazing quests and don't show it, how will people believe it. But when I show you a quest that takes at a minimum of 1.5 hours to do and will result in more then likely multiple deaths I want to prove just how good AAC quests were. If developers would take a page from AC the MMO genre would be so much better and we wouldn't have this glutton of fed-ex tasks to level up MMO's that bore the shit out of you within the first hour of gameplay.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Lets not forget the Denny's quest.
Luckily, i don't need you to like me to enjoy video games. -nariusseldon.
In F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's. -laserit
The best non-generic ones are the ones you make up yourself in order to survive. Completely unscripted, you have a goal that your guild masters have set on their own and your guild has to figure out completely, start to finish, how to achieve that goal. Most MMOs don't have the in-game tools needed to make any quest like this particularly complicated. Others, however, do, and have led to some of the most logistically awesome and flat-out unexpected challenges I've ever had to overcome.
For any of you that follow my posts regularly, you likely know which game I'm talking about
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Where's the any key?
I agree fully. A game with lots of filler quests has multiple negatives associated to it and I guess it could be argued that devs have used those to skip or avoid sandbox elements, which in general require some more thought processing. No need for lots of thinking, just push players to question mark after question mark. When they run out of question marks, make those question marks reappear every day and input a carrot.
I really would like to see devs putting their time more on sandbox elements and input only large and difficult well thought standard quests. Periodically (long periods, week to month I guess) enabling and disabling more of them combined with large enough events would add to the dynamic feeling of the world while helping with the quest fatique. Some introductory quests are perhaps needed, I guess. There are always people who need them.
I think filler quests hurt the games in the long run as they are more and more a major reason for people to get bored of said games. It might be wishful thinking, but I hope the trend of bigger games e.g. AA, BDO, EQN will make some difference and won't stop there. Each of those appears to have, to my knowledge, at least some thought for more interesting long term play. At the very least, it should be interesting to see how those games fare.