I enjoyed WS, its was decent. Not great, but not awful.
I burnt out trying to get attuned to raid. I want to raid, but i log back in and cannot bring myself to keep going on the attunement grind. All i want to do is raid, most of my guild have left, most never got attuned either.
My account is cancelled too, shame, the raids looked fun.
Its the attunement. Its b/s. Everyone hates it, nor does it make any sense do have to "attune" to anything, its just a stupid time sink lazy developers implement in a sad desperate attempt to prolong character progression. Couple that with the fact that the game is the least pug friendly game ever, with both difficulty and timed requirements, people get frustrated over all the redundant walls thrown in their way and quit. The game would be just fine if players would be able to just level up, gear up with end game normals, and progress to the next bracket by upgrading their gear alone. Players just wanted difficult bosses, as in more than just spam rotation, and easily avoided AoE attacks, not all the pointless clutter they insisted on mixing in as well. Carbine however decided to just throw in all these *facepalm* inducing, pointless obstacles in the way because you know ... "challenge"... and all its served to accomplish is frustrate players, making the whole endgame experience more toxic than it usually is.
Not to mention the many bugs and horrible design decisions theyve made with everything from the starter areas, to AMPS, to the horrible handling of bots/cheaters. None of which theyre really even bothering to address to the players or even hinting at changing. Theyve gone from "the devs are listening" to "fuck it, we tried." Yet another potentially great MMO thats plummeting to the garbage heap because of an incompetent dev team.
I enjoyed the game until I reached grimvault. I strongly disliked that place. Then I hit level 50 and I had nothing to do. For some reason, I could not at all enjoy the dungeons or anything after level 50.
I would love a game with hardcore raiding... just not one where the characters look like Bugs Bunny. Where they got the idea that there was a large group of people who wanted both hardcore raiding and graphics that were far more cartoony than WoW is beyond me.
My sub runs out in a little over a week but I honestly gave this game a try. I got to 50, level armorsmithing to max level, completed the dungeons requirements but by that time I was done. Outside of the attunement process there was no need to run dungeons or adventures and all that was left for me to do was dailies and crafting.
I am sure we all feel the same about dailies (gawd I hate them). But as for crafting and the game's economy, I must say WS has the worst crafting economy I've ever experienced. I don't know what the devs were thinking or even their economist. But crafting gear except for the small window of opportunity of level 50 crafted gear, was pretty much useless. Even architect was useless, which I knew it would be since beta because most of the items were purchasable from the housing menu or dropped as rewards.
But yeah I don't know, everything about Wildstar just leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I think since I can't seem to find a good themepark mmo that has a great crafting system and economy, I might just stay away from them now and stick with the sandbox like EvE.
PVE: Attunement killed the game - huge pointless grind forcing the player to run lame hour+ long dungeons over and over that were not PUG friendly due to arbitrary medal requirements. Appealing to niche hardcore = ghost town servers which doesn`t work in a theme park game.
PVP: The way rating and gear was handled is a complete amateur hour joke. The devs should really be Fking ashamed of what they threw together.
PVE: Attunement killed the game - huge pointless grind forcing the player to run lame hour+ long dungeons over and over that were not PUG friendly due to arbitrary medal requirements. Appealing to niche hardcore = ghost town servers which doesn`t work in a theme park game.
PVP: The way rating and gear was handled is a complete amateur hour joke. The devs should really be Fking ashamed of what they threw together.
QFT. The devs knew this before hand because they were told by many players during beta, did they listen? Of course not. Devs---> smart, players -----> dumb that is how devs see players. Lets show them a carrot and we can milk them out.
A few reasons why I think Wildstar isn't succeeding the way it should:
1.) Endgame is about a balance of things to do, for the most successful game we can think of WoW--the balance was awesome PvE and awesome PvP. Wildstar poorly implemented PvP (probably 80-90% of PvP'ers quit because of the broken gear system, rating exploits, and class bugs) and it created a huge outward pressure on PvE to take up all the slack that PvP had apparently lived up to. Which brings me to point #2.
2.) PvE content in wildstar is boring and lacking. Leveling was a fun experience, there was great exploration and humor and it was one of the best leveling experiences in my life. But after leveling? The only thing you were able to do after leveling, is grind dungeons for rep. The only thing to do at end game--because the great potential for action based PvP was inherently broken--was to grind dungeons. And only 4 dungeons at a time at that. You can only queue for 'veteran adventures' or 'veteran dungeons'. Since no one needed to run the veteran dungeons because a.) they were super hard and b.) offered no benefit compared to faster, easier adventures, unless you were on that step of attunement. It's just boring to run 4 adventures at a time when normally we're used to having..more than 4... dungeons to run at a time.
So once you got to 50, you discovered dailies were 2 recycled zones with barely any quests that were 'Kill X, Gather Y', there wasn't any PvP to be had because broken and stacked, you can only queue for 4 dungeons at a time, and would pop the same dungeon over and over again (always crimelords of whitevale). Not to mention, for 'adventures' that supposedly had 'multiple paths to take' those paths were either too buggy, too slow, too boring, too hard for no reward, and so 99% of times I would run an adventure we would pick the same exact path to get through it.
So to recap: the thing thats killing Wildstar is--it wasn't ready to be released. There are game breaking attunement bugs, huge PvP imbalances, shoehorned instance runs with no variety, which made it very tough to find things to do at 50. Not to mention I had heard all the environments they created were unoptimized, the entire game was written using single-threaded programming, the main Exile city Thayd still brings me to 30 fps, 3 months from release and I have an i7 and a 780ti with 16 gigs of ram.
Wildstar made for a fun leveling experience, but unless they take some lessons from golf, give us a reason to go back to these 'holes(zones)' and let us compete for rewards via leaderboards on who does what best or fastest--the game will stay niche. Unless they acknowledge PvP was broken, and release a huge content drop for it as an apology, unless they release about 10 more instances and acknowledge they need to fix the most damning things FIRST, their planned content drops later....the game's future will continue to remain uncertain.
edit: One last thought. Developers should NOT let players know they are listening or affecting decisions. They make take ideas and criticisms in and use it, of course, but they should never outright be buddy buddy with the players . The Devs are supposed to be the gods of the game, who have a hidden vision that is unlocked for players to see when "It's ready". Having players feel their every whim and concern will be listened to by Devs just isn't that professional and there should remain some 'authority' when making and ushering out game decisions. Some trust.
The user and all related content has been deleted.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
The user and all related content has been deleted.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
WS isn't able to retain subscriptions because there is zero to do at 50 unless you want to sink a ton of time into it which is not where gamers are at nowadays. Attunement is a time sink. Dungeons in WS are a time sink. Even PVP is a time sink because of the massive que times. You'd think they'd have learned an MMO history lesson before they put this game out. Back in the early part of the last decade Sony made the mistake of moving EQ to cater to hard core raiders and a time sink, and half of their game community bolted. It's all gotten easier, and less of a time sink, ever since. So you can make a game that's all about the time sink and hard core raiding, but you're only going to get a niche market to stick around.
The user and all related content has been deleted.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
Stick around and watch Arche Age go through the same thing.
Oh no, Archeage isn't going to have nearly as much trouble with this as they are with a purely PVP centric game. You don't even have to do a single quest in AA if you don't want to. But you'll have a harder time avoiding PVP altogether.
Originally posted by odelldanielj WS isn't able to retain subscriptions because there is zero to do at 50 unless you want to sink a ton of time into it which is not where gamers are at nowadays. Attunement is a time sink. Dungeons in WS are a time sink. Even PVP is a time sink because of the massive que times. You'd think they'd have learned an MMO history lesson before they put this game out. Back in the early part of the last decade Sony made the mistake of moving EQ to cater to hard core raiders and a time sink, and half of their game community bolted. It's all gotten easier, and less of a time sink, ever since. So you can make a game that's all about the time sink and hard core raiding, but you're only going to get a niche market to stick around.
So in short the game's failing because the content is a time sink? Well... doesn't that essentially sum up every video game ever? Video games are made for entertainment to pass the time (time sinks).
He never said it was an entertaining time sink.
If content is an entertaining time sink, I imagine most people won't mind. For whatever reason (I'm sure many here can think of several), most don't find Wild Star's time sinks to be very entertaining after a while.
So in short the game's failing because the content is a time sink? Well... doesn't that essentially sum up every video game ever? Video games are made for entertainment to pass the time (time sinks).
There is a difference between a time sink and and purposely shoveling loads of pointless grind and hoop jumping on players and calling it `hardcore`. MMO players are lot more critical now about how their time is being spent since It is extremely easy to find a new game as soon as the present one becomes tiresome.
Wildstar has always been a a walking contradiction since it marketed itself as `hardcore` while at the same time providing an ez mode leveling experience and bad cartoony graphics for mass appeal.
The attunement process is where it all went wrong as players finally understood what the game really is: Shameless content padding. If the game is designed to ultimately only appeal to the 1 percent of people who accept their version of `hardcore` then they should accept their 1 percent of market share and the ghost town that entails.
Originally posted by Nihilist Originally posted by Mtibbs1989So in short the game's failing because the content is a time sink? Well... doesn't that essentially sum up every video game ever? Video games are made for entertainment to pass the time (time sinks).
There is a difference between a time sink and and purposely shoveling loads of pointless grind and hoop jumping on players and calling it `hardcore`. MMO players are lot more critical now about how their time is being spent since It is extremely easy to find a new game as soon as the present one becomes tiresome.
Wildstar has always been a a walking contradiction since it marketed itself as `hardcore` while at the same time providing an ez mode leveling experience and bad cartoony graphics for mass appeal.
The attunement process is where it all went wrong as players finally understood what the game really is: Shameless content padding. If the game is designed to ultimately only appeal to the 1 percent of people who accept their version of `hardcore` then they should accept their 1 percent of market share and the ghost town that entails.
Have to agree with this guy's post, it's the sad truth unfortunately. I honestly can't even understand what the devs were thinking. I thought SWTOR and WARHAMMER ONLINE did bad but WS takes the cake.
You think having a different payment model will suddenly make the game fun for those that don't find it fun? If you don't like a game, how you decide to pay is irrelevant.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
I think the reason it is struggling is a bit different. I like the game a lot. But from what I've seen and played end game is causing the game to do bad. It isn't the fact that it's just hardcore. It's the fact that there is literally nothing to do for people who don't want to raid or do ranked PVP. I guess it's kind of a staple of MMO's to just raid and do dungeons end game, but in Wildstar it's got people rushing the dungeons to do the raid, and then once you complete the raid nothing is left. It's just super barren, the leveling and content up until endgame is nice albeit buggy. That was another major issue, they had so many bugs when it was launched, a lot of which didn't get fixed until recently, and there are still quite a few bugs that cause me to like it less, like while leveling my engineer if I have my pets out, they will constantly fall through the ground if I go up any hills, which causes enemies to reset and gain full hp again. Just annoyances like that and the barren endgame seem to be most of the complaints I see.
Comments
I enjoyed WS, its was decent. Not great, but not awful.
I burnt out trying to get attuned to raid. I want to raid, but i log back in and cannot bring myself to keep going on the attunement grind. All i want to do is raid, most of my guild have left, most never got attuned either.
My account is cancelled too, shame, the raids looked fun.
Its the attunement. Its b/s. Everyone hates it, nor does it make any sense do have to "attune" to anything, its just a stupid time sink lazy developers implement in a sad desperate attempt to prolong character progression. Couple that with the fact that the game is the least pug friendly game ever, with both difficulty and timed requirements, people get frustrated over all the redundant walls thrown in their way and quit. The game would be just fine if players would be able to just level up, gear up with end game normals, and progress to the next bracket by upgrading their gear alone. Players just wanted difficult bosses, as in more than just spam rotation, and easily avoided AoE attacks, not all the pointless clutter they insisted on mixing in as well. Carbine however decided to just throw in all these *facepalm* inducing, pointless obstacles in the way because you know ... "challenge"... and all its served to accomplish is frustrate players, making the whole endgame experience more toxic than it usually is.
Not to mention the many bugs and horrible design decisions theyve made with everything from the starter areas, to AMPS, to the horrible handling of bots/cheaters. None of which theyre really even bothering to address to the players or even hinting at changing. Theyve gone from "the devs are listening" to "fuck it, we tried." Yet another potentially great MMO thats plummeting to the garbage heap because of an incompetent dev team.
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Yea, I tried the game out but couldn't get over the overall esthetic.
Yes, it is important.
My sub runs out in a little over a week but I honestly gave this game a try. I got to 50, level armorsmithing to max level, completed the dungeons requirements but by that time I was done. Outside of the attunement process there was no need to run dungeons or adventures and all that was left for me to do was dailies and crafting.
I am sure we all feel the same about dailies (gawd I hate them). But as for crafting and the game's economy, I must say WS has the worst crafting economy I've ever experienced. I don't know what the devs were thinking or even their economist. But crafting gear except for the small window of opportunity of level 50 crafted gear, was pretty much useless. Even architect was useless, which I knew it would be since beta because most of the items were purchasable from the housing menu or dropped as rewards.
But yeah I don't know, everything about Wildstar just leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I think since I can't seem to find a good themepark mmo that has a great crafting system and economy, I might just stay away from them now and stick with the sandbox like EvE.
Check out this article on Why Crafting Sucks
PVE: Attunement killed the game - huge pointless grind forcing the player to run lame hour+ long dungeons over and over that were not PUG friendly due to arbitrary medal requirements. Appealing to niche hardcore = ghost town servers which doesn`t work in a theme park game.
PVP: The way rating and gear was handled is a complete amateur hour joke. The devs should really be Fking ashamed of what they threw together.
QFT. The devs knew this before hand because they were told by many players during beta, did they listen? Of course not. Devs---> smart, players -----> dumb that is how devs see players. Lets show them a carrot and we can milk them out.
want 7 free days of playing? Try this
http://www.swtor.com/r/ZptVnY
A few reasons why I think Wildstar isn't succeeding the way it should:
1.) Endgame is about a balance of things to do, for the most successful game we can think of WoW--the balance was awesome PvE and awesome PvP. Wildstar poorly implemented PvP (probably 80-90% of PvP'ers quit because of the broken gear system, rating exploits, and class bugs) and it created a huge outward pressure on PvE to take up all the slack that PvP had apparently lived up to. Which brings me to point #2.
2.) PvE content in wildstar is boring and lacking. Leveling was a fun experience, there was great exploration and humor and it was one of the best leveling experiences in my life. But after leveling? The only thing you were able to do after leveling, is grind dungeons for rep. The only thing to do at end game--because the great potential for action based PvP was inherently broken--was to grind dungeons. And only 4 dungeons at a time at that. You can only queue for 'veteran adventures' or 'veteran dungeons'. Since no one needed to run the veteran dungeons because a.) they were super hard and b.) offered no benefit compared to faster, easier adventures, unless you were on that step of attunement. It's just boring to run 4 adventures at a time when normally we're used to having..more than 4... dungeons to run at a time.
So once you got to 50, you discovered dailies were 2 recycled zones with barely any quests that were 'Kill X, Gather Y', there wasn't any PvP to be had because broken and stacked, you can only queue for 4 dungeons at a time, and would pop the same dungeon over and over again (always crimelords of whitevale). Not to mention, for 'adventures' that supposedly had 'multiple paths to take' those paths were either too buggy, too slow, too boring, too hard for no reward, and so 99% of times I would run an adventure we would pick the same exact path to get through it.
So to recap: the thing thats killing Wildstar is--it wasn't ready to be released. There are game breaking attunement bugs, huge PvP imbalances, shoehorned instance runs with no variety, which made it very tough to find things to do at 50. Not to mention I had heard all the environments they created were unoptimized, the entire game was written using single-threaded programming, the main Exile city Thayd still brings me to 30 fps, 3 months from release and I have an i7 and a 780ti with 16 gigs of ram.
Wildstar made for a fun leveling experience, but unless they take some lessons from golf, give us a reason to go back to these 'holes(zones)' and let us compete for rewards via leaderboards on who does what best or fastest--the game will stay niche. Unless they acknowledge PvP was broken, and release a huge content drop for it as an apology, unless they release about 10 more instances and acknowledge they need to fix the most damning things FIRST, their planned content drops later....the game's future will continue to remain uncertain.
edit: One last thought. Developers should NOT let players know they are listening or affecting decisions. They make take ideas and criticisms in and use it, of course, but they should never outright be buddy buddy with the players . The Devs are supposed to be the gods of the game, who have a hidden vision that is unlocked for players to see when "It's ready". Having players feel their every whim and concern will be listened to by Devs just isn't that professional and there should remain some 'authority' when making and ushering out game decisions. Some trust.
If things dont improve soon? Before its makes it to a year. :-(
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
want 7 free days of playing? Try this
http://www.swtor.com/r/ZptVnY
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
Oh no, Archeage isn't going to have nearly as much trouble with this as they are with a purely PVP centric game. You don't even have to do a single quest in AA if you don't want to. But you'll have a harder time avoiding PVP altogether.
He never said it was an entertaining time sink.
If content is an entertaining time sink, I imagine most people won't mind. For whatever reason (I'm sure many here can think of several), most don't find Wild Star's time sinks to be very entertaining after a while.
There is a difference between a time sink and and purposely shoveling loads of pointless grind and hoop jumping on players and calling it `hardcore`. MMO players are lot more critical now about how their time is being spent since It is extremely easy to find a new game as soon as the present one becomes tiresome.
Wildstar has always been a a walking contradiction since it marketed itself as `hardcore` while at the same time providing an ez mode leveling experience and bad cartoony graphics for mass appeal.
The attunement process is where it all went wrong as players finally understood what the game really is: Shameless content padding. If the game is designed to ultimately only appeal to the 1 percent of people who accept their version of `hardcore` then they should accept their 1 percent of market share and the ghost town that entails.
Wildstar has always been a a walking contradiction since it marketed itself as `hardcore` while at the same time providing an ez mode leveling experience and bad cartoony graphics for mass appeal.
The attunement process is where it all went wrong as players finally understood what the game really is: Shameless content padding. If the game is designed to ultimately only appeal to the 1 percent of people who accept their version of `hardcore` then they should accept their 1 percent of market share and the ghost town that entails.
Have to agree with this guy's post, it's the sad truth unfortunately. I honestly can't even understand what the devs were thinking. I thought SWTOR and WARHAMMER ONLINE did bad but WS takes the cake.
Check out this article on Why Crafting Sucks
There is one simple answer: subscription model.
Devs should have realised by now that times changed and the only way to go now is F2P.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
Ever wonder how Wildstar would be doing if it was more realistic, and wasn't a cartoon? If it was more mature and serious, with less humor?
People were looking for another alternative from WoW's artstyle, and yet they mimic it. Go figure.