<p>I completely agree with the PvP-server set up. I would love to play on a PvP server. I admit it would become pretty messy in big fights. Picture the scenario they mention in their video on "The Content of EQN": the fight between Kobolds, Sprites and Dark Elves. Now add 50-70 players on each team. How can you avoid killing your own people? You cannot divide it by race, since everyone would be free to join any side. I don't think they would go for a simple "check this box if you want to fight for the Kobolds"-system. So maybe a group/raid system that won't allow you to harm people in your group/raid? </p><p>Thoughts? </p><p> </p><blockquote> <p><i>Originally posted by TheGoblinKing</i></p> <blockquote> <hr /> <b><i>Originally posted by tolke</i> <b>How much PvP is this game? Is PvP allowed everywhere? Are there PvP servers? Is end game based on PvP?</b> <b> </b></b> <hr /> </blockquote> <b>don't forget kids, it's going to be PVP with a cash shop<img border="0" src="http://images.mmorpg.com/images/emoticons/emt_fight.gif"; /></b> <p><b> </b></p></blockquote><p>You can't even disguise this trolling as constructive commentary.... what is a cash shop going to do in PvP? Stun players with unbelievably hot fashion items? I really don't think so. </p><p> </p>
PVP and PVE can exist together just fine and even compliment each other. The problem honestly is lack of vision from most developers and even less willingness to take risks by publishers. There are as many PvE d-bags as their are PVP d-bags. The problem is implantation, marketing, and revenue structures. This will be a PvE game with probably some side PVP for a quick fix. That's fine, not really revolutionary, but acceptable per the status quo. Eventually a developer with the right insight and a publisher willing to take a chance will come along and show everyone how it's done. Until then PvE games will lack good end game content and PVP games will lack strong communities and game immersion.
What greater tribute to free will than the power to question the highest of authority? What greater display of loyalty than blind faith? What greater gift than free will? What greater love than loyalty?
Originally posted by Pepeq If you can turn PVP off and on, you have no real PVP. Any game that does this, is not a PVP game.
Agreed. If this game is consensual PvP, I wouldn't go anywhere near it. The games of hand holding, zero consequences fluff garbage must come to an end.
Originally posted by Pepeq If you can turn PVP off and on, you have no real PVP. Any game that does this, is not a PVP game.
Agreed. If this game is consensual PvP, I wouldn't go anywhere near it. The games of hand holding, zero consequences fluff garbage must come to an end.
As they've made zero indication that EQN is a "PVP Game" I'm doubting it will be. Unlike a game such as Camelot Unchained which is PVP front and center. EQN will have PVP servers and maybe even PvPvE content, but we don't know to what extent.
Originally posted by Pepeq If you can turn PVP off and on, you have no real PVP. Any game that does this, is not a PVP game.
Agreed. If this game is consensual PvP, I wouldn't go anywhere near it. The games of hand holding, zero consequences fluff garbage must come to an end.
As they've made zero indication that EQN is a "PVP Game" I'm doubting it will be. Unlike a game such as Camelot Unchained which is PVP front and center. EQN will have PVP servers and maybe even PvPvE content, but we don't know to what extent.
This should be interesting how EQN plans to have PvP servers, when there is no announcement yet about "sides".. Yes, World of Warcraft has horde vs. alliance. TOR has sith vs republic. Rift has defiant vs guardians. EQ has good vs evil.. In your one post in another thread you assume and hope that everyone starts the game equal.. So how do you have PvP servers when there are no SIDES.. A hates B, B hate C, and C hates D, but D doesn't hate A or B, however A wants to assist C, but can't, then E stumbles in and hates everyone, etc etc etc..
So much for NATURAL game play.. I guess we'll just have to go with a FREE for ALL and everyone is out for themselves.. NO sides?
Originally posted by Pepeq If you can turn PVP off and on, you have no real PVP. Any game that does this, is not a PVP game.
Agreed. If this game is consensual PvP, I wouldn't go anywhere near it. The games of hand holding, zero consequences fluff garbage must come to an end.
As they've made zero indication that EQN is a "PVP Game" I'm doubting it will be. Unlike a game such as Camelot Unchained which is PVP front and center. EQN will have PVP servers and maybe even PvPvE content, but we don't know to what extent.
This should be interesting how EQN plans to have PvP servers, when there is no announcement yet about "sides".. Yes, World of Warcraft has horde vs. alliance. TOR has sith vs republic. Rift has defiant vs guardians. EQ has good vs evil.. In your one post in another thread you assume and hope that everyone starts the game equal.. So how do you have PvP servers when there are no SIDES.. A hates B, B hate C, and C hates D, but D doesn't hate A or B, however A wants to assist C, but can't, then E stumbles in and hates everyone, etc etc etc..
So much for NATURAL game play.. I guess we'll just have to go with a FREE for ALL and everyone is out for themselves.. NO sides?
And that is why they need to keep Good v Evil and Deities. Everyone liking each other in the EQ universe is quite stupid. And not only for PvP.. A High Elf should not be able to up and walk into a Dark Elf village unless they done some serious faction work.
From the way it sounded to me, just my opinion, it will take more player involvement to determine whos against who. It will be less good v evil, and more faction on faction determined by the players. It also sounds like it will be consensual, but not necessarily a "turn it off and on" kind of thing. More along the lines of, if you join said player faction you are agreeing to have PVP turned on. From then on, you are open to PVP. Its the best of both worlds, those who want PVP have to make a conscious decision to do so, but cant just go around ganking low level people who have no desire for it.
Theres also a good chance of PVE and PVP servers, so long as the game allows for it. SOEs other games have almost always given us both server types, so I dont see why they wouldnt here, unless the coding of the game itself just isnt capable. I would point out though that PVP servers are notoriously the lowest population servers in any game, when given the choice of PVP or PVE servers. They also have the highest turnover rate, and eventually eat themselves until they get shut down. Sure ganking is fun, but being ganked isnt. And most of the time those who like to gank will QQ and run off the server the moment they are no longer the top dog. PVPers are the biggest whiners (generally) and hate fair fights. They like ganking people 20 levels below them or zerging up 20 v 5, and as soon as the tables turn on them they run off the server. Hence why the servers eat themselves up, as some new top dog comes in and devours the old (meanwhile running off new players as well), this repeats until there isnt enough people to sustain a server and it gets shut down.
Consensual factions sounds like the best choice here. Everyone on one server, those who want to PVP can, they just cant gang up on low levels or those with no desire to PVP. This usually appeases anyone with a real desire for PVP, the only people who hate this server concept are those who are terrible at PVP and need "victims" to enjoy their game.
This should be interesting how EQN plans to have PvP servers, when there is no announcement yet about "sides".. Yes, World of Warcraft has horde vs. alliance. TOR has sith vs republic. Rift has defiant vs guardians. EQ has good vs evil.. In your one post in another thread you assume and hope that everyone starts the game equal.. So how do you have PvP servers when there are no SIDES.. A hates B, B hate C, and C hates D, but D doesn't hate A or B, however A wants to assist C, but can't, then E stumbles in and hates everyone, etc etc etc..
So much for NATURAL game play.. I guess we'll just have to go with a FREE for ALL and everyone is out for themselves.. NO sides?
As with EQ, all they have to do is create "sides". Be it Race, Alignment, FFA or whatever. Not too difficult to flip the PVP switch. Actually extremely easy to create any sort of conflict for players to fight about. Making PVP have "meaning" or depth is totally different matter and to me, a game has to be entirely focused on it to really add to the game. DAoC, WAR, Wildstar, Camelot Unchained, WoW, SWTOR, etc make it a fairly obvious feature and I'm not seeing that with EQN so far.
This is actually why I think EQN won't be focused on PVP, as some believe. PVP doesn't really make sense from what they've revealed about The Combine and what not. PvPvE stuff they've suggested does work if players are basically picking temporary or even long term faction alliances within the world, which is a bit broader and would allow for halfling vs halfing fighting and iksar fighting along side humans. Comes back to player choice throughout the adventure and not pick a side on day 1 and stuck forever or have to flip flop. Which sounds more natural to me. But I'd hope it is more event based and not "You killed me 2 months ago and are forever my enemy!"
Despite all your talk of esport and accusing me of wanting to compete with everyone, I actually want to focus on PVE and team work to overcome challenges. PVP is fun and all, but I'm hoping it isn't THE game at all. Player made arenas off the beaten path and more friendly battles would be fun, but I don't need to mindlessly kill others just because they picked a different race or god or color of t-shirt.
Edit: Could you link or tell me where you see stats on all games played that you've mentioned? Can't find anything that lists games into the several hundreds (Landmark #600 for example).
And that is why they need to keep Good v Evil and Deities. Everyone liking each other in the EQ universe is quite stupid. And not only for PvP.. A High Elf should not be able to up and walk into a Dark Elf village unless they done some serious faction work.
Different lore, different game. But the difference is EQN has the potential to move the story forward and a year after release, we could see races/alliances not getting along. The world/story isn't supposed to be static like EQ and most games. Maybe players have to start making choices that will decide their future friends/enemies based on XYZ. We don't know what is coming, but I'm guessing it will be a bit more exciting then, pick High Elf and forever hate Dark Elf unless you grind faction. The whole race/gang mentality gets boring to me, I'd rather think as an individual.
Comments
don't forget kids, it's going to be PVP with a cash shop<p>I completely agree with the PvP-server set up. I would love to play on a PvP server. I admit it would become pretty messy in big fights. Picture the scenario they mention in their video on "The Content of EQN":
the fight between Kobolds, Sprites and Dark Elves. Now add 50-70 players on each team. How can you avoid killing your own people? You cannot divide it by race, since everyone would be free to join any side. I don't think they would go for a simple "check this box if you want to fight for the Kobolds"-system. So maybe a group/raid system that won't allow you to harm people in your group/raid? </p><p>Thoughts? 
</p><p> </p><blockquote> <p><i>Originally posted by TheGoblinKing</i></p> <blockquote> <hr /> <b><i>Originally posted by tolke</i> <b>How much PvP is this game? Is PvP allowed everywhere? Are there PvP servers? Is end game based on PvP?</b> <b> </b></b> <hr /> </blockquote> <b>don't forget kids, it's going to be PVP with a cash shop<img border="0" src="http://images.mmorpg.com/images/emoticons/emt_fight.gif"; /></b> <p><b> </b></p></blockquote><p>You can't even disguise this trolling as constructive commentary.... what is a cash shop going to do in PvP? Stun players with unbelievably hot fashion items? I really don't think so. </p><p> </p>
"stupidity is its own reward"
PVP and PVE can exist together just fine and even compliment each other. The problem honestly is lack of vision from most developers and even less willingness to take risks by publishers. There are as many PvE d-bags as their are PVP d-bags. The problem is implantation, marketing, and revenue structures. This will be a PvE game with probably some side PVP for a quick fix. That's fine, not really revolutionary, but acceptable per the status quo. Eventually a developer with the right insight and a publisher willing to take a chance will come along and show everyone how it's done. Until then PvE games will lack good end game content and PVP games will lack strong communities and game immersion.
What greater tribute to free will than the power to question the highest of authority? What greater display of loyalty than blind faith? What greater gift than free will? What greater love than loyalty?
Agreed. If this game is consensual PvP, I wouldn't go anywhere near it. The games of hand holding, zero consequences fluff garbage must come to an end.
As they've made zero indication that EQN is a "PVP Game" I'm doubting it will be. Unlike a game such as Camelot Unchained which is PVP front and center. EQN will have PVP servers and maybe even PvPvE content, but we don't know to what extent.
This should be interesting how EQN plans to have PvP servers, when there is no announcement yet about "sides".. Yes, World of Warcraft has horde vs. alliance. TOR has sith vs republic. Rift has defiant vs guardians. EQ has good vs evil.. In your one post in another thread you assume and hope that everyone starts the game equal.. So how do you have PvP servers when there are no SIDES.. A hates B, B hate C, and C hates D, but D doesn't hate A or B, however A wants to assist C, but can't, then E stumbles in and hates everyone, etc etc etc..
So much for NATURAL game play.. I guess we'll just have to go with a FREE for ALL and everyone is out for themselves.. NO sides?
And that is why they need to keep Good v Evil and Deities. Everyone liking each other in the EQ universe is quite stupid. And not only for PvP.. A High Elf should not be able to up and walk into a Dark Elf village unless they done some serious faction work.
From the way it sounded to me, just my opinion, it will take more player involvement to determine whos against who. It will be less good v evil, and more faction on faction determined by the players. It also sounds like it will be consensual, but not necessarily a "turn it off and on" kind of thing. More along the lines of, if you join said player faction you are agreeing to have PVP turned on. From then on, you are open to PVP. Its the best of both worlds, those who want PVP have to make a conscious decision to do so, but cant just go around ganking low level people who have no desire for it.
Theres also a good chance of PVE and PVP servers, so long as the game allows for it. SOEs other games have almost always given us both server types, so I dont see why they wouldnt here, unless the coding of the game itself just isnt capable. I would point out though that PVP servers are notoriously the lowest population servers in any game, when given the choice of PVP or PVE servers. They also have the highest turnover rate, and eventually eat themselves until they get shut down. Sure ganking is fun, but being ganked isnt. And most of the time those who like to gank will QQ and run off the server the moment they are no longer the top dog. PVPers are the biggest whiners (generally) and hate fair fights. They like ganking people 20 levels below them or zerging up 20 v 5, and as soon as the tables turn on them they run off the server. Hence why the servers eat themselves up, as some new top dog comes in and devours the old (meanwhile running off new players as well), this repeats until there isnt enough people to sustain a server and it gets shut down.
Consensual factions sounds like the best choice here. Everyone on one server, those who want to PVP can, they just cant gang up on low levels or those with no desire to PVP. This usually appeases anyone with a real desire for PVP, the only people who hate this server concept are those who are terrible at PVP and need "victims" to enjoy their game.
As with EQ, all they have to do is create "sides". Be it Race, Alignment, FFA or whatever. Not too difficult to flip the PVP switch. Actually extremely easy to create any sort of conflict for players to fight about. Making PVP have "meaning" or depth is totally different matter and to me, a game has to be entirely focused on it to really add to the game. DAoC, WAR, Wildstar, Camelot Unchained, WoW, SWTOR, etc make it a fairly obvious feature and I'm not seeing that with EQN so far.
This is actually why I think EQN won't be focused on PVP, as some believe. PVP doesn't really make sense from what they've revealed about The Combine and what not. PvPvE stuff they've suggested does work if players are basically picking temporary or even long term faction alliances within the world, which is a bit broader and would allow for halfling vs halfing fighting and iksar fighting along side humans. Comes back to player choice throughout the adventure and not pick a side on day 1 and stuck forever or have to flip flop. Which sounds more natural to me. But I'd hope it is more event based and not "You killed me 2 months ago and are forever my enemy!"
Despite all your talk of esport and accusing me of wanting to compete with everyone, I actually want to focus on PVE and team work to overcome challenges. PVP is fun and all, but I'm hoping it isn't THE game at all. Player made arenas off the beaten path and more friendly battles would be fun, but I don't need to mindlessly kill others just because they picked a different race or god or color of t-shirt.
Edit: Could you link or tell me where you see stats on all games played that you've mentioned? Can't find anything that lists games into the several hundreds (Landmark #600 for example).
Different lore, different game. But the difference is EQN has the potential to move the story forward and a year after release, we could see races/alliances not getting along. The world/story isn't supposed to be static like EQ and most games. Maybe players have to start making choices that will decide their future friends/enemies based on XYZ. We don't know what is coming, but I'm guessing it will be a bit more exciting then, pick High Elf and forever hate Dark Elf unless you grind faction. The whole race/gang mentality gets boring to me, I'd rather think as an individual.