It's not a good system if you can buy gold for $11 and then use that gold to purchase a token that gives you 30 days of game time, or if only people who have been playing for several years can afford to buy the tokens with the gold they've amassed over time.
This is something that crossed my mind as i read replies, if you know the right site you can get 10k g for £3 ($4.61), sub costs £8.99 or higher, if the cost drops between 10 - 40k.
No idea what making money is like now since the fucked the crafting and made it so you gain a stupid amount of resources from your Garrison.
Originally posted by Salute This will R.I.P. many mmo's...
HIGHLY doubtful. I honestly do not know anybody that left WoW because of the subscription. And for me personally, they would need to change the game entirely to bring me back in.
I can fly higher than an aeroplane. And I have the voice of a thousand hurricanes. Hurt - Wars
Originally posted by Hashcow101 And the game is gooing to turn to shit blizzard is making a big mistake with this they have been on top for years now with current model why change now?
Please elaborate on how this will affect the game.
I can fly higher than an aeroplane. And I have the voice of a thousand hurricanes. Hurt - Wars
It's not a good system if you can buy gold for $11 and then use that gold to purchase a token that gives you 30 days of game time, or if only people who have been playing for several years can afford to buy the tokens with the gold they've amassed over time.
This is something that crossed my mind as i read replies, if you know the right site you can get 10k g for £3 ($4.61), sub costs £8.99 or higher, if the cost drops between 10 - 40k.
No idea what making money is like now since the fucked the crafting and made it so you gain a stupid amount of resources from your Garrison.
Again just a wait and see thing.
Indirectly it will be something that Blizzard will have to monitor.
Indirectly because Blizzard are not selling tokens for gold. Players - who want gold - will be the ones who buy the tokens for money. And so there will only ever be a limited number of tokens.
As you say though if the price of a token, bought for $15, is 25k gold on the AH and that much gold can be had for $11k ..... Blizzard won't want to bring one lot of gold buyers into the fold only to lose an equivalent number.
However for this to happen the person who wants the gold in the first place - who bought the token - will end up getting 25k of gold for $15 knowing - presumably - that they could buy 25k gold for $11. So presumably won't do it again.
Token >= cost of a months sub, NOT less. To use AH, player must be subscribed.
$15 ~= 20,000g from 3rd party site (just checked). In ArcheAge 2xApex = 1 month free = $20. I think this will be the price we see for 1 Token. I first thought we would see 1 Token sell for 600g. But $20 != 600g. I think $20 (1 Token) == 30.0000g. This is the only way that using the Tokens for gold will be cheaper than buying gold from farmers.
Free Trial accounts can't trade (or use AH). They are capped at 10g. They will not be buying Tokens.
To buy a token you will have to subscribe. I'm sure that cancelling the sub and getting your money back will cancel the Token. Gold will be gone, and token will be gone.
Pardon any spelling errors
Konfess your cyns and some maybe forgiven Boy: Why can't I talk to Him? Mom: We don't talk to Priests. As if it could exist, without being payed for. F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing. Even telemarketers wouldn't think that. It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
They don't make a decision like this out of thin air on a whim,there is a definite reason.
Knowing we have PAX and likely new game announcements,perhaps Blizzard is about to release a game it feels might be in direct conflict with WOW,so they are aiming for a system that can keep players in both and not just transfer wow accounts over to the new game.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Simply put, they saw what other games did (Wildstar as the latest) and they see it as a way to do 3 things.
1.) Receive Immediate Profits: It is likely there will be a surplus of tokens available. Those tokens not used act as cash given to blizzard, the biggest benefit of it being immediate rather then having to wait for someone to apply it as a subscription.
2.) Cuts Down Goldsellers: Having a way to pay money to get ingame cash means more people will pick to do so ingame over goldsellers. Its a far safer (and legal) way of getting gold. It is likely gold seller prices will be much lower, but the ease and safety will more likely have players choosing it do so in game.
3.) Retention: Blizzard's biggest foe right now is keeping the numbers. While the expansion greatly boosted its subscriber base, its something they know full well won't last and will dwindle down. Having a "f2p" option means people will be more willing to stay subscribed, despite perhaps not investing as much time in. Players will be far more likely to have that sub with it being payed form in game currency and stick around instead of quiting fully to play another game. Subs will be up, even if the players actually playing actively goes down. It pads the numbers greatly in their favor.
Originally posted by Zarriya Cancelled my sub today. I played for many years, but I will not play it now that it is P2W.
What is the world are you talking about? How is being able to buy game time with gold pay to win?
I'm guessing that those who call this P2W, don't have a subscription. So they are being forced to pay for a subscription so they can win a free month token.
To P4F gamers, having to spend money on any remuneration is P2W. Regardless of any winning being involved.
Pardon any spelling errors
Konfess your cyns and some maybe forgiven Boy: Why can't I talk to Him? Mom: We don't talk to Priests. As if it could exist, without being payed for. F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing. Even telemarketers wouldn't think that. It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
Blizzard is already in the process of nerfing or removing many gold sources in the game to push their token forward.
The plan is obviously to drive people to buy tokens to sell them for ingame gold. Reality however will be that buying online gold and exchanging it for tokens will be cheaper than buying tokens directly from the shop.
So if anything, this won't harm goldsellers but give them a huge run up.
Blizzard is already in the process of nerfing or removing many gold sources in the game to push their token forward.
The plan is obviously to drive people to buy tokens to sell them for ingame gold. Reality however will be that buying online gold and exchanging it for tokens will be cheaper than buying tokens directly from the shop.
So if anything, this won't harm goldsellers but give them a huge run up.
LOL, not true, there adding more gold to the game:
Garrison Mission Changes Patch 6.1.2
Black Forge now also rewards 1,000 gold.
Backhand's Crucible now also rewards 1,000 gold.
Iron Assembly now also rewards 1,000 gold.
Slagworks now also rewards 1,000 gold.
You can be sure they will make the base price for a token pretty high, but they are already dangling the golden carrot in front of your face.
Blizzard is already in the process of nerfing or removing many gold sources in the game to push their token forward.
The plan is obviously to drive people to buy tokens to sell them for ingame gold. Reality however will be that buying online gold and exchanging it for tokens will be cheaper than buying tokens directly from the shop.
So if anything, this won't harm goldsellers but give them a huge run up.
LOL, not true, there adding more gold to the game:
Garrison Mission Changes Patch 6.1.2
Black Forge now also rewards 1,000 gold.
Backhand's Crucible now also rewards 1,000 gold.
Iron Assembly now also rewards 1,000 gold.
Slagworks now also rewards 1,000 gold.
You can be sure they will make the base price for a token pretty high, but they are already dangling the golden carrot in front of your face.
You must have missed the many topics on the official and other forums in which people discuss severe nerfs to gold sources allover.
Blizzard is already in the process of nerfing or removing many gold sources in the game to push their token forward.
The plan is obviously to drive people to buy tokens to sell them for ingame gold. Reality however will be that buying online gold and exchanging it for tokens will be cheaper than buying tokens directly from the shop.
So if anything, this won't harm goldsellers but give them a huge run up.
LOL, not true, there adding more gold to the game:
Garrison Mission Changes Patch 6.1.2
Black Forge now also rewards 1,000 gold.
Backhand's Crucible now also rewards 1,000 gold.
Iron Assembly now also rewards 1,000 gold.
Slagworks now also rewards 1,000 gold.
You can be sure they will make the base price for a token pretty high, but they are already dangling the golden carrot in front of your face.
You must have missed the many topics on the official and other forums in which people discuss severe nerfs to gold sources allover.
Clearly you missed the "dangling the golden carrot" part... they ARE adding more gold to the game... they're just being coy about it. They have NO INTENTION of making it so that you can earn enough gold to pay for a sub during a single 30 day game cycle... you will ultimately have to play more to get a free month down the road. You might be able to pay for a month or two depending on how much you've banked over the years, but in the end, you will discover it's just plain easier to just pay the sub.
They aren't really giving you free game time at all... they are just giving you another reason to do stuff that you would otherwise not do in order to earn enough gold to potentially get free game time. It's all marketing. This is their latest carrot to get you to keep playing.
Blizzard is already in the process of nerfing or removing many gold sources in the game to push their token forward.
The plan is obviously to drive people to buy tokens to sell them for ingame gold. Reality however will be that buying online gold and exchanging it for tokens will be cheaper than buying tokens directly from the shop.
So if anything, this won't harm goldsellers but give them a huge run up.
The gold nerf does sound possible. I wont argue that. But I disagree with the above highlighted section. Those who will buy Tokens with gold, will not spend a dime buying gold. P4F gamers don't want or can't afford to spend real life money, so buying gold is out of the question. If the price of a token were $15, then I estimate that would be equal to 24,990g (rounded up to 25,000g). But I don't expect this to be the sale price for a token. The token sellers will want a better exchange rate than that found at a gold seller, and I expect the dollar price of a token to be higher as well. I expect a token will sell for $20 ($19.95), like they do in other games. So at $20 (one token) == 33,320g, I expect this to round to 34,000g at a minimum. What I expect the reality to be, is Token == 68,000g or more (possibly 100,000,000g). In a well established game, that uses an identical system the price is ~800,000,000 for one token (plex).
It will be way cheaper to sell tokens on the AH and farm for gold rather than buy gold from a farming web site. If the farms cut their price, then the AH will double theirs. No one will be able to buy a $15 token with $5 (8,330g) worth of gold.
Pardon any spelling errors
Konfess your cyns and some maybe forgiven Boy: Why can't I talk to Him? Mom: We don't talk to Priests. As if it could exist, without being payed for. F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing. Even telemarketers wouldn't think that. It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
Originally posted by Matticulous Gold sellers will buy the time coin in game with gold and try to sell it on their sites for less then Blizzard is selling them for.
Farmed gold has a value to farmers. If they have to spend 100,000,000g($60,024) to buy a token and then sell it on their site for $10 they will lose money. If the Farmers' cost of 100,000,000g is only $1, then any price over that is profit. But I suspect the real world cost of 100,000,000g is more like $1,000 (this is real money spent to acquire in game gold).
Pardon any spelling errors
Konfess your cyns and some maybe forgiven Boy: Why can't I talk to Him? Mom: We don't talk to Priests. As if it could exist, without being payed for. F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing. Even telemarketers wouldn't think that. It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
Originally posted by Matticulous Gold sellers will buy the time coin in game with gold and try to sell it on their sites for less then Blizzard is selling them for.
Was under the impression that if they are bought from another player with gold, that they could not be traded again, which would prevent that happening.
Player A buys token from Blizzard for $$
Player A sells token to Player B for gold and token becomes soul bound to player B, and token can no longer be traded.
Originally posted by Matticulous Gold sellers will buy the time coin in game with gold and try to sell it on their sites for less then Blizzard is selling them for.
Was under the impression that if they are bought from another player with gold, that they could not be traded again, which would prevent that happening.
Player A buys token from Blizzard for $$
Player A sells token to Player B for gold and token becomes soul bound to player B, and token can no longer be traded.
Originally posted by Matticulous Gold sellers will buy the time coin in game with gold and try to sell it on their sites for less then Blizzard is selling them for.
Was under the impression that if they are bought from another player with gold, that they could not be traded again, which would prevent that happening.
Player A buys token from Blizzard for $$
Player A sells token to Player B for gold and token becomes soul bound to player B, and token can no longer be traded.
As it reads you are correct.
There are only 2 ways to acquire a token, one through Blizzard in-game store itself (it cannot be purchased outside of the in-game store) and two, through the auction house (a specially segregated portion of said AH).
Any token purchased through AH is immediately soul bound upon receipt. It cannot be traded, it cannot be resold, it cannot be used by any character except the one that receives it in the mail.
Any token purchased in the Blizzard in-game store is either immediately soul bound to the character that purchases it, or can be immediately placed in the AH for sale. You can only put it up for sale at the time of purchase as if you choose not to sell it, it becomes soul bound.
Originally posted by Matticulous Gold sellers will buy the time coin in game with gold and try to sell it on their sites for less then Blizzard is selling them for.
The time coin will be soulbound after being bought from AH.......so, no gold seller could buy it that way and sell back.
Comments
This is something that crossed my mind as i read replies, if you know the right site you can get 10k g for £3 ($4.61), sub costs £8.99 or higher, if the cost drops between 10 - 40k.
No idea what making money is like now since the fucked the crafting and made it so you gain a stupid amount of resources from your Garrison.
Again just a wait and see thing.
HIGHLY doubtful. I honestly do not know anybody that left WoW because of the subscription. And for me personally, they would need to change the game entirely to bring me back in.
I can fly higher than an aeroplane.
And I have the voice of a thousand hurricanes.
Hurt - Wars
Please elaborate on how this will affect the game.
I can fly higher than an aeroplane.
And I have the voice of a thousand hurricanes.
Hurt - Wars
Indirectly it will be something that Blizzard will have to monitor.
Indirectly because Blizzard are not selling tokens for gold. Players - who want gold - will be the ones who buy the tokens for money. And so there will only ever be a limited number of tokens.
As you say though if the price of a token, bought for $15, is 25k gold on the AH and that much gold can be had for $11k ..... Blizzard won't want to bring one lot of gold buyers into the fold only to lose an equivalent number.
However for this to happen the person who wants the gold in the first place - who bought the token - will end up getting 25k of gold for $15 knowing - presumably - that they could buy 25k gold for $11. So presumably won't do it again.
Interesting times ahead maybe.
What is the world are you talking about? How is being able to buy game time with gold pay to win?
Free to play = content updates for the cash shop. Buy to play = content updates for the cash shop.
Subscription = Actual content updates!
Token >= cost of a months sub, NOT less. To use AH, player must be subscribed.
$15 ~= 20,000g from 3rd party site (just checked). In ArcheAge 2xApex = 1 month free = $20. I think this will be the price we see for 1 Token. I first thought we would see 1 Token sell for 600g. But $20 != 600g. I think $20 (1 Token) == 30.0000g. This is the only way that using the Tokens for gold will be cheaper than buying gold from farmers.
Free Trial accounts can't trade (or use AH). They are capped at 10g. They will not be buying Tokens.
To buy a token you will have to subscribe. I'm sure that cancelling the sub and getting your money back will cancel the Token. Gold will be gone, and token will be gone.
Boy: Why can't I talk to Him?
Mom: We don't talk to Priests.
As if it could exist, without being payed for.
F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing.
Even telemarketers wouldn't think that.
It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
They don't make a decision like this out of thin air on a whim,there is a definite reason.
Knowing we have PAX and likely new game announcements,perhaps Blizzard is about to release a game it feels might be in direct conflict with WOW,so they are aiming for a system that can keep players in both and not just transfer wow accounts over to the new game.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Simply put, they saw what other games did (Wildstar as the latest) and they see it as a way to do 3 things.
1.) Receive Immediate Profits: It is likely there will be a surplus of tokens available. Those tokens not used act as cash given to blizzard, the biggest benefit of it being immediate rather then having to wait for someone to apply it as a subscription.
2.) Cuts Down Goldsellers: Having a way to pay money to get ingame cash means more people will pick to do so ingame over goldsellers. Its a far safer (and legal) way of getting gold. It is likely gold seller prices will be much lower, but the ease and safety will more likely have players choosing it do so in game.
3.) Retention: Blizzard's biggest foe right now is keeping the numbers. While the expansion greatly boosted its subscriber base, its something they know full well won't last and will dwindle down. Having a "f2p" option means people will be more willing to stay subscribed, despite perhaps not investing as much time in. Players will be far more likely to have that sub with it being payed form in game currency and stick around instead of quiting fully to play another game. Subs will be up, even if the players actually playing actively goes down. It pads the numbers greatly in their favor.
This isnt free really, its just convincing someone else to pay your subscription for gold.
This will hurt other mmorpg titles, no doubt though.
I'm guessing that those who call this P2W, don't have a subscription. So they are being forced to pay for a subscription so they can win a free month token.
To P4F gamers, having to spend money on any remuneration is P2W. Regardless of any winning being involved.
Boy: Why can't I talk to Him?
Mom: We don't talk to Priests.
As if it could exist, without being payed for.
F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing.
Even telemarketers wouldn't think that.
It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
Blizzard is already in the process of nerfing or removing many gold sources in the game to push their token forward.
The plan is obviously to drive people to buy tokens to sell them for ingame gold. Reality however will be that buying online gold and exchanging it for tokens will be cheaper than buying tokens directly from the shop.
So if anything, this won't harm goldsellers but give them a huge run up.
LOL, not true, there adding more gold to the game:
Garrison Mission Changes Patch 6.1.2
Black Forge now also rewards 1,000 gold.
Backhand's Crucible now also rewards 1,000 gold.
Iron Assembly now also rewards 1,000 gold.
Slagworks now also rewards 1,000 gold.
You can be sure they will make the base price for a token pretty high, but they are already dangling the golden carrot in front of your face.
You must have missed the many topics on the official and other forums in which people discuss severe nerfs to gold sources allover.
Clearly you missed the "dangling the golden carrot" part... they ARE adding more gold to the game... they're just being coy about it. They have NO INTENTION of making it so that you can earn enough gold to pay for a sub during a single 30 day game cycle... you will ultimately have to play more to get a free month down the road. You might be able to pay for a month or two depending on how much you've banked over the years, but in the end, you will discover it's just plain easier to just pay the sub.
They aren't really giving you free game time at all... they are just giving you another reason to do stuff that you would otherwise not do in order to earn enough gold to potentially get free game time. It's all marketing. This is their latest carrot to get you to keep playing.
The gold nerf does sound possible. I wont argue that. But I disagree with the above highlighted section. Those who will buy Tokens with gold, will not spend a dime buying gold. P4F gamers don't want or can't afford to spend real life money, so buying gold is out of the question. If the price of a token were $15, then I estimate that would be equal to 24,990g (rounded up to 25,000g). But I don't expect this to be the sale price for a token. The token sellers will want a better exchange rate than that found at a gold seller, and I expect the dollar price of a token to be higher as well. I expect a token will sell for $20 ($19.95), like they do in other games. So at $20 (one token) == 33,320g, I expect this to round to 34,000g at a minimum. What I expect the reality to be, is Token == 68,000g or more (possibly 100,000,000g). In a well established game, that uses an identical system the price is ~800,000,000 for one token (plex).
It will be way cheaper to sell tokens on the AH and farm for gold rather than buy gold from a farming web site. If the farms cut their price, then the AH will double theirs. No one will be able to buy a $15 token with $5 (8,330g) worth of gold.
Boy: Why can't I talk to Him?
Mom: We don't talk to Priests.
As if it could exist, without being payed for.
F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing.
Even telemarketers wouldn't think that.
It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
Farmed gold has a value to farmers. If they have to spend 100,000,000g($60,024) to buy a token and then sell it on their site for $10 they will lose money. If the Farmers' cost of 100,000,000g is only $1, then any price over that is profit. But I suspect the real world cost of 100,000,000g is more like $1,000 (this is real money spent to acquire in game gold).
Boy: Why can't I talk to Him?
Mom: We don't talk to Priests.
As if it could exist, without being payed for.
F2P means you get what you paid for. Pay nothing, get nothing.
Even telemarketers wouldn't think that.
It costs money to play. Therefore P2W.
Was under the impression that if they are bought from another player with gold, that they could not be traded again, which would prevent that happening.
Player A buys token from Blizzard for $$
Player A sells token to Player B for gold and token becomes soul bound to player B, and token can no longer be traded.
As it reads you are correct.
There are only 2 ways to acquire a token, one through Blizzard in-game store itself (it cannot be purchased outside of the in-game store) and two, through the auction house (a specially segregated portion of said AH).
Any token purchased through AH is immediately soul bound upon receipt. It cannot be traded, it cannot be resold, it cannot be used by any character except the one that receives it in the mail.
Any token purchased in the Blizzard in-game store is either immediately soul bound to the character that purchases it, or can be immediately placed in the AH for sale. You can only put it up for sale at the time of purchase as if you choose not to sell it, it becomes soul bound.
Or you could say. Pay to play for free.... They are really trying to milk out what's left of people...
Im so happy i didn't even bought the last expansion... Should have stopped with the second :P
MMO-Hunter/Spethz
Spetzzon@hotmail.com
The time coin will be soulbound after being bought from AH.......so, no gold seller could buy it that way and sell back.