Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
I can say that I somewhat agree with the other guys argument about profit margins. Games implement systems that market research has proven to be more profitable, not what people think are the most fun. If they can use the most profitable element, and still somehow emulate what the people want, they will try.
Beta tests and early access have become cash grabs due to the uncertainty in the market. "Let's build the hype. Now, let's make people pay to test our games." This counters the fear that companies may have whether a game might be a success or not.
I remember days when beta tests had people that enjoyed the game, and they spent their time testing, and providing meaningful feedback because they were some of the privileged few that were ALLOWED to help. By charging people to play in a testing phase, you have killed your most valuable commodity. While some buyers will still post meaningful feedback, many will shift to the "I paid for this, so I am not required to post any feedback." While it may be the more profitable path, I do not think that it is the most beneficial to the quality of the MMO.
A good example of a cash grab is what Daybreak Games has done to Everquest 2. Under SOE, EQ2 expansions typically had 2-3 large overland zones, any number of dungeons and raids, and other content as well. The pricing model was typically $34.99 for the normal version and $49.99 for the CE. Now that Daybreak has come in, the new expansion being shoved out the door only has ONE overland zone, which screams "limited content." Their pricing scheme is $34.99 for the normal version, $89.99 for the CE, and $139.99 for the "Premium Edition." It looks, to me, like they are trying to cash in on the good will of the player base and raise profitability numbers. This is fairly standard practice for an equity firm, so I am not criticizing their methods as businessmen, but it sucks for the gamers, and this is just one example of many in modern MMO's.
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
I can say that I somewhat agree with the other guys argument about profit margins. Games implement systems that market research has proven to be more profitable, not what people think are the most fun. If they can use the most profitable element, and still somehow emulate what the people want, they will try.
Beta tests and early access have become cash grabs due to the uncertainty in the market. "Let's build the hype. Now, let's make people pay to test our games." This counters the fear that companies may have whether a game might be a success or not.
I remember days when beta tests had people that enjoyed the game, and they spent their time testing, and providing meaningful feedback because they were some of the privileged few that were ALLOWED to help. By charging people to play in a testing phase, you have killed your most valuable commodity. While some buyers will still post meaningful feedback, many will shift to the "I paid for this, so I am not required to post any feedback." While it may be the more profitable path, I do not think that it is the most beneficial to the quality of the MMO.
A good example of a cash grab is what Daybreak Games has done to Everquest 2. Under SOE, EQ2 expansions typically had 2-3 large overland zones, any number of dungeons and raids, and other content as well. The pricing model was typically $34.99 for the normal version and $49.99 for the CE. Now that Daybreak has come in, the new expansion being shoved out the door only has ONE overland zone, which screams "limited content." Their pricing scheme is $34.99 for the normal version, $89.99 for the CE, and $139.99 for the "Premium Edition." It looks, to me, like they are trying to cash in on the good will of the player base and raise profitability numbers. This is fairly standard practice for an equity firm, so I am not criticizing their methods as businessmen, but it sucks for the gamers, and this is just one example of many in modern MMO's.
This is also how the entire market is now. Small bits of content that can be made faster to keep your players coming back. MMOers are mostly game hoppers now, staying for 1-3 months, eating up the content and moving on to another game with another expansion. Developers are now forced to play this game. Even Blizzard has said they need to step up content to more then an expansion once a year they tell us about at Blizzcon. In the end, if you dont like what a company is doing, dont play their games. I see your dislike for how DGC is looking after their games but I dont see you spending all your time bashing them for it. This is what the OP is talking about. Dont like something, move on. If your a poster that is here to post hate post after hate post. Maybe something should be done about game haters.
when people are satisfied they leave a tip and go about there day. It's when people are dissatisfied that they insist there waiter go tell the cook/chef how much they botched it. Also paradox of choice, basically to many options leaves one less satisfied and with more internal conflict about wether or not they chose wisely. This often leads to the crab bucket bashing of the other options you did not choose. Much easier to pull something down than it is to pull something up.
I don't agree with the premise that forums are toxic; far to easy to say. Some forums - maybe; some people "carried away" - sure; all forums - no.
A part of the problem is people assuming that anyone with a different opinion is "bashing" or "attacking" etc.
Take SBFord's recent WoW feature - in which the OP posted extensively and in - just about - a minority of one. And when I pointed out some errors was accused of bashing - my response being to check my post history!
Yes there will be trolls but a difference of opinion is not bashing.
What has changed in the last few years is that forums are less busy. And that is fact not opinion. An example: the launch of Trials of Atlantis generated over 100 pages of new posts, about 40 new posts to a page, in the first day on a now deceased forum. ToA, for those unaware, had a very poor reception. Compare that to mmorpg.com or the EU WoW forums say - the latter getting about 1.5 new pages a day, maybe 50 new threads. (Yes EU WoW is that quiet). And when a forum is so quiet you cannot extrapolate the postings of a few and say everyone is being "quote" negative "unquote".
But I mean it's hard when devs are just out for money and CEOs are micromanaging every aspect of development. Each game made these days, particularly MMOs, are analyzed by a shadowy cult of faceless executives who scour every system in order to best exploit it for maximum profits. There is absolutely no passion involved, only the desire for more money. Much unlike the glory days when games were actually fun and developers lived out of their parents basements.
Obviously the only way we can counter this is by posting extremely negative comments in every single thread about these games. If we eliminate any trace of enjoyment for other players then maybe the devs will finally listen and do their damn jobs better! It's just too bad all these whales are spending thousands of dollars a month to keep them afloat.
I don't think I buy that.
I would say that if developers and executives wanted to make "so much money" then they would probably be in a different business. What person would attach themselves to a product that is so iffy from start to finish, where they are expected to actually converse with their clientele who have a vested interest and want their voices heard and who think that, given very little information, they can make assertions about the product and even expect that "all" their voices be heard.
only for the product to launch and it "might" be one of the few successful examples.
Developers can find better business to work in, have at least a little more job security and executives can work in business that make far better money.
Really, other than having a passion for the video game genre, would anyone actually invest a lot of money expecting a good return? I wouldn't.
Ya sorry, that was a pointless sarcastic post with some of the more ridiculous statements I've seen on these forums. Probably not helping the whole anti negativity theme this thread has going on.
I agree with you though. Nice to see more people in touch with the realities of game development.
Strangely enough, a majority of the regulars here enjoy this site, I know I do and I ask why the OP and others who agree with his view continue to come here, isnt there a fansite or reddit forum you could spend time on.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Strangely enough, a majority of the regulars here enjoy this site, I know I do and I ask why the OP and others who agree with his view continue to come here, isnt there a fansite or reddit forum you could spend time on.
All I can say here now is, "Welcome to my house."
And yes, it is "my" house. :awesome:
Swtor forums toxic
WoW forums toxic
Destiny forums toxic
Lotro forums ...empty?
Had a some time this week and ran across this site...I think you have some cleaning to do in your house it's pretty toxic also.
@Nanfoodle Yeah, no reason to bash them. Companies are going to do what companies are going to do. It isn't worth getting bent out of shape over. I will speak my piece and give my opinion, but it is just the healthy thing to do to move on. My fun time is limited these days, so I see no reason getting bent out of shape about something that my opinion won't change.
I don't consider myself a negative poster but, just to play devil's advocate, maybe posters are so negative because mainstream gaming media reviews are so positive?
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
The players invested in the game or interested in the game are posting on the official forums or on the forums at fansites specifically for that game.
It's rare that someone with a question about the game will post here, because there are far better channels for that information (official sites, YT, wikis). Likewise, the player that looks to answer questions like that would more than likely not be here.
Also, gamers attach to games the same way they attach to bands or sports teams. The same type of rivalry exists. If you had a hard rock site with Poison, Nickleback, Judas Priest, and Slayer forums how do you think that would pan out? Yankees and Mets forums on the same site? Rangers and Islanders?
It's the nature of a general gathering within a multi-faceted special interest group.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I don't consider myself a negative poster but, just to play devil's advocate, maybe posters are so negative because mainstream gaming media reviews are so positive?
Well that could be another topic. Because if a game you enjoy and another poster doesn't enjoy it..well those reviewers are paid off.
I don't consider myself a negative poster but, just to play devil's advocate, maybe posters are so negative because mainstream gaming media reviews are so positive?
Well that could be another topic. Because if a game you enjoy and another poster doesn't enjoy it..well those reviewers are paid off.
No. I'll leave "paid off" to the tin-foil crowd. They just go to conventions, get caught up in the hype and we end up with EQN being the best of show at E3 2013.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Sometimes going into a game's forums can feel like this: Like you are breaching someone's stronghold. It shouldn't be that way, but some people don't like reading what you have to say. Specially if your view doesn't agree with theirs. Then again, some people constantly go in said forums and tell them everyday how their game sucks. Who is at fault for the hostility or negativity? Not sure, so the best you can do is keep it as civil as possible even when someone picks a forum fight.
okay yeah.. The gaming industry can do pretty crappy stuff at times, but at the end of the day, i really think It's a result of most gamers spending extended amounts of times in dark rooms behind a screen without exercise, combined with anonymity, and It's a recipe for disaster.
I recon someone with a positive attitude is a lot less likely to participate in an online / forum argument, so the arguments float to the surface and it seems like It's all negative because the positives aren't being shared.
Sometimes going into a game's forums can feel like this: Like you are breaching someone's stronghold. It shouldn't be that way, but some people don't like reading what you have to say. Specially if your view doesn't agree with theirs. Then again, some people constantly go in said forums and tell them everyday how their game sucks. Who is at fault for the hostility or negativity? Not sure, so the best you can do is keep it as civil as possible even when someone picks a forum fight.
My most memorable, and not in a good way, experience of this kind was with a site called ACLore back in the early days of Asheron's Call. I was playing dagger character and I was often seeing people saying you "have to" have a 2-7 dagger and that a 1-6 dagger was "useless". As the damage seemed shifted by only one point, it seemed strange that a shift of one point with the same variance should make such an extreme difference.
When it came time to create a special Bandit Dagger, I had a 2-7 dagger that was plain in appearance and no bonuses, and a 1-6 dagger that had spells and damage type (fire) that I liked, so...
I would regularly visit AC Lore at the time so stopped by their forums to ask if there would be much of a difference if I went with the 1-6 dagger instead of the 2-7 dagger, hoping they'd have stats or info that would explain what kind of difference I'd be looking at.
HOLY CRAP.
"Are you really asking which is more, 6 or 7?"
"Obv 2-7 is better. How stupid are you?"
"If the people in game told you the 1-6 is useless, why the f*** are you here looking for a different answer?"
"Where do these newbs come from, and why do we let them post here?"
Of the dozen or two replies, no one actually had an answer for me, but each one had plenty of toxic crap to spew about me coming there to ask it.
Looking the forums over after that, I saw that was pretty much the general response thrown at outsiders to the group, especially those that dared to question what has already been accepted as canon.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I've been playing mmos for a long time and
today's forums or so toxic. Take this one for examples you have a single poster make multiple threads (usually a new one once the previous gets off the 1st page) on the F2P, B2p, P2p topic. His post are identical filled with bias , uneducated , baseless , post supported by zero facts. One thread he claims games like Swtor, ffxiv, and Wow will be dead in 2016 two days later he moves the goal post to 2017.
These exact threads are littered with the same people complaining about a topic they don't have any knowledge on.
Then you have threads about "whales" who one poster determined equals any player who spends $47/month on a hobby they enjoy? Why do people care what others spend their money on? Who are these people to tell others they are right or wrong.
Another group usually the same people as above complain games aren't hard enough. And if somebody states they are they are met with you weren't around during x game or you don't know what a challenge is. Again who are you people to tell another person what they find challenging or not?
If all you have to say about a hobby is 100% negative and it's clear the hobby is not changing for you let me ask this simple question?
Why are you spending so much time and energy on something that is negative in your life? Why don't you focus instead on something positive or something you enjoy?
There is no shame in accepting you out grew a hobby or a hobby changed and left you in the dust.
Wouldn't it be great if you could come to a site like this or a specific game forum and it wasn't filled with doom and gloom, I'm quitting, old days garbage, copy//pasting some fanatics irrational links, complaining about how millions and millions enjoy the direction but you don't, some poster changing dates as he spams the same threads?
Instead imagine a forum filled with productive discussion, excitement for a hobby you enjoy.
If all you do is complain and pretend to think you an expert on the video game industry it's time to move on. You are on mmorpg and your name isn't blue, you aren't an expert no matter how much you copy/paste.
Once upon a time games were very challenging. Players needed online forums as a place to gather offline to work out the details before they tried again. This era has long since passed, and people that play games can communicate in game, look up information in online databases, or just play in the game. The social interaction that was once common on the forums is either no longer needed, or has moved elsewhere.
This leaves the forums as a place that people who are no longer actively playing in game can come and rant. It is basically a platform for those that can not project their opinion in game (or to the players in game). This makes it very niche, and extremely minority based. The forum is where people can express opinions that are not actually relevant.
Strangely enough, a majority of the regulars here enjoy this site, I know I do and I ask why the OP and others who agree with his view continue to come here, isnt there a fansite or reddit forum you could spend time on.
All I can say here now is, "Welcome to my house."
And yes, it is "my" house. :awesome:
Swtor forums toxic
WoW forums toxic
Destiny forums toxic
Lotro forums ...empty?
Had a some time this week and ran across this site...I think you have some cleaning to do in your house it's pretty toxic also.
But thanks for the welcome!
I recently revisited the WoW general forums and found them far more pleasant than back in the day.
Partially, because like in any other medium, people polarize on opinions.
Even if a comment is made in a rather mediated manner, there is the preference for opinions to come first. If a commentary runs contrary to a person's opinion or desired perspective, then rather than offer a sane discussion, it rapidly because an assault on the person in one form or another rather than whatever the topic was even about.
The "whales" thread certainly has an example of that.
When a line of commentary is posted and instead of addressing the content other users become unhappy with the fact that the content runs contrary to their opinions in some finite perspective and instead start a spiraling tirade about an individual rather than any real mention of the subject that was even posted by them.
Things that mmoguy and sovrath mentioned play a heavy role in this.
It's a quirky behavior yet remarkably characteristic. In a good part the fact that supposedly "disenfranchised" gamers ultimately collect on the more general forums, and then you have people who are dedicated to a given title collecting within those respective forums.
It's honestly a bit like mob mentality, but as applicable to individuals because of the effects of being online and consequently "free" of direct retribution. It seems to give an almighty sensation to some, and this issue scales as they gain some sense of prevalence or authority within a given forum.
When homogeneity of thoughts an opinions or mild deviance is the only real issue, nothing seems particularly bad. This breaks down though as more and more distinctive opinions come forth.
And that is where a forum like this sits. To call all the people here "disenfranchised" would be a rather inaccurate blanket statement, but the extended implications of it bears merit. The source of the matter more is that the individuals might have a game or not they enjoy, but that ultimately their personal experience within the genre has been tempered by their sense of place within the game world, forums, etc, and they are seeing a lot of other things that effectively defies the reality they have constructed.
Some people seek to change that under the guise of "correcting misinformation".
Some people simply argue back and forth over topics.
Some people seem to skip logic entirely to attack others like a rabid dog.
Some use it as a platform to play coy games and nag at others passive aggressively.
Some seem to skim things until they find a single phrase or comment and then run with it even it makes no sense.
The list goes on.
Point here ultimately is that original comment, people polarize on things. Not all people polarize on a subject, but the more an individual gives in to any combination of anonymity, mob mentality, elitism, dunning-kruger, or otherwise, then the more likely they are going to seek the content that reaffirms their personal values while attacking anything that defies it, rather than using the forums to provide a reasonable and moderated discussion.
"The knowledge of the theory of logic has no tendency whatever to make men good reasoners." - Thomas B. Macaulay
"The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel J. Boorstin
I think alot of people come here looking for new information, not necessarily just to be negative....Often the negative stems from others being overly positive (ie fanbois) and there you have it.
Because few rotten apples are enough to make your basket smell and spoil the rest. Not being racist and not using vile language aren't the only rules to make men gentlemen. No culture is being enforced. Hence these sites become breeding grounds for people with negative behavior because they don't have many other options to vent their destructive opinions. Sites have become clickbaits under the disguise of freedom of speech. Not every junk can be validated as "opinion".
Gaming Rocks next gen. community for last gen. gamers launching soon.
Why are many gamers so desperate for validation that they are emotionally impacted by any negativity directed toward their game(s) or developer(s) of choice? Forums like this one don't exist to make gamers feel good about being a fan of this or that game. [mod edit]
Comments
If they were running a major game studio the industry would be perfect!
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
Beta tests and early access have become cash grabs due to the uncertainty in the market. "Let's build the hype. Now, let's make people pay to test our games." This counters the fear that companies may have whether a game might be a success or not.
I remember days when beta tests had people that enjoyed the game, and they spent their time testing, and providing meaningful feedback because they were some of the privileged few that were ALLOWED to help. By charging people to play in a testing phase, you have killed your most valuable commodity. While some buyers will still post meaningful feedback, many will shift to the "I paid for this, so I am not required to post any feedback." While it may be the more profitable path, I do not think that it is the most beneficial to the quality of the MMO.
A good example of a cash grab is what Daybreak Games has done to Everquest 2. Under SOE, EQ2 expansions typically had 2-3 large overland zones, any number of dungeons and raids, and other content as well. The pricing model was typically $34.99 for the normal version and $49.99 for the CE. Now that Daybreak has come in, the new expansion being shoved out the door only has ONE overland zone, which screams "limited content." Their pricing scheme is $34.99 for the normal version, $89.99 for the CE, and $139.99 for the "Premium Edition." It looks, to me, like they are trying to cash in on the good will of the player base and raise profitability numbers. This is fairly standard practice for an equity firm, so I am not criticizing their methods as businessmen, but it sucks for the gamers, and this is just one example of many in modern MMO's.
so basically you want to shut the op down
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
A part of the problem is people assuming that anyone with a different opinion is "bashing" or "attacking" etc.
Take SBFord's recent WoW feature - in which the OP posted extensively and in - just about - a minority of one. And when I pointed out some errors was accused of bashing - my response being to check my post history!
Yes there will be trolls but a difference of opinion is not bashing.
What has changed in the last few years is that forums are less busy. And that is fact not opinion. An example: the launch of Trials of Atlantis generated over 100 pages of new posts, about 40 new posts to a page, in the first day on a now deceased forum. ToA, for those unaware, had a very poor reception. Compare that to mmorpg.com or the EU WoW forums say - the latter getting about 1.5 new pages a day, maybe 50 new threads. (Yes EU WoW is that quiet). And when a forum is so quiet you cannot extrapolate the postings of a few and say everyone is being "quote" negative "unquote".
I agree with you though. Nice to see more people in touch with the realities of game development.
All I can say here now is, "Welcome to my house."
And yes, it is "my" house. :awesome:
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
WoW forums toxic
Destiny forums toxic
Lotro forums ...empty?
Had a some time this week and ran across this site...I think you have some cleaning to do in your house it's pretty toxic also.
But thanks for the welcome!
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
The players invested in the game or interested in the game are posting on the official forums or on the forums at fansites specifically for that game.
It's rare that someone with a question about the game will post here, because there are far better channels for that information (official sites, YT, wikis). Likewise, the player that looks to answer questions like that would more than likely not be here.
Also, gamers attach to games the same way they attach to bands or sports teams. The same type of rivalry exists. If you had a hard rock site with Poison, Nickleback, Judas Priest, and Slayer forums how do you think that would pan out? Yankees and Mets forums on the same site? Rangers and Islanders?
It's the nature of a general gathering within a multi-faceted special interest group.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Like you are breaching someone's stronghold. It shouldn't be that way, but some people don't like reading what you have to say. Specially if your view doesn't agree with theirs. Then again, some people constantly go in said forums and tell them everyday how their game sucks. Who is at fault for the hostility or negativity? Not sure, so the best you can do is keep it as civil as possible even when someone picks a forum fight.
"If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor
I recon someone with a positive attitude is a lot less likely to participate in an online / forum argument, so the arguments float to the surface and it seems like It's all negative because the positives aren't being shared.
When it came time to create a special Bandit Dagger, I had a 2-7 dagger that was plain in appearance and no bonuses, and a 1-6 dagger that had spells and damage type (fire) that I liked, so...
I would regularly visit AC Lore at the time so stopped by their forums to ask if there would be much of a difference if I went with the 1-6 dagger instead of the 2-7 dagger, hoping they'd have stats or info that would explain what kind of difference I'd be looking at.
HOLY CRAP.
"Are you really asking which is more, 6 or 7?"
"Obv 2-7 is better. How stupid are you?"
"If the people in game told you the 1-6 is useless, why the f*** are you here looking for a different answer?"
"Where do these newbs come from, and why do we let them post here?"
Of the dozen or two replies, no one actually had an answer for me, but each one had plenty of toxic crap to spew about me coming there to ask it.
Looking the forums over after that, I saw that was pretty much the general response thrown at outsiders to the group, especially those that dared to question what has already been accepted as canon.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
This leaves the forums as a place that people who are no longer actively playing in game can come and rant. It is basically a platform for those that can not project their opinion in game (or to the players in game). This makes it very niche, and extremely minority based. The forum is where people can express opinions that are not actually relevant.
Even if a comment is made in a rather mediated manner, there is the preference for opinions to come first. If a commentary runs contrary to a person's opinion or desired perspective, then rather than offer a sane discussion, it rapidly because an assault on the person in one form or another rather than whatever the topic was even about.
The "whales" thread certainly has an example of that.
When a line of commentary is posted and instead of addressing the content other users become unhappy with the fact that the content runs contrary to their opinions in some finite perspective and instead start a spiraling tirade about an individual rather than any real mention of the subject that was even posted by them.
Things that mmoguy and sovrath mentioned play a heavy role in this.
It's a quirky behavior yet remarkably characteristic. In a good part the fact that supposedly "disenfranchised" gamers ultimately collect on the more general forums, and then you have people who are dedicated to a given title collecting within those respective forums.
It's honestly a bit like mob mentality, but as applicable to individuals because of the effects of being online and consequently "free" of direct retribution. It seems to give an almighty sensation to some, and this issue scales as they gain some sense of prevalence or authority within a given forum.
When homogeneity of thoughts an opinions or mild deviance is the only real issue, nothing seems particularly bad. This breaks down though as more and more distinctive opinions come forth.
And that is where a forum like this sits. To call all the people here "disenfranchised" would be a rather inaccurate blanket statement, but the extended implications of it bears merit. The source of the matter more is that the individuals might have a game or not they enjoy, but that ultimately their personal experience within the genre has been tempered by their sense of place within the game world, forums, etc, and they are seeing a lot of other things that effectively defies the reality they have constructed.
Some people seek to change that under the guise of "correcting misinformation".
Some people simply argue back and forth over topics.
Some people seem to skip logic entirely to attack others like a rabid dog.
Some use it as a platform to play coy games and nag at others passive aggressively.
Some seem to skim things until they find a single phrase or comment and then run with it even it makes no sense.
The list goes on.
Point here ultimately is that original comment, people polarize on things. Not all people polarize on a subject, but the more an individual gives in to any combination of anonymity, mob mentality, elitism, dunning-kruger, or otherwise, then the more likely they are going to seek the content that reaffirms their personal values while attacking anything that defies it, rather than using the forums to provide a reasonable and moderated discussion.
"The knowledge of the theory of logic has no tendency whatever to make men good reasoners." - Thomas B. Macaulay
"The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel J. Boorstin
Not being racist and not using vile language aren't the only rules to make men gentlemen.
No culture is being enforced. Hence these sites become breeding grounds for people with negative behavior because they don't have many other options to vent their destructive opinions.
Sites have become clickbaits under the disguise of freedom of speech. Not every junk can be validated as "opinion".