What would WoW be today if WC never was..?

DuraheLL · March 2006

I'm not saying this to bat down the game, whatever you say about WoW people always seem to get the opinion of that you are trying to slay it. I hope you are mature enough to realize this.

This is the first time a MMORPG was born out of a RTS game, when people play WoW for the first time (if they enjoyed WC3) their feeling will be COMPLETELY different from someone playing a MMORPG which is made in a world of it's own.

Those who already loved the world of WarCraft are surely people who will play on for a long time.

But let's face it, if we look at WoW from a completely natural perspective where WC3 and so never existed, we can obviously say it isn't the game with nearly as much free-choise and content which other MMORPG's might have.

Without WC3, WoW at birth would not get nearly as much Hype as it would have had, people would think "Hmm might be cool ... looks like something I might want to play". The hype which started and never ended would have shorten out it's huge success.

With a hype like it had and still has, no wonder so many play it. Everywhere you turn there's WoW, people who were not interested at first and said "What's with all the hype?", truly just gave up for all the hyping and just had to test it because to figure out what all this hype was about.

Then many who maby not liked it that much still play it because such a large majority play it and of course it's always funnier to play a MMORPG with real friends rather than playing it alone. Many might have even left their beloved MMORPG's just to play WoW with their other friends who plays it.

I don't have a problem with WoW, truly, I have my own games, I play them and enjoy them and when I do I only think about them, I just like to ponder about WoW and upon it's success.

But the thing I do have a problem with is it's people, since the large part which has it as it's first MMORPG doesn't really get the whole idea of how you shall act and behave in such a world. Also too many of them seem to put cotton into their ears and completely block everything else that has nothing to do with WoW, like never even trying some other MMORPG. All too many forge opinions with too little backup since they truly haven't tested the other games. It's all "WoW is the best game ever" and so on.

Yup, no wonder people discuss it so much, it's in our humanity, when something gets big humans will always critizise it. No matter if it's good or bad. We all feel like we are part of it.

Shayde · March 2006

I never so much as looked at any Warcraft game.

I don't like any fantasy MMORPG.

I really like WoW.

Take that for what you will.

Volkmar · March 2006

i think this kinda of dicussion is not entirely proper.

What WoW would be without Warcraft? it probably would not exists, because Blizzard would not be the software giant they are today and so not have the resources to pull WoW off (5 years of development are a reaaaaally big investment for any upstart company).

For sake of the argument let's consider that Blizzard would still make the game without all the previous baggage. Would the game still be enjoyable, casual friendly and well programmed? of course.

Would it have as many subscribers as it has now? Probably not as many as all the Warcraft lore would be new stuff and not taking from history of games, but i don't really think just that would transform a giant mega-hit in a secondary game.

WoW can stand on its own legs, in my opinion, and no amount of Hype will have people play the game for more than couple weeks, after that, you play it because you like it.

After all, we have plenty of examples of games taking from great names of the past in either game industry (Everquest 2, Asheron's call 2, Ultima online that had like 9 of the most popular CRPGs of all time behind them, The Sims Online backed by the best selling pc games of all time), or outside the game industry (SWG, Matrix Online, upcoming Stargate MMo, star trek online etc).

Still none of them managed the to have the incredible succes of WoW, not even near it. On the other hand, sleeper games like Lineage, albeit in their own local market, taking from nothing at all but their own world went and became the Biggest thing to happen in South Korea...

What this tell us? You can be Steven Spielberg or Sid Meyer himself but if your game is not worth 5 cents out of my pocket, is still not worth 5 cent out of my pocket, no matter if it is called "indiana Jones Online" or "Adventurous Archeologists MMO". That scam might work with a single player game, but with a MMO.... not really.

Have a nice day

SBOBraveloco · March 2006

Originally posted by Volkmar
i think this kinda of dicussion is not entirely proper.
What WoW would be without Warcraft? it probably would not exists, because Blizzard would not be the software giant they are today and so not have the resources to pull WoW off (5 years of development are a reaaaaally big investment for any upstart company).

I know, right! I love the way some people come up with things to complain about when the "logic train" comes to a dead end.

It's like saying lets have SWG without ever having SW movies or books to back up and give a preface to the universe the MMORPG is offering. What will LOTR:O be like if no one ever read the novels or watched the movies? The preconvived notions that come with prior content make a world of difference. Without that kind of hype or link for the player...what's the point?

As the previous post states...5 years of dev time. They wouldn't do that unless they KNOW the fan base is there. Another example...the single player platform Starcraft Game. How long is Blizzard going to tease us with that...but thats another rant all together. But it will be worth the wait cause the fans love the world it's set in and can't wait to be a part of it.

DuraheLL · March 2006

Originally posted by Volkmar
What WoW would be without Warcraft? it probably would not exists, because Blizzard would not be the software giant they are today and so not have the resources to pull WoW off (5 years of development are a reaaaaally big investment for any upstart company).
Now, saying something like "It would not exist" I only find ok if it's a joke, other than that... short thought, since the scenario I wanted to picture was WoW being the first piece released in the WarCraft serie.
Interesting, without their reputation much of the hype would also disappear, true that.
For sake of the argument let's consider that Blizzard would still make the game without all the previous baggage. Would the game still be enjoyable, casual friendly and well programmed? of course.
... the game would be the same yes, that's the whole point in my image in the first place. Now, do you think people would talk about it as much as they did?
Would it have as many subscribers as it has now? Probably not as many as all the Warcraft lore would be new stuff and not taking from history of games, but i don't really think just that would transform a giant mega-hit in a secondary game.
Not necessairly, the WoW lore could be just as well written. Of course you would not have seen it as deep as you did when you played WC but still.
WoW can stand on its own legs, in my opinion, and no amount of Hype will have people play the game for more than couple weeks, after that, you play it because you like it.
... or think that you like it, as die-hard WC fans.
After all, we have plenty of examples of games taking from great names of the past in either game industry (Everquest 2, Asheron's call 2, Ultima online that had like 9 of the most popular CRPGs of all time behind them, The Sims Online backed by the best selling pc games of all time), or outside the game industry (SWG, Matrix Online, upcoming Stargate MMo, star trek online etc).
Yea yea yea, but none can really measure against the enormous jump from a RTS into a MMORPG.
What this tell us? You can be Steven Spielberg or Sid Meyer himself but if your game is not worth 5 cents out of my pocket, is still not worth 5 cent out of my pocket, no matter if it is called "indiana Jones Online" or "Adventurous Archeologists MMO". That scam might work with a single player game, but with a MMO.... not really.
Sorry I didn't understand anything of that
Have a nice day
Ty

DuraheLL · March 2006

Originally posted by SBOBraveloco

I know, right! I love the way some people come up with things to complain about when the "logic train" comes to a dead end.

I'd love to join a discussion with you ... when you understand the point of my post ... sorry, read again

Volkmar · March 2006

Originally posted by DuraheLL

Originally posted by Volkmar
Not necessairly, the WoW lore could be just as well written. Of course you would not have seen it as deep as you did when you played WC but still.
WoW can stand on its own legs, in my opinion, and no amount of Hype will have people play the game for more than couple weeks, after that, you play it because you like it.
... or think that you like it, as die-hard WC fans.
.. let's us not speculate here, shall we? i don't think WoW is a giant brainwashing experiment as many of the things you can say about it, can be said, almost as well, for any other MMorpg around.
After all, we have plenty of examples of games taking from great names of the past in either game industry (Everquest 2, Asheron's call 2, Ultima online that had like 9 of the most popular CRPGs of all time behind them, The Sims Online backed by the best selling pc games of all time), or outside the game industry (SWG, Matrix Online, upcoming Stargate MMo, star trek online etc).
Yea yea yea, but none can really measure against the enormous jump from a RTS into a MMORPG.
I don't see it as a "enormous" jump, considering the third chapter of the sagas introduced heros in a much more personalized and "RPG" way than before... it kinda paved the way for the MMorpg.
What this tell us? You can be Steven Spielberg or Sid Meyer himself but if your game is not worth 5 cents out of my pocket, is still not worth 5 cent out of my pocket, no matter if it is called "indiana Jones Online" or "Adventurous Archeologists MMO". That scam might work with a single player game, but with a MMO.... not really.
Sorry I didn't understand anything of that
Well, there are plenty of single player games that manage to sell million of copies even if the game is downright bad (50 cent bulletproof) or merely average (Enter the matrix) as they capitalize on a intellectual property or on the fame of a certain developer or producer (you can be certain that Civ 5 will sell very well even if it is a piece of crap as it has the name "Sid Meyer" in front of it... note: i don't want to say Meyer's games are bad.. i enjoy them pretty much).
This works with single player games as once the customer has bought the copy (ie: has been scammed) that's it. you got his money and you can move on to the next thing. There is no continued payment save for possible expansions (and surprise surprise, such games rarely get one).
In a MMorpg such a tactic doesn't work. you CAN entice customers with a flashy IP or a big name, but the people will not continue to play your game if they think it sucks, as simple as that.
Have a nice day
Ty

So in the end, My opinion is that, yes, WoW would have less subscribers, maybe drastically so, but it would still be a mainstream market game and would enjoy a certain amount of popularity.

Bama1267 · March 2006

I think the point is fairly moot to say the least. Without WC3 there would probably not even been a WOW. However if they had decided to do it just off of WC2 or what have you, maybe they do this good, maybe they dont.. They still had a real good following from SC and WC2 as well as D2 to give them enough advertising .

Also I think alot of people underestimate the game it self. There are still a ton of players....and Id venture to say even half the players playing that never played a Blizzard game. They play it on shear advertising and by word of mouth how good it is. I for one didnt even want to buy it. Im a big Blizz fan but as a mmorpg fan, I thought the graphics were too cartoony for my liking. So I got EQ2 on release and quit ater 1 month.

In short...I think it would have still succeeded by mmorpg standards. Its Blizzard and imo they dont do bad games and still havent. Im sure a few people would chew my head off for saying it. But that damn game is polished, it may not have everything soem people are lookign for but it appeals to a vast majority as alot fo there games have done in the past.

IcoGames · March 2006

Star Wars Galaxies had the backing of one of our generation's greatest stories, and yet failed. There was a ton of hype built around the game; I first noticed it from a CNN article. SWG had great concepts, but that's about it.

When I first read about WoW, I cringed at the thought of another 'orcs and elves' game. However, I got into beta and found that I really enjoyed WoW. Not because of it's lore, but for the game's fun factor, mechanics, and polished feel.

I never really liked the WC series; preferring StarCraft.

Would WoW have been successful without Blizzard's prior game? Maybe not at first, but I'd wager it would've in the long term. The game is simply fun.

Hype and a company's previous success will only carry a title so far. After 1.5 years, I think it's safe to say that WoW stands on it's own legs.

Mud_Monster · March 2006

I think Blizzard has enough hype from Diablo and Starcraft that, WoW would have still gotten alot of attention. Then again, would Dialbo/SC ever been made had WC never existed?

The lore for WoW wouldn't be the same. Perhaps it would be set in the Starcraft or Diablo universe. Regardless of lore/hype, I think WoW would still be popular due to its great interface and low learning curve. Whether you love or hate WoW, most would agree that its the most polished of any MMORPG. That alone would make it popular in my opinion.

RexNebular · March 2006

I hate RTS, never played Warcraft.

I love mmorpg and really like WOW.

It's a very good game and stands on its own.

r0hn · March 2006

If I'm not mistaken, WC3 and WoW were being developed at the same time. WoW development started way before the release of WC3. It wasn't long after WC2 that WoW development started and that's why I think WC2 actually had more influence over WoW.

croyal · March 2006

well, most of the people i know in-game have never even touched the WC seires previous to WoW.. i myself have just recently picked up WC3. i just had to get it after a guildie explained to me why the entrance into UC is just so damn cool.

verdantrex · March 2006

Here's my take... I think if there was never any Warcraft, there are two possibilities:

1) Blizzard still would have made Diablo, and in 2004 would have launched "Diablo Online" instead... and it would be very similar to WoW, except with a lot more dungeon crawling maybe. In that world of "Diablo Online", that game would probably have the same amount of success, impact, and complaints as WoW does. Of course, we'll never really know.

A "1a" here is that they may have made "Worlds of Starcraft" instead of WoW... which obviously would have been way different, may not have been as popular, etc. Or it may have been a huge hit...

2) Blizzard may have still made Diablo and Starcraft, but never really gotten into the MMO market.

In WHICH case, I think what we would have at this point in 2006 is that, in some form, "Warhammer Online" would probably have been developed and launched years ago, possibly for all we know, in synch with the schedule that WoW followed in "our world". I'd also say that if there was never a Warcraft, the Warhammer games (which as a license predate Warcraft by about 12+ years) would have done much better commercially. Maybe Warhammer and Warhammer 40K video games would be to that world/reality what Warcraft was to ours. Now, would this Warhammer Online game have been the original "dark" version which was scrapped, or more colorful like the current one... who knows. All I do think is that without Warcraft ever existing, Warhammer might be a HUGE video game empire today.

There are great things about Warcraft, but really... you have to admit that in many ways they kinda copied Warhammer. In fact... I didn't even realize for several years that they weren't the same franchise. I knew Warhammer games from back in the 80s, and when I first heard about Warcraft, I got confused, I think and thought the tabletop game was called Warcraft. Only years later did I realize Warcraft did not equal Warhammer. Given how much Warcraft "borrowed", visually, thematically, even the title... I don't think I was alone. But you know... that was Games Workshop/Warhammer's own problem I guess. They should have done a better job of spreading their license in video games with quality products, then there wouldn't have been an opportunity for Blizzard to do it. They *did* have that 12 year head start, after all.

V

Suitepee · March 2006

I dispise RTS,I dispised WC3 (it was comical though).

Yet I heard a lot about WOW being the 'next best MMORPG' while playing Risk Your Life. What a truely awful game that was,even before P2P. From this alone,and the fact on my other games people were saying 'WOW looks good'. And when I heard about the gamecards,I bought the game. For gamecards alone I tried WOW.

And I liked it. I think the appeal of having easy-to-access gamecards helped WOW a hell of a lot to be honest. And the WC background was just a bonus; it would have been easier for WC-people to be sceptical of this game. I think a better question would be;

What would WoW be today without WC,SC or Diablo?

Ranma13 · March 2006

Blizzard has a record of making very well-made, polished, and just simply irresistably fun games that runs well on old hardware. It is for this reason that World of Warcraft has soared to such heights of popularity, simply because of the fan-base. However, I have no doubt that if World of Warcraft was released as Blizzard's very first game, it would still gather a hefty audience. Just not as much as they would have with their previous games and prestigious name.

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