People who list bethesda games don't know what a rpg is.
Like others have posted I "disagree" with the not knowing part of this.
I assume that what you are suggesting is that bethseda games - specifically Elder Scrolls I assume - are "puzzle / adventure games" rather than "role playing games"?
If so I don't disagree with your view just your wider conclusion. I listed Morrowind as one of my rpgs but didn't list Kingquest 5 say - an absolute classic of a puzzle game but lacking in the character development department. Nor did I suggest Civ say - even though you do roleplay" an empire. I also listed Wizardry 6 which was a more pedantic puzzle game that Return to Zork say - although RtZ had a magic about it that tempted me to list it. And in thinking about a top 3 Sid Meir's Pirates ..... I decided that one is borderline.
In other words what is and what isn't an rpg - I suggest - is a judgement call. Most people will agree that game X is an rpg and game Y isn't. Not eveyone though. And then there will be games that might split people down the middle.
Hence don't disagree with you but - in my judgement call - Morrowind is an rpg. And I didn't put Daggerfall or Oblivion - some did. That's their judgement call regarding what is memorable. Same with Wizardry - I played 5 first but for me 6 was memorable, some put 5, others put 7. Different people, coming to games at different times maybe, different judgement calls for sure.
Now if you had a different reason for saying what you did I would be interested in knowing.
I remember the feeling I had when I finished Torment. It was hard to explain. A mixture of nostalgia, sadness and accomplishment. I think the sadness came from the fact I didn't want it to be ended. The nostalgia came as I remembered the story of the game like a dream long passed. I was deep enough into this game to actually feel like my character. Not many games gave me that feeling, not even Baldur's Gate.
Way too many to do a top 3 but I will try:
pool of radiance
Ultima IV
Pirates! (It may not be considered an RPG but it sure played like a strategic rpg)
Soooo many others though that aren't on the list like champions of krynn, KoTOR, BG, Bards Tales, etc. Wayyy too many for a hard and fast 3.
1. Star Wars : The Old Republic (I played older RPGs too but this story telling blew my mind)
2. Mass Effect 2 (my favorite game of all time, the story was great and at the time I hoped this would usher in top notch RPGs with top of the line graphics. Turned out to be the last great RPG for me.)
I never got the JRPG craze... for me it was C64 for life!
SSI, Origin and Sir-Tech were RPG Gods of their time.
this is very very close to my toplist ....
i only would exchange Wizardry 7 with Fallout 2
as an interesting sidenote .... deep in the pool of radiance code were lots of ( unfinished ) bits for more extra races ... a food system and ship travelling
Zelda - A Link to the Past (most memorable, first rpg as a kid, Snes) The Elder Scrolls - Oblivion (most immersive, first rpg as an adult, X360) Risen 1 (best atmosphere, favourite current rpg, PC)
I can understand the sentiment of Bard's Tale but I think the whole concept of why FF7 is always and continually highly ranked in RPG lore is simply the effect it had as a whole in genre: FF7 was pretty ground shattering as far as introducing the 3D concept in RPG's and did so without relying on a "niche" system like Destiny (great game looks but no story line). In that respect FF7 combined the elements of something new, great storyline and really dramatic moments.
The other part too is that without it, it kind of ends up being a strange case of how gamers are introduced to RPG and subsequently, mmorps in general. Many of the players that experiend mmo's for the first time can trace their first rpgs to something like FF7, 8 or 10 but FF7 is the one that begins introducing itself as a "streamline" game for the general audience and not something as someone whose into RPGs in general.
An easier analogy is what WoW did for MMORPG's; it didn't really do anything groundbreak but did everything before it extremely well and combined these elements to a public that included a huge portion of players that never played MMO's before and lead to the eventual Ultima & EQ crowd vs. WoW crowd. A lot of people here who've played Bard's Tale, Morrowind or a similar era title don't typically pick FF7 as "the greatest MMORPG's" but its really the "what it did for the industry and gamers in general" that makes its position warranted.
Comments
1: Persona 4: The Golden. My favorite game of all time. Anyone who hasn't played this, do so. Make it a priority.
2: Persona 3 FES. Another fantastic game, but not quite as good as Persona 4. Even so, this is my 2nd favorite RPG ever.
3: Final Fantasy Tactics. So many tactics style games have come after, but none have come close. Such a wonderful tale. RPG perfection.
I assume that what you are suggesting is that bethseda games - specifically Elder Scrolls I assume - are "puzzle / adventure games" rather than "role playing games"?
If so I don't disagree with your view just your wider conclusion. I listed Morrowind as one of my rpgs but didn't list Kingquest 5 say - an absolute classic of a puzzle game but lacking in the character development department. Nor did I suggest Civ say - even though you do roleplay" an empire. I also listed Wizardry 6 which was a more pedantic puzzle game that Return to Zork say - although RtZ had a magic about it that tempted me to list it. And in thinking about a top 3 Sid Meir's Pirates ..... I decided that one is borderline.
In other words what is and what isn't an rpg - I suggest - is a judgement call. Most people will agree that game X is an rpg and game Y isn't. Not eveyone though. And then there will be games that might split people down the middle.
Hence don't disagree with you but - in my judgement call - Morrowind is an rpg. And I didn't put Daggerfall or Oblivion - some did. That's their judgement call regarding what is memorable. Same with Wizardry - I played 5 first but for me 6 was memorable, some put 5, others put 7. Different people, coming to games at different times maybe, different judgement calls for sure.
Now if you had a different reason for saying what you did I would be interested in knowing.
pool of radiance
Ultima IV
Pirates! (It may not be considered an RPG but it sure played like a strategic rpg)
Soooo many others though that aren't on the list like champions of krynn, KoTOR, BG, Bards Tales, etc. Wayyy too many for a hard and fast 3.
"This is life! We suffer and slave and expire. That's it!" -Bernard Black (Dylan Moran)
1. Star Wars : The Old Republic (I played older RPGs too but this story telling blew my mind)
2. Mass Effect 2 (my favorite game of all time, the story was great and at the time I hoped this would usher in top notch RPGs with top of the line graphics. Turned out to be the last great RPG for me.)
3. Morrowind (simply amazing)
this is very very close to my toplist ....
i only would exchange Wizardry 7 with Fallout 2
as an interesting sidenote .... deep in the pool of radiance code were lots of ( unfinished ) bits for more extra races ... a food system and ship travelling
The Elder Scrolls - Oblivion (most immersive, first rpg as an adult, X360)
Risen 1 (best atmosphere, favourite current rpg, PC)
The other part too is that without it, it kind of ends up being a strange case of how gamers are introduced to RPG and subsequently, mmorps in general. Many of the players that experiend mmo's for the first time can trace their first rpgs to something like FF7, 8 or 10 but FF7 is the one that begins introducing itself as a "streamline" game for the general audience and not something as someone whose into RPGs in general.
An easier analogy is what WoW did for MMORPG's; it didn't really do anything groundbreak but did everything before it extremely well and combined these elements to a public that included a huge portion of players that never played MMO's before and lead to the eventual Ultima & EQ crowd vs. WoW crowd. A lot of people here who've played Bard's Tale, Morrowind or a similar era title don't typically pick FF7 as "the greatest MMORPG's" but its really the "what it did for the industry and gamers in general" that makes its position warranted.
2. FF7 (first time I put over a hundred hours into an rpg)
3. Diablo 2 (first rpg I played on a pc)
did you get dragon warrior with a Nintendo Power subscription? That's how I got mine.
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2. Morrowind
3. Baldur's Gate 2