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Jumping Combat
Volkmar
Member UncommonPosts: 2,501
Greetings.
I wanted to open a topic on combat, to discuss how it will be in WAR compared to other games.
You are surely aware that, at the moment, there are two types of combat in most MMorpgs: PvE and PvP.
PvE combat is a static affair. you run to the mob and whack it on its head until it drops dead. You can try to flee, but beside that, there ain't much room for "tactical maneuvering" as the mob will sticky to you no matter what.
PvP is a chaotic and unrealistic affair with this half a ton plate wearing warriors jumping around each other and running in circles making it seems more of a running competition than a combat.
What kind of combat do you envision WAR to have in PvP? the "who jumps the most wins" or something different?
Comments
Colission detection is needed for any PvP environment to be realistic...
This means you can't shoot arrows/bullets through trees, and they you can't run through other players. The means if there is a rouge standing in a threshold of a doorway and you try to walk through you'll hit and invisible wall... and probably get stabbed.
The prob is it eats bandwidth and unless you have a friendly fire option... if a couple of butholes stood in a doorway they could block it.
Planetside... did a good job with this... by having Friendly fire always on... but giving you the equalivent of dishonor for harming your allies that aren't grouped with you. So if some person lagged or is just trying to be a punk and block your way you can kill them without much penilty. However, if you go around purposely killing your allies... your dishoner will build up to the point you get weapons lock... and if you keep it up after that (running over people) a 1 day banning.
That said I doubt Warhammer will have colission detection... because of the bandwidth, and no easily accepted way to deal with blockers... and you can still have very good PvP without it... it's just not as realistic and silly tactics evolve like jousting... stuff that really doesn't much much on the battle field so much as duels.
well you could just have it set up that when you are in cities etc that collision detection is off unless the city is under attack by a certain number of the opposite faction, gods and heroes is using collision detection, but im not sure to what extent, i do know that characters occupy space and can block other characters, but im not sure exactly how the system is going to work
oh and count on mythic having something like this, and the benefits to having the high ground for ranged combat at least, since that is the way it works in daoc and i doubt mythic will change to much from a very popular system of pvp
would be nice to have something like this and it is exactly where i wanted to go with this post. a good half way between complete static fighting and jumping rabbits style.
Positional styles have been used in DAoC, reactionary ones in other games as well. the problem with positional styles is that they are pretty useless in solo combat and come to play a role only in group fighting. So having a certain ability that you can use practically only when fighting in a group can be seen as limiting (unless you can somehow stealth and take the enemy by surprise), but still an option to consider.
Collision detection is a nice idea and the only way to have real tactical combat. Without it, as it is not in maaaany other games, "cloth" casters, be them healers or damage dealer get targetted immediatly and killed as fast as possible without a chance for the melee fighters to do much about it.
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
Dungeons and Dragons Online has a very neat combat system. It's based on the PnP of course, but it contains some very good features which makes me love it, alas the game is plagued by bugs in countless other areas, but the combat is truly awesome (It's a purely PVE game though).
1. Real time.
You don't click a button and wait for your character to swing (The option is there), you swing yourself by a mouseclick. You have to block, dodge and move around "yourself".
2. Collision detection.
You can't run through other creatures inside "instances", just in the quest-hub (anything else would be a pain in crowded taverns).
I can't say how many times I've been frustrated with my halfling rogue (who tumbles a lot to avoid getting hit!) when I've been cornered by 3 kobolds with absolutely no ability to get away from their merciless onslaught.
3. Positioning bonuses
I am not sure if you get bonuses for high ground and terrain in DDO, but you do get bonuses to attack rolls if you attack the enemy from behind or flank him.
I'd love to see a system like this for War, as it really is the most tactical and immersive combat system I've seen in a mmorpg.
man your post got me hyped up about this game which i know nothing about hte board game but i want to play this game, i always wanted a freakin realtime fighting i really can't stand all this no skill roll of the dice type combat system. if they do this i would play.. anyways i have a questin for all of you i might post this on the general board...
the koreans and the japanese and europe have cheap ultra fast dsl 22mbps right? so... if badwidth is not an issue for they why dotn the freakin koreans make mmorpgs with real time fighting!!!! they seem to just keep playing the same old stupid roll the dice fighting! with no skill at all! exception of webzen tho with huxley.. let me hear your thoughts