He is in denial. It happens. We already had an entire week here posting links and showing how much he lied and never went back to apologize or correct himself - yet we still have people here clicking that button over and over again... How sad.
As shown above, you need little to no time searching on google (nowadays) to find proof of that.
The first wave of "it was the hype" was made by people either defending the game or just echoing that too lazy to research. That affected even famous reviewers.
I listened to Co Optional Podcast (TotalBiscuit, Jesse Cox, Dodger) where, on launch, TB said it was a illusion thing... One week later on the same podcast he apologized and correct himself - because you could find (again, as shown above) that Sean in fact lied and said there was multiplayer. One of the main videos out there with all the story during development is his video. Also Jim Sterling's Jimquisition covered that up too - So did NMS's Angry Review of Angry Joe.
I dont think I am getting thru
YES I believe and understand 10000000% that MP was a game feature that was advertised to the people prior to the games release. I know that and I believe it, i see it, I get it.
However, at the point of purchase
I do not believe people believed MP was actively in the game. meaning August 9, 2016 no date before that counts to my point
now please give it a rest already.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
I agree on your general statement however on the specifics of multiplayer and NMS I do not.
One news story long ago said there would be PVP in the game Sean said on TV that to see yourself another person would have to be looking at you Sean said in several interviews that people could interact together
When denying multiplayer, Sean NEVER said multiplayer was not in the game. He said "people looking for the multiplayer EXPERIENCE" would not find it. Many people took that to mean because the universe was so big, that much of the time you would be alone but that there was some form of multiplayer in the game.
For you to insinuate that no one should have expected multiplayer in some form after the number of times Sean specifically mentioned it on TV and in interviews is just silly.
at the point of purcahse when the transaction took place, I do not believe there are people who believed that there was multiplayer in the game at that time.
How can you say that? Just because you dug though enough information and made a decision to NOT think multiplayer was in the game has absolutely no bearing on what other people believed.
"Will you be able to play with your friends?" Seans answer = "yeah" 1:12 into the video below https://youtu.be/cJ-tgaE37UE
"Can you grief other players?" Seans answer = "a little bit" (1:40 into the video above)
Sean's words on Colbert show: "The only way for you to know what you look like is for someone else to see you" (1:49 into the video above)
Colbert asks Sean specifically "Can you run into other players in the game?" Seans answer = "yes" (1:54 into the video above)
How in the world you can say that you do NOT believe, there were people who thought that there was some form of multiplayer in that game at the time of purchase is nonsense.
nope...doesnt work for me
sorry but Sean saying MP will be in the game is not remotely close to evidence that at the point of purchase people thought there was MP in the game.
I dont believe you or anyone else thinks that there are people who when they bought the game thought that MP was in game and nothing you can say related to what Sean said before the date and hour of the games release will change that. nothing. peroid.
'at the point of purchase' is extreemly important in this point
OMG, Thank you for giving me a great quote for my signature
"Sean (Murray) saying MP will be in the game is not remotely close to evidence that at the point of purchase people thought there was MP in the game." - SEANMCAD
I agree on your general statement however on the specifics of multiplayer and NMS I do not.
One news story long ago said there would be PVP in the game Sean said on TV that to see yourself another person would have to be looking at you Sean said in several interviews that people could interact together
When denying multiplayer, Sean NEVER said multiplayer was not in the game. He said "people looking for the multiplayer EXPERIENCE" would not find it. Many people took that to mean because the universe was so big, that much of the time you would be alone but that there was some form of multiplayer in the game.
For you to insinuate that no one should have expected multiplayer in some form after the number of times Sean specifically mentioned it on TV and in interviews is just silly.
at the point of purcahse when the transaction took place, I do not believe there are people who believed that there was multiplayer in the game at that time.
How can you say that? Just because you dug though enough information and made a decision to NOT think multiplayer was in the game has absolutely no bearing on what other people believed.
"Will you be able to play with your friends?" Seans answer = "yeah" 1:12 into the video below https://youtu.be/cJ-tgaE37UE
"Can you grief other players?" Seans answer = "a little bit" (1:40 into the video above)
Sean's words on Colbert show: "The only way for you to know what you look like is for someone else to see you" (1:49 into the video above)
Colbert asks Sean specifically "Can you run into other players in the game?" Seans answer = "yes" (1:54 into the video above)
How in the world you can say that you do NOT believe, there were people who thought that there was some form of multiplayer in that game at the time of purchase is nonsense.
nope...doesnt work for me
sorry but Sean saying MP will be in the game is not remotely close to evidence that at the point of purchase people thought there was MP in the game.
I dont believe you or anyone else thinks that there are people who when they bought the game thought that MP was in game and nothing you can say related to what Sean said before the date and hour of the games release will change that. nothing. peroid.
'at the point of purchase' is extreemly important in this point
OMG, Thank you for giving me a great quote for my signature
your welcome.
the reason for my point is that the community acts as if they were literally sold, and money was trasacted with the contractual agreement that MP was in the game at the point of purchase. This is being just as dishonest as Hello games.
not making the distinction between saying something is GOING to be in a game before money is committed and what is understood to actually be in the game at the point of transfer of money is being just as trollish as Hello was
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
He is in denial. It happens. We already had an entire week here posting links and showing how much he lied and never went back to apologize or correct himself - yet we still have people here clicking that button over and over again... How sad.
As shown above, you need little to no time searching on google (nowadays) to find proof of that.
The first wave of "it was the hype" was made by people either defending the game or just echoing that too lazy to research. That affected even famous reviewers.
I listened to Co Optional Podcast (TotalBiscuit, Jesse Cox, Dodger) where, on launch, TB said it was a illusion thing... One week later on the same podcast he apologized and correct himself - because you could find (again, as shown above) that Sean in fact lied and said there was multiplayer. One of the main videos out there with all the story during development is his video. Also Jim Sterling's Jimquisition covered that up too - So did NMS's Angry Review of Angry Joe.
I dont think I am getting thru
YES I believe and understand 10000000% that MP was a game feature that was advertised to the people prior to the games release. I know that and I believe it, i see it, I get it.
However, at the point of purchase
I do not believe people believed MP was actively in the game. meaning August 9, 2016 no date before that counts to my point
now please give it a rest already.
Just for craps and giggles, if we have all this evidence that multiplayer was part of the game, what do you believe changed between the time that Sean said all these things and the day the game was released?
Do you honestly believe that whatever it was, no one else on the planet could have possibly missed it?
"Sean (Murray) saying MP will be in the game is not remotely close to evidence that at the point of purchase people thought there was MP in the game." - SEANMCAD
He is in denial. It happens. We already had an entire week here posting links and showing how much he lied and never went back to apologize or correct himself - yet we still have people here clicking that button over and over again... How sad.
As shown above, you need little to no time searching on google (nowadays) to find proof of that.
The first wave of "it was the hype" was made by people either defending the game or just echoing that too lazy to research. That affected even famous reviewers.
I listened to Co Optional Podcast (TotalBiscuit, Jesse Cox, Dodger) where, on launch, TB said it was a illusion thing... One week later on the same podcast he apologized and correct himself - because you could find (again, as shown above) that Sean in fact lied and said there was multiplayer. One of the main videos out there with all the story during development is his video. Also Jim Sterling's Jimquisition covered that up too - So did NMS's Angry Review of Angry Joe.
I dont think I am getting thru
YES I believe and understand 10000000% that MP was a game feature that was advertised to the people prior to the games release. I know that and I believe it, i see it, I get it.
However, at the point of purchase
I do not believe people believed MP was actively in the game. meaning August 9, 2016 no date before that counts to my point
now please give it a rest already.
Just for craps and giggles, if we have all this evidence that multiplayer was part of the game, what do you believe changed between the time that Sean said all these things and the day the game was released?
Do you honestly believe that whatever it was, no one else on the planet could have possibly missed it?
I will say again
I believe on the date of August 9, 2016 and greater that the vast majority if not all people who bought the game (as in paied for it) knew very well that there was not MP in the game at the time they spent the money.
thus is hard to say you were scammed if you didnt buy it in the first place because you knew full fucking well at that time it didnt have MP in it.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
in fact i will take it a step further. I think people who bought NMS then proceed to state on forums and in legal avenues that they where scammed because they thought NMS had muliplayer in it when they bought it that those specific people and not other people who do not fit that parameter are flat out unadulterated lying. simple as that.
you can feel free to disagree with me but I doubt very seriously you will change my view on what happend during that time. I also might be wrong, but this is how I see it.
now I will say the pre-sell hype was a scam.yes but its bordline to really take it farther than that.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
He is in denial. It happens. We already had an entire week here posting links and showing how much he lied and never went back to apologize or correct himself - yet we still have people here clicking that button over and over again... How sad.
As shown above, you need little to no time searching on google (nowadays) to find proof of that.
The first wave of "it was the hype" was made by people either defending the game or just echoing that too lazy to research. That affected even famous reviewers.
I listened to Co Optional Podcast (TotalBiscuit, Jesse Cox, Dodger) where, on launch, TB said it was a illusion thing... One week later on the same podcast he apologized and correct himself - because you could find (again, as shown above) that Sean in fact lied and said there was multiplayer. One of the main videos out there with all the story during development is his video. Also Jim Sterling's Jimquisition covered that up too - So did NMS's Angry Review of Angry Joe.
I dont think I am getting thru
YES I believe and understand 10000000% that MP was a game feature that was advertised to the people prior to the games release. I know that and I believe it, i see it, I get it.
However, at the point of purchase
I do not believe people believed MP was actively in the game. meaning August 9, 2016 no date before that counts to my point
now please give it a rest already.
Just for craps and giggles, if we have all this evidence that multiplayer was part of the game, what do you believe changed between the time that Sean said all these things and the day the game was released?
Do you honestly believe that whatever it was, no one else on the planet could have possibly missed it?
I will say again
I believe on the date of August 9, 2016 and greater that the vast majority if not all people who bought the game (as in paied for it) knew very well that there was not MP in the game at the time they spent the money.
You continue to tell us WHAT you believe but you offer no evidence as to WHY you believe it
"Sean (Murray) saying MP will be in the game is not remotely close to evidence that at the point of purchase people thought there was MP in the game." - SEANMCAD
The only mistake NMS made was selling it at such a high cost. Price plays a factor, and I didn't buy it due to the costs associated with it, though I was able to play my friends game, and it led me to make the decision that yes, I will buy NMS... when it's like.. 15 bucks on sale.
Hard to tell. Other than it actually being hacked and tweeted for the lulz the tweet doesn't really mean anything. On the other hand, Hello Games staging this and getting the obvious attention from it is free advertising. It's a win either way for HG so if people did hack and attempt detriment the jokes on them.
in fact i will take it a step further. I think people who bought NMS then proceed to state on forums and in legal avenues that they where scammed because they thought NMS had muliplayer in it when they bought it that those specific people and not other people who do not fit that parameter are flat out unadulterated lying. simple as that.
you can feel free to disagree with me but I doubt very seriously you will change my view on what happend during that time. I also might be wrong, but this is how I see it.
now I will say the pre-sell hype was a scam.yes but its bordline to really take it farther than that.
So if I saw an interview with him and preordered it. . making that the time of purchase. . since I paid then and then didn't follow the game until release. . There is no way I could expect it to be multi-player?
[mod edit] if the developer tells you in countless ocasions there will be mp, there will be mp and so on, u expect the damn thing to have mp when u buy it
Yep, I expected multiplayer. I didn't pre-order, waited several weeks to determine if I would eventually purchase it (which I didn't), and was pretty surprised that something Sean Murray had been talking about as much as he had, as it came up several times in interviews (I found at least 4), was completely missing from the end product.
The only reason I'm not sour about it is because I have the wherewithal to recognize that pre-ordering isn't as beneficial to consumers as it is to producers.
Post edited by Lawlmonster on
"This is life! We suffer and slave and expire. That's it!" -Bernard Black (Dylan Moran)
I'm very adverse to have to get @SEANMCAD back, although I do find his posts awesome at times, I'll break it down for you guys:
"Point of Purchase" or "POP" in retail terms basically means the area, physical or online, where you put your money down.
He is saying that from hard launch and after of NMS nowhere in either the physical POP or online POP did it state multiplayer enabled.That is true.
He is ignoring preorders obviously. That is all he is saying.
Not much I know.
EDIT: Actually I totally missed his whole point, I think.
I think what he is arguing is that no where ever on any POP did it state Multiplayer enabled. The only time MP was uttered was from The Bearded Hipster One's mouth. So his stance is that if it wasn't listed as a component of the game in writing on POP then you should have no expectations of it, even if the Lead Dev stated it could happen.
Post edited by bartoni33 on
Bartoni's Law definition: As an Internet discussion grows volatile, the probability of a comparison involving Donald Trump approaches 1.
I believed multiplayer was in the game at point of purchase.
Then you obviously don't exist @SEANMCAD told us so!
Indeed.
But both of you are mistaken in what @SEANMCAD is saying.
Technically he is correct. Look at my edit 3 posts up.
Aah the reasonable man test. In this case arguing that a reasonable man arrives at the point of purchase armed with no further knowledge than that which is written on the hypothetical box. Might work in a court of law. But do we really believe that everyone arrived at the point of purchase never having heard the hype that it was a multiplayer game?
NMS was a heavily preordered game, how much of that was due to the 'advertising' well, all of it maybe? People do buy games on the basis of hype and dev interviews, and they really shouldn't, NMS is a cautionary tale. Be sensible, don't preorder a game because of something one of the devs says in interviews, because it cannot be relied upon, in fact, don't preorder a game for any reason, its a gamble. Perhaps we should really be thanking Sean Murray for highlighting this.
I believed multiplayer was in the game at point of purchase.
Same. And I didn't refund immediately because Hello Games reported server instability which made me believe that multiplayer was coming at some point. Then when I tried to refund later, Sony told me that I unlocked too many achievements (walking around) to get a refund. They wouldn't state how many hours I played, but it was less than 5.
I'm very adverse to have to get @SEANMCAD back, although I do find his posts awesome at times, I'll break it down for you guys:
"Point of Purchase" or "POP" in retail terms basically means the area, physical or online, where you put your money down.
He is saying that from hard launch and after of NMS nowhere in either the physical POP or online POP did it state multiplayer enabled.That is true.
He is ignoring preorders obviously. That is all he is saying.
Not much I know.
EDIT: Actually I totally missed his whole point, I think.
I think what he is arguing is that no where ever on any POP did it state Multiplayer enabled. The only time MP was uttered was from The Bearded Hipster One's mouth. So his stance is that if it wasn't listed as a component of the game in writing on POP then you should have no expectations of it, even if the Lead Dev stated it could happen.
I strongly disagree.
I may not be a lawyer, but I have studied this type of thing in depth; I have a MBA in International Business.
For what it's worth: as a company officer, you can't go on national television and strongly imply that your product will have X feature, then expect to get away scott-free because at the point of purchase it didn't indicate anywhere in writing that your product would have that feature. At best, this is underhanded and dishonest. It may even be illegal marketing.
Let me explain: as you bring up Point of Purchase I'm assuming you know that a retail purchase constitutes a contract. It's reasonable to assume that someone purchasing No Man's Sky would have seen at least one of the interviews where the Managing Director of Hello Games stated that 'other players could see you' and 'you can grief other players a little bit'.
Now, this is where it gets a bit complex; stating something doesn't mean that it has to be set in stone, and I think that's why some fans (or even bystanders) feel aggrieved that NMS is taking so much flak. The problem is that Hello Games did nothing to publicly correct these assertions by their lead developer. Sure, he might have stated 'don't expect a multiplayer experience', but he also tweeted this the day before launch:
"Pretty much zero" is not the same thing as "zero", which two players found out on launch day when they stood in the same spot and could not see each other.
So... you have a contract which was set up by Sean making repeated public statements to the effect of 'oh, you could potentially run into other players but our world is so large it will probably never happen' up until the day before launch... which turned out to be complete bogus.
Sorry... but Hello Games doesn't get a free pass on this from me. The game may be beautiful, their advertising was not. It's laughable to imply that players should feel foolish for feeling misled. I can easily see how some people might feel that way.
Post edited by Phaserlight on
"The simple is the seal of the true and beauty is the splendor of truth" -Subrahmanyan Chandrasekhar Authored 139 missions in VendettaOnline and 6 tracks in Distance
I'm very adverse to have to get @SEANMCAD back, although I do find his posts awesome at times, I'll break it down for you guys:
"Point of Purchase" or "POP" in retail terms basically means the area, physical or online, where you put your money down.
He is saying that from hard launch and after of NMS nowhere in either the physical POP or online POP did it state multiplayer enabled.That is true.
He is ignoring preorders obviously. That is all he is saying.
Not much I know.
EDIT: Actually I totally missed his whole point, I think.
I think what he is arguing is that no where ever on any POP did it state Multiplayer enabled. The only time MP was uttered was from The Bearded Hipster One's mouth. So his stance is that if it wasn't listed as a component of the game in writing on POP then you should have no expectations of it, even if the Lead Dev stated it could happen.
NOPE! Here is what he said:
"at the point of purcahse when the transaction
took place, I do not believe there are people who believed that there
was multiplayer in the game at that time. "
He said nothing about looking at POP or at the "hard launch". He said "when the transaction took place" which the majority of transactions took place well before the launch of the game via preorder.
Lets assume you are correct though. What if I watched the Colbert show and saw Sean speak of multiplayer and then decided to buy the game. I wait until launch day and then go down to my local gamestop and buy it. Could I possible still believe that the game had some form of multiplayer? ABSOLUTELY!
Most stores dont have big sellers on the shelf, you ask for it at the counter and they grab it for you. The majority of people dont look at the box, they go in knowing what they want and what they expect from the game based on advertising and reviews. Almost ALL advertising at the very least hinted at some form of multiplayer so why in the world, would anyone state that no one could possibly believe multiplayer was in the game at purchase?
"Sean (Murray) saying MP will be in the game is not remotely close to evidence that at the point of purchase people thought there was MP in the game." - SEANMCAD
Comments
YES I believe and understand 10000000% that MP was a game feature that was advertised to the people prior to the games release. I know that and I believe it, i see it, I get it.
However,
at
the
point
of
purchase
I do not believe people believed MP was actively in the game. meaning August 9, 2016 no date before that counts to my point
now please give it a rest already.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
the reason for my point is that the community acts as if they were literally sold, and money was trasacted with the contractual agreement that MP was in the game at the point of purchase. This is being just as dishonest as Hello games.
not making the distinction between saying something is GOING to be in a game before money is committed and what is understood to actually be in the game at the point of transfer of money is being just as trollish as Hello was
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Do you honestly believe that whatever it was, no one else on the planet could have possibly missed it?
I believe on the date of August 9, 2016 and greater that the vast majority if not all people who bought the game (as in paied for it) knew very well that there was not MP in the game at the time they spent the money.
thus is hard to say you were scammed if you didnt buy it in the first place because you knew full fucking well at that time it didnt have MP in it.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
you can feel free to disagree with me but I doubt very seriously you will change my view on what happend during that time. I also might be wrong, but this is how I see it.
now I will say the pre-sell hype was a scam.yes but its bordline to really take it farther than that.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
So, did ESO have a successful launch? Yes, yes it did.By Ryan Getchell on April 02, 2014.
**On the radar: http://www.cyberpunk.net/ **
Here 5:44 in -
Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!
The only reason I'm not sour about it is because I have the wherewithal to recognize that pre-ordering isn't as beneficial to consumers as it is to producers.
"This is life! We suffer and slave and expire. That's it!" -Bernard Black (Dylan Moran)
I'm very adverse to have to get @SEANMCAD back, although I do find his posts awesome at times, I'll break it down for you guys:
"Point of Purchase" or "POP" in retail terms basically means the area, physical or online, where you put your money down.
He is saying that from hard launch and after of NMS nowhere in either the physical POP or online POP did it state multiplayer enabled.That is true.
He is ignoring preorders obviously. That is all he is saying.
Not much I know.
EDIT: Actually I totally missed his whole point, I think.
I think what he is arguing is that no where ever on any POP did it state Multiplayer enabled. The only time MP was uttered was from The Bearded Hipster One's mouth. So his stance is that if it wasn't listed as a component of the game in writing on POP then you should have no expectations of it, even if the Lead Dev stated it could happen.
Bartoni's Law definition: As an Internet discussion grows volatile, the probability of a comparison involving Donald Trump approaches 1.
But both of you are mistaken in what @SEANMCAD is saying.
Technically he is correct. Look at my edit 3 posts up.
Bartoni's Law definition: As an Internet discussion grows volatile, the probability of a comparison involving Donald Trump approaches 1.
People do buy games on the basis of hype and dev interviews, and they really shouldn't, NMS is a cautionary tale.
Be sensible, don't preorder a game because of something one of the devs says in interviews, because it cannot be relied upon, in fact, don't preorder a game for any reason, its a gamble.
Perhaps we should really be thanking Sean Murray for highlighting this.
http://twitch.tv/woetothevanquished
I may not be a lawyer, but I have studied this type of thing in depth; I have a MBA in International Business.
For what it's worth: as a company officer, you can't go on national television and strongly imply that your product will have X feature, then expect to get away scott-free because at the point of purchase it didn't indicate anywhere in writing that your product would have that feature. At best, this is underhanded and dishonest. It may even be illegal marketing.
Let me explain: as you bring up Point of Purchase I'm assuming you know that a retail purchase constitutes a contract. It's reasonable to assume that someone purchasing No Man's Sky would have seen at least one of the interviews where the Managing Director of Hello Games stated that 'other players could see you' and 'you can grief other players a little bit'.
Now, this is where it gets a bit complex; stating something doesn't mean that it has to be set in stone, and I think that's why some fans (or even bystanders) feel aggrieved that NMS is taking so much flak. The problem is that Hello Games did nothing to publicly correct these assertions by their lead developer. Sure, he might have stated 'don't expect a multiplayer experience', but he also tweeted this the day before launch:
"Pretty much zero" is not the same thing as "zero", which two players found out on launch day when they stood in the same spot and could not see each other.
So... you have a contract which was set up by Sean making repeated public statements to the effect of 'oh, you could potentially run into other players but our world is so large it will probably never happen' up until the day before launch... which turned out to be complete bogus.
Sorry... but Hello Games doesn't get a free pass on this from me. The game may be beautiful, their advertising was not. It's laughable to imply that players should feel foolish for feeling misled. I can easily see how some people might feel that way.
"The simple is the seal of the true and beauty is the splendor of truth" -Subrahmanyan Chandrasekhar
Authored 139 missions in Vendetta Online and 6 tracks in Distance
"at the point of purcahse when the transaction took place, I do not believe there are people who believed that there was multiplayer in the game at that time. "
Lets assume you are correct though. What if I watched the Colbert show and saw Sean speak of multiplayer and then decided to buy the game. I wait until launch day and then go down to my local gamestop and buy it. Could I possible still believe that the game had some form of multiplayer? ABSOLUTELY!
Most stores dont have big sellers on the shelf, you ask for it at the counter and they grab it for you. The majority of people dont look at the box, they go in knowing what they want and what they expect from the game based on advertising and reviews. Almost ALL advertising at the very least hinted at some form of multiplayer so why in the world, would anyone state that no one could possibly believe multiplayer was in the game at purchase?