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General: Outside the Box: Widespread Marketing
Dana
Member Posts: 2,415
The weekly column Outside the Box returns after a brief GDC hiatus. This week, Nathan Knaack takes a peek at the concept of widespread marketing and what MMORPGs need to do.
| I touched upon the subject briefly in my last column, but for this week, Id like to really focus on how to bring the MMORPG market to the world at large, spreading beyond the hardcore gaming nerds (including myself), even beyond the casual console gamers that most MMO companies are currently trying to absorb. As they dumb down their gameplay options, oversimplify each activity, and blow 99% of their budget on flashy eye candy, these companies are trying to appeal to the least common denominator of people who could potentially be interested in online games, trying to draw them in with an overly basic experience full of shiny objects. For some reason, I always imagine that to be the kind of plan Wile E. Coyote would dream up, ordering the latest, obnoxiously system-intensive shaders and renderers from ACME, then setting them out in the desert to try and capture the elusive potential MMORPG gamer. Reducing your product to a meaningless waste of time with pretty visuals is like trying to get someone to fall in love with a clinically brain-dead supermodel. Not only are you going to get more long-term enjoyment out of an average-looking person with full mental faculties, but there are plenty of supermodels out there with functioning minds as well. |
You can read the full article here.
Dana Massey
Formerly of MMORPG.com
Currently Lead Designer for Bit Trap Studios
Comments
As they dumb down their gameplay options, oversimplify each activity,
and blow 99% of their budget on flashy eye candy, these companies are
trying to appeal to the least common denominator of people who could
potentially be interested in online games, trying to draw them in with
an overly basic experience full of shiny objects.
[/quote]
Where do you pull these writers from? I mean seriously what idiot thinks that games becoming more fun is a bad thing. As much as I hate WoW (for it's end game) just because the UI is simple and the game isn't stupidly complex doesn't make it a bad thing. Why do you think people drive to work instead of walking or riding horses? It's easier but the same task is performed.
Get over yourself. Just because you played EQ1 and think you are better than everyone else doesn't mean you know "better" or even out of the box. Infact these articles have been nothing but backwards evolution. I played EQ1 for 5 years or so, played beta 2,3 and 4. Guess what, the longer it was around the better it got. Going back to those days is NOT a good idea.
http://www.greycouncil.org/
1. You state that my opinion of making MMORPGs more involving and having a greater difficulty for the long-term player is "backwards," hinting that you believe EQ1 was a more difficult game than WoW. Exactly how long did you play EQ1? I believe you mentioned five years, but let's get a more accurate figure. This will be X.
2. You also state that you "hate" WoW (even though you misquote me as lamenting the game because of it's simplistic user interface; actually, one of the only parts of WoW I did enjoy was the streamlined UI. It's the fact that the rest of the game's content is also streamlined into nearly optionless redundancy that bothered me). So, how long did you play WoW? We'll make this Y.
Now let's put your two answers together. EQ1 was difficult, and you played it for X. WoW is over simplified, and you played it for Y. Since WoW has only been out for a year and a half, I believe it's safe to make the assumption based on your statements above that X is greater than Y, that you played EQ1 longer than WoW, and the ratio will remain so because you most likely don't play either of them any longer. Let's also consider that WoW had a budget (in both development and advertising) that was a few multiples of the original EQ's funding. WoW has a huge, seamless world with highly stylized, modern graphis. WoW's network layer supports many more players per sever, and there is by far less down time. WoW is even based on a worldwide best-selling franchise.
So, being that WoW is statistically a better game than EQ1 due to all of the above reasons, why is X still greater than Y for you? Why did you play EQ1 for so long, but WoW for only a fraction of that before quitting?
Amusing, I found this article quite the opposite then Celestian did. Firstly, replying to your comments, you mention you hate WoW "for it's endgame". I honestly get the idea that that is also what Nathan is talking about. Lots of eyecandy, but no content. Repetitive, oversimplified gameplay. There's just not enough variety in the things you can do.
As for a simple UI, I agree, it's a must for a game to be simple, functional and user friendly. But, what does not matter for the game is if it looks pretty. And it kind of makes you wonder if everything looks good, but the game manages to suck nonetheless.
Game complexity? Yes, well, you can go several ways with this, as it's also a matter of taste. A matter of long term enjoyment versus short term. A game should not require a player to study it's game mechanics for ages to enjoy it, but neither should you get the idea that after one session of gaming you've actually allready seen the whole of it. Same thing with MMORPG vs MMOFPS, strategy versus action, etc. Make it too complex, and it's not fun, too simple, and it isn't either. Lets look at what Nathan said though. He was talking about 'OVERsimplifying'. To use your comparison, it would be like taking the car yes, but using it to bring your girlfriend home in 5 minutes via the highway, instead of the romantic walk by the beach at sunset.
As for the rest, now honestly Celestian, there's a lot of articles written where I agree with you, that it's just someone sighing for the good old EQ1 time. But not this time, Nathan's actually saying that the market should change, that the developers should stop trying to 'do' another EQ, to get over the fantasy deal and start on a genre that actually draws new blood into the MMO world.
What can I say, it's pretty obvious that I agree with Nathan. The MMO world needs some change. Exactly what change I don't know, but trying new genres doesn't sound like a bad idea.
LordGrokk aka Captain Jherid,
member of The Renegade Buccaneers
Recruiting Pirates - we need competent leaders and mature members
Please read >>this<< before applying.
I think we can all agree a game with destructable doors that an NPC replaced after destroyed would outsell WoW tenfold. It would really make the player feel like Chuck Norris, ya know?
Also, I wish MMO developer would stop playing Will. E and let us. I'd love to see Looney Toons Online, in fact the only reason I don't play Toontown is because of the huge grind, it's housing, minigames and worlds are awsome, it's far more immersive and interesting then WoW.
I fully agree with Knaack's column.
The first MMO I ever played was Ultima Online. This game immersed me like no other, because I could do anything I really could think of at the time... baking bread, dungeon crawling, making armour, or just hanging out.
However, after EA screwed the game over and I quit, I tried other MMOs. Since then, nothing has really held my interest, with the exception of Dransik (now known as Ashen Empires.) That game had taken UO and basiclly improved on a few things, mostly craftables and such. But I quit that one soon simply because I found the UI and general make-up of the game to be somewhat poor.
I have yet to find a game that came close to UO, or surpass it.
Why aren't any companies making a game that simply has many different things that you can do? I want to be able to do what I want, that I cannot do in real life. I want an MMO where I can farm and make my own foods, or grow a flower garden behind my virtual home. I want to be able to craft that unique sword, complete with my own stamp. I want to go into any dungeon, or any place that I want to without a level limit, even if I'll more likely end up in a coffin shortly after wandering into such a place.
And I also want an MMO that is not fantasy based! Sure, I love fantasy games, but I also love sci-fi games, and I'd definetly try out games revolving around gangs, cops, leadership, or business.
Good article, Knaack, keep it up.
The doll would surely say, "I do not want to be human!" although her master wants her to be even more.
I don't see why everyone has it stuck in ther minds that your game has to be either Guild Wars (simplified to death) or Eve Online (so complex that new players are often overwhelmed). It seems like every game that lands somewhere between those two is applauded by some for being close to one end of the spectrum and damned by everyone else for being too far from the other end.
How about a game that lets you choose your level of involvement, one that caters to casual and hardcore players? After all, some people want to be generals, but others just want to be soldiers. Although I'm a great fan of balance in RPGs, there's something to be said against trying to over-balance character types. We end up with games where unique gameplay options and clever new ideas are bulldozed aside because they threaten the fragile balance. If I want to play a machinegun grunt in a massive war, I couldn't care less if the general of my army technically has more power than I do. I'm there to run around on the battlefield and shoot bad guys. The point is that the option to play both should always exist, else you're only appealing to a fraction of the potential player base.
The point is; just because I have less time to play now, and am a "casual gamer" doesnt mean I want to have a dumbed down experience; if anything its more the opposite; I need to be challenged and immersed in the short time I have.
The other huge deal breaker for me and WoW was that if I had an exam on some day I wouldnt play for a couple days just to study; meaning for the next week or so I wouldn't be able to play with my RL friends from back home as they had passed me up - this would be fixed with a skill based system. Hell, I'm fine with getting the sh*t kicked out of me by a higher level monster while in a party with friends who have higher skills; the challenge is fun. What's not fun is the whole "soz > 5 lvl diffno expz goway thxn00bye", (no that's not how my friends talk).
Right now I'm watching for The Chronicle and Fallen Earth. FE won't be out for a bit but I'm interested to see what these guys at MMO center can pull out of their hats.
Over the years, I've played various MMORPG's ...
I loved Asheron's Call in the early days .. because it was complex .. because I could run (and die many times trying) with my level 3 character to Ayan and look at all the lvl 30+ people and be amazed at their level.
I played SWG, and loved the game, because being a trader, crafter or entertainer was a viable option and you could have fun doing it. (Until they ruined the entertainer profession with player cities). It wasn';t that I hated combat, I just loved the idea of not having to be in combat all the time in order to be succesful at the game.
I've played, and are actually still playing Anarchy Online. Not because it's the best game out there, or because the leveling doesn't get boring after a while ... but AO has a complexity to it that makes it a little bit more interesting then some of the other MMORPG's out there. Of course, if you're a n00b to the game and don't have an experienced friend to show you around there just is no way you'll ever understand the game fully.
Of course I played EVE too, and though I loved the concept of the game ... and the graphics of the game are decent, I just didn't like being a 'ship' ... mabe someday someone will decide that Elite Online is a good idea and will make it work. (I hope you're reading this David Braben)
I also played WoW ... for a relatively short time. WHen after just a few months of playing I already had a 'end' level healing spec Priest ... I started to wonder why I would pay $15 a month just so I could do it all over again. As each character I started basically had to follow the same path ... do the same quests ... and go through the same areas ... Even running to dwarf territory with my Night Elf Hunter and picking up a gun and the gun skill only to go back to NE territory and make the other n00bs wonder how a nightelf got a gun didn't satisfy me much, as it was just about the only way I could differentiate myself from every other NE Hunter out there ...
No more cookie cutter MMORPG's for me ...
I worry you have critics syndrome where you can't tell the difference between good and weird. What we need is good, not necessarily weird. So while its fun to directly connect fantasy with "been there done that" or industry stagnation, I don't buy it for a second.
What we really need is the whole package: deep complexity AND easy accessability (both can be possible as one person already noted) plus visually stunning like WoW. Throw in monthly content adds and the ability to change the world as you play and who knows how popular that title might be. Whether that home run title involves elves or not is immaterial. I do think it will need to involve an on-screen alter ego in the flesh, not a piece of hardware like a ship, car, or spacecraft.
There are some real contenders in development to do just that and most involve elves. But thats fine, because elves are not the real problem.
Buck
i agree with knaak all most of these games are just graphics but brain dead games it could take a 5 yr old to figure out
i like games that are a bit complicated and have lots of features, like WoW it has smithy mining engineering and stuff its great
Playing: EVE Online
Favorite MMOs: WoW, SWG Pre-cu, Lineage 2, UO, EQ, EVE online
Looking forward to: Archeage, Kingdom Under Fire 2
KUF2's Official Website - http://www.kufii.com/ENG/ -
Back on track, I have to agree with Nathan and disagree with the person that thinks wow has "stunning" graphics hah. Let's face it, most of the people playing these games aren't going to buy a $700 just to play them, and do you really think the average non-MMO person is going to invest that much to start playing an MMO? So the flashy stuff reatlly is only going to go so far I think. I also don't think the fantasy genre is beat to death, what's killing these fantasy games is that they're all reusing the SAME fantasy setting! Look at DND. You have Ravenloft, there's a fantasy setting that's different from say, Forgotten Realms. Forgotten Realms is different than Midnight. It's not the setting that burned out, it's that in EVERY fantasy game you kill spiders/bats/rats, then orcs/goblins, then this then that in the same damn order every game over and over. Make some new monsters. For instance Morrowind, while not an MMO, had all sorts of strange wildlife in it that would change things up from the typical fantasy MMO.
That said, fantasy still doesn't appeal to the mainstream the way that some other settings Nathan mentioned would. How about an MMO with Egyptian (I know ATITD did Egypt but it's small-time), Incan or even native american roots? Civil War? We also haven't seen a gothic world or a world set in White Wolfish gothic punk settings. Something like Werewolf or Mage would do wonders for getting new people into the game, by basing the world on something they know and are familiar with, while only adding hints or elements of the supernatural like vampires, werewolves, demons, or reality bending magics (which except for the reality bending magics, most people are even familiar with vampires and werewolves). How about cyber punk like Shadowrun? It's 4am and I'm outta steam so that's the end.
-doro
Hehe, the punishment I get for not writing everything what I think. Well, I tried not to steer too far from where I started out. Indeed, you're right, it's best to cater to all sides of the gamer spectrum. While writing my post, I was in fact thinking about some posts by one of the developers of Pirates of the Burning Sea, on the topic of their new ingame economics model. It's promised to be a very expansive, complex system, in which there are a lot of ways to make a fortune. But, not every player will be interested in that, and can as well just have one basic resource produced on his property, and sell it once in a while at an auction house or local market. Or not dabble in trade at all, and just have some fun sinking and plundering (or perhaps the other way round
) those merchants.
That's why I thought about PotBS, at least they promise a combination of complex and non-complex game mechanics, and also, like this economics system, you can choose your level of involvement. Want to earn some bucks? Do the basics or stick with missions and PvP, want to become stinking rich, learn the whole system, keep track of prices in different ports, make deals with other players for escort, etc etc. Of course, it's only promised, and perhaps I'm too faithful, but why do other games allways end up becoming a boring grind of doing the same thing over and over, or end up forcing you to work with spreadsheets and notebooks just to get on with the game? As if nobody ever had the idea that different players like different things, but that there's ways to interest them both.
Oi, and Buckeyefog, that was Nathan who said that himself btw
What you mention Buck, elves not being the problem, perhaps you're right and it's not THE problem. But it's still a problem, just as a piece of hardware as player character is (yes, and I realize that is also so in my beloved PotBS, even though they have spiffy good customizable avatars for when you're on land, it's still the ship that counts). It makes it harder to identify with said character for those who aren't 'into' the genre. People who are new to it feel weird and out of place, which quickly translates into a dislike for the game. And yes, it does seem that people are becoming tired of the genre. I have no idea if it has any real influence on the MMO world, no idea if they stop buying, but I do get the feeling there's a lot of folks who've seen enough swords and sorcery (though I realize I might have this idea because I hang out on forums of MMO's that are set in a different genre, and so attract that kind of people).
Indeed, changing it won't fix the problem, you'd just be playing WoW again in a different coat. But to me it does seem to be a step in the right direction. O well, fantasy or not, I would enjoy a good game.
LordGrokk aka Captain Jherid,
member of The Renegade Buccaneers
Recruiting Pirates - we need competent leaders and mature members
Please read >>this<< before applying.
I agree with Nathan. But I think the whole thing goes far deeper then complex versus simple. I dont know about everyone else..... But I am feeling fantasy burnout. I am getting sick and tired of the fantasy theme in MMOs. Granted fantasy was the first. But every year it seems 50 to 75% of the MMOs released are fantasy based. The remaining are a mix of everything else.
Sometimes I just want to grab the game developer's throat and scream "IT'S BEEN DONE ALREADY!". Its maddening. I have played every type of fantasy character out there. Lets move on.
But who can blame them? Its the safe bet. Fantasy is easier to put yourself in game. Its easier to understand. And it's already got a basic system. Sci Fi, Hero, Futuristic, etc types wont ever have the big fanbase that fantasy has because fantasy is easier to do.
But I dont think that is the genre's fault. That falls on the companies. When they make a Sci Fi or other genre type game they always end up with a fantasy style set up. Look at SWG. Started out with its own type of playstyle. Complex yes. But only because it was new. Now its just a fantasy game in a Sci Fi shell. COH is yet another that almost got it right but ended up just another fantasy game with a different shell.
I think that is where part of the problem lies. Game companies will always continue to play the safe card and lay up on every hole. Until that one game company comes along and decides to make a game that is completely different and "outside the box" so to speak.
And to the poster that used cars versus walking to get to work everyday as an analogy. Walking is the easy way. Driving is the complex one. Insurance, gas, repairs, licence, laws, etc all to drive. But hey you got a pair of shoes? Then walk.
Kai
-doro
But could you see a game where melee was on the back burner and really only used when in very close? Where the guy with the power hammer gets plastered by a trooper with a laser rifle? Where the idiot with the polearm has his face weaved into the dirt when he charges a tank? People would scream to high heaven. "I am playing a sci fi game but I want to be a paladin!".
Kai
Perhaps that's the only marketing failure of the WoW team: They forgot that sometimes what a community asks for and what they really want aren't the same thing. You'll hear mobs of people screaming about how much they want a new fantasy, class/level game with uber loot and no death penalties. They'll buy the game by truckload, subscribe for a month or two, then quit. In my opinion, it would have been a better idea (both artistically and financially) to put some more long-term meat into WoW (player controlled territories, housing, governments, economics, etc) to keep subscribers instead of just pumping out more linear content (new dungeons, new static items, new armor sets, etc). All of that stuff is just going to keep the most dedicated and/or gullable 1% subscribing, whereas some real interactive content would have kept just about everyone playing WoW.
I pretty much agree with you Nathan.
"Some people say that WoW tries to "cater to everyone," but in reality, they're really only trying to appeal to what they correctly identified as the bulk of the gaming community: The casual grinder."
I don't agree that the bulk of the gamers are casual "grinders". I can't prove anything, of course, since there's simply no real competition in the "D+D" fantasy setting to draw from. But I can't believe that gamers are that shallow, generally speaking. We have to remember that WoW drew alot of new gamers, and in the North America market where they enlisted something like a million subscriptions, are we really all that sure that the bulk of the new numbers are actually new gamers? Or are they from the ever increasing foreign markets looking to sell game money for real money, which with exchange rates means a pretty nice chunk of change to them?
If you look at the timing of it all, and recognize that it's the first line of "levels" that make the bulk of the money, you can see that any of these level grind games have a sort of a shelf life to these foreign "investors". When a new game like this comes out, the race is on. And they feed on eachother, making and selling levelled characters to getting game money and items to sell for $US.
WoW made a great game in it's pattern. The world is large, feels large due to the layout, is full and beautiful, and has alot of neat features like the flight travel, and is generally very well designed (for what it is). If another game can do even better, I would think that coupling that with this ever increasing world trade, it would do even better. Unless someone comes out with a different, richer, deeper, longer lasting style, which I think would redirect the course of MMORPG design. No longer would these grinding games be enough, or competative enough.
As far as the game design to new players, they are new and don't know the difference yet. But I don't think it takes them long to learn. People have trouble spelling out exactly what it is they want. But they know it when they see it.
We also have to remember that old time players are complaining by the truck loads, yet they have nowhere else to go yet. And the majority of them have no other reference to draw from. Even so, many of the older players are being joined by many of the newer players in recognizing that they do want something more in their game.
It's my contention that had WoW been designed like what many of us are calling for, replacing the wild level grind and growth with a skill based, more evenly distributed power grid, with more social interaction between players, with more "realism" to the game worlds mechanics, et.al., it would have sold at least as many new boxes, plus it would have held onto their subscriptions to a much larger degree.
I mean, think about it. How many buyers really know what a game is going to play like when it's first released?
Once upon a time....