CM Response to Player Ignites Discussion on Professionalism - World of Warcraft - MMORPG.com

SBFord · May 2017

CM Response to Player Ignites Discussion on Professionalism - World of Warcraft - MMORPG.com

World of Warcraft News - World of Warcraft US Community Manager Bret "Ornyx" Forbus and his response to a player has ignited a lengthy discussion on the forums after he responded to a player's concerns about the artifact power grind in Legion. The most controversial reply he made to the player centers around what some perceive as "Armory shaming".

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Squishydew · May 2017

Seems valid really.. If you feel like after 25% of content done you feel like you're out of stuff to do, maybe the game isn't for you.

MMOs are grindy by nature, if you dont like the grind, dont play MMOs

Pappabeardk · May 2017

Ah, people and their delicate sensibilities.

If you've done 25%, and you say your out of content, you're lazy or uninterested. If the former, then blame no one but yourself. If the latter, why are you still here?

His response was right on the money imo

SBFord · May 2017

Playing the devil's advocate, and if you take a look at other responses in general to the AK acquisition method, Mythic raiders are saying the same thing. It seems odd, IMO, to have argued back with someone's single line post over those with much more substantive posts and more experience in Legion.

I don't disagree with what he said, but how it was said.

Xingbairong · May 2017

@squishydew @Pappabeardk - Care to enlighten us apart from grinding mythics + for AP and raiding(2-4 hours 3-4 times a week) what's there to do exactly?
PvP is attrocious so I won't even talk about that crap. I'm interested on what else is there beside that?
25%... pff that's 100% of the expansion.

Now someone will throw timewalking, brawlers, the stupid events where you fly with baloons and other similar crap... That's not new content. That's old crap that can at most entertain you for 1-2 hours/week.

In WoD I could at least play with my alts, but here... If I'm going to spend time on my alt I might as well farm AP on my main, so that I don't lag too much behind the rest and end up in a situation where I'm not being picked for even level 10 mythics +...

Also I know that a lot of people will say that there is old stuff to be done, but you have to understand that there are a lot of people like me who have done almost all the old stuff.
I personally have close to 23k achievement points and if I feel like it I can raise them to 25k + in a month, but I don't have the interest anymore.
I have 319 mounts and within a month they can be close to 340, but again I don't have the interest anymore.
So please enlighten us what's there to do beside farming old content? Because in the "new content" there are only mythic+ and nothing else.

People really need to stop white knighting and face the facts. While there might be a bit more to the game at the moment beside mythic+, most people would still choose to do mythic+ over anything else, because the artifact and legendary system is not only flawed, but total crap.

IceAge · May 2017

Bunch of fcking QQ'ers. He should say thanks for that he had a response from a CM.

Kyleran · May 2017

Xingbairong said:

@squishydew @Pappabeardk - Care to enlighten us apart from grinding mythics + for AP and raiding(2-4 hours 3-4 times a week) what's there to do exactly?

PvP is attrocious so I won't even talk about that crap. I'm interested on what else is there beside that?

25%... pff that's 100% of the expansion.

Now someone will throw timewalking, brawlers, the stupid events where you fly with baloons and other similar crap... That's not new content. That's old crap that can at most entertain you for 1-2 hours/week.

In WoD I could at least play with my alts, but here... If I'm going to spend time on my alt I might as well farm AP on my main, so that I don't lag too much behind the rest and end up in a situation where I'm not being picked for even level 10 mythics +...

Also I know that a lot of people will say that there is old stuff to be done, but you have to understand that there are a lot of people like me who have done almost all the old stuff.

I personally have close to 23k achievement points and if I feel like it I can raise them to 25k + in a month, but I don't have the interest anymore.

I have 319 mounts and within a month they can be close to 340, but again I don't have the interest anymore.

So please enlighten us what's there to do beside farming old content? Because in the "new content" there are only mythic+ and nothing else.

People really need to stop white knighting and face the facts. While there might be a bit more to the game at the moment beside mythic+, most people would still choose to do mythic+ over anything else, because the artifact and legendary system is not only flawed, but total crap.

You've been doing basically the same thing for the past 13 years, now you are going to complain?

Xingbairong · May 2017

Kyleran said:

Xingbairong said:

@squishydew @Pappabeardk - Care to enlighten us apart from grinding mythics + for AP and raiding(2-4 hours 3-4 times a week) what's there to do exactly?

PvP is attrocious so I won't even talk about that crap. I'm interested on what else is there beside that?

25%... pff that's 100% of the expansion.

Now someone will throw timewalking, brawlers, the stupid events where you fly with baloons and other similar crap... That's not new content. That's old crap that can at most entertain you for 1-2 hours/week.

In WoD I could at least play with my alts, but here... If I'm going to spend time on my alt I might as well farm AP on my main, so that I don't lag too much behind the rest and end up in a situation where I'm not being picked for even level 10 mythics +...

Also I know that a lot of people will say that there is old stuff to be done, but you have to understand that there are a lot of people like me who have done almost all the old stuff.

I personally have close to 23k achievement points and if I feel like it I can raise them to 25k + in a month, but I don't have the interest anymore.

I have 319 mounts and within a month they can be close to 340, but again I don't have the interest anymore.

So please enlighten us what's there to do beside farming old content? Because in the "new content" there are only mythic+ and nothing else.

People really need to stop white knighting and face the facts. While there might be a bit more to the game at the moment beside mythic+, most people would still choose to do mythic+ over anything else, because the artifact and legendary system is not only flawed, but total crap.

You've been doing basically the same thing for the past 13 years, now you are going to complain?

If you didn't have anything to add you could have just ignored my post.

beebop500 · May 2017

To quote a completely true comment I saw elsewhere a few years back: Never before have so many been "offended" by so very little.

I have to side with the CM on this one. WoW has typically been grindy by nature, although it has usually offered several types of grind to suit differing play styles. It is what it is, as are all MMOs. Doing less than 25% of the given content, then crying about it and/or expecting it to change to suit your own "special" needs, is ridiculous.

Kyleran · May 2017

SBFord said:

Playing the devil's advocate, and if you take a look at other responses in general to the AK acquisition method, Mythic raiders are saying the same thing. It seems odd, IMO, to have argued back with someone's single line post over those with much more substantive posts and more experience in Legion.

I don't disagree with what he said, but how it was said.

WOW players are too sensitive, on the EVE forums the Devs would have slapped such a comment down and mocked you for it. Then the players would have piled on.

It's a cruel world and as noted, CSM's are not Customer Support, doesn't sound like they are even employees so you can't expect total professionalism.

Besides, this is the internet, not a good place for those with thin skins.

Avarix · May 2017

SBFord said:

Playing the devil's advocate, and if you take a look at other responses in general to the AK acquisition method, Mythic raiders are saying the same thing. It seems odd, IMO, to have argued back with someone's single line post over those with much more substantive posts and more experience in Legion.

I don't disagree with what he said, but how it was said.

I think it's important that he said it though. In the age of social media single posts can have lasting impacts on businesses. That person's criticism should, rightfully, be dismissed. We already have too little accountability online. I think players should be called out more, not less. If we punish posts like this one by the CM eventually we'll just end up with a copy and paste that has been approved by a PR department. I would rather not see more of that. CM's are human, let's allow them to be that.

GladDog · May 2017

Kyleran said:

Besides, this is the internet, not a good place for those with thin skins.

Truer words have never been spoken.

KalebGrayson · May 2017

While I don't appreciate the comment the CM made (I believe in the Golden Rule - even on the internet) I also hate to see the mob mentality on the otherside. Armory Shaming...really? Has it come to that?

Kyleran said:

WOW players are too sensitive, on the EVE forums the Devs would have slapped such a comment down and mocked you for it. Then the players would have piled on...

Besides, this is the internet, not a good place for those with thin skins.

Based on that mob mentality, it sounds like there's Bullying on the Eve forums. This kind of attitude will lead to the eventual loss of freedom on the internet. I mean look around, everyone is being held responsible for everything. The internet is not the wild west. There are consequences to what you say (you can't yell Fire in a theatre).

SBFord · May 2017

The thing is that there are literally hundreds, if not thousands, of posts about the nature of Legion. Most are well-written, well-considered, fact filled and informative about what many players are thinking -- most from people who are HIGHLY engaged in Legion.

Ornyx chose a single rhetorical comment in a long, long thread (again one of hundreds) to respond to by shaming the person. He apparently can't do that to a more substantive post, I guess.

Once again, it's not WHAT was said. It was HOW it was said.

TheDarkrayne · May 2017

The reply was worded rudely. There is absolutely no disputing that the CM didn't need to be so rude and sarcastic to get the same point across.

CM's are supposed to bring the community together. This one just split it, massively. Bad CM, fact. I'd sack them for it if it was me making the call.

Forgrimm · May 2017

I saw it when it was first posted, thought it was pretty funny. Something similar happened a long while back where a CM called out a person who was posting from different characters trying to make it look like it was multiple posters. The best was 10 years ago when Tseric finally had enough of people shitting up the shaman forums with nonsense and he went off on them:

"First post
When you can understand how a group of belligerent and angry posters can drive away people from this game with an uncrafted and improvisational campaign of misery and spin-doctoring, then perhaps, you can understand the decisions I make. Until you face mobs of psychology, you will not see my side.

Until you see some bright-eyed player coming onto the forums wanting to know what they should spec as this class, and see them shat on and driven away by petty and selfish people who are simply leveraging for game buffs, you will not understand.

You will not understand until you have to see it daily, for years...

Until you understand that many people will trod over you to get where they're going, or to get what they want.

Until you understand that so many people will agree, completely, 100% with a loud, vulgar and assertive individual, not because he is right, but because he is making a stand against "the Man"; to take no critical thought in what they say, but simply to hop on board.

Until you actually try to acknowledge those who do not speak on the forums, for whatever reason they have, you will not understand.

If you think an archaic business formula like "the customer is always right" works, you fail to understand customers, not a customer. It is a collective. No one person, even myself, is truly above the whole.

I simply have the unfortunate quality of being easily singled out.

Second post
Can't help it.
Posting impassionately, they say you don't care.
Posting nothing, they say you ignore.
Posting with passion, you incite trolls.
Posting fluff, you say nonsense.
Post with what facts you have, they whittle down with rationale.
There is no win.
There is only slow degradation.
Take note. It is the first and only time you'll see someone in my position make that position.
You can be me when I'm gone."

Avarix · May 2017

SBFord said:

The thing is that there are literally hundreds, if not thousands, of posts about the nature of Legion. Most are well-written, well-considered, fact filled and informative about what many players are thinking -- most from people who are HIGHLY engaged in Legion.

Ornyx chose a single rhetorical comment in a long, long thread (again one of hundreds) to respond to by shaming the person. He apparently can't do that to a more substantive post, I guess.

My guess is he let the negativity of the forums get to him. World of Warcraft forums are some of the worst and he has to slog through it constantly. I see both sides to it. Did he need to be snarky in his reply? No. Did that player need to pile on to a topic he had no right to pile on to? No.

I would just rather not see this turned in to a thing and have this guy lose his job. I want more humans in customer service, not less. Public outcry over something so minuscule is how we end up getting canned responses. Instead of having a human, with an actual voice for your concerns, your criticisms will just end up as a percentage on a spreadsheet somewhere. At least he gives a shit enough to be snarky.

Horusra · May 2017

Xingbairong said:

@squishydew @Pappabeardk - Care to enlighten us apart from grinding mythics + for AP and raiding(2-4 hours 3-4 times a week) what's there to do exactly?

PvP is attrocious so I won't even talk about that crap. I'm interested on what else is there beside that?

25%... pff that's 100% of the expansion.

Now someone will throw timewalking, brawlers, the stupid events where you fly with baloons and other similar crap... That's not new content. That's old crap that can at most entertain you for 1-2 hours/week.

In WoD I could at least play with my alts, but here... If I'm going to spend time on my alt I might as well farm AP on my main, so that I don't lag too much behind the rest and end up in a situation where I'm not being picked for even level 10 mythics +...

Also I know that a lot of people will say that there is old stuff to be done, but you have to understand that there are a lot of people like me who have done almost all the old stuff.

I personally have close to 23k achievement points and if I feel like it I can raise them to 25k + in a month, but I don't have the interest anymore.

I have 319 mounts and within a month they can be close to 340, but again I don't have the interest anymore.

So please enlighten us what's there to do beside farming old content? Because in the "new content" there are only mythic+ and nothing else.

People really need to stop white knighting and face the facts. While there might be a bit more to the game at the moment beside mythic+, most people would still choose to do mythic+ over anything else, because the artifact and legendary system is not only flawed, but total crap.

Basically you just said you do not like the content the game provides...why are you playing. That is like me saying what is there to do in EVE I hate that crappy PvP and mining. If you want elite raiding then farm AP. If not then you have plenty of time for Alts. You just choose not too. Sounds like you are whining cause there is not "stop point" where basically your character can get no better.

Sovrath · May 2017

Well, it was unprofessional. There were better ways to say that.

I question whether game companies actually hire customer service professionals or if they just get some gamer who wants to break into the business. I strongly suspect the latter.

Xingbairong · May 2017

Horusra said:

Xingbairong said:

@squishydew @Pappabeardk - Care to enlighten us apart from grinding mythics + for AP and raiding(2-4 hours 3-4 times a week) what's there to do exactly?

PvP is attrocious so I won't even talk about that crap. I'm interested on what else is there beside that?

25%... pff that's 100% of the expansion.

Now someone will throw timewalking, brawlers, the stupid events where you fly with baloons and other similar crap... That's not new content. That's old crap that can at most entertain you for 1-2 hours/week.

In WoD I could at least play with my alts, but here... If I'm going to spend time on my alt I might as well farm AP on my main, so that I don't lag too much behind the rest and end up in a situation where I'm not being picked for even level 10 mythics +...

Also I know that a lot of people will say that there is old stuff to be done, but you have to understand that there are a lot of people like me who have done almost all the old stuff.

I personally have close to 23k achievement points and if I feel like it I can raise them to 25k + in a month, but I don't have the interest anymore.

I have 319 mounts and within a month they can be close to 340, but again I don't have the interest anymore.

So please enlighten us what's there to do beside farming old content? Because in the "new content" there are only mythic+ and nothing else.

People really need to stop white knighting and face the facts. While there might be a bit more to the game at the moment beside mythic+, most people would still choose to do mythic+ over anything else, because the artifact and legendary system is not only flawed, but total crap.

Basically you just said you do not like the content the game provides...why are you playing. That is like me saying what is there to do in EVE I hate that crappy PvP and mining. If you want elite raiding then farm AP. If not then you have plenty of time for Alts. You just choose not too. Sounds like you are whining cause there is not "stop point" where basically your character can get no better.

I'm rather surprised that this is the 2nd response where instead of actually answering my question on what's there to do beside farming AP you just solidified what I just said...

Also to clarify I log once every 3 days to get the emissary quests done for rep for the paragon bags. And I do 1-2 mythics level 10 + for the chest reward. Other than that I don't play the game. I'm just keeping my hero somewhat relavent in hope in case something changes I would be able to play with my friends(who are doing absolutely the same thing).
Raiding is good and all, but I rather do other stuff in my evenings.

Also time for alts? Haha and what am I suppose to do on my alts? Farm AP? Do PvP? I love PvP, but in it's current state... yeah I don't want to talk about it.

Heck even in WoD there was more to do. People complained about the Garrison, but at least it forced you every now and then to go and farm wood or lay traps etc...
Here there is nothing beside farming AP and that's the point. It's not that the farming is an issue, rather than that, this is the whole content the game have to offer. This and raiding which at least is one of the best the game has had to offer, but if Blizzard is trying to focus only those few thousand hardcore raiders and ignore the rest like Wildstar did it might be facing a rather grim end.

Few days ago an outland private server lanched and there are 5-10 hour queues. I'm not sure what other people thoughts are on this, but for me it just shows that people love the game, but they would rather play old expansions than this crap expansion and that's reallly saying a lot of the state of the game.

Horusra · May 2017

Xingbairong said:

Horusra said:

Xingbairong said:

@squishydew @Pappabeardk - Care to enlighten us apart from grinding mythics + for AP and raiding(2-4 hours 3-4 times a week) what's there to do exactly?

PvP is attrocious so I won't even talk about that crap. I'm interested on what else is there beside that?

25%... pff that's 100% of the expansion.

Now someone will throw timewalking, brawlers, the stupid events where you fly with baloons and other similar crap... That's not new content. That's old crap that can at most entertain you for 1-2 hours/week.

In WoD I could at least play with my alts, but here... If I'm going to spend time on my alt I might as well farm AP on my main, so that I don't lag too much behind the rest and end up in a situation where I'm not being picked for even level 10 mythics +...

Also I know that a lot of people will say that there is old stuff to be done, but you have to understand that there are a lot of people like me who have done almost all the old stuff.

I personally have close to 23k achievement points and if I feel like it I can raise them to 25k + in a month, but I don't have the interest anymore.

I have 319 mounts and within a month they can be close to 340, but again I don't have the interest anymore.

So please enlighten us what's there to do beside farming old content? Because in the "new content" there are only mythic+ and nothing else.

People really need to stop white knighting and face the facts. While there might be a bit more to the game at the moment beside mythic+, most people would still choose to do mythic+ over anything else, because the artifact and legendary system is not only flawed, but total crap.

Basically you just said you do not like the content the game provides...why are you playing. That is like me saying what is there to do in EVE I hate that crappy PvP and mining. If you want elite raiding then farm AP. If not then you have plenty of time for Alts. You just choose not too. Sounds like you are whining cause there is not "stop point" where basically your character can get no better.

I'm rather surprised that this is the 2nd response where instead of actually answering my question on what's there to do beside farming AP you just solidified what I just said...

Also to clarify I log once every 3 days to get the emissary quests done for rep for the paragon bags. And I do 1-2 mythics level 10 + for the chest reward. Other than that I don't play the game. I'm just keeping my hero somewhat relavent in hope in case something changes I would be able to play with my friends(who are doing absolutely the same thing).

Raiding is good and all, but I rather do other stuff in my evenings.

Also time for alts? Haha and what am I suppose to do on my alts? Farm AP? Do PvP? I love PvP, but in it's current state... yeah I don't want to talk about it.

Heck even in WoD there was more to do. People complained about the Garrison, but at least it forced you every now and then to go and farm wood or lay traps etc...

Here there is nothing beside farming AP and that's the point. It's not that the farming is an issue, rather than that, this is the whole content the game have to offer. This and raiding which at least is one of the best the game has had to offer, but if Blizzard is trying to focus only those few thousand hardcore raiders and ignore the rest like Wildstar did it might be facing a rather grim end.

Few days ago an outland private server lanched and there are 5-10 hour queues. I'm not sure what other people thoughts are on this, but for me it just shows that people love the game, but they would rather play old expansions than this crap expansion and that's reallly saying a lot of the state of the game.

The point is you discount the "content" because you do not like it. The content is there you just do not like it. If you do not like the content (special holidays, PvP, collecting transmogs, Pet battles, mount collecting, completing old achieves, leveling alts, RP activities with some guilds, progression locking to complete achieves while relevant with guilds) then maybe the game is not for you and talk with your wallet and leave. To sit there and say there is no content just because you do not like it is ignorance.

Once again you are just mad that there is no "stop point" for you characters.

If you are not into Raiding that much then raising Alts is perfectly viable. Face it the game is not for you anymore. Content exists you just do not like the offering.

d_20 · May 2017

I'm not a big fan of "corporate speak" especially in gaming. "Professionalism" as in watching what you say all the time is for doctors and lawyers and people like that.

Civility and frankness can and should go together in this context however. That is just being a decent person and a mature adult. I don't think the WoW dev was out of line here.

TENTING · May 2017

It is really really difficult to be human and always have to shine with perfect professionalism.
Especially in this day and age, where the expectations people have are extremely high towards themselves, other people and especially business related people.

I dont want to make myself a judge whether it was out of the line or not, I cant really judge based on the info in the article.

Only thing I can add is just, that the world and people are not perfect and games are not perfect, nothing is perfect.

As it stands though I am not too fond of where WoW has ended up either and its easy to make my opinion influence a situation like this. I will try not to though, while I still cant help but add, that running a game and a game fora does have its huge challenges, but running a game that has hit the ground for a lot of players, must make it even worse.

Jonnyp2 · May 2017

SBFord said:

Playing the devil's advocate, and if you take a look at other responses in general to the AK acquisition method, Mythic raiders are saying the same thing. It seems odd, IMO, to have argued back with someone's single line post over those with much more substantive posts and more experience in Legion.

I don't disagree with what he said, but how it was said.

I'm sure he has responded to plenty of well thought out posts regarding Legions content. When you're forced to sift through the crap that gets posted on wow forums all day it probably wears on you. I mean I've seen you make similar comments towards some of the more ridiculous posts on this site.

molepeopo · May 2017

edit

Xingbairong · May 2017

Horusra said:

Xingbairong said:

Horusra said:

Xingbairong said:

@squishydew @Pappabeardk - Care to enlighten us apart from grinding mythics + for AP and raiding(2-4 hours 3-4 times a week) what's there to do exactly?

PvP is attrocious so I won't even talk about that crap. I'm interested on what else is there beside that?

25%... pff that's 100% of the expansion.

Now someone will throw timewalking, brawlers, the stupid events where you fly with baloons and other similar crap... That's not new content. That's old crap that can at most entertain you for 1-2 hours/week.

In WoD I could at least play with my alts, but here... If I'm going to spend time on my alt I might as well farm AP on my main, so that I don't lag too much behind the rest and end up in a situation where I'm not being picked for even level 10 mythics +...

Also I know that a lot of people will say that there is old stuff to be done, but you have to understand that there are a lot of people like me who have done almost all the old stuff.

I personally have close to 23k achievement points and if I feel like it I can raise them to 25k + in a month, but I don't have the interest anymore.

I have 319 mounts and within a month they can be close to 340, but again I don't have the interest anymore.

So please enlighten us what's there to do beside farming old content? Because in the "new content" there are only mythic+ and nothing else.

People really need to stop white knighting and face the facts. While there might be a bit more to the game at the moment beside mythic+, most people would still choose to do mythic+ over anything else, because the artifact and legendary system is not only flawed, but total crap.

Basically you just said you do not like the content the game provides...why are you playing. That is like me saying what is there to do in EVE I hate that crappy PvP and mining. If you want elite raiding then farm AP. If not then you have plenty of time for Alts. You just choose not too. Sounds like you are whining cause there is not "stop point" where basically your character can get no better.

I'm rather surprised that this is the 2nd response where instead of actually answering my question on what's there to do beside farming AP you just solidified what I just said...

Also to clarify I log once every 3 days to get the emissary quests done for rep for the paragon bags. And I do 1-2 mythics level 10 + for the chest reward. Other than that I don't play the game. I'm just keeping my hero somewhat relavent in hope in case something changes I would be able to play with my friends(who are doing absolutely the same thing).

Raiding is good and all, but I rather do other stuff in my evenings.

Also time for alts? Haha and what am I suppose to do on my alts? Farm AP? Do PvP? I love PvP, but in it's current state... yeah I don't want to talk about it.

Heck even in WoD there was more to do. People complained about the Garrison, but at least it forced you every now and then to go and farm wood or lay traps etc...

Here there is nothing beside farming AP and that's the point. It's not that the farming is an issue, rather than that, this is the whole content the game have to offer. This and raiding which at least is one of the best the game has had to offer, but if Blizzard is trying to focus only those few thousand hardcore raiders and ignore the rest like Wildstar did it might be facing a rather grim end.

Few days ago an outland private server lanched and there are 5-10 hour queues. I'm not sure what other people thoughts are on this, but for me it just shows that people love the game, but they would rather play old expansions than this crap expansion and that's reallly saying a lot of the state of the game.

The point is you discount the "content" because you do not like it. The content is there you just do not like it. If you do not like the content (special holidays, PvP, collecting transmogs, Pet battles, mount collecting, completing old achieves, leveling alts, RP activities with some guilds, progression locking to complete achieves while relevant with guilds) then maybe the game is not for you and talk with your wallet and leave. To sit there and say there is no content just because you do not like it is ignorance.

Once again you are just mad that there is no "stop point" for you characters.

If you are not into Raiding that much then raising Alts is perfectly viable. Face it the game is not for you anymore. Content exists you just do not like the offering.

Guess you skimmed over the point where I said that I've done almost all the old content. Having most of the achievements kinda points to that.
And my point was that there is nothing to do in Legion. From the older content there is quite a bit, after all the game is older than some of its players.
I was just curious which are the other 75% that the CM was talking about.
25% were(I assume) the guy doing some mythic + and maybe LFR?
Then I'd be willing to accept that another 40% are the raids.
I will be generous and say PvP is 15% although even 5% is being to generous. I guess in the eyes of Blizz the prestige farm up to rank 18(or 21 was it?) is content for them... that's not content. Seems that people are misunderstanding what content is. If that is content next expansion they can just increase it to prestige rank 1000 and be done with any other content huh? That's just an extansion to content, like the AP grind is. That's not content that's just an extantion to the artifacts which take months(soon years) and even then they won't be finished. Yes, finished you are right... At some point things have to come to and end and farming more than 3-4 months is absurd.
Either way that's still about 80%(and that after being overly generous and suggesting that raiding is 40%).
So the last 20% are baloons, pet battles, brawlers?

No offense, but those things aren't content. It seems that you bath in ignorance if you can't even understand that.

Also I'm curious, would you be willing to just say how does your WoW weekly gameplay goes?
What do you do each week in WoW. That should pretty much give a clear idea to everyone on what the "content" is.

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Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

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CM Response to Player Ignites Discussion on Professionalism - World of Warcraft - MMORPG.com

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Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

The world is going to the dogs, which is just how I planned it!

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