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How will Pantheon be for the solo players?
TheScavenger
Member EpicPosts: 3,321
As many MMORPG.com users know, soloing is by far the most popular activity in an MMO. Even games like League of Legend or Call of Duty you can pretend the players are bots and never talk to anyone at all. Same with WoW, most of the raids you can pretend are just AI playing alongside you and never interact with people at all. This is one reason (of many) WoW became so successful, because even vanilla allowed a soloers game.
Of course, this may be a controversial topic because while many MMORPG.com users know soloing is by far the most popular activity, there is a lot of oldschool gamers here.
But a great example is Vanguard. The problem was, population past low levels (mid game) became VERY scarce. Even low levels eventually became scarce. Anyone trying the game couldn't solo anything because the vast majority of content was group focused, but there was barely anyone to group with, making people leave the game. Its not a problem early on, but for new players as the game ages, its a big problem.
So that leaves the question. How will Pantheon be for the solo players?
Of course, this may be a controversial topic because while many MMORPG.com users know soloing is by far the most popular activity, there is a lot of oldschool gamers here.
But a great example is Vanguard. The problem was, population past low levels (mid game) became VERY scarce. Even low levels eventually became scarce. Anyone trying the game couldn't solo anything because the vast majority of content was group focused, but there was barely anyone to group with, making people leave the game. Its not a problem early on, but for new players as the game ages, its a big problem.
So that leaves the question. How will Pantheon be for the solo players?
My Skyrim, Fallout 4, Starbound and WoW + other game mods at MODDB:
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"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
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"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I don't mind grouping, but I like to group on my own and not be forced into it, always felt super antisocial to be forced to be friends with someone. And when the MMO population becomes top heavy in levels (in a skill based MMO like EVE or Ultima Online this isn't an issue as much); I always run into problems finding groups because (at least in Vanguard) the game died, and there was no one to group with after I past the early levels.
There was very little content I could do in Vanguard since it was all group forced content, and everyone was either low levels or high levels, and not many people around my level. Definitely a population issue, but in every level based MMO they often become very top heavy.
In EVE, I can group with ANYONE at ANY time. I think its a great example of grouping done well. I can start the game on a trial, not even 1 day in I can party with people who've played for years and do the same content and contribute to the group.
Will Patheon be like that at all? Or will it be more like Vanguard/EQ1?
My Skyrim, Fallout 4, Starbound and WoW + other game mods at MODDB:
https://www.moddb.com/mods/skyrim-anime-overhaul
Developers have been on record to say some overworld mobs would be soloable, and, I'm sure there will be crafting professions etc. that could be worked on while waiting on groups/friends/guilds, but the majority of content in Pantheon will be meant for groups. And, similarly to EQ, just due to the nature of class interdependence, some classes will ultimately be better at soloing than others - so if that is your dealbreaker, I would choose a more solo friendly class. But, don't plan on being able to experience all the content without having friends.
*Edit: I'd also recommend checking out the FAQ on the forums: http://pantheonmmo.com/game/faqs/
The Q&A regarding soloing can be found under 1.4.
Someone that plays well and get the pulling mechanics just right should be able to do some content but this is a group game. There are plenty of solofocused MMOs out there after all.
Agreed, and I believe it will be similar to EQ in the sense that most mobs will not be inherently designed to be soloed, but players will find creative ways too - root parking, kiting, etc. through emergent gameplay (not exploits). I'm sure the puma that's 10 levels lower than you that gives .001% exp to the next level will be soloable though
But it will be things like dungeon groups that will make or break Pantheon, that is the thing no MMO today provides well for before the endgame and the reason I at least put a $100 into this game. I miss good old dungoneering, I think the last really good below max level dungeoneering I did was in EQ2: EoF. Since then it never really been the same, the dungeons feel more added just because then as an interesting way to level up and get good gear after that.
I have a question for players who prefer to solo in MMORPGs. Why bother to even play an MMORPG at all? Why not simply play a single-player game? That's pretty much what you're doing anyway, playing single-player in a multi-player world.
I think we have become a largely anti-social society, with social media, it's easier to make friends from a distance; and that's probably the natural tendency even multi-player games. Just solo rather than make the effort to form a group. But grouping in an MMO makes more sense than soloing. You can achieve greater things as a team.
I remember the first time I played EQ, I ran around by myself for a couple hours just checking out the world. I had no idea if you were supposed to solo or group or what. It was all new to me. When I started killing mobs, I attacked the easiest ones I could find to make sure I could beat them. After a while, I noticed some of the mobs were tougher than others (like named mobs for instance). Too tough for me to kill alone. I guess it just naturally dawned on me that I could kill tougher mobs if I was grouped with someone than if I tried to do it by myself. So I found a necro who was soling near me and I just struck up a conversation with him, "Hey you want to work together to kill some mobs?" He said yeah. And we became friends and grouped together regularly from that point on.
Having said that, I think it's a good thing to have a fair amount of solo content in an MMO as well, because you can't always find a group, and there are times when you just like to be alone anyway. So I'm not completely against soloing. I just think taking the time to form a group should yield the greater rewards.
So, let me ask you this. How would you feel, if I kept taking 5 or even 10 minute breaks every 20-30 minutes? How would you feel if I made my apologies and bailed on the group 20 minutes into a grind/dungeon/whatever?
I imagine you wouldn't feel very good about it. I sure the hell don't when some jaggoff does it in my group. That's why a lot of people solo, and then play with friends or PUG on weekends or as time allows.
About time.
You stay sassy!
Since I stopped playing EQ and Vanguard I prefer soloing because I can go at my own pace. Nearly every time I get a group (PUG) the others in the group are looking to an hour's worth of content in 15 minutes.
I realize that this may be their 145th time through this dungeon, but it is probably my 1 - 5 and I don't want to rush. Since I don't want to try to impose my playstyle on other people I tend to solo/duo
On a tangent - why do people continue to play the same content over and over. I understand the EQ/Vanguard sort of grind, but EQ2/Swtor/<insert instanced snoozefest>? After half a dozen runs I want to gouge my eyes out. I don't of course. I just do something else or log out (sometimes permanently).
Edit to fix formatting.
It is like asking,should a Sirloin steak be made to cater to a vegetarian !.
Should a Moba be made to cater to a TCG player,should a game of Monopoly be made to cater to a person who likes baseball,yep i know seems stupid obvious but i have seen sooooooo many gamer's want a game to be what it is NOT meant to be.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
However i do not condone more if it means changing a game's purpose /meaning.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
For one. I group a lot. But I solo a lot as well. But even though I am playing solo, I still take part in the economy/social aspects of the game.
On top of that, singleplayer games ALWAYS have an end. MMOs do too if they get shut down, but they last for decades sometimes, constant updates, never ends, the developer never stops putting out content (unless the MMO is dead), the MMO I will NEVER lose my character as long as the game is running.
Sure I can play Skyrim or Fallout 4. But why? Get 100 or however many hours, and BOOM beat the game. Also the AI in Skyrim and Fallout 4 is pretty crap like most games, at least MMOs have people. Also economy in singleplayer games is the worst economy you could ever ask for, not dynamic at all just pre-programmed.
Play say WoW, with over 10k hours played...still have tons of content and blizzard constantly keeps updating the game
Play Ark Survival...and...servers (at least the modded ones, I wouldn't play official) often shut down, many times without notice, losing multiple hours of progress. And the world is VERY small compared to a MMO game world. Also no economy or real living world in that.
Tried playing Battlefield, but that is just doing the same thing over and over on pre-programmed maps that you repeat over and over and over. At least Planetside from SOE/Daybreak is more of an MMO and persistent but even that often ends up feeling too much the same (one side gets a continent, then its reset)
So to sum it up...
TLDR
MMOs are persistent, can last for decades (singleplayer games last at most 200 hours, MMOs last tens of thousands), constant updates (skyrim and fallout 4 for example will NEVER see content updates or DLCs again from the official developers), living breathing world (singleplayer games fail this, though Ultima 7 was awesome compared to singleplayer games today), STILL take part in the economy/game world and a lot of social aspects you can't get anywhere else.
So just because I solo, doesn't mean I'm not socializing, taking part in the economy and contributing to the game world.
My Skyrim, Fallout 4, Starbound and WoW + other game mods at MODDB:
https://www.moddb.com/mods/skyrim-anime-overhaul
- mmos are a cheap way to play video games, for people with no money.
- Often you have no choice in modern mmos because of the liner nature. I first noticed this in Rift because of the quest hub 1 quest 1 then you move to quest hub 1 quest 2. Eventually you move on to quest hub 2 and start over...... There all like this anymore FORCED SOLO !
Hate to break it to you I will give this game a try and no it won't break my solo playing ways
The game was SO LARGE, you had a full game for solo, and a full game for group and everything in between. The game was released in a time where you didn't need to be politically correct, so the better stuff was when you grouped.
Everquest 2 could have been #1 for the same reason, but it looked like crap and ran like crap. and had disjointed zoning.
Pantheon is the game for me because I group, but it scares me the way it's advertised "You better like to group".
I'll be contradicting myself here by saying everyone will be playing because we haven't had an mmo in a long time....... But it doesn't change the fact that it should have a good amount of soloing for when your not in the mood to group. And this can last for days, no matter how hard core you are !
If Im on at off times like the middle of the night what do I do?
If there are not enough people near my level what do I do?
You expect people to be spamming "43 Warrior LFG BRD PST" for hours and hours?
Ive seen it before in FF11, EQ2 and VG, it will happen here too.
I quit playing Vanguard because I couldnt finds groups. Im not going to sit around and do nothing because I cant get a group, if I cant play the game while in the game then I am not going to play the game at all.
Other than this clown who didn't address the issue and simply used it to display pseudo-intellect by using big words, there were a fair number of responses to the question.
I understand the difficulty involved in finding a group at times. I played a ranger in EQ which is probably one of the most disrespected classes in the game. It was often very hard for my character to find a group. That's one reason why it's good to form online friendships in the game. When my friends were playing, I usually was able to group with them right off the bat.
One of the problems I have with the trend toward lack of grouping is that devs started gearing MMOs toward solo content and that led to widespread anti-social behavior in MMOs. I'll never forget when I was playing Age of Conan, everyone was soloing, almost no one ever looked for a group unless it was absolutely necessary. There was this one quest that required you to kill a mob too tough to solo and so people were calling out for members to join a group to kill it. Well I had the quest, so I joined and we killed the mob. When it was over, I thought cool, we've got a group now, let's go out and kill some more tough mobs. But as soon as the quest mob was dead, everyone immediately disbanded and went their own way again. It was disappointing.
So I'm encouraged by a game like Pantheon that will force you to form groups in order to accomplish big things. Hopefully it will bring the sociability back into MMOs.