GW2 cities are the only ones that feel to scale like a real city would be. The rest feel more like instanced lobbies and hamlets with few npc's and even fewer PC's.
Black Desert online set the bar on that front, though some GW2 cities came close.
1 Trinsic - Ultima Online - Really stood out from the dirt and cobblestone of most cities 2 Allemantheia - TERA - One of the more awe inspiring cities in an MMO 3 Calpheon Capital - Black Desert - The closest an MMO has gotten to feeling alive.
Honorable mentions: Divinity's Reach GW2, Old Lion's Arch (before they ruined it) GW2, Stormwind WoW
Shard - DragonRealms. going real old school with this one. not even sure it technically counts, as it's actually a MUD, but in it's heyday it was one of the bigger ones boasting 2000+ active players at a time when most other MUDs were lucky to break 50-100. while it was all text and imagination, the descriptions of the scenery were beautifully described, and the diamond-shaped layout of the city was very cool. watch out for the bandits in the sewers!
Kaladim - EverQuest. underground dwarven city. what's not to like. a little hard to get around in, but the concept of it was very cool. Kelethin would be a close 2nd just because a treehouse city is a very cool concept. a deadly concept to noobs unfortunately, which is why it wasn't my first EQ pick (lol) but a cool looking city and a unique idea nonetheless.
Cannith Enclave - Dungeons & Dragons Online. beautiful colorful well detailed architecture with a borderline steampunk feel to it (in Eberron lore, Cannith was in to tech/magitech type things, so when this city was added in an update, it was appropriately decorated with magical tech... gears, levitating/moving platforms, etc)
The Grove - Guild Wars 2. for sheer beauty not much beats this city. whimsical plant everything, floating specks of light, graceful flowing organic architecture. again, a little bit of a PITA to maneuver around, but visually stunning. Divinity's Reach is a close-ish 2nd
Heidel - Black Desert Online. this answer may change as i explore more... i am very new to BDO... i am still constantly overwhelmed by how wonderfully detailed and rich and complex everything is in this game. I like Heidel so far because it feels very alive. not just with the sheer number of other players that i see (and there's quite a few), but there's NPCs everywhere, and i can talk to almost every one of them and learn things. i have a house, i have expanded stable room (because i like horses... don't judge >.> ) i have workers farming potatoes and i don't even know what to do with them. lol. (yes yes i know. make beer. but still!)
BDO has its faults but they nailed both the size and feel of cities that feel alive.
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Has anyone noticed how few MMOs from the last 5 years are on this thread? We are not talking gameplay or cash shops, just cities. If they were from more recent MMOs they were still large open worlds, that's what makes for cities we remember.
It's a bit unfair since you can only choose 3. If I could choose more, there would be Dalaran (WoW), most cities in Black Desert and most cities in ESO in no particular order because all look great, and many others (Arwic /AC1 for instance).
My 3 top choices come from a 20 years old MMO (UO), a 13 years old one (WoW) and a 2012 one (GW2), not too bad when it comes to be spread out in time, considering GW2 has still very nice graphics even by today's standards.
I don't quite get the point, Sovrath also posted something similar. The only reason it is skewed to older MMOs is there were more large open world MMOs then. Irrespective of zones and instances, they tended to be larger. That's why BDO, ESO and GW2 get a mention, they have large worlds, maybe not as big in acreage or such but big enough to put a big city in.
So many MMOs are tinyMMOs in comparison and you are not going to be able to put a memorable city in a shoebox.
1 Trinsic - Ultima Online - Really stood out from the dirt and cobblestone of most cities 2 Allemantheia - TERA - One of the more awe inspiring cities in an MMO 3 Calpheon Capital - Black Desert - The closest an MMO has gotten to feeling alive.
Honorable mentions: Divinity's Reach GW2, Old Lion's Arch (before they ruined it) GW2, Stormwind WoW
The thing about UO's cities was as Scot alluded to, the game was such a social atmosphere. Trinsic really was a great city. It had everything. Large, docks, walls and gates, and a lot of game history. There was a room above a shop in Trinsic that you couldn't get to. No stairs or anything. But we used to teleport in through a window and hold secret meetings there. Things like that add a special something to your world.
Has anyone noticed how few MMOs from the last 5 years are on this thread? We are not talking gameplay or cash shops, just cities. If they were from more recent MMOs they were still large open worlds, that's what makes for cities we remember.
It's all just nostalgia and rose colored glasses, there was clearly nothing different, special or better in older MMORPGs, its all in your head.
......
but if you think about it, there is mention of cities from more contemporary games.
Black Desert, Guild Wars 2 and Aion were all mentioned.
Additionally, it probably has less to do with certain games being made before a certain time (and therefore "better" and therefore "nostalgia") and more to do with the games that players on this site have actually played.
Given that there seems to be a leaning for "older games" among a good many of this forum's "residents" I imagine that those who are listing older games probably played the older games quite a bit. They might not have played many of the newer games or played them "a lot". So no real reason to list their cities as "favorites".
There's also a strong "been there, done that" factor involved. Those first few years of MMO playing, people were still dazzled by "Wow, virtual worlds!" Now a decade later that initial sense of wonder is hard to recapture.
My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)
Has anyone noticed how few MMOs from the last 5 years are on this thread? We are not talking gameplay or cash shops, just cities. If they were from more recent MMOs they were still large open worlds, that's what makes for cities we remember.
It's all just nostalgia and rose colored glasses, there was clearly nothing different, special or better in older MMORPGs, its all in your head.
......
I disagree. It probably has more to do with how open and free MMOs used to be. Cities felt like cities.
The cities in SWG were even more grand due to the world housing just outside the city borders. It felt like a real hustle-n-bustle city with actual suburbs.
I did like the desert city in ArcheAge, though. Real nice!
Has anyone noticed how few MMOs from the last 5 years are on this thread? We are not talking gameplay or cash shops, just cities. If they were from more recent MMOs they were still large open worlds, that's what makes for cities we remember.
It's all just nostalgia and rose colored glasses, there was clearly nothing different, special or better in older MMORPGs, its all in your head.
......
but if you think about it, there is mention of cities from more contemporary games.
Black Desert, Guild Wars 2 and Aion were all mentioned.
Additionally, it probably has less to do with certain games being made before a certain time (and therefore "better" and therefore "nostalgia") and more to do with the games that players on this site have actually played.
Given that there seems to be a leaning for "older games" among a good many of this forum's "residents" I imagine that those who are listing older games probably played the older games quite a bit. They might not have played many of the newer games or played them "a lot". So no real reason to list their cities as "favorites".
It's also harder to impress people over time.
The First MMO someone plays could captivate them for years, and they are just awe struck by the world they are playing in.
Their 10th MMO, and they trying to figure out how this is better/different the last 6 MMO's they played, so it's harder to impress them.
In that front, I find it to be a testament to a games quality and ability to impress, when I see a list that started with a place out of UO and ends with a city in GW2, for example.
For me, there is also a "techno-let-down" involved where my "little town of Kelethin or Qeynos" in EQ1 amazed me and I had visions while playing about "massive cities" in games to come. Every new MMO had, as someone else said, "villages, not cities." Stormwind & Ironforge in WoW felt like cities with districts and industries in place and lots of NPCs wondering about. The starting "city" in SW:TOR is HUGE, but empty as all get out. Divinity's Reach in GW2 feels like a city to me. Otherwise, the computing and internet power available today is either underused or ignored.
Now, we have cities with unopenable doors all over, lacking enough NPCs to have a "city feel" to it, and generally just streamlined "quest hubs" labeled as cities. There are exceptions, but they are the exceptions.
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse. - FARGIN_WAR
The First MMO someone plays could captivate them for years, and they are just awe struck by the world they are playing in.
Their 10th MMO, and they trying to figure out how this is better/different the last 6 MMO's they played, so it's harder to impress them.
In that front, I find it to be a testament to a games quality and ability to impress, when I see a list that started with a place out of UO and ends with a city in GW2, for example.
For me, there is also a "techno-let-down" involved where my "little town of Kelethin or Qeynos" in EQ1 amazed me and I had visions while playing about "massive cities" in games to come. Every new MMO had, as someone else said, "villages, not cities." Stormwind & Ironforge in WoW felt like cities with districts and industries in place and lots of NPCs wondering about. The starting "city" in SW:TOR is HUGE, but empty as all get out. Divinity's Reach in GW2 feels like a city to me. Otherwise, the computing and internet power available today is either underused or ignored.
Now, we have cities with unopenable doors all over, lacking enough NPCs to have a "city feel" to it, and generally just streamlined "quest hubs" labeled as cities. There are exceptions, but they are the exceptions.
And what doors you can open in Divinity's Reach? It is a terrible imitation of a city. Looks good only from outside. L2 cities were at least usable - you could enter in every building and every had purpose for the players. Also BDO - every city in BDO is far superior than anything in any other MMORPG, if we are talking for architecture, design and NPCs. They are not very usable in the terms of a multiplayer game, but look great and have many functionalities for the solo player. What have towns in GW2? Nothing.
There are a lot of buildings in Divinity's Reach that you can go into. Some of them are only accessible during story quests though. They didn't model the interior of every building, but then it has a lot more total structures than games that do model the interior. Do you really need to see inside every peasant hovel?
Divinity's Reach is a living city. Just walking around you hear gossip and people talking about their problems to others. It also sounds alive with all the background chatter. I once followed an NPC and saw what she went through to try and find her missing husband. Not part of a quest line just one of many little stories someone added to the game to make it feel alive.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Comments
Kelethin, Rivervale - EQ
Divinity's Reach, Lion's Arch - GW2
Darnassus, Stormwind - WOW
Freeport - EQ2
Paragon City - CoH
Limsa Lominsa - FFXIV
Sorry, it's hard to pick JUST three. lol
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As said earlier, MC in CO. http://www.championswiki.com/images/3/36/Millennium_City_Map.png
At least if size matters and you want "scale like a real city". Both in dimensions, as in layout (industrial area, residental areas, parks, etc.).
2 Allemantheia - TERA - One of the more awe inspiring cities in an MMO
3 Calpheon Capital - Black Desert - The closest an MMO has gotten to feeling alive.
Honorable mentions: Divinity's Reach GW2, Old Lion's Arch (before they ruined it) GW2, Stormwind WoW
Freeport - Everquest 2
Khal - Vanguard
Vanguard had some awesome cities with the music to go with them.
1. Rome - Anarchy Online
Pardon my English as it is not my 1st language
Kaladim - EverQuest. underground dwarven city. what's not to like. a little hard to get around in, but the concept of it was very cool. Kelethin would be a close 2nd just because a treehouse city is a very cool concept. a deadly concept to noobs unfortunately, which is why it wasn't my first EQ pick (lol) but a cool looking city and a unique idea nonetheless.
Cannith Enclave - Dungeons & Dragons Online. beautiful colorful well detailed architecture with a borderline steampunk feel to it (in Eberron lore, Cannith was in to tech/magitech type things, so when this city was added in an update, it was appropriately decorated with magical tech... gears, levitating/moving platforms, etc)
The Grove - Guild Wars 2. for sheer beauty not much beats this city. whimsical plant everything, floating specks of light, graceful flowing organic architecture. again, a little bit of a PITA to maneuver around, but visually stunning. Divinity's Reach is a close-ish 2nd
Heidel - Black Desert Online. this answer may change as i explore more... i am very new to BDO... i am still constantly overwhelmed by how wonderfully detailed and rich and complex everything is in this game. I like Heidel so far because it feels very alive. not just with the sheer number of other players that i see (and there's quite a few), but there's NPCs everywhere, and i can talk to almost every one of them and learn things. i have a house, i have expanded stable room (because i like horses... don't judge >.> ) i have workers farming potatoes and i don't even know what to do with them. lol. (yes yes i know. make beer. but still!)
2. Tortage - Age of Conan
3. The Inevitable City - WAR
/Cheers,
Lahnmir
Kyleran on yours sincerely
'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'
Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless.
It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.
It is just huge resource waste....'
Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer
Limsa Lominsa-Final Fantasy XIV
Orsha-Tree of Savior (because its al-ways unpopulated).
Thurgadin, Rivervale, Ak'Anon - EQ
Undercity - WoW
BDO has its faults but they nailed both the size and feel of cities that feel alive.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Jeuno - FFXI
Undercity - WoW
So many MMOs are tinyMMOs in comparison and you are not going to be able to put a memorable city in a shoebox.
Trinsic really was a great city. It had everything. Large, docks, walls and gates, and a lot of game history.
There was a room above a shop in Trinsic that you couldn't get to. No stairs or anything. But we used to teleport in through a window and hold secret meetings there.
Things like that add a special something to your world.
Once upon a time....
My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)
https://www.ashesofcreation.com/ref/Callaron/
Giran - L2 (with warehouse manager T...? )
Calpheon - BDO
Kelethin EQ (it just iconic)
Thunderbluff WoW (city on top of the mountains + mulgore)
Windurst FFXI ( tarus were a plus )
Gorowyn Eq2 (cool as hell)
Lion Arch Gw2 (before and after)
Limsa lominsa - FFXIV (both 1.0 and 2.0)
EverQuest 2: Original Freeport - I felt dirty.
SWG: Mos Eisley - I felt like I had my own part in the story.
I think it's hard to beat EQ 2 Freeport, you had a whole city with different quarters and housing.
On top of that you had so many quest that took you all over and below the city with the sewers.
You also had great music and a great lore story to go with the city. In fact I think EQ 2 has the best cities of any mmo to date.
The cities in SWG were even more grand due to the world housing just outside the city borders. It felt like a real hustle-n-bustle city with actual suburbs.
I did like the desert city in ArcheAge, though. Real nice!
Now, we have cities with unopenable doors all over, lacking enough NPCs to have a "city feel" to it, and generally just streamlined "quest hubs" labeled as cities. There are exceptions, but they are the exceptions.
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.- FARGIN_WAR
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey