The thing MMORPG tag are dead

Maurgrim · July 2018

Well it seems the very core of what MMO used to be are dead the very core MMORPG tag are dead these days.

You can go on steam and see, wow a MMORPG game there and you think wow damn I want to play that but when you read about it It's a 64 man server.

So, what happen?

MightyUnclean · July 2018

IDK, what happen?

Guizee · July 2018

Maurgrim said:

Well it seems the very core of what MMO used to be are dead the very core MMORPG tag are dead these days.
You can go on steam and see, wow a MMORPG game there and you think wow damn I want to play that but when you read about it It's a 64 man server.

So, what happen?

People tried to make MMOs the way they were supposed to be, and most of them failed beautifully. But imo the problem is not about making the ideal MMO, the money, manpower and other resources are indeed the hardest parts.

Xasapis · July 2018

What actually happened is shady developers trying the same tactic they tried with single player games, only mmorpgs are marathons, hence most of those low effort high visibility titled died out.

Both mmorpgs and multiplayer games that are build to last do bring money to their respective companies. It's just that low effort cheap phone or facebook games bring much much more.

kjempff · July 2018

Trends changed, labels stuck.
The nature park with amazing wildlife experiences had resorts built, then a themepark and a supermarked, the wildlife left but the area is still named "the wildlife retreat".

Scot · July 2018

MMORPG's have changed for many reasons, but the OP is picking out the 64 man servers you can now get in "MMOs". To me this is a lot to do with the fusion of MMO and solo gaming but comes as much from the solo end. We have seen solo games which also have multiplayer gaining ground over pure solo games for years. That sort of number of players, 64 is a reasonable number for that sort of play.

As MMOs have been led around by the nose by the solo genre for nearly two decades it is not surprising that the sort of number of players you find in a Battlefield match is seen as worthy of the name "MMO". It is ridiculous, but the term MMORPG lost its meaning so long ago, the gameplay priorities of other gaming genres are what now rule the "MMO" genre.

Xasapis · July 2018

I think there is a technological barrier around that number. That in turn is limiting the design.

The only game that I've successfully played that had easily passed that barrier was Planetside 2. Even more impressive, the engine it was build supported FPS battles in that scale. Only time that engine was brought to its knees was during 1000 players PvP battles in the same area.

I can't think of another game with similar numbers.

Bananable · July 2018

Maurgrim said:

Well it seems the very core of what MMO used to be are dead the very core MMORPG tag are dead these days.
You can go on steam and see, wow a MMORPG game there and you think wow damn I want to play that but when you read about it It's a 64 man server.

So, what happen?

Oh, nothing special... just steam monopoly (now you can pay to play unfinished no innovation alpha BS that was released/failed years ago, yay!); developers impotence and publishers greediness. New generation kids that believe everything what those tell em, just because they think throwing money is cool.

Seriously, wtf is this:

Bless. Aparently was around for couple years already (somehow i missed that), but recently they released it on steam with amazing preorder bs.
From wiki:"From December 2016 until May 2017, an open beta version of the Bless client was hosted on servers located in Russia, before being shut down after failing to gain traction"
Lolz.

Rift. Behold amazing Rift Prime!
They made wow clone ( thats what ppl say, ive never played wow), failed. Made game f2p...failed.
Then decided to make it p2p again. >.>
Lolz.

Defiance 2050. Trion strikes again!
Year 2018. Be a founder to play the 2014 game (SAME game) before anyone else!
Lolz.

PUBG.
Couple of guys made multiplayer mod, called it a game (ofcourse kids belived em) got lucky and become popular rich @!#$...
But now they have no idea what to do.
Lolz.

FORTNITE.
From what i remember originally it was co-op base building/defence from zombie waves pve arcade shooter...
Aparently their own idea wasnt that good, so they just stole one from other ppl... again got lucky and become popular rich @!#%...
Its better than PUBG, its free - thats what kids say.

See, multiplayer always was about money. Devs just wanna spend $1 to get millions. They have no ideas. They only rely on pure luck.
Dont you remember moba fever before? They also called some of them mmos.

P.S. Speakin about tags alot of games on steam have misleading tags. Aparenlty every game is RPG nowadays.

Scorchien · July 2018

Plz................not again

AlBQuirky · July 2018

The answer is in my signature. Publishers wanted World of Warcraft numbers so they streamlined the life out of the "RPG" part of MMORPG. 10 years later, it still hasn't worked. No MMO is close to WoW's peak 10+ million monthly subscribers. But we have millions of players now that never wanted the "boring RPG" aspect to begin with. yay?

Kyleran · July 2018

Xasapis said:

I think there is a technological barrier around that number. That in turn is limiting the design.

The only game that I've successfully played that had easily passed that barrier was Planetside 2. Even more impressive, the engine it was build supported FPS battles in that scale. Only time that engine was brought to its knees was during 1000 players PvP battles in the same area.

I can't think of another game with similar numbers.

Besides EVE? Recently failed in hosting a 6400 player fight, but they are still working on it.

Deddmeat · July 2018

Another thing which doesn't help .. PvE

Remember when you had choice or Meridian 59 or UO, well or MuD's etc

your choice to play was safe in town, set foot outside and PvP. Everyone, ok NOT everyone but a LOT of people learned to look out for each other, warn about reds up ahead, go out PK'ng Reds .. funnily that was ok. Red PK blues NOOOO your a criminal and boooooooooooooooo

BUt if you were Blue, right was on your side and you could go murder, i mean slaughter, wait butche, no maim, dammit .. erm, catch with prejudice the Reds

Then EQ hit, PvE and UO changed it's ways, it spilt to PvE/PvP choice and games since just haven't been the same.

Must admit tho you can get some total buttwipes on the PvP servers .. i think it's because there's less people to put them in their place (Blue's vs Reds effectively)

madazz · July 2018

People allowed others to bastardize what MMO stood for. They started adding in weird things. Like character progression, questing, items, persistence. MMO only stands for player quantity. Its sooooo simple.

Some of those people are the site moderators here. This site used to be a central hub that people would reference. For years now we all know this site is a joke when expecting ANY of the writers here to know what they are writing about. They list Path of Exile as an MMO still for instance.

THIS VERY SITE once voted for League of Legends to be one of the best MMO's of the year back in 2012. Like get a clue... how is 5 vs 5 a massively multiplayer experience? Multiplayer and online means online multiplayer guys... so MMO means.... you got it! Massively Multiplayer Online. STOP ADDING EXTRA CRAP AND CONFUSING PEOPLE. Only MMORPG needs persistence and stores with character progression. An MMO could be 15 minutes of 2000 people shooting each other in a 500 x 500 foot room. It could also be thousands of people building something together in a shared space for 5 minutes. Doesn't matter, as long as there are a massive amount of players together.

TheScavenger · July 2018

Good. Old MMOs were boring, grindy and incredibly bad.

Games evolve, change. Either stick with old games, or enjoy new games or find a new hobby.

For example, people still play MUDs...they are actually a quite popular niche. But, nowhere close at all to the numbers of new modern games. But for those who hate new games, they have MUDs as a choice

I myself am very happy with the MMO genre since WoW. I hated pretty much every MMO before WoW. WoW made MMOs mainstream for a while, but actually made the whole genre branch off into many new types of MMOs or MMO-lite games.

And the vast majority of gamers agree with me, because despite a bunch of old people on MMORPG.com that are stuck in their old ways...new MMOs and MMO-lites are so much more popular than old MMOs ever were.

madazz · July 2018

TheScavenger said:

Good. Old MMOs were boring, grindy and incredibly bad.

Games evolve, change. Either stick with old games, or enjoy new games or find a new hobby.

For example, people still play MUDs...they are actually a quite popular niche. But, nowhere close at all to the numbers of new modern games. But for those who hate new games, they have MUDs as a choice

I myself am very happy with the MMO genre since WoW. I hated pretty much every MMO before WoW. WoW made MMOs mainstream for a while, but actually made the whole genre branch off into many new types of MMOs or MMO-lite games.

And the vast majority of gamers agree with me, because despite a bunch of old people on MMORPG.com that are stuck in their old ways...new MMOs and MMO-lites are so much more popular than old MMOs ever were.

There is no such thing as mmo-lite. Its either massively multiplayer, or just large scale, or standard. Its the same with shirt sizes. There is no X-large-lite. That's called large. There are also large scale co-op games to consider too. But no such thing as MMO-lite.

KnightFalz · August 2018

Maurgrim said:

Well it seems the very core of what MMO used to be are dead the very core MMORPG tag are dead these days.
You can go on steam and see, wow a MMORPG game there and you think wow damn I want to play that but when you read about it It's a 64 man server.

So, what happen?

The only thing that is constant is change. ~ Heraclitus

Change in happening, in the application of the MMO acronym, such that is no longer used only as synonymous to the MMORPG acronym.

For some this is an unwelcome change, but it continues regardless.

KnightFalz · August 2018

madazz said:

TheScavenger said:

Good. Old MMOs were boring, grindy and incredibly bad.

Games evolve, change. Either stick with old games, or enjoy new games or find a new hobby.

For example, people still play MUDs...they are actually a quite popular niche. But, nowhere close at all to the numbers of new modern games. But for those who hate new games, they have MUDs as a choice

I myself am very happy with the MMO genre since WoW. I hated pretty much every MMO before WoW. WoW made MMOs mainstream for a while, but actually made the whole genre branch off into many new types of MMOs or MMO-lite games.

And the vast majority of gamers agree with me, because despite a bunch of old people on MMORPG.com that are stuck in their old ways...new MMOs and MMO-lites are so much more popular than old MMOs ever were.

There is no X-large-lite. That's called large.

This is, though, X-large-tall. So, X-large in and of itself is not the be all, end all of X-large shirts as you suggest.

As far as MMO-lite, whether such exists is a matter of collective opinion, and that is subject to change as the ongoing shift in definitions demonstrates.

TheScavenger · August 2018

DMKano said:

Imagine that - games evolve over time.

Oh yeah - evolve doesn't mean "the direction you wanted them to go to" - sometimes quite the opposite happens

Yup. Its like WoW is very different today than it used to be back in Classic. Some people like that, some don't.

AriesTiger · August 2018

World of Warcraft is finally kicking the roleplayers and PVE'ers to the curb and trying out a PVP focus. Only reason I'm back in 4+ years.

Xasapis · August 2018

I can't think of a single mmorpg that survived by focusing entirely on PvP or even having a mostly PvP focus. Maybe EVE Online (which is kind of funny I mentioned since it's a game I never PvP for the little I stayed).

I think we're talking personal preference here. I, for example, left Blade & Soul solely because at the time they didn't separate their PvE progress from their PvP daily quests. Which is sad really because it had one of the most enjoyable combat systems I had the pleasure to play.

esc-joconnor · August 2018

Maurgrim said:

Well it seems the very core of what MMO used to be are dead the very core MMORPG tag are dead these days.
You can go on steam and see, wow a MMORPG game there and you think wow damn I want to play that but when you read about it It's a 64 man server.

So, what happen?

This doesn't have to do with PvE, PvP, or wow clones.
It just doesn't make sense to make what you think of as an MMO.
Why? What most people actually want to do doesn't require them interacting with more than 10 or 20 people most of the time.
No matter how many people will lament the loss of their 2000 player battles, the amount of enjoyment you get out of the game the game doesn't go up the more players there are.
Basically what you think you want in a game and what they have figured out you will enjoy aren't the same thing.
In the future, I think most games will be solo or limited co-op, because they will be able to simulate a better experience customized to you than you can get with random other players.
I'm trying to promote a truely Massive Multiplayer game, but even if there are large battles, the actual players you will interact with at any given moment won't be in the hundreds, never mind the thousands. You can get that in a game like Destiny now. There may only be 20 players or so per instance, but the actual players are constantly changing.

Theocritus · August 2018

Deddmeat said:

Another thing which doesn't help .. PvE

Remember when you had choice or Meridian 59 or UO, well or MuD's etc

your choice to play was safe in town, set foot outside and PvP. Everyone, ok NOT everyone but a LOT of people learned to look out for each other, warn about reds up ahead, go out PK'ng Reds .. funnily that was ok. Red PK blues NOOOO your a criminal and boooooooooooooooo

BUt if you were Blue, right was on your side and you could go murder, i mean slaughter, wait butche, no maim, dammit .. erm, catch with prejudice the Reds

Then EQ hit, PvE and UO changed it's ways, it spilt to PvE/PvP choice and games since just haven't been the same.

Must admit tho you can get some total buttwipes on the PvP servers .. i think it's because there's less people to put them in their place (Blue's vs Reds effectively)

Yes how great would the genre be if we had such high quality games as meridian 59 and UO to choose from now.....EQ helped save the genre, not hurt it....WoW is the one where the genre started to fall apart because of it.

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The thing MMORPG tag are dead

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The thing MMORPG tag are dead

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Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV