Jokes aside. I was one who bought: - Defiance. It was so boring and dull, i regret that i spend money. Not only it became f2p, trion is re-released it again this year...
-TSW, right after it went b2p, it was so confusing...its f2p now and devs re-released it again...
- Gw2 got it on release, my favorite game. I quit it because devs have no ideas any more, they just milk their fans now. Devs made it f2p because the base game worth nothing anymore, And by letting f2p players play they make an illusion that the game is alive while they make money on xpacks. (You can officially buy gem store items for gold btw).
Wildstar is wow killer :b
You can sub to Rift prime... :P
Those games went to fp2 because devs, dont give flock about me, or you. All what they want is money. I mean MONEY.
All b2p or p2p games are not worth that money they ask in the first place, they all have f2p quality lvl.
MMOs these days live not because you (or me) pay. They live as long as they bring new players in.
FFXIV ARR only popular, because its franchise and japanese have no other game to play. Eso is popular because its Elder scrolls series and its b2p now. Look morrowind is free for new players when they buy base game now. (Also you can buy DLCs for in-game gold. )
I knew a 'WoW Raider' that paid a guild thousands of IRL $ to get all the BIS gear she could want, and after she got it....she quit not too long after. She still sucked at her class, and didn't 'earn' her shinnies and peeps caught on soon enough....
Let's be real here. We pay the highest amount possible to game in the most important currency for a human to pay with, and that's TIME.
It doesn't really matter what sub method you play a game under, as much as it's important to play something that's entertaining to you.
Stop looking at my screen and into my wallet and go enjoy yourself! Try not to stroke out over something none of us have any control over individually, and hardly much more collectively.
But, I will say (do as I say, not as I do, with regards to my 'mind your own business' comment above), if you are playing a F2P game and really enjoying yourself why not throw SOMETHING the Dev's way. Show them some love for giving you a place to spend some entertaining TIME.
It's like when you go to a restaurant and don't leave a tip. Fast food places? No tip. Sit down restaurant? 10-20%+ of pre-tax bill depending on quality of service. Hell, even buffets where they refill your drinks and take away your empty plates, leave a few dollars. And don't think we don't know that you DO know what you're doing Europeans! In America, follow the above guidelines. In Europe, I guess it's included in the bill? Crazy talk!
Post was a bit confusing to read at first, but you got your point across my friend. Just say no to free games. Lol. I don't blame you. I pay my monthly subscription fee too.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and in my opinion, the OP's FTP opinion is not a good opinion.
And here's why ...
First, I'm in agreement with the OP's first commenter DMKano.
Stop telling me what to do!
Your tone is bombastic, shrill and domineering — more like a rant tbh.
Second, while "Free" rarely means truly free, the FTP scenario makes more games available to more people.
If I wanted to, and if I had infinite computing power, I could spend the rest of today downloading the MMORPG classics — DDO Online, Neverwinter, Black Desert Online (infinite hard drive needed there) — and I could check these out to see if they were the games for me.
If I'm lucky, I LOVE the 20 games I download today — but that kind of romance is statistically rare, so it's likely I'll end up with a few bummers.
Solution?
I simply undownload the bummers, and playtest the rest.
And, yeah ... a few more of these are not to my liking either.
So I undownload those also.
A month into my crazed F2P experiment — whose bedrock is also TIME as well as MONEY — I have maybe three games I've found that I really like playing.
For two of these, I splash out on the odd bonus pack, but for my favourite, I commit to the monthly or annual fee because I'm hooked.
This is good for me as a player, and good for the games manufacturers also.
For players, it means not spending vast sums of money on games you hate and don't want to play.
For games manufacturers — who do you want sharing comments about your game on social media?
Clearly, you want the hardcore zealots and enthusiasts — but what about the people who DON'T play your game because they've tried it and don't like it?
Depends whether those people are
a) F2P ... tried the game ... didn't like it ... moved on to Spyro 7 Bunnies ... no fired-up opinion
or
b) Bought the game for $50 ... hated it ... felt aggrieved ... ranted on Twitter.
In essence the F2P concept is similar to that of a LIBRARY — only instead of going to the "books", the "books" come to YOU.
Third, every payment barrier shuts people out of the game.
It's true that F2P is good for business — but isn't that what we all want?
A big choice of games rather than fewer games?
F2P makes it easier for people to discover the great new game world you have to offer.
And if they LIKE IT so much they SIGN UP FOR THE SUB, likely they'd have liked the game anyway even if they'd paid up front in full.
It's very difficult to make people like games they don't like!
"Curse that Neverwinter for FORCING me to go from FTP to sub! I HATE IT!"
What we see in FTP is a working model that pulls in a lot of the way Kickstarter works.
FTP generates support and momentum — precisely what you need to build a thriving gaming industry for the benefit of frothing aficionados.
Plenty of people here benefit from the system enormously.
Either they discover games they wish to sign up for ... or they busk it.
That last part may look like suicide from the POV of the game manufacturers — until you consider the Two Diner Town in The Desert.
You're hungry, and you've been driving all night.
You pitch up at the Town in The Desert & discover it has two diners.
One is empty, one has a few people sitting in the window, chatting and eating.
Unless there's something else going on, like the 2nd diner also has a DEMON waiting to bite everyone's heads off, the populated diner is usually considered to be the more enticing prospect.
So you go in and order a burger.
Turns out the people in the window are the owner's fam, but hey, you're here now eating your $8 burger.
And as you gaze out of the window, here comes a big ole truck with another weary driver ...
Stumpiness & Unbridled Misery Masquerading as VIRTUE
Need an AI-Free Elf Names Generator to bring your next elven character to life? Why ... course you do, you darn fool!
Ppl will always find a way even in sub based games to pay their way up. WoW is an example for that matter.
You also forget one thing; There's specific forums, gold/gaming websites which can offer for x amount of money to make your progress faster (for sub based games) so there's that.
There's pay to win everywhere, not just in f2p games. Also some of these "Free to Play MMO's" are quite good imo. Like you know, LoTRO for example. I love that game.
I'm a F2P player and i wanna tell you that. Not everybody like you can afford games, sometimes people just wanna have a little fun that's all. You can't just say it like this. Not every game is the same.
So go play EQ1 and give them $15 a month...I did it for 4-5 years and didnt enjoy having to do that...I felt the customers were being milked for money...I like f2p....I pay what I want, when I want, not just a forced amount every 30 days.
Subscription is weird, especially if the game dev releases updates as slow as possible and you end up playing the same content with multiple characters waiting for something to change.
I'm a F2P player and i wanna tell you that. Not everybody like you can afford games, sometimes people just wanna have a little fun that's all. You can't just say it like this. Not every game is the same.
For me right now i'm playing swtor but i am a premium player. The only thing i like in swtor are the class and zone stories. And those are F2P. I'M having a blast just doing that and don't give a crap about grouping or anything else in the game.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
So long as I don't have to spend a dime, I'll play them. I don't spend money to win. I don't spend money for quality of life. I don't spend money unless I WANT TO. If the game doesn't entertain me, I play something else. With a F2P game, I'm out nothing.
Not all F2P games are the same - You are dumping them all into the same bucket because of how they are monetized and not by the merit of each game.
Seems like your real complaint is the cash shop - not F2P.
So you want everyone to stop playing games that have a cash shop.... tell me again - how many games don't have a cash shop?
Yeah.....about that
So how about this - you play what makes you happy and let everyone do the same.
Playe whatever is fun, drawing a hard line in the sand over the cash shop - gonna miss out on a lot of great games
This. Also, wait till @OP finds out that most Pay to Play games these days still contain a Cash Shop. OP doesn't seem to realize that the problem isn't Free to Play games or Pay to Play games. It's the gaming industry itself. The majority of game publishers and studios are out to make as much money as they possibly can off their product, and I don't fault them for that. They are are a business after all. However, it's the monetization practices that we let happen because we excused such behavior.
The constant attitude I see when it comes to gaming is "I can afford this, and if you can't; then get a better job or don't play.". These kinds of gamers don't care about gaming as a whole. Just themselves. They are the ones buying Loot Boxes, insanely priced cosmetics, etc. They are what the industry calls "Whales". It's not about how much they spend, it's the fact that they're willing to spend.
People need to realize when to say no. Example. The loot box. Say a game your fond with decides to add a Loot Box for the first time for say $2.50 (Average price of a loot box these days), but makes it so that even if you can't buy the boxes, you can still earn them, albeit, at a much less rate and thus they are technically "free" as well. THIS is where you should say "No!". Most gamers would go "Oh it's fine since you can still get it for free". This is where they get you. This is why Loot Boxes got out of hand.
I play the only HQ f2p game out there,not because it is a cash shop game but because it is a private server game that cannot charge anything to play. The real problem is supporting lame cash shops that are ALWAYS more invasive than any subscription ever was.I do feel that EQ2 is likely the best option out there for a cash shop game that is also HQ. Actually supporting f2p is bad for a better reason than lame cash shops,it allows developers/publishers an easy legal out because you are not purchasing or subbing to the game the dev/pub has almost no legal obligations to the gamer's. The only obligation i can think of is your account security but even then devs like to use minimal measures and blame YOU.
So yeah supporting f2p is supporting VERY bad business practices that NEVER support the gamer and only make it super easy for the developer.In essence the cash shop games are usually offering nothing,you NEED to spend money or play those games at an even lesser degree than the cheap free model already incorporates.I mentioned EQ2 because unlike a few other games,that game was actually designed not around f2p but around a purchase+sub so it is not a f2p model.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Replaying to the title even though I hate f2p games: STOP TELLING US WHAT TO DO!
Your region tells you what to do,your city,your government,your lawmen,your teacher,your boss and once you step inside someone else's domain be it online or in real life,they tell you what to do as well. So seems you are NEVER going to avoid that dilemma.Often times people need to be told what to do hence why there is so much of it in society,otherwise lot's of odd people out there waiting to do stupid things,like the recent stabbing over auto rage or people leaving their kids in hot cars,yeah there seems to be a need to tell people what to do.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
This entire thread post and the OP just spouts gaming elitism at its very core. I don't like f2p games just as much as the next person, but the issue I have is degrading people who do. "True gamers," is not a real thing; and it never has been. It's simply a made-up term by special snowflakes who denigrate people who spend less time then them in a game and found another way to compensate with by financially, utilizing a friend to powerlevel, multiboxing, and etc. If they play video games, then they are a gamer. That's it. No less, no more. If they play casually, they are a casual gamer. A sub-class if you will of gamers, but still a gamer; just as a player who plays game hardcore is a hardcore gamer. At its heart though, they are still both gamers, just as anyone who plays f2p, b2p, p2p, rpg, mmo, fps, sports, anything.
Yet, people still come out and spout the term calling other people casuals, saying they aren't gamers, or don't like games because they have different tastes. We are all allowed to have our own tastes in video games. We are entitled to our own differing opinions, and our own different opinions are still right because they are our opinions and thus our truth. You want to get your point across, and try to "lead the revolution against f2p?" Don't insult the people you are trying to influence by insinuating that they are fake gamers just because they like something different from you.
This entire thread post and the OP just spouts gaming elitism at its very core. I don't like f2p games just as much as the next person, but the issue I have is degrading people who do. "True gamers," is not a real thing; and it never has been. It's simply a made-up term by special snowflakes who denigrate people who spend less time then them in a game and found another way to compensate with by financially, utilizing a friend to powerlevel, multiboxing, and etc. If they play video games, then they are a gamer. That's it. No less, no more. If they play casually, they are a casual gamer. A sub-class if you will of gamers, but still a gamer; just as a player who plays game hardcore is a hardcore gamer. At its heart though, they are still both gamers, just as anyone who plays f2p, b2p, p2p, rpg, mmo, fps, sports, anything.
Yet, people still come out and spout the term calling other people casuals, saying they aren't gamers, or don't like games because they have different tastes. We are all allowed to have our own tastes in video games. We are entitled to our own differing opinions, and our own different opinions are still right because they are our opinions and thus our truth. You want to get your point across, and try to "lead the revolution against f2p?" Don't insult the people you are trying to influence by insinuating that they are fake gamers just because they like something different from you.
I've been saying this for a long time. Someone who played games for 10 years or more think they are the "real gamer" when a newborn baby playing with a ball is just as much a hardcore gamer as the experienced guy is. It's just a matter if you are a good sport about it or you are an annoying guy to play with. That said i think good gamer is a humble gamer. And a humble, fun player to play with is a "true gamer" that which is not elitist and knows that life is a series of multiple games and everyone is a player. Even if you are working as a bus driver, financial consultant, physicist, anything really is a series of small games. So i agree with you
I used to think the term "true gamer" is meaningless till I realized some people call themselves a gamer because they have Candy Crush on their smartphone. Yeah thats where I draw the line, those are fake gamers!
Constantine, The Console Poster
"One of the most difficult tasks men can perform, however much others may despise it, is the invention of good games and it cannot be done by men out of touch with their instinctive selves." - Carl Jung
I used to think the term "true gamer" is meaningless till I realized some people call themselves a gamer because they have Candy Crush on their smartphone. Yeah thats where I draw the line, those are fake gamers!
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Seems this guy is a bit too dumb to realize there's a difference between a game that's merely F2P and one that has P2W cashshops or just cashshops in general [which uhh.....WoW, you know, the biggest MMO has].
Well basically this guy wants ppl to stop playing Warframe, or Path of Exile, or any other good f2p MMO/ARPG for them.
Since this is internet and everything could happen (or see in this case), instead of telling ppl what to do, make an constructive criticism "why playing F2P games is bad for you", something like that. Make your point/statement, but never tell ppl what to do...
Even if they doing it wrong in your eyes. Behaving like this will most likely lead to bashing and negative response from the community.
Comments
Lolz
But i like to play Marvel heroes online, Dead island epidemic and Spirit tales... :P
"I am used to pay my SUB every month"
Lolz.
Then why you blame players, but not your beloved devs that you supported so much?
"Reason why All good MMO going with that F2P model is ..... YOU"
You are right, its because of.... YOU.
"You can INVEST 100 hour in a FREE to PLAY games but someone who spend 5 hour and more $ than you is better than you ?"
I agree, i spent 100hrs and $0 in f2p game and you wasted $15 every month. You arent better than me.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jokes aside.
I was one who bought:
- Defiance. It was so boring and dull, i regret that i spend money. Not only it became f2p, trion is re-released it again this year...
-TSW, right after it went b2p, it was so confusing...its f2p now and devs re-released it again...
- Gw2 got it on release, my favorite game. I quit it because devs have no ideas any more, they just milk their fans now. Devs made it f2p because the base game worth nothing anymore, And by letting f2p players play they make an illusion that the game is alive while they make money on xpacks. (You can officially buy gem store items for gold btw).
Wildstar is wow killer :b
You can sub to Rift prime... :P
Those games went to fp2 because devs, dont give flock about me, or you. All what they want is money. I mean MONEY.
All b2p or p2p games are not worth that money they ask in the first place, they all have f2p quality lvl.
MMOs these days live not because you (or me) pay. They live as long as they bring new players in.
FFXIV ARR only popular, because its franchise and japanese have no other game to play.
Eso is popular because its Elder scrolls series and its b2p now. Look morrowind is free for new players when they buy base game now. (Also you can buy DLCs for in-game gold. )
Both ESO AND FFXIV have awfull and old mechanics.
P.S. I play only eso atm.
Let's be real here. We pay the highest amount possible to game in the most important currency for a human to pay with, and that's TIME.
It doesn't really matter what sub method you play a game under, as much as it's important to play something that's entertaining to you.
Stop looking at my screen and into my wallet and go enjoy yourself! Try not to stroke out over something none of us have any control over individually, and hardly much more collectively.
But, I will say (do as I say, not as I do, with regards to my 'mind your own business' comment above), if you are playing a F2P game and really enjoying yourself why not throw SOMETHING the Dev's way. Show them some love for giving you a place to spend some entertaining TIME.
It's like when you go to a restaurant and don't leave a tip. Fast food places? No tip. Sit down restaurant? 10-20%+ of pre-tax bill depending on quality of service. Hell, even buffets where they refill your drinks and take away your empty plates, leave a few dollars. And don't think we don't know that you DO know what you're doing Europeans! In America, follow the above guidelines. In Europe, I guess it's included in the bill? Crazy talk!
Gut Out!
What, me worry?
And here's why ...
First, I'm in agreement with the OP's first commenter DMKano.
Stop telling me what to do!
Your tone is bombastic, shrill and domineering — more like a rant tbh.
Second, while "Free" rarely means truly free, the FTP scenario makes more games available to more people.
If I wanted to, and if I had infinite computing power, I could spend the rest of today downloading the MMORPG classics — DDO Online, Neverwinter, Black Desert Online (infinite hard drive needed there) — and I could check these out to see if they were the games for me.
If I'm lucky, I LOVE the 20 games I download today — but that kind of romance is statistically rare, so it's likely I'll end up with a few bummers.
Solution?
I simply undownload the bummers, and playtest the rest.
And, yeah ... a few more of these are not to my liking either.
So I undownload those also.
A month into my crazed F2P experiment — whose bedrock is also TIME as well as MONEY — I have maybe three games I've found that I really like playing.
For two of these, I splash out on the odd bonus pack, but for my favourite, I commit to the monthly or annual fee because I'm hooked.
This is good for me as a player, and good for the games manufacturers also.
For players, it means not spending vast sums of money on games you hate and don't want to play.
For games manufacturers — who do you want sharing comments about your game on social media?
Clearly, you want the hardcore zealots and enthusiasts — but what about the people who DON'T play your game because they've tried it and don't like it?
Depends whether those people are
In essence the F2P concept is similar to that of a LIBRARY — only instead of going to the "books", the "books" come to YOU.
Third, every payment barrier shuts people out of the game.
It's true that F2P is good for business — but isn't that what we all want?
A big choice of games rather than fewer games?
F2P makes it easier for people to discover the great new game world you have to offer.
And if they LIKE IT so much they SIGN UP FOR THE SUB, likely they'd have liked the game anyway even if they'd paid up front in full.
It's very difficult to make people like games they don't like!
"Curse that Neverwinter for FORCING me to go from FTP to sub! I HATE IT!"
What we see in FTP is a working model that pulls in a lot of the way Kickstarter works.
Well except maybe devs of MMORPGs I suppose, sux for them.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
The constant attitude I see when it comes to gaming is "I can afford this, and if you can't; then get a better job or don't play.". These kinds of gamers don't care about gaming as a whole. Just themselves. They are the ones buying Loot Boxes, insanely priced cosmetics, etc. They are what the industry calls "Whales". It's not about how much they spend, it's the fact that they're willing to spend.
People need to realize when to say no. Example. The loot box. Say a game your fond with decides to add a Loot Box for the first time for say $2.50 (Average price of a loot box these days), but makes it so that even if you can't buy the boxes, you can still earn them, albeit, at a much less rate and thus they are technically "free" as well. THIS is where you should say "No!". Most gamers would go "Oh it's fine since you can still get it for free". This is where they get you. This is why Loot Boxes got out of hand.
The real problem is supporting lame cash shops that are ALWAYS more invasive than any subscription ever was.I do feel that EQ2 is likely the best option out there for a cash shop game that is also HQ.
Actually supporting f2p is bad for a better reason than lame cash shops,it allows developers/publishers an easy legal out because you are not purchasing or subbing to the game the dev/pub has almost no legal obligations to the gamer's.
The only obligation i can think of is your account security but even then devs like to use minimal measures and blame YOU.
So yeah supporting f2p is supporting VERY bad business practices that NEVER support the gamer and only make it super easy for the developer.In essence the cash shop games are usually offering nothing,you NEED to spend money or play those games at an even lesser degree than the cheap free model already incorporates.I mentioned EQ2 because unlike a few other games,that game was actually designed not around f2p but around a purchase+sub so it is not a f2p model.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
So seems you are NEVER going to avoid that dilemma.Often times people need to be told what to do hence why there is so much of it in society,otherwise lot's of odd people out there waiting to do stupid things,like the recent stabbing over auto rage or people leaving their kids in hot cars,yeah there seems to be a need to tell people what to do.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Yet, people still come out and spout the term calling other people casuals, saying they aren't gamers, or don't like games because they have different tastes. We are all allowed to have our own tastes in video games. We are entitled to our own differing opinions, and our own different opinions are still right because they are our opinions and thus our truth. You want to get your point across, and try to "lead the revolution against f2p?" Don't insult the people you are trying to influence by insinuating that they are fake gamers just because they like something different from you.
That said i think good gamer is a humble gamer. And a humble, fun player to play with is a "true gamer" that which is not elitist and knows that life is a series of multiple games and everyone is a player. Even if you are working as a bus driver, financial consultant, physicist, anything really is a series of small games. So i agree with you
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Since this is internet and everything could happen (or see in this case), instead of telling ppl what to do, make an constructive criticism "why playing F2P games is bad for you", something like that. Make your point/statement, but never tell ppl what to do...
Even if they doing it wrong in your eyes. Behaving like this will most likely lead to bashing and negative response from the community.