Funding

Amathe · October 2018

When VR got its Series A funding, they announced it. They even issued a press release:

https://www.pantheonmmo.com/content/forums/topic/5934/series-a-funding-for-pantheon-is-now-complete

Same with the Angel Investor:

https://venturebeat.com/2015/09/28/everquest-creator-raises-seed-round-to-build-pantheon-rise-of-the-fallen/

But I haven't seen anything lately about a new funding round, as ostensibly we draw nearer to closed beta.

To the contrary, I see people raising the issue and VR saying that they don't discuss funding.

I mention this not to be a naysayer or a critic. I still fully support the game. I'm just concerned about whether or not they are going to have the funds needed to complete this very ambitious undertaking.

Wellspring · October 2018

I think you mean as we draw near to closed alpha. They're still currently in "pre-alpha".

Anyways, they did just post about hiring for multiple positions. You don't do that if funds are running out.

Arkade99 · October 2018

There were no numbers mentioned in either press release, so I'm not surprised that they won't talk about the funding. I'm sure if and when they have something new to announce, they will.

Whoever the investors are, they no doubt receive financial updates. As an investor with Crowfall, I get an email every month with financial data.

Kyleran · October 2018

No good can from a discussion around funding. If they announced some investor was going to put in $100M some portion of the community would scream Brad was selling out.

Likely another group would say it was great news and all, but still only half of what SC raised totally scot free and conclude Pantheon was doomed to fail.

Finally with all the new money lying around fewer customers would likely be inclined to pre-order or pledge more free funds to build a better game.

Best if they keep quiet and heads down on delivering a playable game in the next 5 years.

Besides the 3 B's essential to game development (and hip hop) are expensive to maintain.

JamesGoblin · October 2018

Wellspring said:

I think you mean as we draw near to closed alpha. They're still currently in "pre-alpha".

Anyways, they did just post about hiring for multiple positions. You don't do that if funds are running out.

Not really, furthermore you might do that if people are running out, too. @OP They are (still...) hiding numbers, I'm afraid for quite good reasons.

PS somewhat on-topic, it seems that someone edited Wikipedia article about Pantheon, by deleting the fact that their Kickstarter failed; here is how it sounds now:

On January 13, 2014, Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen was announced alongside a Kickstarter campaign. Visionary Realms continues to crowdfund independently and sell pledges for the game and various levels of external testing. The game is in pre-alpha since December 13th, 2017.

Wellspring · October 2018

Kyleran said:

No good can from a discussion around funding. If they announced some investor was going to put in $100M some portion of the community would scream Brad was selling out.

Likely another group would say it was great news and all, but still only half of what SC raised totally scot free and conclude Pantheon was doomed to fail.

Finally with all the new money lying around fewer customers would likely be inclined to pre-order or pledge more free funds to build a better game.

Best if they keep quiet and heads down on delivering a playable game in the next 5 years.

Besides the 3 B's essential to game development (and hip hop) are expensive to maintain.

I gotta know, what are these 3 B's you speak of?!

Brad
Backers
and Bevelopers?

Kyleran · October 2018

LOL, no its Booze, B!itch!s, and Blow.

I'm going to hell, who's coming with me?

Gdemami · October 2018

JamesGoblin said:
@OP They are (still...) hiding numbers, I'm afraid for quite good reasons.

Of course there is good reason: It's none of your business.

delete5230 · October 2018

I'm hyped..... It's premature hype.

I've been called out on why I don't study deeply into the structure of both the game and Visionary Realms.

It's simple:
- Its pre-alpha
- It a long way out
- Financials are none of our business
- Donations are just that DONATIONS !... Give "freely" or don't give at all.

I believe, it's premature, but I believe anyway

Kyleran · October 2018

Actually they should provide their donors an accounting of their financials, common practice in many situations.

I donate signicant amounts of money to my church who once a year publish a financial accounting which is validated with an audit by a reputable accounting firm.

It includes all sources of income and a breakdown of expenses such as number of paid staff (109), volunteer staff (935), rent, mortgages, utilities for four campuses, charitable ministries, expansions (campus 5 opens soon) and more.

They don't have to, many churches don't but it's one reason why I am a member and donate.

No reason a game developer accepting donations shouldn't do similar but unless a public entity they don't have to.

But it most definitely is our business.

kitarad · October 2018

Especially in this case considering the funds were mismanaged before. It behoves them to be more transparent in their accounting to whoever is giving them the funds.

Amathe · October 2018

Gdemami said:

Of course there is good reason: It's none of your business.

What are you saying exactly? If you are saying I have no right to this information, that's true of course. I don't (as a non-investor).

Are you saying that detailed financial information is something non-public companies generally regard as confidential and even trade secret data? That is also true.

Or are you saying it is inappropriate to inquire just as to the funding status of the project? That is absolutely not true. As shown in the original post, VR has been using its obtainment of funding stages to market the game. Now they have stopped doing that. As a consumer, that catches my eye and I am within my rights to point it out. But hey, maybe they don't need more funding because what they have is more than adequate.

Kyleran · October 2018

Amathe said:

Gdemami said:

Of course there is good reason: It's none of your business.

What are you saying exactly? If you are saying I have no right to this information, that's true of course. I don't (as a non-investor).

Are you saying that detailed financial information is something non-public companies generally regard as confidential and even trade secret data? That is also true.

Or are you saying it is inappropriate to inquire just as to the funding status of the project? That is absolutely not true. As shown in the original post, VR has been using its obtainment of funding stages to market the game. Now they have stopped doing that. As a consumer, that catches my eye and I am within my rights to point it out. But hey, maybe they don't need more funding because what they have is more than adequate.

In all fairness the Pantheon team doesn't spend a lot of effort trying to raise additional donations, unlike some other Devs (Soulbound Studios, cough, cough)

I'd say they have someone there properly managing the project financials. No indication to the contrary and silence doesn't indicate anything, just how most any Dev rolls unless the law forces them to do otherwise.

Mendel · October 2018

Amathe said:

Gdemami said:

Of course there is good reason: It's none of your business.

What are you saying exactly? If you are saying I have no right to this information, that's true of course. I don't (as a non-investor).

Are you saying that detailed financial information is something non-public companies generally regard as confidential and even trade secret data? That is also true.

Or are you saying it is inappropriate to inquire just as to the funding status of the project? That is absolutely not true. As shown in the original post, VR has been using its obtainment of funding stages to market the game. Now they have stopped doing that. As a consumer, that catches my eye and I am within my rights to point it out. But hey, maybe they don't need more funding because what they have is more than adequate.

That is a very good distinction. The public should know if an anticipated project is in financial trouble. Financing is a common cause of project delay, and a possible delay affects everyone, investor and (future) customer alike. Like you stated, VR has made a point of it to expressly advertise to the world of their financial health, and that practice has stopped. Why has that stopped? Several possible reasons come to mind.

My guess. They don't need to sell any more pre-alpha access packages. I'm guessing they have enough testers to finish development (plus @Nanfoodle

). So, their financing is in good shape. We won't see about their financing from VR, as they begin to transition from a preliminary product to a finalized game, ready for sales. So, stopping marketing using their financial position isn't alarming, only curious.

asteldiancaliskan · October 2018

Amathe said:

When VR got its Series A funding, they announced it. They even issued a press release:

https://www.pantheonmmo.com/content/forums/topic/5934/series-a-funding-for-pantheon-is-now-complete

Same with the Angel Investor:

https://venturebeat.com/2015/09/28/everquest-creator-raises-seed-round-to-build-pantheon-rise-of-the-fallen/

But I haven't seen anything lately about a new funding round, as ostensibly we draw nearer to closed beta.

To the contrary, I see people raising the issue and VR saying that they don't discuss funding.

I mention this not to be a naysayer or a critic. I still fully support the game. I'm just concerned about whether or not they are going to have the funds needed to complete this very ambitious undertaking.

I would not read too much into it. In reality the only reason Series A funding was announced was because the only finance related info prior to this was 'failed kickstarter' so prior to Series A funding most assumed the game was just a dead dream in denial. Getting the funding was a big change to the situation letting people know they were back in the running.

The latest news letter briefly mentioned reaching a funding goal, that is likely the most we will hear because while it is reassuring, announcements on funding wont have the impact their first did - at this point people not backing because they dont see a future for this game style or simply dont back games, not because they believe the game lacks funds to release.

Wellspring · October 2018

asteldiancaliskan said:

Amathe said:

When VR got its Series A funding, they announced it. They even issued a press release:

https://www.pantheonmmo.com/content/forums/topic/5934/series-a-funding-for-pantheon-is-now-complete

Same with the Angel Investor:

https://venturebeat.com/2015/09/28/everquest-creator-raises-seed-round-to-build-pantheon-rise-of-the-fallen/

But I haven't seen anything lately about a new funding round, as ostensibly we draw nearer to closed beta.

To the contrary, I see people raising the issue and VR saying that they don't discuss funding.

I mention this not to be a naysayer or a critic. I still fully support the game. I'm just concerned about whether or not they are going to have the funds needed to complete this very ambitious undertaking.

I would not read too much into it. In reality the only reason Series A funding was announced was because the only finance related info prior to this was 'failed kickstarter' so prior to Series A funding most assumed the game was just a dead dream in denial. Getting the funding was a big change to the situation letting people know they were back in the running.

The latest news letter briefly mentioned reaching a funding goal, that is likely the most we will hear because while it is reassuring, announcements on funding wont have the impact their first did - at this point people not backing because they dont see a future for this game style or simply dont back games, not because they believe the game lacks funds to release.

Agreed. Also the fact that they don't have a cash shop or constant sales events speaks volumes.

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Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

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Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV