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World of Warcraft - New Information About v8.2 Rise of Azshara - MMORPG.com

SBFordSBFord Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,129
edited April 2019 in News & Features Discussion

imageWorld of Warcraft - New Information About v8.2 Rise of Azshara - MMORPG.com

On Thursday afternoon, World of Warcraft’s Jeremy Feasel spent time in a live stream to take a “deep dive” into the upcoming 8.2 Rise of Azshara content. The RoA patch will arrive on the WoW PTR next week, but not being present yet, the event was exciting to fans as it’s the first real glimpse of 8.2 so far. Most are hoping it will bring interesting new features and content to the game. We sat through the stream to provide you with all the information Feasel was willing to show.

Read the full story here



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Comments

  • SBFordSBFord Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,129
    edited April 2019
    This is the key to the entirety of 8.2:

    "From our perspective, Rise of Azshara has a lot of interesting new things in it. The caveat, however, is that it seems to be piling all kinds of new on top of BfA systems that have been pretty roundly castigated by the player community and it doesn’t fix the core issues the game has right now. It will remain to be seen how successful Blizzard is with adding a ton of new mechanics and features to the game when BfA has already stumbled on so many fronts (i.e. War Mode, Warfronts, Island Expeditions, Azerite Traits, etc.)."

    I mentioned this yesterday in the post about the Heart of Azeroth. It just feels like pouring "good after bad" and, honestly, it doesn't erase all the garbage story-wise and gameplay-wise that have come before in BfA. While I like some of what they're talking about, I can already see the downside: Grind and huge amounts of it. And that's not even counting the possibility that the new stuff simply isn't fun.

    PS In b4 someone rides in to say, "I'm just waiting for vanilla and avoiding this shit show!" :D
    [Deleted User]Geddon95405Folmenmike32927MensurBlacklabelcaliPsYcHoGBR


    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 


  • Tykam123Tykam123 Member UncommonPosts: 95
    I have been enjoying this expansion and am actually very excited about this update. Very excited to explore the new area!
    HorusraPuReDusTMatimusmaximusMensur
    [CENTER][URL=http://www.nodiatis.com/personality.htm][IMG]http://www.nodiatis.com/pub/11.jpg[/IMG][/URL][/CENTER]
  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,919

    SBFord said:

    This is the key to the entirety of 8.2:



    I can already see the downside: Grind and huge amounts of it. And that's not even counting the possibility that the new stuff simply isn't fun.

    PS In b4 someone rides in to say, "I'm just waiting for vanilla and avoiding this shit show!" :D



    Id does indeed look like a lot of new grind.

    Regarding this:

    "Interestingly, Blizzard is trying something new this time and will not be time gating the content and story in Rise of Azshara. Rather than have the story spin out over months with tiny questlines released on a weekly, or bi-weekly, basis, it will all be there from the start with players able to fully explore Nazjatar and Mechagon island right away."

    I think the key difference is "aimed at enticing players back" vs. "aimed at keeping people subscribed". Was that the original plan? It certainly looks like rebuilding Rustbolt could have been gated so that it would play out over a period of time.
  • PalebanePalebane Member RarePosts: 4,011
    edited April 2019
    Almost afraid to ask what the requirements for Pathfinder part 2 will be, but it makes no difference to me at this point. I do like a good laugh though.
    Viper482

    Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.

  • SBFordSBFord Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,129
    Palebane said:
    Almost afraid to ask what the requirements for Pathfinder part 2 will be, but it makes no difference to me at this point. I do like a good laugh though.
    Here you go! Giggle away! <3

    https://www.wowhead.com/news=291159/battle-for-azeroth-pathfinder-part-2-flying-unlock-requirements-and-rewards
    [Deleted User]Palebane


    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 


  • Panther2103Panther2103 Member EpicPosts: 5,779
    SBFord said:
    Palebane said:
    Almost afraid to ask what the requirements for Pathfinder part 2 will be, but it makes no difference to me at this point. I do like a good laugh though.
    Here you go! Giggle away! <3

    https://www.wowhead.com/news=291159/battle-for-azeroth-pathfinder-part-2-flying-unlock-requirements-and-rewards
    That's rather annoying. They are locking it behind rep again, but the only way to get the rep I assume would be dailies after a certain point so another time based unlock. If they let me grind rep off a mob for hours to unlock, I would be more okay with that. Easier to get out of the way. 
    Octagon7711[Deleted User]Palebane
  • Gobstopper3DGobstopper3D Member RarePosts: 970
    I will go back for 8.2, play it until I'm through the story, and unsub again. Not going to grind for flying. I can't fly in WoD or Legion because I refuse to grind the reps required for it. Not going to do it here either. If I find things enjoyable I may, but not likely.
    [Deleted User][Deleted User]jimmywolf

    I'm not an IT Specialist, Game Developer, or Clairvoyant in real life, but like others on here, I play one on the internet.

  • Jrich_cpJrich_cp Member UncommonPosts: 63
    edited April 2019

    Gobstopper3D said:

    I will go back for 8.2, play it until I'm through the story, and unsub again. Not going to grind for flying. I can't fly in WoD or Legion because I refuse to grind the reps required for it. Not going to do it here either. If I find things enjoyable I may, but not likely.



    That’s the whole deal, right? If the gameplay was enjoyable, these grinds wouldn’t be an issue. But there just isn’t an enjoyable core game passed doing everything the first time. Why is rifting in d3 so fun, but anything in wow isn’t? Hopefully mechagons design is to combat lack of fun repeatable things to do by adding just that. But we will see I guess. Most likely, it will be a one and done type experience.
    PalebaneViper482
  • MadFrenchieMadFrenchie Member LegendaryPosts: 8,505
    SBFord said:
    This is the key to the entirety of 8.2:

    "From our perspective, Rise of Azshara has a lot of interesting new things in it. The caveat, however, is that it seems to be piling all kinds of new on top of BfA systems that have been pretty roundly castigated by the player community and it doesn’t fix the core issues the game has right now. It will remain to be seen how successful Blizzard is with adding a ton of new mechanics and features to the game when BfA has already stumbled on so many fronts (i.e. War Mode, Warfronts, Island Expeditions, Azerite Traits, etc.)."

    I mentioned this yesterday in the post about the Heart of Azeroth. It just feels like pouring "good after bad" and, honestly, it doesn't erase all the garbage story-wise and gameplay-wise that have come before in BfA. While I like some of what they're talking about, I can already see the downside: Grind and huge amounts of it. And that's not even counting the possibility that the new stuff simply isn't fun.

    PS In b4 someone rides in to say, "I'm just waiting for vanilla and avoiding this shit show!" :D
    Suzie, at this point I'm relying on you to let me know when/if I should resub to WoW. :D  Thank you for sharing your commentary, as you know more than I do about the game's core mechanics and lore, so I feel like I can trust your judgement on the direction it's headed.
    SBFordCazriel

    image
  • TheDarkrayneTheDarkrayne Member EpicPosts: 5,297
    SBFord said:
    Palebane said:
    Almost afraid to ask what the requirements for Pathfinder part 2 will be, but it makes no difference to me at this point. I do like a good laugh though.
    Here you go! Giggle away! <3

    https://www.wowhead.com/news=291159/battle-for-azeroth-pathfinder-part-2-flying-unlock-requirements-and-rewards
    As usual it's just do everything possible in the areas you want to fly in without being able to fly so that when you get flying you don't even need it anymore.

    Fucking stupid.
    Cazrielmike32927PalebaneNetspookViper482
    I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
  • MadFrenchieMadFrenchie Member LegendaryPosts: 8,505
    Panther2103 said:
    SBFord said:
    Palebane said:
    Almost afraid to ask what the requirements for Pathfinder part 2 will be, but it makes no difference to me at this point. I do like a good laugh though.
    Here you go! Giggle away! <3

    https://www.wowhead.com/news=291159/battle-for-azeroth-pathfinder-part-2-flying-unlock-requirements-and-rewards
    That's rather annoying. They are locking it behind rep again, but the only way to get the rep I assume would be dailies after a certain point so another time based unlock. If they let me grind rep off a mob for hours to unlock, I would be more okay with that. Easier to get out of the way. 
    I think the bigger issue is that Pathfinder adds nothing fun, which us why you see achieving it as "getting it out of the way.". It's a less than inspired feature.
    SBFordPalebaneViper482

    image
  • Geddon95405Geddon95405 Member UncommonPosts: 111
    it is definitely a buttload of new grind, with unending RNG

    i feel like part of the bliz team designs around 'fun' and then the grind/progression devs come in and pretty much ruin it all
    SBFordOctagon7711

    Crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of their women...

  • seshsesseshses Member UncommonPosts: 67

    Geddon95405 said:

    it is definitely a buttload of new grind, with unending RNG



    i feel like part of the bliz team designs around 'fun' and then the grind/progression devs come in and pretty much ruin it all



    Sometimes i think it's not only about what fun it's about retention of players which = more subs
    [Deleted User]
  • TheDarkrayneTheDarkrayne Member EpicPosts: 5,297
    edited April 2019

    seshses said:



    Geddon95405 said:


    it is definitely a buttload of new grind, with unending RNG





    i feel like part of the bliz team designs around 'fun' and then the grind/progression devs come in and pretty much ruin it all






    Sometimes i think it's not only about what fun it's about retention of players which = more subs



    This is where WoW is going wrong in terms of retention though. They need to realise that their core player base has got older now. Their main audience does not have time for this kind of thing anymore and that's why player numbers are dropping rapidly.
    Octagon7711Cazriel
    I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
  • AlbatroesAlbatroes Member LegendaryPosts: 7,671
    edited April 2019

    SBFord said:


    Palebane said:

    Almost afraid to ask what the requirements for Pathfinder part 2 will be, but it makes no difference to me at this point. I do like a good laugh though.


    Here you go! Giggle away! <3

    https://www.wowhead.com/news=291159/battle-for-azeroth-pathfinder-part-2-flying-unlock-requirements-and-rewards



    People do know this is actually longer than legion's which was only 1 with the part 2, right....? Hours played.... As for 8.2's 'potential,' the more they try to hype it and delay it being on the ptr, the more flags get raised (to me at least). Nothing against some youtubers like T&E, but they aren't really known for going 'deep' into how game mechanics work first hand (they do provide the information that others uncover, so that's not a complete loss). With the whole 'secret' summit thing, its just reminding me too much of the bfa alpha/beta period which just ended up being mostly about free PR rather than actually getting things tested and fixed before launch. You can look at some of Preach Gaming's alpha/beta footage videos and see that it still took the team months after launch to address mechanical issues within the game. Oh yeah, btw, why haven't they said anything about 'class balancing' which was supposedly at the forefront....?
  • SBFordSBFord Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,129
    seshses said:

    Geddon95405 said:

    it is definitely a buttload of new grind, with unending RNG



    i feel like part of the bliz team designs around 'fun' and then the grind/progression devs come in and pretty much ruin it all



    Sometimes i think it's not only about what fun it's about retention of players which = more subs
    Honestly, I think this is spot on. Literally everything feels as if it's designed as "busy work" and long term busy work at that designed specifically to fill the spreadsheet with MAUs. Nothing feels as if it's truly designed for fun, but is first designed to keep players grinding away in the game for those faraway rewards which feeds into keeping the completionists subbed to the game and keeping those MAUs intact.

    Between people being fed up with funless grind and a truly terrible story, I can't imagine good things are happening to sub numbers.

    I have two conditions to resub: 

    1) Some type of surprise on the shit show of a story that doesn't involve more Horde leaders biting the big one or turning into Alliance lackeys. The Horde story has been just awful in BfA with players having an ostensible "choice" (really? branching narratives in an MMO? not happening) between a Horde traitor or a villain batted psychopath. Add in being made to feel guilty for literally everything they do and having their entire war campaign mean absolutely zero, and you have the recipe for canceling a subscription. Just ugh...

    and...

    2) If -- and this is a big IF -- the grind is fun in Nazjatar and in Mechagon to a lesser degree (mechanized gnomes hold little interest to me), then I will resubscribe. I never truly minded the grind in Warlords of Draenor (who know BfA would make people nostalgic for that one, eh?) or in Legion because it wasn't "unfun" at least. 

    I guess we'll see what next week's 8.2 arrival on PTR brings. 

    MadFrenchieThahar[Deleted User]gervaise1


    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 


  • AlbatroesAlbatroes Member LegendaryPosts: 7,671
    TheDarkrayne said:

    seshses said:



    Geddon95405 said:


    it is definitely a buttload of new grind, with unending RNG





    i feel like part of the bliz team designs around 'fun' and then the grind/progression devs come in and pretty much ruin it all






    Sometimes i think it's not only about what fun it's about retention of players which = more subs



    This is where WoW is going wrong in terms of retention though. They need to realise that their core player base has got older now. Their main audience does not have time for this kind of thing anymore and that's why player numbers are dropping rapidly.
    I wouldn't say its about time alone, its about reward for time which is why people are quitting. The activities themselves are honestly the exact same as Legion. However, the main difference between Legion and bfa is that when you did things in Legion, it always gave you something that would last, which isn't the case in bfa. In Bfa, you're literally doing the entire thing you were doing as a fresh capped character, again and again and again for the exact same thing you had just with a higher ilvl (which no one is realizing will still be the same problem regardless of the AP grind existing or not, since you're having to farm each azerite set per spec over and over each time the ilvl cap goes up unless you want to pay out the butt in gold reforging).

    This goes into Suzie's point of them only basing content off of metrics instead of incentive. They look at legion and see what activities have the largest numbers and base design off of that, without realizing at least 2 things very important to Legion which are absent in Bfa: 1) gold was hella easy to make, so a large majority of players were buying clears on a weekly basis, 2) EVERYTHING you did in legion had a chance of rewarding a legendary (hell, even the blingtron daily could give you a leggo). Couple that with your class literally being weaker than you were at the same point in legion and of course there is going to be some feeling of getting ripped off.
    Octagon7711
  • MadFrenchieMadFrenchie Member LegendaryPosts: 8,505
    edited April 2019
    So now they're pushing existential despair as a game feature. Figures.

    "Run, run rabbit run
    Dig that hole, forget the sun,
    And when at last the work is done
    Don't sit down it's time to dig another one"

    Devs in general have found that players respond surprisingly well to being beat down with busy work or ridiculous gameplay-limiting timers and mechanic resources.

    Truly, gamers have laid claim to the title of masochistic consumers.  Check out how ES Blades is doing despite having one of the worst monetization systems possible, even in the context of mobile games.
    Octagon7711

    image
  • SBFordSBFord Former Associate EditorMember LegendaryPosts: 33,129
    edited April 2019
    Well....there is this too if Rise of Azshara goes badly....


    mike32927gervaise1[Deleted User]PemminNetspook


    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 


  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,919
    edited April 2019

    SBFord said:


    seshses said:



    Geddon95405 said:


    it is definitely a buttload of new grind, with unending RNG





    i feel like part of the bliz team designs around 'fun' and then the grind/progression devs come in and pretty much ruin it all






    Sometimes i think it's not only about what fun it's about retention of players which = more subs


    Honestly, I think this is spot on. Literally everything feels as if it's designed as "busy work" and long term busy work at that designed specifically to fill the spreadsheet with MAUs. Nothing feels as if it's truly designed for fun, but is first designed to keep players grinding away in the game for those faraway rewards which feeds into keeping the completionists subbed to the game and keeping those MAUs intact.

    Between people being fed up with funless grind and a truly terrible story, I can't imagine good things are happening to sub numbers. . 




    Absolutely. Possibly one eye on being able to say there is "something" new coming to WoW when they announce their next quarterly results as well.

    As for your suggestion that subs might have fallen surely what you mean is: "WoW's MAUs have continued to perform in line with expectations after an expansion." !!!
    [Deleted User]
  • dekkion1dekkion1 Member UncommonPosts: 152

    TheDarkrayne said:



    seshses said:





    Geddon95405 said:



    it is definitely a buttload of new grind, with unending RNG







    i feel like part of the bliz team designs around 'fun' and then the grind/progression devs come in and pretty much ruin it all









    Sometimes i think it's not only about what fun it's about retention of players which = more subs






    This is where WoW is going wrong in terms of retention though. They need to realise that their core player base has got older now. Their main audience does not have time for this kind of thing anymore and that's why player numbers are dropping rapidly.



    no thats why they are doing it... yea we got older but dude lol. alot of people young people
    like 17 to 25 are looking at this and they are going to pick up today where we started almost 20yrs ago
    yea we are getting older maybe time to move on but!!!!! the milenials are just getting started!!!
    gammer 4 life
  • AenghasAenghas Member UncommonPosts: 116
    I feel like Classic is only going to be salt rubbed into WoW's wounds at this point. A 14 year old version of the game that the general population could already be playing similar versions of right now on private servers but aren't is going to save face for the company how?
  • PemminPemmin Member UncommonPosts: 623

    Aenghas said:

    I feel like Classic is only going to be salt rubbed into WoW's wounds at this point. A 14 year old version of the game that the general population could already be playing similar versions of right now on private servers but aren't is going to save face for the company how?



    because it allows the company to retain a demographic that has shown brand loyalty without the risk of alienating new/target demographics. Even if it ends up being a monetary loss it might still be worth pursuing for the positive PR alone.
  • gervaise1gervaise1 Member EpicPosts: 6,919
    Pemmin said:

    Aenghas said:

    I feel like Classic is only going to be salt rubbed into WoW's wounds at this point. A 14 year old version of the game that the general population could already be playing similar versions of right now on private servers but aren't is going to save face for the company how?



    because it allows the company to retain a demographic that has shown brand loyalty without the risk of alienating new/target demographics. Even if it ends up being a monetary loss it might still be worth pursuing for the positive PR alone.
    Hmmm - I think they are doing it for the money as a result of subs having fallen below some benchmark. They could have done it for the PR  much earlier.
  • AenghasAenghas Member UncommonPosts: 116
    @gervaise1 I'm inclined to agree. They considered their options for what may retain players while expending the least energy creatively. I know they had to rebuild it but the team would be way smaller than any expansion team or team working on a new game. It seems like there is interest in 'old-school' mmo's so it was time to cash in.

    Maybe they didn't expect the hype to get as big as it has, or clearly didn't anticipate it would arrive at a time where the Diablo announcement and reaction to BfA has caused so much negativity.

    If the hivemind decides it doesn't deliver the amazing golden age of mmo's experience they imagined it would, or they realize the golden age really wasn't that golden, tables will get flipped. Like I said the simulators are out there already, if the millions wanted to be playing vanilla WoW right now they could be. I think that speaks to how much they truly want the product rather than the lip service of hype.
    gervaise1
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