These guys have no idea the mess they are cooking up. I don't think they have the numbers to square up either...
1. A streamer with 100 followers will completely s*** on this inquisition. A decent streamer has a discord server well established with proper groups and global channels for communications. They can run an efficient guild, be self-sufficient of resources, establish proper groups and participate in everything aspect of the game without saying a single word in game chat.
2. Many streamers have decent relationships with other streamers on their platforms (twitch, FBGaming, Mixer). If 5 them ran their own guilds with their followers in the hundreds and they got word of this anti streamer act, oh boy. These streamers just need to utter the words, "Don't partner up with the anti streamer coalition..." GG folks, that's at least 500+ toons that's been removed from the field of play.
Dr. Disrespect AVERAGES 25000 viewers alone. if only 5% of those viewers (not even his total followers) were to come... we'll you see where I'm going...
As someone who sees and deals with both sides of the issue(I am a mod for multiple "large" streamers), I can see the issue with the addon... but it's also true about streamers causing issues with servers.
The addon is bs, plain and simple. It's easy to see how blatantly it goes against the TOS, and "hardcore" pvp guilds aren't going to risk getting banned before the servers even launch. I'm guessing it's a troll, or just someone shouting a threat with no backing.
The main issue that pops up with streamers is population inflation and deflation, and how it can affect pvp scene and faction balance. I define a "large streamer" and someone with thousands of viewers at any given day. If you have said streamer join a server and a faction, it's possible that community will come along and inflate the numbers of the streamers faction causing a huge imbalance.
But this also applies to the opposite! If a streamer leaves (because god knows most can;t keep their eyes on a game for more than a week) that pendulum swings in the opposite direction. You now have a massive deflation of players on one faction due to a streamer losing interest. Both swings of the pendulum negatively affect the server, and it's this that I think most people are trying to avoid alongside the general toxicity and stupidity that most streamer community brings.
I've seen it happen in Archeage and GW2. It can just as well happen here. I am all for streamers being moved to their own separate server (which I have heard rumors of anyway). Here's hoping for the best.
I can certainly see why some people have such a distaste for streamers. Narrow viewpoints like: 'There's only two types!' or even 'They're all like (x)!' is based on what's floated to the surface in news or clips or briefly digging into the broadcast list.
It's a big list. There's thousands of streamers and it's hard to find (if you're even interested in finding) even one streamer that clicks with you. If you're not interested, yet take some kind of overly negative view... why?
But anyway, I'm lucky I've found some good streamers that click with my viewing interests. I've tried to think up a list of things I look for:
1. Interactive - they all converse with chat (not talk to, but converse with). Harder for the ones with larger chats, but they still interact on some level.
2. Overall a good person - They all have a good sense of "Just be good to each other." They don't tolerate asshats in their chat and they just want everyone to behave like reasonable adults. They're not easy targets either.
3. Excellent chat moderation - The bigger ones have dedicated moderators, some even compensated for their duties. The smaller ones still keep an eye on chat (see #2).
4. Variety streamers - All of them dip pretty heavily into games and genres I'm at least slightly interested in.
5. Rules for sponsorship - The only sponsorships they take are for games they're interested in actually playing or at least fit into the genre of games they like. They always follow sponsorship rules (because it's.. you know, the law) and they all freely criticize things that need it during the sponsored portion of the stream. I value that as a consumer.
6. They don't beg for subs - ...but they do thank them (donators too). Part of the interactivity and being, well, grateful for the support people give them.
7. Entertainers - They're not just playing a game, they're entertaining their viewers. Through humor, general conversation, insightful points of view on relevant gaming topics, etc. Sometimes by being good at a game, sometimes by being bad at it, but loving gaming and the game their playing.
8. Enjoying the games they play - I've seen them play a certain game for days, or continue a sponsored stream past the requirement because the game sucked them in so hard. I've seen them play for a few days then realize (by themself or because longtime viewers can tell) that they're just not having fun and quit. I've seen a superfan of a particular dev and game series tear both the game and company down because of a really, really bad release.
That's the main items I can think of right now. I don't check off a list before I follow a streamer, the list came into being while thinking of why I like the streamers I like. I know some people don't like streamers who talk, and that's ok.
Some critics here ask why watch when you can play?
Well there's several reasons:
a. I have a stream on while doing other things. Streaming has replaced TV for me. I have an ancient laptop running Ubuntu that just streams twitch and outputs to an old HD tv and a 2.1 speaker set.
b. I do play, thus the second computer. I also browse, watch YouTube, shop and everything else someone might do on their computer. And sometimes I sit back and watch Twitch because I'm interested in what's on screen atm.
c. Consumer information. I buy games. Back in the day, I would read gaming magazines that featured a game I might be interested in. Later on, I read online reviews, then watched YouTube. Now I watch a game I might be interested in in action. I can see in real time how the performance is, what bugs pop up, what the mechanics of the game are, what the game-loop is like.
All of this information helps me decide if I want to buy the game. I've stopped watching a story heavy game once I knew I wanted to buy it so I wouldn't be spoiled, or at least ignored story sections if I'm still watching the technical aspects of the game.
d. Tips and tricks. I'm not a min-maxer, I don't enjoy beating myself head into a wall... but I will watch a streamer do it so I can avoid some of that pain... and because the streamers are entertaining in their fails and their wins.
e. I enjoy watching people play something or play a certain way, that I won't, because it's still entertaining. I don't particularly like multiplayer games, but it's fun to watch other people do it when their level of interaction with each other and the game is entertaining.
Damn, that's the longest post I've made in a while. You may not agree with it, and that's ok. I don't expect to change any opinions. So many people draw their battle-lines for one reason or another.
I just figured so many people love to post how much they don't understand streamers or viewers, or just plain hate either/both, I would toss a balancing opinion into the ring.
"I hate streamers" is a very cringe thing to say... No one is forcing anyone to watch a person stream. And their supposed negative impact on games are mildly put exaggerated.
If it's true I hope that the people that done the addond and people using it will get permanently banned. As bullying should never be allowed anywhere.
People seriously need to drop the redneck "we don't like your kind round here" mentality.
First of all, it is that bad. Second, I hope everyone uses the app to get these annoying streamer asses out of here. Besides sucking up to companies, they do nothing worthwhile.
It's not bullying to not like something, get the fuck over it. I don't like onions, am I bullying them?
The redneck, which is hate speech by the way, except rednecks don't give a shit or get offended by being called that, aren't wrong in this case. Your bullshit "we have to accept everyone" needs to go away.
You do not get a ribbon for showing up People are not always going to like you, get over it Labeling opinions under racist terms does nothing to further your points Some times, you just have to punch someone in the face, get used to it, its called life.
Where did I say that it's not OK to have a opinion about streamers? Even if its uncalled for and sad to have a negative view its perfectly ok. Quote me.
This addon and stated behavior against steamers by this pvp guilds is per definiton harassment, selective bullying. Read the rest of the comments AND the link to the addon(it's even in the article *roll eyes*). This has never been about solely disliking a certain group, it's been about taking action against said group, in very questionable ways.
Ex.
After 9 days, we will begin the plan of attack. They will be corpse
camped. They will be chain CCed. They will have their bags and mailboxes
filled with Heavy Leather Balls and Peeling the Onions. They will not
be able to tag a single mob in any zone they're in. This will be a
coordinated effort of at least 180 level 60 players. No amount of fanboi
spergs will stop us.
And there we have it... The true face of classic... The upper crust and their overblown sense of entitlement that i remember. The real class system of the game with one or a few guilds dictating how everyone else on the server should live.. If one does not fall in line... well... there was blacklists back then too. Not to mention blockades and manhunts and many other darling behaviors.
This is the true classic... This is why the new age was such a hard blow... After all it is hard to be a server dictator when you can not control the ebb and flow of the server. This is the true reason LFG is disliked... You can not blockade it...
Ok slight exaggeration but there are some truth to it.
Much of the nashing of teeth back in the days was because of the perceived loss of power. Blizzard stripped guilds like these of pretty much all of their power...
Anyway this is petty bullcrap at best and downright disturbed behavior at worst (borderline obsessive to be honest) and is getting very close to garden variety fascism.
I do not see the major issue of streamers personally. Most are just entertainers doing it to make a salary.
I see issues with mmo devs giving them special privileges to get "Free Advertising" that shit really pisses me off. Example the ability to invite friends and followers to Betas and such above other people who subbed just as long and supported the game just as much as them. Or be given rare items to be handed out to subs and such in giveaways... that shit always annoyed me.
Honestly in any pvp game being a streamer is probably a negative cause you could just be stream snipped and your group killed that much easier. And I get sick of hearing WTF ban the stream snipper... You stream it is your own fault... that simple in my eyes.
The risk I see is what streamers can do to a server. For example on WoW if Asmongold wanted to completely screw over the server he is on.. he has enough following and players that will be with him to easily do it. He has immense power due to his following. I honestly think he is probably one of the main targets of this bs honestly. But that is not really any different then someone making some super large zerg style guilds in other mmos. I ran and monopolized a server in FFXI back in the day. I was in dominate guilds on AA that literately dictated who could do what due to power and size. It is no different really, just one is televised one is not.
But this Add-on crap is utter bs... and anyone doing it should be banned or suspended until the addon is removed in my opinion.
Does not resolve the lag issues, resource issues and so on; but remember this is not about you playing the game it is about them streaming the game. One of the other posters was talking about the elitist sense of entitlement guilds have, well to me these streamers seem rather elitist and entitled themselves.
And there we have it... The true face of classic... The upper crust and their overblown sense of entitlement that i remember. The real class system of the game with one or a few guilds dictating how everyone else on the server should live.. If one does not fall in line... well... there was blacklists back then too. Not to mention blockades and manhunts and many other darling behaviors.
This is the true classic... This is why the new age was such a hard blow... After all it is hard to be a server dictator when you can not control the ebb and flow of the server. This is the true reason LFG is disliked... You can not blockade it...
Ok slight exaggeration but there are some truth to it.
Much of the nashing of teeth back in the days was because of the perceived loss of power. Blizzard stripped guilds like these of pretty much all of their power...
Anyway this is petty bullcrap at best and downright disturbed behavior at worst (borderline obsessive to be honest) and is getting very close to garden variety fascism.
Fascists are pushing their ideals and agenda into every aspect of our societies and cultures. Their favorite ploy is playing the victim card like "the other group" is causing the problems with their entitlement. It's classic gaslighting.
Remember not so long ago how everyone hated WoW players because they were such asshats. "Go back to WoW" became a thing for a reason. It's unfortunate for the nice WoW players to be overshadowed by the drooling masses of Hodor.
And you absolute clowns don't understand why no one takes you seriously when you call people racist, Nazi, and Fascist.
They don't want to play with people who have a history of shitty, community destroying behavior and a string of dead servers in their wake. If that makes them Fascists then the word means nothing.
And you absolute clowns don't understand why no one takes you seriously when you call people racist, Nazi, and Fascist.
They don't want to play with people who have a history of shitty, community destroying behavior and a string of dead servers in their wake. If that makes them Fascists then the word means nothing.
I did not call anyone a fascist per se... I said they used methods that closely resembles the tactics used by fascist movements. Things like setting up watch-lists, blackmailing and threats (this also comes fairly close to your garden variety terrorism.. =P if we take the word literally) and having the undesired followed and monitored. As well as setting up lists of people not welcome.. People who have not really done anything.
As i said... This was fairly common back then and it seems that it will still be a big component of classic...
And there we have it... The true face of classic... The upper crust and their overblown sense of entitlement that i remember. The real class system of the game with one or a few guilds dictating how everyone else on the server should live.. If one does not fall in line... well... there was blacklists back then too. Not to mention blockades and manhunts and many other darling behaviors.
This is the true classic... This is why the new age was such a hard blow... After all it is hard to be a server dictator when you can not control the ebb and flow of the server. This is the true reason LFG is disliked... You can not blockade it...
Ok slight exaggeration but there are some truth to it.
Much of the nashing of teeth back in the days was because of the perceived loss of power. Blizzard stripped guilds like these of pretty much all of their power...
Anyway this is petty bullcrap at best and downright disturbed behavior at worst (borderline obsessive to be honest) and is getting very close to garden variety fascism.
Fascists are pushing their ideals and agenda into every aspect of our societies and cultures. Their favorite ploy is playing the victim card like "the other group" is causing the problems with their entitlement. It's classic gaslighting.
Remember not so long ago how everyone hated WoW players because they were such asshats. "Go back to WoW" became a thing for a reason. It's unfortunate for the nice WoW players to be overshadowed by the drooling masses of Hodor.
Calling out gaslighting makes those who think that doubling down on lies is a cool new thing uncomfortable... expect some WTFs from the usual suspects.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
They don't want to play with people who have a history of shitty, community destroying behavior and a string of dead servers in their wake. If that makes them Fascists then the word means nothing.
I read this quite often now. Can someone please elaborate where this specifically happend?
-What games and servers have this happen to? + sources.
-What streamers where involved? + sources.
-AND in what way have streamers presence on certain servers or games ruining complete communities, literally killing whole servers and/or games? Elaborate and have sources to strenghten these claims.
Thanks.
I've been playing MMORPGs and multi- and singleplayer RPGs since before I made this account and I can't recall anywhere in any game I've played that this ever happend. So please enlighten me, I'm always open minded to facts.
Anything goes with true PVPers, betrayel, backstabbing, steamrolling 2 people with a 25 man raid, fair game is almost never sought, as long as you can win. Enter a larger, more organised group and all of a sudden your chances of winning shrink considerably, so let the whining commence
Anything goes, but not when you are on the recieving end, so all this drama is created because all of it is so unfair, something most PVPers never thought about when they were top dog.
/Cheers, Lahnmir
'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'
Kyleran on yours sincerely
'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'
Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless.
It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.
It is just huge resource waste....'
Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer
Toxicity was a staple to WoW back then. So as long as it didn't go on the deep end like racism and actual threats IRL, crap talking was an official pasttime. I will be installing this add on and doing my part.
Streamers will always have that New game and WoW live if they kill classic. If streamers ruin the experience for everyone else those players don't have another WoW classic.
Asking for written proof of damage done to games by streamers is ridiculous because there isn't someone archiving everything from every game as it happens. I do remember not so long ago though when PUBG banned players who killed streamers even if they didn't know the person they killed was a streamer. The giveaways devs give to streamers instead of paying players is one negative IMO that is common knowledge cause it creates a multi-tier "preference" order that puts paying players at the very bottom. If paying players were given the same or similar perks as streamers I don't think they would bother people as much but paying players coming second to people who get stuff for free is what causes drama IMO. Also, the hero worship in chat and disruption to the natural/organic flow of experiences in the game as a direct result of streamers "just trying to make a living" starts to get old in many ways for me at least.
Hate streamers with a passion, I am actually happy to see this move even if I feel it may be a bit extreme. The metaphor is a little broken but to me they are leeches like the co worker you have that sits on their ass while you are busting ass, but then they claim credit for your hard work to the boss. Screw em, if anyone is going to make money off my hard work its going to be me.
And there we have it... The true face of classic... The upper crust and their overblown sense of entitlement that i remember. The real class system of the game with one or a few guilds dictating how everyone else on the server should live.. If one does not fall in line... well... there was blacklists back then too. Not to mention blockades and manhunts and many other darling behaviors.
This is the true classic... This is why the new age was such a hard blow... After all it is hard to be a server dictator when you can not control the ebb and flow of the server. This is the true reason LFG is disliked... You can not blockade it...
Ok slight exaggeration but there are some truth to it.
Much of the nashing of teeth back in the days was because of the perceived loss of power. Blizzard stripped guilds like these of pretty much all of their power...
Anyway this is petty bullcrap at best and downright disturbed behavior at worst (borderline obsessive to be honest) and is getting very close to garden variety fascism.
Fascists are pushing their ideals and agenda into every aspect of our societies and cultures. Their favorite ploy is playing the victim card like "the other group" is causing the problems with their entitlement. It's classic gaslighting.
Remember not so long ago how everyone hated WoW players because they were such asshats. "Go back to WoW" became a thing for a reason. It's unfortunate for the nice WoW players to be overshadowed by the drooling masses of Hodor.
And you absolute clowns don't understand why no one takes you seriously when you call people racist, Nazi, and Fascist.
They don't want to play with people who have a history of shitty, community destroying behavior and a string of dead servers in their wake. If that makes them Fascists then the word means nothing.
I don't have to call people names. Their words and behavior make it self evident. I'm just identifying the behavior. The rest of the band isn't out of step.
Its funny how people who just don't want to deal with X are called fascists by people who hate almost everything else besides X and the narrow allowed opinions of their cult. I don't understand, like, or want to be involved with people who watch other people play video games. This is a free country, right? I'm still allowed to not like something, right?
The word fascist would mean a lot more if the people bandying it around weren't hell bent on forcing everyone to adopt their mindset, views, and ideologies or be called horrible names, be othered, be de-personed, etc. Not wanting to join your evangelical religious hate cult doesn't make me a fascist - it makes me a free thinker who likes what I like and fuck anyone trying to impose their views on me. People watching other people play video games are fucking creepy and weird. I don't care how popular it is. Incest porn is super popular and is also creepy and weird. I don't want to have anything to do with incest people or people whose big thing is watching other people play video games.
I don't care if a religious hate cult considers me a NAZI fascist for thinking this. You guys can take your ideology and go back to 1984.
To be fair, a lot of this started when streamers were given Beta keys almost exclusively, and then you had some popular streamers saying they were going to work together to blacklist people globally that went against them from ever raiding.
I'm glad real PvP guilds are coming together to trash these plebs. If they can't handle getting camped, they can move on to PvE servers.
You can see how the behaviour of both guilds and streamers has not been as it should be, I take the guilds side because for me they represent what gaming should be about. Yes they can promote bad practices and be elitist, but they represent a collegiate approach to gaming, a community which games. Where as streamers are "look at me" types who I feel have lost contact with what gaming is about.
My only concern is that such an app could be used to remove players someone in a guild has issues with rather than its intended application. Players do need to be able to say "that streamer is not me" and have an avenue to put that point.
OK let´s see if we can sort this out... As far as i can see no one is really calling anyone a fascist per se. That is absurd since no player in WoW can obtain that sort of powerbase. But the facts are what they are, back in classic and Burning Crusade... Many servers had a "collegiate" of players that fairly heavyhanded enforced their rules. If you got on their bad side... You might as well switch servers (but doing that was also looked down on so if you where found out you would be a social pariah on two servers) because you would not get anywhere endgame wise. The smaller the server the worse it got.
This was stranglehold broken when Blizzard introduced it´s instanced system and the LFG (and by extrension LFR)
But the metods used by some of these guilds do line up with those used by oppressive regimes. Why?.. because they work.
So it is not wrong to say that there was people in classic that acted like a oppressive , garden variety fascist organisation... That is not the same as saying they are fascists, heck many of them might not even understand what they did.. Many where young and pushed in to leadership and fame without any training or support.
But things like this add-on is not some juvenile powerplay... This is pure fear and envy. Fear that the "purity" of the project will be tainted and envy that these "streamers" get the VIP treatment over the people who "built" classic. (not really wanting to grasp that.. well... marketing is marketing) and as a green muppet once said... fear is the path to the dark side... That is why we need to call it out because if these people do not get a bit of friction forcing them to reflect on their path, they are simply just posterior primates flinging things at anything they do not like.
If you can manage to do something like this in a game like WoW where your dungeons are instanced can you fathom how much worse it was in a game like old Everquest where the dungeons were camped 24/7 by guilds and since it was open with no instances you cannot even go do your own thing because you were at the mercy of these people.
I always belonged to the top guilds in Everquest but was acutely aware of the problems it caused to many small guilds and players who didn't belong to any guild. This too on a PvE server and I think it would have been far worse on a PvP server.
We forget that many players become tyrants and petty lords when they play games and let powers get to them corrupting them completely. It is exactly like the real world and to hell with being fair or uncorrupted. Greed is the principle cause.
Comments
Gut Out!
What, me worry?
1. A streamer with 100 followers will completely s*** on this inquisition. A decent streamer has a discord server well established with proper groups and global channels for communications. They can run an efficient guild, be self-sufficient of resources, establish proper groups and participate in everything aspect of the game without saying a single word in game chat.
2. Many streamers have decent relationships with other streamers on their platforms (twitch, FBGaming, Mixer). If 5 them ran their own guilds with their followers in the hundreds and they got word of this anti streamer act, oh boy. These streamers just need to utter the words, "Don't partner up with the anti streamer coalition..." GG folks, that's at least 500+ toons that's been removed from the field of play.
Dr. Disrespect AVERAGES 25000 viewers alone. if only 5% of those viewers (not even his total followers) were to come... we'll you see where I'm going...
Better find a better way to play nice...
The addon is bs, plain and simple. It's easy to see how blatantly it goes against the TOS, and "hardcore" pvp guilds aren't going to risk getting banned before the servers even launch. I'm guessing it's a troll, or just someone shouting a threat with no backing.
The main issue that pops up with streamers is population inflation and deflation, and how it can affect pvp scene and faction balance. I define a "large streamer" and someone with thousands of viewers at any given day. If you have said streamer join a server and a faction, it's possible that community will come along and inflate the numbers of the streamers faction causing a huge imbalance.
But this also applies to the opposite! If a streamer leaves (because god knows most can;t keep their eyes on a game for more than a week) that pendulum swings in the opposite direction. You now have a massive deflation of players on one faction due to a streamer losing interest. Both swings of the pendulum negatively affect the server, and it's this that I think most people are trying to avoid alongside the general toxicity and stupidity that most streamer community brings.
I've seen it happen in Archeage and GW2. It can just as well happen here. I am all for streamers being moved to their own separate server (which I have heard rumors of anyway). Here's hoping for the best.
Be an asshole and the whole community will simply ignore you. Simple as that.
This is the true classic... This is why the new age was such a hard blow... After all it is hard to be a server dictator when you can not control the ebb and flow of the server. This is the true reason LFG is disliked... You can not blockade it...
Ok slight exaggeration but there are some truth to it.
Much of the nashing of teeth back in the days was because of the perceived loss of power. Blizzard stripped guilds like these of pretty much all of their power...
Anyway this is petty bullcrap at best and downright disturbed behavior at worst (borderline obsessive to be honest) and is getting very close to garden variety fascism.
This have been a good conversation
They don't want to play with people who have a history of shitty, community destroying behavior and a string of dead servers in their wake. If that makes them Fascists then the word means nothing.
As i said... This was fairly common back then and it seems that it will still be a big component of classic...
Ball is on your court....
This have been a good conversation
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Anything goes, but not when you are on the recieving end, so all this drama is created because all of it is so unfair, something most PVPers never thought about when they were top dog.
/Cheers,
Lahnmir
Kyleran on yours sincerely
'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'
Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless.
It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.
It is just huge resource waste....'
Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer
If streamers ruin the experience for everyone else those players don't have another WoW classic.
Asking for written proof of damage done to games by streamers is ridiculous because there isn't someone archiving everything from every game as it happens. I do remember not so long ago though when PUBG banned players who killed streamers even if they didn't know the person they killed was a streamer. The giveaways devs give to streamers instead of paying players is one negative IMO that is common knowledge cause it creates a multi-tier "preference" order that puts paying players at the very bottom. If paying players were given the same or similar perks as streamers I don't think they would bother people as much but paying players coming second to people who get stuff for free is what causes drama IMO. Also, the hero worship in chat and disruption to the natural/organic flow of experiences in the game as a direct result of streamers "just trying to make a living" starts to get old in many ways for me at least.
The word fascist would mean a lot more if the people bandying it around weren't hell bent on forcing everyone to adopt their mindset, views, and ideologies or be called horrible names, be othered, be de-personed, etc. Not wanting to join your evangelical religious hate cult doesn't make me a fascist - it makes me a free thinker who likes what I like and fuck anyone trying to impose their views on me. People watching other people play video games are fucking creepy and weird. I don't care how popular it is. Incest porn is super popular and is also creepy and weird. I don't want to have anything to do with incest people or people whose big thing is watching other people play video games.
I don't care if a religious hate cult considers me a NAZI fascist for thinking this. You guys can take your ideology and go back to 1984.
I'm glad real PvP guilds are coming together to trash these plebs. If they can't handle getting camped, they can move on to PvE servers.
You can see how the behaviour of both guilds and streamers has not been as it should be, I take the guilds side because for me they represent what gaming should be about. Yes they can promote bad practices and be elitist, but they represent a collegiate approach to gaming, a community which games. Where as streamers are "look at me" types who I feel have lost contact with what gaming is about.
My only concern is that such an app could be used to remove players someone in a guild has issues with rather than its intended application. Players do need to be able to say "that streamer is not me" and have an avenue to put that point.
This was stranglehold broken when Blizzard introduced it´s instanced system and the LFG (and by extrension LFR)
But the metods used by some of these guilds do line up with those used by oppressive regimes. Why?.. because they work.
So it is not wrong to say that there was people in classic that acted like a oppressive , garden variety fascist organisation... That is not the same as saying they are fascists, heck many of them might not even understand what they did.. Many where young and pushed in to leadership and fame without any training or support.
But things like this add-on is not some juvenile powerplay... This is pure fear and envy. Fear that the "purity" of the project will be tainted and envy that these "streamers" get the VIP treatment over the people who "built" classic. (not really wanting to grasp that.. well... marketing is marketing) and as a green muppet once said... fear is the path to the dark side... That is why we need to call it out because if these people do not get a bit of friction forcing them to reflect on their path, they are simply just posterior primates flinging things at anything they do not like.
This have been a good conversation
I always belonged to the top guilds in Everquest but was acutely aware of the problems it caused to many small guilds and players who didn't belong to any guild. This too on a PvE server and I think it would have been far worse on a PvP server.
We forget that many players become tyrants and petty lords when they play games and let powers get to them corrupting them completely. It is exactly like the real world and to hell with being fair or uncorrupted. Greed is the principle cause.