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What is the difference between RvR and Faction vs Faction to you?
MMOExposed
Member RarePosts: 7,400
I came across this recently which made me create this thread. Some people said to me that RvR is different from Faction vs Faction.
But how. Going on the Wikipedia page on Realm vs Realm, they even say Faction vs Faction is interchangeable terminology.
So can anybody explain how they are different?
But how. Going on the Wikipedia page on Realm vs Realm, they even say Faction vs Faction is interchangeable terminology.
So can anybody explain how they are different?
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
Comments
Raquelis in various games
Played: Everything
Playing: Nioh 2, Civ6
Wants: The World
Anticipating: Everquest Next Crowfall, Pantheon, Elden Ring
Realm vs. Realm is a merit based system of accounting for all accomplishments of all members in a Realm against those of the other Realm. It is a matter of conflict that takes into account PvE actions as well as PvP actions. A Realm's dungeoneers could essentially carry the Realm to merit victory against the opposing Realm, even if that other Realm is significantly better in PvP, just based on how points are allocated as well as overall participation progress.
And thus is how Warhammer failed so hard as well. The games original emphasis on RvR in consumer advertisement highlighted a large amount of PvP, with very little PvE additive. However when actually delivered, it was far more PvE with very little PvP. But the developers still sold PvE and PvP as both contributors to the overall Realm progression. Because mechanics weighed heavier for PvE, the PvP portion of the game was more or less avoided so that groups could circle-cap PvE objectives for Realm progress.
As for Faction vs. Faction, it is strictly a PvP term with little-to-no PvE matter within it. World of Warcraft is the best example of this because its Faction vs. Faction was strictly regulated to PvP progress. Sure later down the road they added in some PvE-progress areas (Negrand in the first expansion, for example), but the bulk was not that. No dungeon contributed to a merit of one Faction over the other. No raid either. they shared zones, shared some quests, and even shared neutral ports in quite a lot of areas. Only PvP really counted as Faction vs. Faction.
Consider Pirates of the Burning Sea.
In addition to the basic small scale PvP (ship vs. ship combat in specific danger zones) there was an overarching battle for control fought between the various maritime powers. This revolved around major port battles triggered by doing stuff that included "PvE" type activity meaning people who didn't want to "PvP" could support their "realms" struggles through PvE! Port battles generated victory points etc.
However the game also included "Pirates". Not a "realm", essentially a faction. And their rules were different.
I don't think PotBS used either of the terms "RvR" or "faction vs. faction". It simply had a system.
Or consider EQ1.
Arguably the very model of PvE. And yet it had more PvP servers than e.g. DAoC had total servers back in the day. And the combat took place between a wide array of different ... factions? realms? both? Its a long time ago but it seemed as though every server was - nominally - different.
Hence my view is that what these terms means is very much game specific. What might be RvR in one game might be called faction vs. faction in another even though they are "the same". Or RvR in one might be different to RvR in another.
There are three realms in CF, but they intend to add in Guild vs guild, which is essentially faction Vs faction. Meaning, you can be in the same realm but in opposing factions within that Realm.
I do not know how they plan to make this a reality, I am going on what I read and what was told to me. So you can still have RvR, but you can also have FvF.
I could be completely wrong on this as I have not checked that game out in a few weeks, but even if this is inaccurate it would be one answer to the question
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
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But I think RvR end up being used to call games where almost the entire game play is about fighting opponent faction.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
Try to find the difference between these type of game and other games which aren't being called RvR.
The mistake they made was adding WOW-like scenario PvP to it and making that the premiere way of getting XP while leveling. War bands were constantly losing a big chunk of their players whenever their scenario PvP popped. Additionally players were so used to the large XP gains in those and the piss poor XP in the real RvR for everything except conquering keeps that swapping keeps (they were routinely abandoned after capture) for XP became the WAR thing in RvR.
They did try to fine tune the XP disparity but by then it was too late.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Or the example I used above (Crowfall), three realms fighting each other, and within these realms you can have factions that fight one another. This to me seems like a pretty clear cut difference.
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
Rvr or FvF usually means 2 to 3 ROFLMAO,if that isn't like the laziest effort,then idk what is.
if you are going to have realms and or factions,there had better be at the very minimum 20+ and NOT 2 or 3 lol.This is the kind of half assed lazy effort i keep saying game to game,nobody is putting any effort into their games anymore.
What dev studios are doing a lot of is taking your money,often for no reason other than we are stupid enough to give it to them.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Realms are “servers”.
Factions are like minded groups on servers...
This isn't a signature, you just think it is.
I think people are arguing about terminology when I think RvR is just a term used to describe DAOC or any games which try to be a spiritual successor to DAOC.
I will use Crowfall again. You join one of three realms and these three realms fight one another for resources and control points. However, within this realm, you have different guilds or factions that can fight one another. That is the easiest way for me to visualize this anyway.
Your realm is your country, your faction is your State.
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
The main reason is that when 1 faction becomes to powerful the other 2 can "group" against it.
So yah .. kinda everything else which is almost 100% 2 factions /red vs blue cant be called real RVR.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED