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Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
The initial cost with Pets, weight, and inventory are the biggest purchases. However, as I said in another post, you don't need anymore than $200 initially. If you're smart about the locations you grind or lifeskill inventory space never becomes an issue. You can obtain inventory spaces through loyalty points.
You have gawked about a tinfoil conspiracy as if all TET/PEN items came from people spending hundreds or thousands on artisan memories.
Anyone who comes to understand grinding and lifeskilling in this game don't need to waste money frivolously on artisan memories as said players can easily earn 100m+ an hour grinding or lifeskilling. Making the need for purchasing these items irrelevant.
Cron stones can be purchased for a a mere 2m a piece. Assuming you can only obtain 100m an hour, that's 10 hours per Cron attempt at PEN. If you're at the high end of the gear curve, this can be cut down even further. There are methods that can earn you 300m+ silver per hour with little effort.
The value pack can be purchased off of the market place and it only takes 1 1/2 hours to at 100m per hour to obtain the needed funds. If someone is willing to spend money which is equal to the monthly equivalent of a subscription, this would be that item.
Kamaslyvia's Blessing, not worth it unless you lifeskill for faster energy regeneration and even then it's smarter to have the maximum amount of alts for lifeskilling. The +20% increased drop chance is a joke when the most valuable drop rates are 0.01-0.001%. You can stop talking out of your ass as if +20% with provide you with a huge increase in profits earned (tldr, don't waste your money on it).
Swapping your weapons from your old class to a newly released class? No different than World of Warcraft for example providing the option to instantly level a new character to cap.
Combat XP swap is no different from the previous statement. Don't waste your money when the game literally hands out 200% and 600% xp scrolls like candy from the events. Additionally, it takes at most 1-3 days to get a character from 1-61 in the current iteration of the game. You'd be wasting $100 purchasing this.
Valk's Cry, I've got over 200 of these sitting in my bank from past events, if you're going to pay-to-win you'd never buy these to begin with. Not to mention +10 fail stacks is nothing when you're looking at TET/PEN attempts. Irrelevant and not worth the money.
There's a free tent in game and you can craft anvils if you don't want to spend $50 on the cash shop tent.
Mount skill coupons are probably the most pay-to-win option, I'll give you that. However, it doesn't take more than eight hours to grind for a T8 courser at 100m an hour. You don't particularly need a T9 horse.
Book of the Old Moon, merged several old cash shop items together for a better value. However, the only good thing on the list of things worth while is the villa buff. Not worth the money. The only reason you'd purchase this item is for the skill resets.
I can throw money at WoW with their tokens and purchase Mythic raid runs. I can throw Plex at players for ships and resources in EVE Online. I can convert gems to gold for endgame gear in Guild Wars 2. I'm able to sell tokens in Everquest to buy endgame gear. I can purchase tokens to buy endgame gear in Runescape. You talk as if BDO is a monster for the fact that you can earn a mere 335,000,000 silver which only translates to 1-3 hours of work.
Have I ever said it was fair? No, but if you're frivolously wasting your money for such little value in return, that's your prerogative and your fault by getting baited.
What % of the playerbase has the ability to earn 100mil per hour?
You talk as if this is readily available to anyone - it's not.
New players as you pointed out are HOSED.
What % of the playerbase has the ability to earn 300mil an hour - yeah
This is precisely the problem for PA apologists- you are talking edge case scenario that is not realistic.
What is realistic is about 10-30mil per hour for non-noob players and this is with five t3/t4 pets, 6+ storage maids... weight increases at least.. so you've already spend 100s in the cash shop
Also without people dumping $$$$ in the cash shop there would be no market for end game gear - again people are spending a ton of money because that is how game is designed.
That us my whole point - BDO is deliberately designed to push players into spending as much money as possible
Obtaining 100m+ an hour is readily available if you do the research and invest your time properly. Hell one of the easiest methods is simply butchering wolf meat.
New players do have a harder time catching up, but that's the cost for retaining veteran players and their commitment to the game. BDO is a game I respect for not throwing away all of someone's work away in a blink of an eye, something that every cookie-cutter MMO that follows in the footsteps of World of Warcraft is at fault for.
Not a BDO apologist, I'm just a realist who knows that you're talking out of your ass.
I've mentioned you'd only need pets, weight, and inventory. You could do that with maybe $200 USD. Not a huge cost (at least upfront) when you compare the amount of money people have spent in other games.
If a new player is only making 10-30m per hour, they're not investing their time properly and could easily improve their methods.
I don't spend thousands on the game and have built almost every piece of gear I have from scratch. Hell, I bought TET Urugon boots (~2,300,000,000 silver) from a few weeks of afk fishing during a fishing event while taking a break from the game.
Just because someone can drop thousands of dollars on the game to possibly obtain a few pieces of gear doesn't mean the gear magically shows up in the market place for others to buy.
$60+ for those 2 costumes = 660 million silver in game if you sell them to other players
BDO is not P2W guys...
Do you win a game wearing a fancy costume? Who would have thought, you learn something new every day.....
DMKano is off his rocker thinking that this game is terrible by comparison to other games. lol, to me, it sounds like he has spending issues and refuses to touch the game due to his impulsive nature.
PA is building a brand new 20mil building in Korea because they have managed to squeeze players for max money in the cash shop.
BDO is a hugely profitable game directly because of how the game design pushed players to spend in the cash shop.
I play BDO actively still I just leveled my guardian to 61, also have a 61 mystic and musa, have a 60 zerk, and all classes awakened at 56+ also have done succession on my warrior (level 59).
I am very familiar with how BDO is designed and how PA keeps adding mechanisms to keep players spending more and more money.
I dont care what other games do - this is besides the point - because being ripped off in other games doesnt make it any more valid for BDO to rip players off.
If you go to service your car and the shop tells you we will charge you $2000 for an oil change because all other shops are ripping people off - this doesnt make it ok.
So now you're mad because PA is building a 20m build in Korea because they're profitable?
If players are stupidly wasting their money on many of the irrelevant/useless items in the cash shop. That's their prerogative, it doesn't make a difference.
Congrats on reaching level 61 on your guardian. Mine is sitting at 62, in addition to my level 62 archer, 61 Mystic, 61 Zerker, 60 Wizard, 60 Lahn, 60 Musa, 60 Ninja, 60 Shai, and 59 Ranger. Awakening and Succession isn't an achievement, the quests are minor and at most take 5-10 minutes to complete.
I have 4 TET zarka's a, TET Steel Dagger, TET Kutum, TET Nouver, PEN Dande, PEN Frost Jordun, 2 sets of TET boss armor, 1 set of TET Heve, 3 sets of TRI yellow accessories, TRI Manos butchering Knife, and a DUO Manos Gathering Clothes.
Not caring what other games do to pay-to-win? Hypocrite, lol. It's asinine assuming people are forced into spending thousands of dollars into this game. If I see 12-15 year olds running around in 260+ AP/300+ DP gear without dropping thousands on this game then I know for a fact that a grown adult can do the same (If not better).
The issue here is that you think anyone with more gear than you in this game paid to win.
Keep thinking purchasing a Kamasylvia's Blessing is worth that +20% drop rate. You obviously have no idea how minuscule the increases are. Especially when they give out hundreds of +100% drop rate and +20% quantity scrolls for free.
Err ... how much time do you (and have you spent) playing and learning to play this game?
I'm suspecting it is quite above "average" as your arguments are similar to EVE players making such ease of income generation remarks.
They usually were in the top 10% in terms of time spent.
I suppose anything in a game comes fairly easy to the 6 hour plus a day player....especially if they've been doing so for years.
Also, it appears you take advantage of the autoplay, afk features and perhaps across multiple accounts?
No worries if you do, always been a multiboxer myself, though I won't play games with afk/auto play.
If so realize your gameplay style is atypical and while it might be possible for others to follow your lead, I can well understand others deciding to pay their way through which is clearly part of PAs plan.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
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Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
The user and all related content has been deleted.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
Anyway whatever you think about BDO monetisation, the reality is that the majority of players likes it, since the game has done really well... unlike Archeage.
For a guy who hates the game, you'd think he'd actively stay away from the game.
Sounds to me like he is making sense. From what it looks like, every obstacle you come across can be overcome with the cash shop. Whether it is easy to do with out support from the cash shop doesn't matter to me. The game is still heavy p2w at that point.
The user and all related content has been deleted.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
"So I think even for subscriptions, if they really just like the content, if they believe in the value they are getting for the subscription, of course they are going to pay... The subscription model will survive, but probably in a little different way, because there is more and more competition between free-to-play games and not free-to-play, whether they are subscription-based or a one time purchase model."
Even the American CEO of BDO realises subscription/B2P is not going away, it will be supported by players. Can one of those guys like Gdemmani who think our support for using these revenue models is archaic and unrealistic post to tell us how we are so wrong. Thanks.
Well I'm sure @Gdemami would be more than willing, but might still be in timeout so I'll try.
I believe subscriptions are here to stay, but as the sole revenue generation tool, unlikely we'll ever see a sub only game.
Hybrid models like BDOs is are the wave of the future, and PA is a clear market leader in this model.
When you think about it, from a business perspective it makes little sense to not try to maximize revenues / profits which all of you are too ignorant to comprehend with your inferior intellects.
*threw in that last paragraph to try and stay in character, how did I do? Be sure to LOL this post if you think I nailed it)"
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
The user and all related content has been deleted.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
The thing he should talk about is how BDO cripples base systems and then fixes them via cash shop.
Also the gear upgrade system is pure evil - even if you don't PvP - they keep adding PvE zones that have 250+ AP requirement, 280AP zone coming, after that 310AP zone...
The only way to realistically get that past the soft cap is - well someone has to spend massive amounts of money on artisan memories to enchant gear to PEN
Bottom line - the cash shop is way greedy and there are entirely far too many ways to drain your wallet dry in this game - there are far too many players in game that regularly spend $100s every week.
The game is just too damn expesive if you want to go high end AP
I haven’t spent one dollar on artisan memories and I’m well over soft cap.
These arguments are almost as fun as watching Elyria burn. ___
To be honest most players here could have made the assumption that the game was going to go P2W just because all the skills are flashier than a casino.
Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent.
"At one point technology meant making tech that could get to the moon, now it means making tech that could get you a taxi."
In BDO you get free pets, weight and inventory by just playing the game, by questing and participating in the periodic events. Same for the few P2W items in the shops which can be easily be obtained by afk fishing.
I played BDO for almost 2 years and never paid a single penny. I have plenty of pets, costumes and high end gear in my bank, together with a year worth of FREE subscription, all obtained by just playing the game.
So BDO isn’t P2W if you play the game. Yes, if you play only 1 hour per day, you have to open the wallet, that’s true. But that’s also true for every other MMORPG that you play casually and in which somewhat you want to be competitive.
This is simply false - because none of the free stuff is enough to be actually efficient.
You cant loot fast enough with free in game pets as they are tier 1. Free weight is not enough nor is free inventory.
Also you need at least 6 storage maids at 7k trash per hour without stopping too much.
Those cash shop items you buy from other players - well somebody had to spend real money for those- lets not ignore that fact
What they do is give you free stuff to give you a little taste like a drug dealer to get you to start spending $$# in the cash shop where you can unlock the full potential of the game.
Again making excuses how it's ok before other games also rip you off is a flawed argument.
The game is P2W and the free stuff you get is just a little taste to lure you into spending more
Stop talking BS. Pets do level, and you can use up to 4, which I do. I can loot a group of 20 mobs at a time without stopping.
I have 12 Free months of subscription sitting on my bank, lots of costumes, a maid, plenty of inventory space, and my gear is good enough that I can rotate an entire camp by myself, instead of doing it with a group (and at the same speed), so I don’t have to share the loot.
And I’ve done that without paying a penny.
Unlike you, I play one MMORPG at a time so I can dedicate more hours to it. You are a casual player and obviously if you want to compete with people like me you have to open your wallet. But that’s true for every other MMORPG.
EQ, WOW, EVE, if you want to have the best gear you have to sink an insane amount of hours to it. The gear grind in BDO is nothing unusual, they just decided to monetise it.
BDO isn’t s casual game, and I like it because of it. If you want to play it casual, you’ll have to pay for the privilege. Simple.
In BDO you get free pets, weight and inventory by just playing the game, by questing and participating in the periodic events. Same for the few P2W items in the shops which can be easily be obtained by afk fishing.
I played BDO for almost 2 years and never paid a single penny. I have plenty of pets, costumes and high end gear in my bank, together with a year worth of FREE subscription, all obtained by just playing the game.
So BDO isn’t P2W if you play the game. Yes, if you play only 1 hour per day, you have to open the wallet, that’s true. But that’s also true for every other MMORPG that you play casually and in which somewhat you want to be competitive.
This is simply false - because none of the free stuff is enough to be actually efficient.
You cant loot fast enough with free in game pets as they are tier 1. Free weight is not enough nor is free inventory.
Also you need at least 6 storage maids at 7k trash per hour without stopping too much.
Those cash shop items you buy from other players - well somebody had to spend real money for those- lets not ignore that fact
What they do is give you free stuff to give you a little taste like a drug dealer to get you to start spending $$# in the cash shop where you can unlock the full potential of the game.
Again making excuses how it's ok before other games also rip you off is a flawed argument.
The game is P2W and the free stuff you get is just a little taste to lure you into spending more
Stop talking BS. Pets do level, and you can use up to 4, which I do. I can loot a group of 20 mobs at a time without stopping.
I have 12 Free months of subscription sitting on my bank, lots of costumes, a maid, plenty of inventory space, and my gear is good enough that I can rotate an entire camp by myself, instead of doing it with a group (and at the same speed), so I don’t have to share the loot.
And I’ve done that without paying a penny.
Unlike you, I play one MMORPG at a time so I can dedicate more hours to it. You are a casual player and obviously if you want to compete with people like me you have to open your wallet. But that’s true for every other MMORPG.
EQ, WOW, EVE, if you want to have the best gear you have to sink an insane amount of hours to it. The gear grind in BDO is nothing unusual, they just decided to monetise it.
BDO isn’t s casual game, and I like it because of it. If you want to play it casual, you’ll have to pay for the privilege. Simple.
Oh man...please
You can use 5 pets at a time in BDO - they can level up yes, but they cannot tier up
Stop embarrassing yourself 4 pets was the limit a long time ago, also tier 1 pets at level 10 cannot loot fast enough - this has been proven countless times.
Again my clear speed is up to 9k trash per hour and my t3/t4 pets cant loot everything at that clear speed.
Do you even realize pets have tiers???
A maid? Hehe I have 7 storage maids and 3 market so I can dump trash loot in storage on the fly.
How much trash/hour do you get - you cant even go above 4K with T1 pets.
Please...
By your own admission you play many MMORPGs at a time plus other single player games, so you will never get close to achieve anything meaningful in BDO let alone understand how to get the best out of the game.
I mentioned I quit BDO some time ago, and my memory can be a bit fuzzy, but at the time it was 4 pets, and I could easily insta loot whole camps of mobs (you are familiar with camp rotations I hope).
Probably you only play in group therefore you are competing with other players pets, tiers makes a difference only in that case.
I used to farm alone and my pets could cope with an entire camp rotation no problem. Suffice to say, groups used to move camps when I showed up, because I used to kill their mobs faster than them, that’s how well geared I was. Plus, I really knew how to get the best of each Class, since I learned the game the hard way, and never bought any gear with real money.
Your knowledge of BDO can only be superficial, as you are a casual gamer, but you talk like you are some kind of expert.
Plus you keep dissing BDO cash shop, but I never heard you saying anything at all about Archeage P2W cash shop on steroids.
If you were as obsessive about Archeage cash shop as you are with BDO, maybe Trion would be still in business (as you seemed to have friends at Trion, they might have listened to you).
I will poke in here. Some of the statements against BDO are hilarious and show people that don't want to invest any time into mmorpgs and thus complain about people that do and think that being able to bypass a time constraint somehow makes a game P2W. Stop applying subjective bullshit to the term Pay to win for the love of god already. Pay to win refers to being able to buy power that is not attainable through any other means other than opening your wallet. Mu Online is pay to win BDO is not. Just because you can bypass something that takes time doesn't make it P2W. Pay for convenience =/= p2w and it never has. There is a difference between the two and applying anything beyond that baser meaning of p2w is entirely subjective and doesn't change that fact.
Can you pay to advance a little faster? Yes. Can you pay to gain an edge over people that don't pay? No because everything is literally earn-able in game minus costumes which you can buy on the marketplace pretty readily. It is easy to get money while leveling up, doing gathering, and actually investing time into the game.
So sick of you kids that were brought up on WoW that have become so lackadaisical in how you treat mmorpgs that putting in any actually effort is too much for you. MMORPGS are meant to be a time investment that is fun to you. If a game isn't fun to you move on and shut the hell up about it because it gets freaking nauseating at this point.
I've been in this genre since the literal inception of it and I've been around when most of the phrases were even coined. These arguments basically boil down to "That guy got there faster than me using money P2W P2W" you might as well scream the sky is falling here bunch of chicken little sounding asses.
I will poke in here. Some of the statements against BDO are hilarious and show people that don't want to invest any time into mmorpgs and thus complain about people that do and think that being able to bypass a time constraint somehow makes a game P2W. Stop applying subjective bullshit to the term Pay to win for the love of god already. Pay to win refers to being able to buy power that is not attainable through any other means other than opening your wallet. Mu Online is pay to win BDO is not. Just because you can bypass something that takes time doesn't make it P2W. Pay for convenience =/= p2w and it never has. There is a difference between the two and applying anything beyond that baser meaning of p2w is entirely subjective and doesn't change that fact.
Can you pay to advance a little faster? Yes. Can you pay to gain an edge over people that don't pay? No because everything is literally earn-able in game minus costumes which you can buy on the marketplace pretty readily. It is easy to get money while leveling up, doing gathering, and actually investing time into the game.
So sick of you kids that were brought up on WoW that have become so lackadaisical in how you treat mmorpgs that putting in any actually effort is too much for you. MMORPGS are meant to be a time investment that is fun to you. If a game isn't fun to you move on and shut the hell up about it because it gets freaking nauseating at this point.
I've been in this genre since the literal inception of it and I've been around when most of the phrases were even coined. These arguments basically boil down to "That guy got there faster than me using money P2W P2W" you might as well scream the sky is falling here bunch of chicken little sounding asses.
Yeah, if only it was that simple....
Buying power in the cash shop that isn’t obtainable through gameplay is P2W.
Buying power in the cash shop that is relatively easily obtainable through gameplay isn’t P2W.
Buying power in the cash shop that is very grind heavy to obtain in game while having a huge chance to fail with game mechanics actively working against the player is most definitely P2W.
A simply ‘but you can get it through gameplay’ is a gross simplification that completely ignores the real issue, the grey area/slippery slope. No amount of bad boy language can cover that up kid.
/Cheers, Lahnmir
'the only way he could nail it any better is if he used a cross.'
Kyleran on yours sincerely
'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'
Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless.
It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.
It is just huge resource waste....'
Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer
I will poke in here. Some of the statements against BDO are hilarious and show people that don't want to invest any time into mmorpgs and thus complain about people that do and think that being able to bypass a time constraint somehow makes a game P2W. Stop applying subjective bullshit to the term Pay to win for the love of god already. Pay to win refers to being able to buy power that is not attainable through any other means other than opening your wallet. Mu Online is pay to win BDO is not. Just because you can bypass something that takes time doesn't make it P2W. Pay for convenience =/= p2w and it never has. There is a difference between the two and applying anything beyond that baser meaning of p2w is entirely subjective and doesn't change that fact.
Can you pay to advance a little faster? Yes. Can you pay to gain an edge over people that don't pay? No because everything is literally earn-able in game minus costumes which you can buy on the marketplace pretty readily. It is easy to get money while leveling up, doing gathering, and actually investing time into the game.
So sick of you kids that were brought up on WoW that have become so lackadaisical in how you treat mmorpgs that putting in any actually effort is too much for you. MMORPGS are meant to be a time investment that is fun to you. If a game isn't fun to you move on and shut the hell up about it because it gets freaking nauseating at this point.
I've been in this genre since the literal inception of it and I've been around when most of the phrases were even coined. These arguments basically boil down to "That guy got there faster than me using money P2W P2W" you might as well scream the sky is falling here bunch of chicken little sounding asses.
Yeah, if only it was that simple....
Buying power in the cash shop that isn’t obtainable through gameplay is P2W.
Buying power in the cash shop that is relatively easily obtainable through gameplay isn’t P2W.
Buying power in the cash shop that is very grind heavy to obtain in game while having a huge chance to fail with game mechanics actively working against the player is most definitely P2W.
A simply ‘but you can get it through gameplay’ is a gross simplification that completely ignores the real issue, the grey area/slippery slope. No amount of bad boy language can cover that up kid.
/Cheers, Lahnmir
Actually....while I well understand your point, I have always felt the term P2W is more along the lines of buying power in a cash shop which is unobtainable elsewhere.
Your third example of buying something to skip heavy grind is more of a convenience issue, so a better term would be Pay for Advantage (PFA).
There's all sorts of degrees of course, from experience boosters, salvage tents to avoid trips back to town, gathering pets which BDO has refined to an art form, to of course, items to help reduce the amount of RNG failures while "leveling up" gear.
Heck, it wouldn't be so bad if the cash shop stones you bought completely removed the RNG element, but in most games they still one of the more onerous designs, worse than loot boxes in most cases and I won't play a game with either mechanic.
I have to laugh. FO76 tied SC this year over on MOP for worst monetization model....really? Bethesda's (or RI) got nothing on Pearl Abyss, that's for sure.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
In BDO you get free pets, weight and inventory by just playing the game, by questing and participating in the periodic events. Same for the few P2W items in the shops which can be easily be obtained by afk fishing.
I played BDO for almost 2 years and never paid a single penny. I have plenty of pets, costumes and high end gear in my bank, together with a year worth of FREE subscription, all obtained by just playing the game.
So BDO isn’t P2W if you play the game. Yes, if you play only 1 hour per day, you have to open the wallet, that’s true. But that’s also true for every other MMORPG that you play casually and in which somewhat you want to be competitive.
This is simply false - because none of the free stuff is enough to be actually efficient.
You cant loot fast enough with free in game pets as they are tier 1. Free weight is not enough nor is free inventory.
Also you need at least 6 storage maids at 7k trash per hour without stopping too much.
Those cash shop items you buy from other players - well somebody had to spend real money for those- lets not ignore that fact
What they do is give you free stuff to give you a little taste like a drug dealer to get you to start spending $$# in the cash shop where you can unlock the full potential of the game.
Again making excuses how it's ok before other games also rip you off is a flawed argument.
The game is P2W and the free stuff you get is just a little taste to lure you into spending more
Stop talking BS. Pets do level, and you can use up to 4, which I do. I can loot a group of 20 mobs at a time without stopping.
I have 12 Free months of subscription sitting on my bank, lots of costumes, a maid, plenty of inventory space, and my gear is good enough that I can rotate an entire camp by myself, instead of doing it with a group (and at the same speed), so I don’t have to share the loot.
And I’ve done that without paying a penny.
Unlike you, I play one MMORPG at a time so I can dedicate more hours to it. You are a casual player and obviously if you want to compete with people like me you have to open your wallet. But that’s true for every other MMORPG.
EQ, WOW, EVE, if you want to have the best gear you have to sink an insane amount of hours to it. The gear grind in BDO is nothing unusual, they just decided to monetise it.
BDO isn’t s casual game, and I like it because of it. If you want to play it casual, you’ll have to pay for the privilege. Simple.
Oh man...please
You can use 5 pets at a time in BDO - they can level up yes, but they cannot tier up
Stop embarrassing yourself 4 pets was the limit a long time ago, also tier 1 pets at level 10 cannot loot fast enough - this has been proven countless times.
Again my clear speed is up to 9k trash per hour and my t3/t4 pets cant loot everything at that clear speed.
Do you even realize pets have tiers???
A maid? Hehe I have 7 storage maids and 3 market so I can dump trash loot in storage on the fly.
How much trash/hour do you get - you cant even go above 4K with T1 pets.
Please...
By your own admission you play many MMORPGs at a time plus other single player games, so you will never get close to achieve anything meaningful in BDO let alone understand how to get the best out of the game.
I mentioned I quit BDO some time ago, and my memory can be a bit fuzzy, but at the time it was 4 pets, and I could easily insta loot whole camps of mobs (you are familiar with camp rotations I hope).
Probably you only play in group therefore you are competing with other players pets, tiers makes a difference only in that case.
I used to farm alone and my pets could cope with an entire camp rotation no problem. Suffice to say, groups used to move camps when I showed up, because I used to kill their mobs faster than them, that’s how well geared I was. Plus, I really knew how to get the best of each Class, since I learned the game the hard way, and never bought any gear with real money.
Your knowledge of BDO can only be superficial, as you are a casual gamer, but you talk like you are some kind of expert.
Plus you keep dissing BDO cash shop, but I never heard you saying anything at all about Archeage P2W cash shop on steroids.
If you were as obsessive about Archeage cash shop as you are with BDO, maybe Trion would be still in business (as you seemed to have friends at Trion, they might have listened to you).
I have not had the time to read every post here but like you I stick to one MMO at a time. I found BDO fine until it came to upgrading weapons/armour, that is a grind fest worthy of being nominated for the award "Biggest Grindfest in MMOs". Now if you do not want to be doing top "level" play then it does not matter, but if you do many turn to buying items in the cash shop and then selling them for in game gold.
As that's not the sort of game I wanted to play I stopped there. But there were people in the guild who just like playing it as an economic game, one of our guys was always in the top five wealthiest and just loved to talk about trading and manufacturing. You could go and visit one of his homes and it was just full of looms.
What I liked about BDO was the graphics and combat, though not a pure arcade combat fan in a MMO they did that very well. Also some of the pastimes like whaling were great and gave a real community feel to a guild.
I recall reading a story on MOP or someplace where the writer described their step by step experience of trying to level up their gear set from one tier to another. (Not the highest one either)
It was a pretty grim tale, punctuated by hair pulling failures despite the author even using a decent number of the items to mitigate some of the RNG. (Some commentators felt the author was way too optimistic in the estimate.)
Starting off the writer was sure they had enough resources to upgrade the entire set but as I recall they fell well short of achieving their goal and though enjoying the game overall came away quite discouraged by this experience.
Definitely not the sort of experience I would enjoy though watching me hurl a laptop through my flat screen TV might be good for several hundred thousand views on YouTube if I thought to record it all.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
The way gear is upgraded is downright villainry. I played this game without ever trying the upgrade thing so never experienced this system first hand so I only have fond memories of this game.
Comments
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
I thought games were supposed to be fun?
I'm suspecting it is quite above "average" as your arguments are similar to EVE players making such ease of income generation remarks.
They usually were in the top 10% in terms of time spent.
I suppose anything in a game comes fairly easy to the 6 hour plus a day player....especially if they've been doing so for years.
Also, it appears you take advantage of the autoplay, afk features and perhaps across multiple accounts?
No worries if you do, always been a multiboxer myself, though I won't play games with afk/auto play.
If so realize your gameplay style is atypical and while it might be possible for others to follow your lead, I can well understand others deciding to pay their way through which is clearly part of PAs plan.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
I believe subscriptions are here to stay, but as the sole revenue generation tool, unlikely we'll ever see a sub only game.
Hybrid models like BDOs is are the wave of the future, and PA is a clear market leader in this model.
When you think about it, from a business perspective it makes little sense to not try to maximize revenues / profits which all of you are too ignorant to comprehend with your inferior intellects.
*threw in that last paragraph to try and stay in character, how did I do? Be sure to LOL this post if you think I nailed it)"
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
I haven’t spent one dollar on artisan memories and I’m well over soft cap.
___
To be honest most players here could have made the assumption that the game was going to go P2W just because all the skills are flashier than a casino.
Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent.
"At one point technology meant making tech that could get to the moon, now it means making tech that could get you a taxi."
Pets do level, and you can use up to 4, which I do. I can loot a group of 20 mobs at a time without stopping.
I have 12 Free months of subscription sitting on my bank, lots of costumes, a maid, plenty of inventory space, and my gear is good enough that I can rotate an entire camp by myself, instead of doing it with a group (and at the same speed), so I don’t have to share the loot.
And I’ve done that without paying a penny.
Unlike you, I play one MMORPG at a time so I can dedicate more hours to it.
You are a casual player and obviously if you want to compete with people like me you have to open your wallet.
But that’s true for every other MMORPG.
EQ, WOW, EVE, if you want to have the best gear you have to sink an insane amount of hours to it.
The gear grind in BDO is nothing unusual, they just decided to monetise it.
BDO isn’t s casual game, and I like it because of it.
If you want to play it casual, you’ll have to pay for the privilege.
Simple.
I mentioned I quit BDO some time ago, and my memory can be a bit fuzzy, but at the time it was 4 pets, and I could easily insta loot whole camps of mobs (you are familiar with camp rotations I hope).
Probably you only play in group therefore you are competing with other players pets, tiers makes a difference only in that case.
I used to farm alone and my pets could cope with an entire camp rotation no problem.
Suffice to say, groups used to move camps when I showed up, because I used to kill their mobs faster than them, that’s how well geared I was. Plus, I really knew how to get the best of each Class, since I learned the game the hard way, and never bought any gear with real money.
Your knowledge of BDO can only be superficial, as you are a casual gamer, but you talk like you are some kind of expert.
Plus you keep dissing BDO cash shop, but I never heard you saying anything at all about Archeage P2W cash shop on steroids.
If you were as obsessive about Archeage cash shop as you are with BDO, maybe Trion would be still in business (as you seemed to have friends at Trion, they might have listened to you).
Can you pay to advance a little faster? Yes. Can you pay to gain an edge over people that don't pay? No because everything is literally earn-able in game minus costumes which you can buy on the marketplace pretty readily. It is easy to get money while leveling up, doing gathering, and actually investing time into the game.
So sick of you kids that were brought up on WoW that have become so lackadaisical in how you treat mmorpgs that putting in any actually effort is too much for you. MMORPGS are meant to be a time investment that is fun to you. If a game isn't fun to you move on and shut the hell up about it because it gets freaking nauseating at this point.
I've been in this genre since the literal inception of it and I've been around when most of the phrases were even coined. These arguments basically boil down to "That guy got there faster than me using money P2W P2W" you might as well scream the sky is falling here bunch of chicken little sounding asses.
Buying power in the cash shop that isn’t obtainable through gameplay is P2W.
Buying power in the cash shop that is relatively easily obtainable through gameplay isn’t P2W.
Buying power in the cash shop that is very grind heavy to obtain in game while having a huge chance to fail with game mechanics actively working against the player is most definitely P2W.
A simply ‘but you can get it through gameplay’ is a gross simplification that completely ignores the real issue, the grey area/slippery slope. No amount of bad boy language can cover that up kid.
/Cheers,
Lahnmir
Kyleran on yours sincerely
'But there are many. You can play them entirely solo, and even offline. Also, you are wrong by default.'
Ikcin in response to yours sincerely debating whether or not single-player offline MMOs exist...
'This does not apply just to ED but SC or any other game. What they will get is Rebirth/X4, likely prettier but equally underwhelming and pointless.
It is incredibly difficult to design some meaningfull leg content that would fit a space ship game - simply because it is not a leg game.
It is just huge resource waste....'
Gdemami absolutely not being an armchair developer
Your third example of buying something to skip heavy grind is more of a convenience issue, so a better term would be Pay for Advantage (PFA).
There's all sorts of degrees of course, from experience boosters, salvage tents to avoid trips back to town, gathering pets which BDO has refined to an art form, to of course, items to help reduce the amount of RNG failures while "leveling up" gear.
Heck, it wouldn't be so bad if the cash shop stones you bought completely removed the RNG element, but in most games they still one of the more onerous designs, worse than loot boxes in most cases and I won't play a game with either mechanic.
I have to laugh. FO76 tied SC this year over on MOP for worst monetization model....really? Bethesda's (or RI) got nothing on Pearl Abyss, that's for sure.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
As that's not the sort of game I wanted to play I stopped there. But there were people in the guild who just like playing it as an economic game, one of our guys was always in the top five wealthiest and just loved to talk about trading and manufacturing. You could go and visit one of his homes and it was just full of looms.
What I liked about BDO was the graphics and combat, though not a pure arcade combat fan in a MMO they did that very well. Also some of the pastimes like whaling were great and gave a real community feel to a guild.
It was a pretty grim tale, punctuated by hair pulling failures despite the author even using a decent number of the items to mitigate some of the RNG. (Some commentators felt the author was way too optimistic in the estimate.)
Starting off the writer was sure they had enough resources to upgrade the entire set but as I recall they fell well short of achieving their goal and though enjoying the game overall came away quite discouraged by this experience.
Definitely not the sort of experience I would enjoy though watching me hurl a laptop through my flat screen TV might be good for several hundred thousand views on YouTube if I thought to record it all.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon