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MUDs v. MMORPGS, and the consequences of disregarding the differences in playerbase
Amathe
Member LegendaryPosts: 7,630
One of the things I like best about HJ is also the thing I fear most - the fact that Simultronics was a pioneer in the making of MUDs and has 15+ years experience with that type of game. That experience suggests that they will have a great story, promote roleplay, and do many, many fun and innovative things to break away from the design inflexability that has calcified so many major modern mmorpgs. Lately it seems that other gamemakers do little more than make a laundry list of features that have been popular in other games, and then just build the feature list, forgetting to put an actual game into the code. I don't think Simu will do that because of their emphasis on the story and having fun. All of that is good. 
Simu will definitely not follow but blaze a trail, and I applaud them for it.
But I can still remember when the mmorpg genre was new and a large percentage of the players were former PnP gamers and MUDDers. Things were different then. More people roleplayed. More people were patient with the game, had less expectations and were nicer to their fellow players. Communities were more cohesive and supportive. And the standard grind to max level/the only thing that matters is your stuff and getting it quick mentality had not yet taken root. There was no such thing as IGE and powerleveling services for money.
A LOT has changed. Most modern mmorpg players are NOT former MUDDERS and PnP gamers anymore. Their background is console gaming, FPS gaming and playing other mmorpgs. Their mindset is often that the only things that matter in a game are getting to max level, getting it first, defeating the end game, having better stuff than the next guy, and then demanding more high end content that only people like themselves will enjoy and as many people as possible can be excluded from. Are there exceptions? Surely. Can I give you exact statistics? No. But have I seen a TON of people with this mentality in ALL of the 7-8 mmorpgs I have played and can offer anecdotal evidence of my claim? You bet.
It's one thing for HJ to be innovative and to put renewed emphasis where emphasis has been sorely lacking of late. That's awesome. But it's an entirely different thing to ignore the realities of modern mmorpg demographics and established playstyles. Very few leopards change their spots. Make no mistake - HJ will be descended upon by thousands and thousands of players who will disregard HJ's intended design and play HJ the same way they have played every other game if possible.
If the game has exploits they will be used. If you can get to max level faster by powergaming and grinding than by roleplaying and questing, that will be done. If some item is highly prized it will be camped if possible and farmed. If roleplayers are in the way of these players they will be harassed and griefed. Gold will be farmed, sold and purchased. If people can be scammed with player casinos and the ilk, they will get scammed. And so on and so on. Every trick in the book will be used to disregard and thwart HJ's intended purpose and for players who only want to be first and best to achieve that (I hasten to add that not all such players use illigitimate methods). By the way, I certainly won't be doing that, but I have seen it done, and done early and often, in every single mmorpg I have played.
I am hoping and praying that while HJ has one eye towards the stars that it keeps one foot on the ground. Many newcomers to the mmorpg genre have sorely underestimated the mendacity of gamers, only to see their game run roughshod over and the economy unbalanced before you can say "Pollyanna." Even experienced mmorpg designers make this mistake. For example, I can still remember the throngs of people on my server in SWG wearing stormtrooper armor (an intended high level reward) within hours of launch because an exploit failed to be corrected in beta.
Why do I write this? I hope that when you consider a feature, that after asking the questions, "will it be fun", "does it fit our design intent", "can it be integrated into the story", etc., you also take a long, hard, cynical look at "can it be screwed with and misused to someone's advantage or to someone else's disadvantage?" Because if it can be it will. I also hope that HJ knows that the mmorpg gamer is frequently a different animal than a MUD gamer, and what worked in one genre may not work for a lot of people in the other.
HJ is going to be a great game. I just hope that it is ready for the shock of letting hundreds of thousands of people loose in it who don't roleplay, who neither know nor care to know the story, and whose purpose and sole enjoyment is personal aquisition and empowerment, and little more.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
Comments
I don't get to sit in the design meetings but I can tell you that every member of the onsite team plays one or more of the current MMO's so they are well aware of the MMO player mentality. Most, if not all, of the offsite GM's also play one or more MMO's so we're also well aware of those players.
I for one am always looking for ways to counteract the standard MMO player mentality. Some of the systems we already have in place are going to force people to re-think how they play these games. I've even mentioned to Steph that one of our biggest challenges is going to be re-training current MMO players and breaking the habits they've learned, and had reinforced by every game since EQ1.
My ultimate dream is to see someone come into a game and spend a month grinding and grinding to get to max level only to realize that their character is gimped because they did so. Will HJ deliver that, I don't know but I can dream.
I can only hope that Simu is able, somehow, to subvert the expectations and playstyles of those who play their game. Such things *can* happen, albeit slowly and not easily and rarely by plan. Maybe they have magic and wiles up their collective sleeves. I can hope.
Simu knew going into this thing that the community for HJ wasn't going to be the same as their communities in Gemstone or Dragonrealms. They know that they're going to have a lot of power gamers and people that just don't care about roleplaying. Their way of dealing with that is to create specific servers and allow the player to chose which type of server they want to play on. At least this was the plan in the beginning. I haven't heard of that changing so I assume that's still the plan.
What a great post Amathe and I coulnt agree with you more. I was one of those people who started with (and still play) PnP, then moved on the Muds Gemstone by far the best one I have played, followed by EQ. When I got into EQ I came at it like it was a Mud with graphics. I followed the lore, I role played my halfing rogue everything was fun for a little while. I started to notice that I was going now where I couldnt group with my friends as they went the route of powergaming when they realized they could. I then stopped playing EQ because I could not do anything if I was level 50+ with the best gear.
I then started to play other games when they came out, DAOC, Shadowbane, AC, Anarchy Online, the list goes on I even tried to get back into EQ but stopped again only after a few months. All of these games had that same feeling I need to be level 50+ with the best gear to do anything or I need to be in a group (I am not going to get into the group and solo thing here). So I have stopped playing MMORPG's and I am waiting for one that comes out that will give me the expernce I long for which is my Gemstone days. I feel, think and hope that HJ will bring this to me.
And as you have so elegantly stated Amathe I hope they keep their design vision in mind when hammering out cool new features.
Yes it's a very valid concern and a clear case in point can be seen in the very recent past.
EQ2 PvP.
When those servers opened, within a day there were two big guilds, who
I suppose should remain unnamed, who had obviously planned extensively
during beta how they would exploit the PvP content when it opened. And
sure enough, within a day or two they had members double the level of
the average player, exploiting holes to be able to mass kill players a
quarter of their level etc.
All in all, that first few days completely threw the PvP server out of
wack and it's still debatable whether a fun PvP balance will be
achieved.
I am curious to know, though I don't expect to get an official answer,
whether certain 'syndicate' Guilds who excel at exploiting and farming,
will be banned from the outset like has been done with Vanguard (least
I remember hearing Sigil had banned Ebonlore, whether it's true or not,
dunno).
Because in my opinion it's a problem which is not a case of deal with
it when i becomes apparent as the server is ruined within a couple of
days. Or at least have a tonne more balls than SoE and actually do
something about it post-anarchy.
It's a tough one. It's human nature at its finest in MMOs. Someone
(and it's usually a lot of someones...) will exploit a loophole and
'farm' players 1/10th their level if it means they'll get to endgame
uberness faster. People don't give a crap about what they'll be doing
in that game in a year's time. MMOs are a dime a dozen these days, and
some people will happily get to endgame, crap on anyone they need to in
the process, and declare they've "beaten" the game, then go off and do
the same in the next MMO that gets released, not caring if they help to destroy the server in the process.
Of course by saying people and some people I am talking about a very
specific type of player. And as Amathe says, it's not the people who
have grown up in this gaming environments. It's some of the 'hardcore' FPS converts and a majority
the adolescents and adolescent grown-ups "wo tlk w as lil txt as psbl ftw rolfcopter" who are
effectively ruining the roleplay and potential of depth that MMOs could
cater to. But due to the obscene numbers of those types of players, and
the horridly huge success of World of Plasticville nothing is sacred.
Not even an RP server.
I mean, these days you get people, like Guilds of people, who roll characters on RP servers just to grief the RPers.
I mean, what sort of lowbrain halfbaked pot smoking dipsh*t do you have
to be to actively go out of your way to grief and hassle roleplayers on
a designated roleplaying server?
Personally, what I would like to see if a very clear outline of what is
expected of us on the servers. Not what would be liked, what is
expected. How it is to be. Period.
EQ2, WoW etc, all these games have RP servers that are 'roleplay
preferred' at best. And there is no solid list of rules on the wall
that the players themselves can quote to a griefer and say "Look here,
it says if you do what you're doing, we get to coat you in cow crap".
In reality meaning if a player breaks the rules of RP etc, they know
what the punishments are because it's stated very clearly; on the
website, when you select the server at creation, as you load up the
game etc.
In summary, I think one of the biggest helping hands Simutronics could
give themselves to create a deep, rich gaming experience is to make
different servers, explain and spread the rules and what is expected of
each server, and then ENFORCE THEM. Help to spread the fun of roleplaying (as in, enjoying your character, not necessarily quoting Shakespeare) to the new generation of MMO players, help people to learn to respect others etc.
As in, if someone constantly griefs, they are banned from rolling on the RP server etc. If someone constantly swears, they are banned for a week or whatever.
I would just love, once and for all, to see an MMO company come out
with some solid brass and lay down the law. MMOs are delving so deeply
in to the base depravity of human nature now (just visit Barrens in
WoW, any public zone in Guild Wars) that I think the only thing that's
going to make HJ stand out as different from the rest is with strict
and enforced rules.
Well, it'd be nice anyways.
That's my rant for the month, hereby titled: "Prepubescents and prepubescent adults who
value the size of their e-peens over the overall health of an MMO
should die in a flaming ****ing Hell."
"(The) Iraqi people owe the American people a huge debt of gratitude." - George W Bush.
Oh. My. God.
Amathe --
What an excellent, well-thought-out post. I have made similar arguments in my ramblings and my blog at the Roleplay Cafe, which is a site I started in part to be able to post my thoughts on RPGs without being censored by forum admins (at the time, the SWG admins were locking and deleting threads of anyone who raised serious gameplay issues with them).
One of the arguments I made in "where do we go from here?" was similar:
When UO first came onto the scene, the primary players and audience
were not fast-action arcade gamers but more deliberative roleplayers.
As the games became faster and more action-intensive, more and more
arcade gamers have been attracted to these games, and fewer roleplayers
have remained. As a result, it's questionable whether the current
"market" for these "MMOs" would provide enough of a player base to
support a true roleplay-oriented game. The roleplayers would be
(understandably) skeptical after having been burned repeatedly. The
arcade gamers would likely try it, complain, and either leave (if their
complaints were not heard) or force the game to transform from a
roleplaying game into an arcade game (as they did with SWG). Therefore
it isn't clear whether such a game would retain a sufficient subscriber
base to be marketable.
That is a similar concern to what you raised here, and I think it is a valid one. The consumer population is so console-FPS-arcade based now, that it's hard to picture an old-school "roleplay" audience forming for one of these games. And I think even if the devs have wills of iron, there wiill be a massive tumult of hate and anger from the arcade-based audience, who insist that all games be designed with twitch-click action to satisfy their ADD needs.
I keep waiting and hoping an MMO will come out that once again is a true roleplaying game, and for the most part I like what I'm seeing/hearing from HJ and its team. Only time will tell, I suppose.
I think that the insistence on making MMORPGs fast-action twitch games rather than true roleplaying games (which are slower and more deliberative by nature) has pushed a lot of roleplayers away from MMORPGs entirely. I have friends who started out MUSHing and MUDding, got into the early versions of MMORPGs, and now are... back to MUSHes because "nobody RPs in an MMO anyway." I mean think of it... they're going back to a 1980s style text-only medium from all the bells and whistles because MMOs are really not RPGs at all anymore -- they're fancy arcade games. I think this means there is a large, untapped audience of roleplayers out there who would play a true MMORPG, if such a thing existed... and just play none right now, because they're all MMOs not MMORPGs.
If nothing else, it will be interesting to see how this plays out.
C
Amathe, I hate to be a me-too'er, but... yes. Well said, and my experience and observation of players tallies to six decimal places with your description.
In fact, some years back I started thinking about this kind of player as like a plague of locusts: they swarm in, devour all content as rapidly as possible, buzz around angrily when it's all gone, then swarm off to the Next Big Thing that launches.
The thing that puzzles me most is why any developer would consciously design a game to service this playstyle. If your goal is to create a persistent game world, why spend crucial time/money developing features that cater only to players who won't persist?
The good news is that Simutronics seems to recognize this, and be shooting for a happy medium between conventional fantasy combat game (marketing to current gamers) and RP community (marketing to Simu's MUD players and underserved RPers). I've grumbled elsewhere about the decision to go with a class system, that classes are all focused on combat, and the use of the antique tank/nuker/healer+aggro model, all of which are locust-bait... but HJ still seems to be putting a different spin on these things, and I appreciate that.
But that's also cause for a little concern. (Not a lot, just a little.) Sometimes it seems as though critical questions are answered with, "We've-been-making-multiplayer-games-for-twenty-years-so-just-trust-us." That tends to come up most in media interviews, so it may just be marketing copy. Even so, it sends a shiver down my spine because it sounds a little like "we have all the answers."
Graphical MMORPGs aren't MUDs. Giving Simu the benefit of the doubt (and hearing confirmations like yours, HJ-Sisca), I'm hopeful that HJ is being designed combine the best of both worlds. And I hope that turns out to be what current and potential online gamers have been waiting for.
But that "we've been doing this since 1986" comment is still going to bug me.
--Flatfingers
And I also agree with the person who said that enforcement on an RP server is key. I know from first-hand experience that non-RPers can and will come to RP servers and complain that they are being forced to RP and that the server is full of "RP-nazis". Drove me crazy in EQ2 when it first started. There were huge debates in /ooc about whether it should be expected of people to RP on an RP server. /facepalm
will disregard HJ's intended design and play HJ the same way they have
played every other game if possible.<<
When I first played Gemstone, I was a battle.net veteran. I found out in a very short period of time that battle.net culture did not belong in Gemstone, and if I wanted to continue playing Gemstone, despite my anger in response to my various... disciplinary actions... I had to shape up. So I did. I kept my OOC and bad language in whispers or instant messages with my buddies, and I truly believe my "hard lessons" in Gemstone made me a more mature individual in the gaming realm. If I hadn't done this, I would not longer be invited to play Gemstone. That was pretty clear.
Now, I know Gemstone is a niche market, and that HJ will draw in a more "diverse" crowd, but I do not expect Simutronics' level of service and seriousness of their policies to wane. Of course we will always attempt to cater to the play-styles and desires of all types of players, but I do not expect it will come at the cost of the overall intent and design goals of the game. I suppose what I'm trying to say is, there will be an army--um team--of like-minded GMs and GHs around on HJ at any given time. I'm sure most of us will play as much as we can, and work on it as much as we can. Obviously, there's a more personal attachment the "authority" has with the game world and environment. This game is being built by passionate people who take what they're doing seriously. Most of us aren't being paid, so really, that's all we have.
That right there makes us a lot different than just about every MMO out there, doesn't it?
With that in mind, the types of players you mention may find after some time they simply do not fit in with HJ. That's a shame, and as much as I don't want that to be the case, it would be more a shame to allow our vision and design goals go to shambles simply for business reasons. I am a firm believer in that if you go too far to please a bad customer, you'll just exchange him for a good one.
While I understand the concern one has to be careful not to categorize players too broadly in the one category of "We want you out!".
I agree that certain kind of player behavior are bad for a game and one has to keep that in mind but I don't hope HJ community will not be a two class community with the people coming from MUDs and the ones coming from MMORPG.
Its one of thing I dislike the most in Vanguard (another games that I am following) where every non-Pre-Luclin EQ player (and much more I don't want to go deeper with) is categorized as unwanted and responsible for every gamedesign fault that is not to the liking of the hardcore crowd.
(Of course this goes to both sides, some people try to encourage flaming and insulting for whatever reason)
I am not saying that HJ has this shift (yet) but it all started with things like that.
In general I would say not eschew new blood/ideas generally as some good things might come out of it, especially seeing the direction that HJ seems to try the merging of MUD and MMORPG to something new and hopefully fun for people from both sides at the same time
Not to be redundant, but this was a great post. Im a veteran of Gemstone, and it was the RP that drew me into the genre of online gaming. Sure there were people who would grind their butts off to level fast, BUT they still RP'd because ooc talk was not only looked down on by its player base, but RP was enforced.
I can still recall NPCs coming into a room and forcibly removing ooc'rs, the offender would literally be drug off and in a lot of cases never heard from again. Gemstone was a game of RP first and foremost, and frankly i havent felt at home in an online game since I quit playing it. Hell even talking about it here makes me feel kinda nostalig and homesick.
But I agree that the new gen of MMO'rs arent into RP, (my sincere apologies for the broad generalization) and it makes me kinda sad that MMOs will never feel like a whole different world to me, they just feel like like someone said, a multi player console game.
I do have faith in Simu, and I look forward to HJ, and really I hope that its possible for simu to open a world of imagination and RP value that we have long since lost.
After reading this post it got me thinking about something that kind of has me concerned.
I know Hero’s Journey has what they call the Hero’s Journey’s Hero Council. This is a group of gaming community leaders that act as representatives of the player communities to express our desires, thoughts and ideas about the game design of Hero’s Journey. This has me troubled for the following reasons. If the Hero Council is made up of guild leaders of the players that will try and force their notion of what a MMO should be such as EQ, Shadowbane, or WoW. I truly hope that Simu is also listening to us here more specifically what we are saying in this thread. I am a little comforted in the fact that all the posts I have read from the future GM’s of Hero’s Journey seem to be in line and agree with what we are saying and what we are looking for in HJ as a MMO.
I'm stuck...
I've been following HJ for an awful long time, and I've been reading these boards and the boards at play.net/hj daily for months. Don't let my low post count fool you--I don't like to post, but I do like to read and understand what's happening. I am a mature, fun-loving adult. I like to think I add to any community I become a part of.
As I said, however, I'm stuck. I don't like RP'ing in the traditional sense. I never have, and I never will. I do, however, respect everyone that does and do my utmost to make sure my play style doesn't interfere with others. I like to experience all the content a game has to offer. I like to maximize my character. I like to be that "wow, did he really just do that all by himself" guy.
Again, I don't like traditional RP'ing. I do, however become my character in my own way. I like my online characters to be an extension of me. I like them to joke about my life, just like I joke about my life. They ARE me...why not have the same problems I have? Now, some of you might say...well, that's RP'ing. My experience, however, has been that the traditional "hail, and well met" crowd doesn't like my "kind' of RP'ing. So I don't interfere with their gaming, and I happily find others to adventure with. I have fun, they have fun, and we exist in peace. But what if not joining the "hail, and well met" crowd means I can't succeed in HJ? What if being me and playing as me isn't wanted?
My fear is simple--HJ looks amazing, I've been following it forever, and I can't wait to play it. But I DO NOT--UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES--look forward to being forced into a "hail, and well met good sir" style of playing.
I laugh, I joke, I make references to pop culture...that's who I am, and as my online characters are a personification of me, that's who they are...
Will this type of gaming be frowned upon in HJ?
Please, don't misunderstand. I never try to interfere with anyone's gaming, and I'm not that 13 year-old community member so common and so unpoplular in games like WoW. I'm an adult, with a family and a career, that happens to love online gaming. I left WoW because I couldn't handle the 13 year-old miscreants any longer. I don't, however, want to feel ostracized for being myself...and I don't want my gameplay to be hindered by overzealous GMs that are upset because I don't drop my cloak over the puddle for the fair maiden walking by that happens to be a 22 year-old man in real life playing the part of a damsel-in-distress or because I neglected to specify that "Derek the Dashing" always greets players with a hearty "Good Day! This morning is a FINE morning for adventuring...as are ALL mornings!" It's not me, and it never will be...
Here's hoping HJ is all we hope it will be--and all it seems to be...and that all players that add to the community--even if in their own way--will be welcomed.
FYI--I've made this a main topic as well as this issue is very important to me...I'm not trying to spam.
I wouldnt worry about it. Now, if you go to a dedicated RP server, that might be a problem, but I'm almost certain that not all servers with be dedicated RP servers. I'm sure the majority will be Non RP servers, where you are not going to be hunted by the "RP Nazis", whom are just as bad as powergamers IMO. I don't RP much either, but I'm of the kind of character that you are, I'm more into playing my character to the best of my ability, and want my ability to be rewarded. He becomes a extention of me as well, and I tend to write background stories and stuff, but I'm not going to talk like I'm auditioning for a Shakespere play.
Pick a Non RP server, and things will be fine.
I think if Simutronics asked themselves the question you stated this game wouldn't be released til 2008 with half of the features. Every system has an exploit, and people will find a way expose it. ALWAYS. Am I one? Sure, you could say I always want a one up on everyone else, but isn't that what makes games great? I ask this, the entire game is constantly a competative game. Whether you put that focus against the game, or against another person. I'm sure you'll always want that higher level, and you'll always want to find the super-rare Wyr. You're pitting yourself in competition, so if you want to remove the exploits so people can level/grind faster then you'll remove the competition as well.
Also, I belive certain servers will have less of this then others. I'm sure whatever server I play on everyone will be racing to max level, with the best Wyr, with the best skills, with whatever else Simutronics offers. Why you ask? Because I will be playing on a PvP server with hardly any RP in it. I'm sure the Role-Playing servers on the other hand would have a more mature gaming network, and wouldn't have the problem I would pose.
The weeding out process begins once the game is released.
I hope what I said made sense too =[
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
I guess I worded what I said wrong. Difficult for you to understand to say. Where I was going was that everyone will use exploits to their advantage. Does an exploit truely mean taking advantage of something that isn't patched, or is faulty, and not supposed to be their? No. An exploit could be in the regards of a mob who is giving slightly higher exp gain then other mobs at the same level. Is that an exploit, yes. Thats where I was coming from on that.
I find it funny that you say you wont visit Hero's Hall anymore. I really wish you would reconsider that after what I just said, but if not. That is fine. I don't hack, or cheat. I never have, not even in FPS. However, if their is a 'system' in the game that I can use to my advantage. I will.
I forgot to bring out what you said about 'encouraging everyone to be the best'. Is it wrong to not encourage people to not be the best? Is mediocraity a way of society these days. I guess it is in your eyes. I don't belive I even hinted that people should do everything in their power to be the best. I just said people will.
You and I both know that "exploit" is a gaming term and in that context it does not mean simply using tactics or choosing one mob over another because one has more desirable xp or loot. It means using a cheat that is made possible by a programming error or oversight.
If you are sincere in your clarification that you don't do this and are not encouraging others to do so, rather than just taking your hand hurridly out of the cookie jar, than fine, I apologize and retract my statement.
So far as being the "best", we could have a lengthy debate about that. I respect people's accomplishments, virtual in this setting though they may be, when they are honestly obtained but not otherwise. But Frosty, when you finish high school and have two college degrees and a professional license you can tell me how mediocrity is a way of life for me.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
You and I both know that "exploit" is a gaming term and in that context it does not mean simply using tactics or choosing one mob over another because one has more desirable xp or loot. It means using a cheat that is made possible by a programming error or oversight.
If you are sincere in your clarification that you don't do this and are not encouraging others to do so, rather than just taking your hand hurridly out of the cookie jar, than fine, I apologize and retract my statement.
So far as being the "best", we could have a lengthy debate about that. I respect people's accomplishments, virtual in this setting though they may be, when they are honestly obtained but not otherwise. But Frosty, when you finish high school and have two college degrees and a professional license you can tell me how mediocrity is a way of life for me.
I honestly can't even think of a MMORPG that I have played where you were able to 'exploit' in the game. The example I can come up with off the top of my head was farming in Guild Wars. Some mobs dropped insanely high drops, while others dropped low. So you farmed the higher dropped items.
As for however mediocrity. Give me 3 years, and I'll be exactly where you are at except mine will be at the age of 22.
Of course a person that stumbles upon it, repeats it to ensure it is reproduceable then /bugs it, shouldn't be banned for exploiting. Reproducing it 50+ times, should expect to have their account/personal name banned from the game.
~ Jaraeth
im certainly not condoning anyone's actions. i was going to state the way i read frosty's statement. it made me think of hl2:dm's way of bunny hoping or nade cooking with the g-gun. they were not things actually intended to be used in the game. you can think of those 'features' as an exploit, as the dev's did not purposfully put them there. but anyone who plays that game will use them. [ well, anyone with enough sense to ]
the dev's know about it, there has not been any official statement about their stance on it, and some players think its cheating. though very few. the point is, if the general consensus is that its ok, the dev's know and are not actively pursuing a fix, is it still wrong to use? maybe it isn't a way to gain more exp, or coin, or items. but what if its a way to get to another area quicker by falling off a cliff without dying or something. maybe that wasn't the intention, but is that cheating or exploiting?
in dr i used to 'exploit' the guild system by never joining a guild. thus i got to hang out with friends in the "soon to be upstanding citizen's" guild in haven with crow and swan all the time. if i had joined some other guild, they wouldn't have let me in. id hang with kalag in crossing too. the game thought i was there to join, but really, i was just visiting friends. on another note, my mute halfling commoner was the roxor. i got all the way up to hunting rock guardians by myself before i finally got to tied up with other things and had to quit.