ZeniMax Workers United Votes to Unionize, With Microsoft Formally Recognizing Its First Union | MMOR

System · January 2023

ZeniMax Workers United Votes to Unionize, With Microsoft Formally Recognizing Its First Union | MMORPG.com

Representing about 300 QA workers across ZeniMax Studios, ZeniMax Workers United has officially voted to unionize under the CWA. Microsoft has formally recognized this, its very first union.

Read the full story here

OG_Solareus · January 2023

and the end is nigh. My sub is running out and I will never be returning.

lahnmir · January 2023

Another Union, those poor companies, when will their endless suffering stop, I hope they’ll survive. Sincerely, one of the many, many, countries in the world where unions have not been ruined by turning them into a political tool or are a ridiculous synonym for, scary, Socialism.

/Cheers,
Lahnmir

Sovrath · January 2023

OG_Solareus said:

and the end is nigh. My sub is running out and I will never be returning.

Shouldn't you just wait to see if the game actually suffers?

OG_Solareus · January 2023

will also pointout,all governments now has unrestrained access to all microsoft platforms without a warrant or NSA type covertness..

OG_Solareus · January 2023

Sovrath said:

OG_Solareus said:

and the end is nigh. My sub is running out and I will never be returning.

Shouldn't you just wait to see if the game actually suffers?

game is already suffering. Now you are going increase peoples pay ? plus pay for Union dues? IS there a magical pot of gold somewhere ? All that cost get [placed on the end user.

GameByNight · January 2023

OG_Solareus said:

Sovrath said:

OG_Solareus said:

and the end is nigh. My sub is running out and I will never be returning.

Shouldn't you just wait to see if the game actually suffers?

game is already suffering. Now you are going increase peoples pay ? plus pay for Union dues? IS there a magical pot of gold somewhere ? All that cost get [placed on the end user.

That may be the case, but I say wait and see. If they do increase, the per box cost would be what, $5-10 more? My bigger fear is that they'll simply find a way to fire all of these people. Their negotiators need to bargain for rightful termination clauses so people can't just be fired on a whim.

I work in a union and though, yes, paying dues sucks, it is absolutely worth it. The benefits and protections far outweigh the negatives. The voice of the many is more powerful than the voice of the individual. I wish these people well.

The other thing to remember is that if there wasn't a need for a union, they probably wouldn't have felt the need to form one, risking their own jobs in the process. The gaming industry is incredibly exploitative and has been that way for years. Widespread unionization may well increase the cost of games, but if that means the people behind them don't have to suffer through churn and burn development cycles, ridiculous crunch, and have to uproot their entire lives to move across the country for project after project, I'm for it. There are more important things than small increases to the cost of games. The wellbeing of the people making these games are foremost among them.

MMOgamerdad666 · January 2023

Honest question, Why would people who have couches, TV's, pool tables, cafeterias, Video game consoles, free stuff at their job want to unionize?

From a guy who runs a Fineblanking press all day.

Kyleran · January 2023

MMOgamerdad666 said:

Honest question, Why would people who have couches, TV's, pool tables, cafeterias, Video game consoles, free stuff at their job want to unionize?

From a guy who runs a Fineblanking press all day.

You probably make more money than 3 of these QA people combined.

Aeander · January 2023

The publishers ultimately brought this on themselves by mistreating their employees. Play shitty games, win shitty prizes.

[Deleted User] · January 2023

The user and all related content has been deleted.

Herithius · January 2023

My sentiment is that companies are not built on the back of the CEO or the shareholders. Rather, it's the hundreds/thousands of employees that maintain & build upon it's successes.

If a company experiences a tremendous windfall I have no problem with that being shared with the employees. If Microsoft has 67 billion in funds to buy up Blizzard then surely they can pay good wages to their employees.

OG_Solareus · January 2023

Well good luck to them, but not with my money.

LePetitSoldat · January 2023

OG_Solareus said:

Well good luck to them, but not with my money.

A top-notch answer. I wonder how democracies fail with debates at such high levels.

Celcius · January 2023

Very happy for them, hopefully more of the industry continues this trend. Game developers are some of the most poorly treated workers in tech despite it being a job that a lot of people are passionate about. These big studios (see: Blizzard) take advantage of that.

[Deleted User] · January 2023

The user and all related content has been deleted.

Scot · January 2023

It is the payment of dues to one party that I primality object to, which for most union members here is mandatory. Also having had experience of many union officials in my time I was not impressed, it seems to me that the longer a union exists the more it becomes a beast only interested in ensuring its own continued existence and the privileges of union delegates.

This is a rather political topic and as we are supposed to avoid politics I will leave this as my final political post in this thread.

Iselin · January 2023

Scot said:

It is the payment of dues to one party that I primality object to, which for most union members here is mandatory. Also having had experience of many union officials in my time I was not impressed, it seems to me that the longer a union exists the more it becomes a beast only interested in ensuring its own continued existence and the privileges of union delegates.

This is a rather political topic and as we are supposed to avoid politics I will leave this as my final political post in this thread.

Then you must also object to paying taxes and having the politicians you elect do their own thing with those taxes instead of representing your one-of individual list of priorities.

I mean if you're going to object to paying for people doing things that are not in your best interest with the money you give them maybe you should start there and then move on to organized religions and monarchies after that.

But no, unions are the sleazy suspects you must bash. LMAO.

OG_Solareus · January 2023

MadLovin said:

OG_Solareus said:

Well good luck to them, but not with my money.

A top-notch answer. I wonder how democracies fail with debates at such high levels.

Thanks for attacking my intellect. We can't have a real debate here because political discussions are prohibited. But you would already know that since you been a mmorpg.com member since 2006... o wait....

mklinic · January 2023

I don't have any issue with workers unionizing and doubt this will have a noticeable impact on players/pricing.

With that said, QA seems like an easily outsourced role so this seems, potentially, to fall into the "win the battle, lose the war" category.

Maybe I'm just being skeptical though. The article, and linked press release, did seem to paint MS as favorable, or at least not hostile, toward unionization efforts. Maybe this will end up to be a net positive for all involved.

McSleaz · January 2023

Iselin said:

Scot said:

It is the payment of dues to one party that I primality object to, which for most union members here is mandatory. Also having had experience of many union officials in my time I was not impressed, it seems to me that the longer a union exists the more it becomes a beast only interested in ensuring its own continued existence and the privileges of union delegates.

This is a rather political topic and as we are supposed to avoid politics I will leave this as my final political post in this thread.

Then you must also object to paying taxes and having the politicians you elect do their own thing with those taxes instead of representing your one-of individual list of priorities.

I mean if you're going to object to paying for people doing things that are not in your best interest with the money you give them maybe you should start there and then move on to organized religions and monarchies after that.

But no, unions are the sleazy suspects you must bash. LMAO.

This thread IS about unions, NOT politics and taxes. Nice attempted derail.

Iselin · January 2023

McSleaz said:

Iselin said:

Scot said:

It is the payment of dues to one party that I primality object to, which for most union members here is mandatory. Also having had experience of many union officials in my time I was not impressed, it seems to me that the longer a union exists the more it becomes a beast only interested in ensuring its own continued existence and the privileges of union delegates.

This is a rather political topic and as we are supposed to avoid politics I will leave this as my final political post in this thread.

Then you must also object to paying taxes and having the politicians you elect do their own thing with those taxes instead of representing your one-of individual list of priorities.

I mean if you're going to object to paying for people doing things that are not in your best interest with the money you give them maybe you should start there and then move on to organized religions and monarchies after that.

But no, unions are the sleazy suspects you must bash. LMAO.

This thread IS about unions, NOT politics and taxes. Nice attempted derail.

Actually, it isn't about unions. It's about one single solitary group of workers forming a union and their single solitary employer recognizing them.

Derailing is when the resident whack jobs decide to use it as a platform to say profoundly dumb shit about unions, plural.

Kyleran · January 2023

mklinic said:

I don't have any issue with workers unionizing and doubt this will have a noticeable impact on players/pricing.

With that said, QA seems like an easily outsourced role so this seems, potentially, to fall into the "win the battle, lose the war" category.

Maybe I'm just being skeptical though. The article, and linked press release, did seem to paint MS as favorable, or at least not hostile, toward unionization efforts. Maybe this will end up to be a net positive for all involved.

Microsoft is trying to look like good guys right now in order to get regulatory approval of their acquisition of Activision Blizzard.

Nanfoodle · January 2023

Fact, game developers deserve better treatment and pay. There should be a a share of wealth from upper management that is over paid. 2nd fact, there will not be a better distribution of wealth. This will just be passed on to the consumer. You won't find anything fair.

Andemnon · January 2023

Money, makes the world go round and it appears causes people to compare their lives to their neighbours. Unionisation is a dirty word lately and i severely doubt any real good will come of it, if employees are unhappy with their pay, then vote with your feet, work for somebody else, trying to force employers to increase their wages usually ends up with fewer employees, the Turkeys it seems, are voting for Christmas, well good luck with that! People who are worth more, tend to earn more as employers recognise their talent and do not want to lose them, same with those with mediocre talents, they are easily replaceable, worse, with the increase in diversity hires with no real talent only tick boxes, represent a drag on a companies resources. Worth remembering that while actual skilled talents are always in demand, there is an absolute glut of people in the employment market with skills that are 'barely' good enough. Life is not fair, what people 'deserve' is irrelevant, what matters is what people are actually worth, and what they are worth is entirely dependent on how good they are at their job and how much work they are willing to put into it, nothing else.

Slapshot1188 · January 2023

It’s all cost/benefit for the company.

These workers just increased their cost. Not just money but in pain they cause the company.

When that pain exceeds their benefits to the company they will be cut/outsourced/made redundant.

We aren’t talking Windows Project Leaders here. We are talking about game testers. A job that quite literally a million college kids would sign up for.

They seem to make around $76k a year https://www.glassdoor.com/Salary/ZeniMax-Media-QA-Tester-Salaries-E134492_D_KO14,23.htm

Will be interesting to see what happens once the Activision deal goes through or if this was already part of a back room political deal to insure approval.

My guess is that they realize (they have all along) that having redundant game testers across multiple business units is a prime opportunity for centralized consolidation. Let’s also face it…Zenimax is not exactly known for releasing well polished and tested games right? And if most fans had to pick one area of Zenimax games to improve it would likely be to release less buggy games. Think this Union is going to result in less buggy releases? I somehow doubt it.

Time will tell though!

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ZeniMax Workers United Votes to Unionize, With Microsoft Formally Recognizing Its First Union | MMOR

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Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

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ZeniMax Workers United Votes to Unionize, With Microsoft Formally Recognizing Its First Union | MMOR

Comments

Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV