I enjoyed what i tried of it so far. Their payment model doesn't really bother me as long as they keep MTX and battle pass P2W free. If it's all purely cosmetic I'm cool with that. I view D4 as more of an MMO, World of Diablo if you will, than straight ARPG. So I just view their battle pass as their version of a subscription. I have D2R, Grim Dawn, and Last Epoch for my tradional ARPG's if I want and one of them is brand new. So I'll be fine if D4 becomes my psuedo MMORPG subscription. I enjoyed aspects of Lost Ark, but the P2W was atrocious, so as long as D4 keeps away from that I'll be happy and probably enjoy this. It felt better than that abomination D3.
I enjoyed what i tried of it so far. Their payment model doesn't really bother me as long as they keep MTX and battle pass P2W free. If it's all purely cosmetic I'm cool with that. I view D4 as more of an MMO, World of Diablo if you will, than straight ARPG. So I just view their battle pass as their version of a subscription. I have D2R, Grim Dawn, and Last Epoch for my tradional ARPG's if I want and one of them is brand new. So I'll be fine if D4 becomes my psuedo MMORPG subscription. I enjoyed aspects of Lost Ark, but the P2W was atrocious, so as long as D4 keeps away from that I'll be happy and probably enjoy this. It felt better than that abomination D3.
I was all for the grim atmosphere but after playing every Beta weekend, I think I will miss the color and flash in D3.
They just lied pretty big about Overwatch, Immortal rakes in millions, they will change it to be more like Immortal in no time, wait and see. They are holding off now so people don't refund and avoid purchasing, but once the playerbase has settled in a few months, the changes will come
I enjoyed what i tried of it so far. Their payment model doesn't really bother me as long as they keep MTX and battle pass P2W free. If it's all purely cosmetic I'm cool with that. I view D4 as more of an MMO, World of Diablo if you will, than straight ARPG. So I just view their battle pass as their version of a subscription. I have D2R, Grim Dawn, and Last Epoch for my tradional ARPG's if I want and one of them is brand new. So I'll be fine if D4 becomes my psuedo MMORPG subscription. I enjoyed aspects of Lost Ark, but the P2W was atrocious, so as long as D4 keeps away from that I'll be happy and probably enjoy this. It felt better than that abomination D3.
I was all for the grim atmosphere but after playing every Beta weekend, I think I will miss the color and flash in D3.
They just lied pretty big about Overwatch, Immortal rakes in millions, they will change it to be more like Immortal in no time, wait and see. They are holding off now so people don't refund and avoid purchasing, but once the playerbase has settled in a few months, the changes will come
I don't think so. I think after the blowback they got with their flippant "don't you all have phones" comment, they know there's two distinct markets here: the mobile Immortal market, and the PC/Console D4 market. If they try turn D4 into Immortal's P2W model, players will leave in droves and then there will be no one to sell battlepasses to. The mobile market tolerates Immortal because so many other mobile titles follow the same monetization model. It's slimy but also very very common. To a mobile player, it's just yet another in a long list of P2W F2P titles. PC players don't put up with that, at least not in the west, and since that's where Blizzard's home base is, I don't think they're stupid enough to kill the golden goose. There's just too many other good ARPG's available on PC. The market is too competitive, and after the laundry list of shit shows that have gone down in the last 2 years with Blizzard, they need a win.
Seems pretty definitive to me leaving themselves zero wriggle room.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
It's a nice sentiment, but as has been stated before. Given the rest of their business reputation and the direction franchise has been taken with similar sentiments shared on the last title, not going to exactly take them at their word until it's seen in action.
Point of example made in previous thread being the likes of dungeon keys and sigils, as those aren't themselves "power".
I'd certainly be happy to be surprised and see them being honest, but that's far removed from their track record as of last few years.
I enjoyed what i tried of it so far. Their payment model doesn't really bother me as long as they keep MTX and battle pass P2W free. If it's all purely cosmetic I'm cool with that. I view D4 as more of an MMO, World of Diablo if you will, than straight ARPG. So I just view their battle pass as their version of a subscription. I have D2R, Grim Dawn, and Last Epoch for my tradional ARPG's if I want and one of them is brand new. So I'll be fine if D4 becomes my psuedo MMORPG subscription. I enjoyed aspects of Lost Ark, but the P2W was atrocious, so as long as D4 keeps away from that I'll be happy and probably enjoy this. It felt better than that abomination D3.
I was all for the grim atmosphere but after playing every Beta weekend, I think I will miss the color and flash in D3.
They just lied pretty big about Overwatch, Immortal rakes in millions, they will change it to be more like Immortal in no time, wait and see. They are holding off now so people don't refund and avoid purchasing, but once the playerbase has settled in a few months, the changes will come
I don't think so. I think after the blowback they got with their flippant "don't you all have phones" comment, they know there's two distinct markets here: the mobile Immortal market, and the PC/Console D4 market. If they try turn D4 into Immortal's P2W model, players will leave in droves and then there will be no one to sell battlepasses to. The mobile market tolerates Immortal because so many other mobile titles follow the same monetization model. It's slimy but also very very common. To a mobile player, it's just yet another in a long list of P2W F2P titles. PC players don't put up with that, at least not in the west, and since that's where Blizzard's home base is, I don't think they're stupid enough to kill the golden goose. There's just too many other good ARPG's available on PC. The market is too competitive, and after the laundry list of shit shows that have gone down in the last 2 years with Blizzard, they need a win.
Blizzard doesn't exist anymore. All the old dogs are gone. It's all run by Activision leadership now. They can just as well call it ActiVision now, as that's what it is.
Remember, ActiVision was caught with their pants down after leaked papers some years ago, showed they were activily hiring Psychologists for the sole purpose in helping them creating the most addictive MTX mechanics possible, targeting addictive vulnerabilities within people.
Diablo Immortal is the clear result of that.
All big publishers ( EA, 2K, Activision, Ubisoft ) keep pushing the limits with MTX as far as they can these days.
Hence, why I mostly stopped playing any new games from them.
Thrust me. It won't be any different with Diablo 4! If they going to push cosmetic MTX in this game, it will mean only one thing....shitty looking loot galore in the game, forcing you to spend real money on good looking armor and weapon skins, after already dropping 80 bucks on the game itself! Yeah.... thanks, but no thanks.
If the game was F2P I could maybe stomach that a bit better, like Path of Exile has been doing for years with their business model. But paying 80 bucks for Diablo 4 and then heavily pushing (cosmetic) MTX on top of that. Activision can take a hike!
It's a shallow live service game with predatory game for consumerists who think less and spend more.
The graphics are cartoony like Diablo 3 and the story is also garbage like Diablo 3. They are only making this for money and preying upon people's nostalgia.
The game is going to be a mediocre trash that will get a few weeks of fame and then everyone will forget about it. Path of Exile captures the dark and creepy feel of Diablo 2 better than Diablo 3 and 4 combined. When Path of Exiles 2 releases, it will have much more interesting and enticing mechanics than Diablo 4 and it will be free, so even if it's also a live service game, at least you don't have to waste good money when the servers shut down one day.
Activisions are liars, scumbags and greedy swines, nobody who still has some sense should give them money or buy their trash recycled games. They don't even have any real developers left, all their games are made by outsourced studios of 20 year old interns in Southeast Asia whose first game in life was Angry Birds and they became pro at Minecraft and then Fortnite before they decided to chase a career as "game developers". That's why all new games, especially AAA from the last 5 years or so feel like a combination of Angry Birds, Candy Crush, Minecraft, Fortnite and Roblox all combined into one thing as dumbed-down as it is predatory.
The only hope for the dead gaming is indie developers and only some of them, because a lot of them also produce a lot of trash and store asset flips.
You're entitled to your opinion, but I enjoyed the beta a lot. If that hurts your butt in some way so be it.
It's a shallow live service game with predatory game for consumerists who think less and spend more.
The graphics are cartoony like Diablo 3 and the story is also garbage like Diablo 3. They are only making this for money and preying upon people's nostalgia.
The game is going to be a mediocre trash that will get a few weeks of fame and then everyone will forget about it. Path of Exile captures the dark and creepy feel of Diablo 2 better than Diablo 3 and 4 combined. When Path of Exiles 2 releases, it will have much more interesting and enticing mechanics than Diablo 4 and it will be free, so even if it's also a live service game, at least you don't have to waste good money when the servers shut down one day.
Activisions are liars, scumbags and greedy swines, nobody who still has some sense should give them money or buy their trash recycled games. They don't even have any real developers left, all their games are made by outsourced studios of 20 year old interns in Southeast Asia whose first game in life was Angry Birds and they became pro at Minecraft and then Fortnite before they decided to chase a career as "game developers". That's why all new games, especially AAA from the last 5 years or so feel like a combination of Angry Birds, Candy Crush, Minecraft, Fortnite and Roblox all combined into one thing as dumbed-down as it is predatory.
The only hope for the dead gaming is indie developers and only some of them, because a lot of them also produce a lot of trash and store asset flips.
Graphics look nothing like D3. I mean seriously I don't think you've so much as looked at D4. You're like one of these guys that say the graphics of some game looks like the 1980's without actually taking the 30 seconds it takes to Google what a game from that era actually looked like. I'd do a side by side of D3 and D4, but you can do that on your own. Do some research before you spout random, made up bullshit.
I really hate PoE. PoE 2 is just going to double down on more of the same. As to D4 being a flash in the pan game, do you mean like D3 which is still live to this day? That kind of flash in the pan?
Finally we get to the core of your actual hang up with D4: you hate Activision. That's fine. If you want to boycott D4 for your laundry list of grievances against Activision that's your prerogative. Just be honest about it and save us all the made up nonsense like D4 looks like D3 when anyone with eyes can see that's simply not the case. Funny how you call out Activision for lying in the same post you try to convince other people not to buy their game by... lying.
It's a nice sentiment, but as has been stated before. Given the rest of their business reputation and the direction franchise has been taken with similar sentiments shared on the last title, not going to exactly take them at their word until it's seen in action.
Point of example made in previous thread being the likes of dungeon keys and sigils, as those aren't themselves "power".
I'd certainly be happy to be surprised and see them being honest, but that's far removed from their track record as of last few years.
You can consider what was said about Diablo Immortal not selling gear and then weaseling out by saying gems are not gear to be similar to what is being said here about not selling power, but using the much more general "power" keyword is IMO, a public statement that is orders of magnitude more meaningful.
I don't blame you or anyone for being suspicious given their recent track record but what I'm hearing from them and the frequency and forcefulness of its expression gives me some comfort in that this would be infinitely harder for them to weasel out of than what Wyatt Cheng did with his gear and gems comment.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Seems pretty definitive to me leaving themselves zero wriggle room.
Followed, after some period of time, by "We here at [company] are constantly evaluating whether [product] is competitive and fun. We've listened to the players and will now be including [some item of minor power]"
Some time later: "[Previous statement +1]"
rinse hands, repeat.
Pessimistic I know. I'm just a product of my conditioning. :P
-mklinic
"Do something right, no one remembers. Do something wrong, no one forgets" -from No One Remembers by In Strict Confidence
On another note this sounds like a great community lmao. Toxic for the sake of being toxic is the norm in bliz games. Exclusive things have been around forever, but it seems kind of like they wanted to create some form of drama from the get go and division in the community. Either way most likely something better will come along to replace it but still xD
On another note this sounds like a great community lmao. Toxic for the sake of being toxic is the norm in bliz games. Exclusive things have been around forever, but it seems kind of like they wanted to create some form of drama from the get go and division in the community. Either way most likely something better will come along to replace it but still xD
The whole Ashava Trophy Club (ATC) thing on Reddit started as a self-deprecating joke poking fun at those who brag about doing something where they likely got carried since the Ashava kill that gave you that trophy was a 9-12 player thing and someone could do almost nothing but die over and over again but if the group got the kill despite your own uselessness, you get the trophy. Someone even started an ATC subreddit and the posts there are funny. No one in their right mind is taking that shit seriously.
I read D4 Reddit daily and I have never even seen the "bare mare" term used once there. I'm not doubting that the writer of the article has seen it but he totally misses that it's just some people having some fun joking around and not "gatekeeping" as he calls it.
Humor and reading comprehension are in short supply these days when it's so much easier to fake outrage for sensational headlines and clicks.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
I'm looking forward to launch and enjoyed the server stress test. If they go "full stupid" with monetization then my time there will be shorter lived. My expectation is that they will push gray areas, selling boosters and such, but they won't gate content like mobile. I'm okay with that.
At this point in live service gaming, I don't even care if they sell "pay to win" or advantage items, as long as they don't gate content/progression behind a store and loot crates. There has been so much hand waving and virtue signalling by this site and gaming media, and the gamers in general, that we've made the bed we're lying in. So, whatever about that.
My biggest concern with D4 isn't monetization, it's that it feels like an MMO and not an ARPG to me. My interest in playing MMOs is really low, while I'm still looking for a new ARPG that fits the bill.
The color palette isn't the same for sure, but the graphic style and quality is very similar. Engine rendering in D4 is nearly flawless, just like D3. Graphically D4 feels like a solid generational evolution from D3. The world and textures feel more detailed with excellent lighting. The character models and animations are improved. In short it is a lot like D3 (in all the best ways) only it feels like a generational upgrade, as it should.
I object to the premise that D3 is "cartoony" or the graphics or rendering were bad and that D4 needs to be defended against such a low effort accusation. People who claim such are trolling for the lulz, much like those who claim "Blizzard has no talent left".
I'm not buying D4, at least not until they release a Paladin type of class to play. By then, some time will have passed to show whether or not they've developed a game with design decisions based on providing fun or whether their focus is on designing content in a way that makes you want to spend money on the cash shop.
My trust in Blizzard is low based on how they've managed their IPs, their cash shop focused and MAU based design decisions, and their disrespect for the demographic they used to serve.
As a fan of their previous Diablo games, especially 1 and 2, I'm just not that interested in this game based on their design decisions so far. It feels bad being a part of a demographic that got tossed to the trash in favor of a demographic that wants online all the time, with other people running around, and who are okay with cash shops.
I enjoyed what i tried of it so far. Their payment model doesn't really bother me as long as they keep MTX and battle pass P2W free. If it's all purely cosmetic I'm cool with that. I view D4 as more of an MMO, World of Diablo if you will, than straight ARPG. So I just view their battle pass as their version of a subscription. I have D2R, Grim Dawn, and Last Epoch for my tradional ARPG's if I want and one of them is brand new. So I'll be fine if D4 becomes my psuedo MMORPG subscription. I enjoyed aspects of Lost Ark, but the P2W was atrocious, so as long as D4 keeps away from that I'll be happy and probably enjoy this. It felt better than that abomination D3.
It starts with a 20-30 dollar pay to win to get in the game early. I am guessing the mtx is going to get worse as it goes. The leveling system for the experience rewards has come in to question as well. I am not hopeful.
I enjoyed what i tried of it so far. Their payment model doesn't really bother me as long as they keep MTX and battle pass P2W free. If it's all purely cosmetic I'm cool with that. I view D4 as more of an MMO, World of Diablo if you will, than straight ARPG. So I just view their battle pass as their version of a subscription. I have D2R, Grim Dawn, and Last Epoch for my tradional ARPG's if I want and one of them is brand new. So I'll be fine if D4 becomes my psuedo MMORPG subscription. I enjoyed aspects of Lost Ark, but the P2W was atrocious, so as long as D4 keeps away from that I'll be happy and probably enjoy this. It felt better than that abomination D3.
I was all for the grim atmosphere but after playing every Beta weekend, I think I will miss the color and flash in D3.
They just lied pretty big about Overwatch, Immortal rakes in millions, they will change it to be more like Immortal in no time, wait and see. They are holding off now so people don't refund and avoid purchasing, but once the playerbase has settled in a few months, the changes will come
That seems to be the general consensus that i have seen; and it's not even abnormal of a business model when we look at what they did for the diablo 3 launch; which had a mxt marketplace right out of the gate- which was eventually removed; but the game suffered some terrible gold exploits and ....other stuff.
Fishing on Gilgamesh since 2013 Fishing on Bronzebeard since 2005 Fishing in RL since 1992 Born with a fishing rod in my hand in 1979
Comments
I was all for the grim atmosphere but after playing every Beta weekend, I think I will miss the color and flash in D3.
They just lied pretty big about Overwatch, Immortal rakes in millions, they will change it to be more like Immortal in no time, wait and see. They are holding off now so people don't refund and avoid purchasing, but once the playerbase has settled in a few months, the changes will come
I don't think so. I think after the blowback they got with their flippant "don't you all have phones" comment, they know there's two distinct markets here: the mobile Immortal market, and the PC/Console D4 market. If they try turn D4 into Immortal's P2W model, players will leave in droves and then there will be no one to sell battlepasses to. The mobile market tolerates Immortal because so many other mobile titles follow the same monetization model. It's slimy but also very very common. To a mobile player, it's just yet another in a long list of P2W F2P titles. PC players don't put up with that, at least not in the west, and since that's where Blizzard's home base is, I don't think they're stupid enough to kill the golden goose. There's just too many other good ARPG's available on PC. The market is too competitive, and after the laundry list of shit shows that have gone down in the last 2 years with Blizzard, they need a win.
Seems pretty definitive to me leaving themselves zero wriggle room.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Point of example made in previous thread being the likes of dungeon keys and sigils, as those aren't themselves "power".
I'd certainly be happy to be surprised and see them being honest, but that's far removed from their track record as of last few years.
Blizzard doesn't exist anymore. All the old dogs are gone. It's all run by Activision leadership now. They can just as well call it ActiVision now, as that's what it is.
Remember, ActiVision was caught with their pants down after leaked papers some years ago, showed they were activily hiring Psychologists for the sole purpose in helping them creating the most addictive MTX mechanics possible, targeting addictive vulnerabilities within people.
Diablo Immortal is the clear result of that.
All big publishers ( EA, 2K, Activision, Ubisoft ) keep pushing the limits with MTX as far as they can these days.
Hence, why I mostly stopped playing any new games from them.
Thrust me. It won't be any different with Diablo 4! If they going to push cosmetic MTX in this game, it will mean only one thing....shitty looking loot galore in the game, forcing you to spend real money on good looking armor and weapon skins, after already dropping 80 bucks on the game itself! Yeah.... thanks, but no thanks.
If the game was F2P I could maybe stomach that a bit better, like Path of Exile has been doing for years with their business model. But paying 80 bucks for Diablo 4 and then heavily pushing (cosmetic) MTX on top of that. Activision can take a hike!
You're entitled to your opinion, but I enjoyed the beta a lot. If that hurts your butt in some way so be it.
Graphics look nothing like D3. I mean seriously I don't think you've so much as looked at D4. You're like one of these guys that say the graphics of some game looks like the 1980's without actually taking the 30 seconds it takes to Google what a game from that era actually looked like. I'd do a side by side of D3 and D4, but you can do that on your own. Do some research before you spout random, made up bullshit.
I really hate PoE. PoE 2 is just going to double down on more of the same. As to D4 being a flash in the pan game, do you mean like D3 which is still live to this day? That kind of flash in the pan?
Finally we get to the core of your actual hang up with D4: you hate Activision. That's fine. If you want to boycott D4 for your laundry list of grievances against Activision that's your prerogative. Just be honest about it and save us all the made up nonsense like D4 looks like D3 when anyone with eyes can see that's simply not the case. Funny how you call out Activision for lying in the same post you try to convince other people not to buy their game by... lying.
I don't blame you or anyone for being suspicious given their recent track record but what I'm hearing from them and the frequency and forcefulness of its expression gives me some comfort in that this would be infinitely harder for them to weasel out of than what Wyatt Cheng did with his gear and gems comment.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Some time later: "[Previous statement +1]"
rinse hands, repeat.
Pessimistic I know. I'm just a product of my conditioning. :P
-mklinic
"Do something right, no one remembers.
Do something wrong, no one forgets"
-from No One Remembers by In Strict Confidence
I read D4 Reddit daily and I have never even seen the "bare mare" term used once there. I'm not doubting that the writer of the article has seen it but he totally misses that it's just some people having some fun joking around and not "gatekeeping" as he calls it.
Humor and reading comprehension are in short supply these days when it's so much easier to fake outrage for sensational headlines and clicks.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
My trust in Blizzard is low based on how they've managed their IPs, their cash shop focused and MAU based design decisions, and their disrespect for the demographic they used to serve.
As a fan of their previous Diablo games, especially 1 and 2, I'm just not that interested in this game based on their design decisions so far. It feels bad being a part of a demographic that got tossed to the trash in favor of a demographic that wants online all the time, with other people running around, and who are okay with cash shops.
It starts with a 20-30 dollar pay to win to get in the game early. I am guessing the mtx is going to get worse as it goes. The leveling system for the experience rewards has come in to question as well. I am not hopeful.
That seems to be the general consensus that i have seen; and it's not even abnormal of a business model when we look at what they did for the diablo 3 launch; which had a mxt marketplace right out of the gate- which was eventually removed; but the game suffered some terrible gold exploits and ....other stuff.
Fishing on Gilgamesh since 2013
Fishing on Bronzebeard since 2005
Fishing in RL since 1992
Born with a fishing rod in my hand in 1979