Is There PvP in Nightingale? | MMORPG.com

System · February 27

Is There PvP in Nightingale? | MMORPG.com

The survival genre seems to attract a specific type of player, as many of the best enjoy some sort of PvP. Does Nightingale have PvP?

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Scot · February 27

Isn't this survival as well, come on devs we need more of these low content games!

Elvoc · February 27

Lets hope they dont add PVP to this game, it is listed as a PVE Coop and should probably stay that way. If it was listed as an MMO then maybe PVP would have some place in this game.
And if they do add PVP lets hope they add the Fully Offline mode first. Plenty of other PVP games for people to go play at this point.

Mensur · February 27

Scot said:

Isn't this survival as well, come on devs we need more of these low content games!

yes- another survival chop chop low IQ game.

Sovrath · February 27

Mensur said:

yes- another survival chop chop low IQ game.

When was the last time you played a "current" mmorpg and had to actually think?

You might be able to count them on one hand though I don't even think you'd use all the fingers.

Scot · February 28

Sovrath said:

Mensur said:

yes- another survival chop chop low IQ game.

When was the last time you played a "current" mmorpg and had to actually think?

You might be able to count them on one hand though I don't even think you'd use all the fingers.

Thats true, it is not just survival that demands nothing from players in regard to knowledge about the game, gaming has drifted that way for decades.

waveslayer · February 28

Scot said:

Sovrath said:

Mensur said:

yes- another survival chop chop low IQ game.

When was the last time you played a "current" mmorpg and had to actually think?

You might be able to count them on one hand though I don't even think you'd use all the fingers.

Thats true, it is not just survival that demands nothing from players in regard to knowledge about the game, gaming has drifted that way for decades.

and thats why I have drifted toward spending more time playing single player RPGs, RTS and 4X strat games the past couple of years

ValdemarJ · February 28

Scot said:

Sovrath said:

Mensur said:

yes- another survival chop chop low IQ game.

When was the last time you played a "current" mmorpg and had to actually think?

You might be able to count them on one hand though I don't even think you'd use all the fingers.

Thats true, it is not just survival that demands nothing from players in regard to knowledge about the game, gaming has drifted that way for decades.

By demanding something from the players I bet you mean memorizing the best tab-target button rotation for your mmrpg "group content". You know, in games with no consequences, risks, or player agency where players are little Pavlov bots playing tricks for rewards. This probably surprises you, but memorizing 1, 1, 3, 4, 2, 5 isn't "demanding".

In survival crafting base builders not understanding the game will get you killed, losing your gear to the mobs that kill you. Your base, resources, and xp penalties will also be at risk. It could mean setbacks on a scale that might mean starting over to build from lower tiers back up to top tier gear, resources, and bases.

I have a feeling you've beat no boss encounters or completed the maps in games like Ark, Grounded, and Conan, but trash talking behind a keyboard is easy. Or maybe you're just so much better than everyone else that these games are super simple for you? But don't try and pretend that mmos (the lobotomies of the gaming world) are challenging and risky by comparison.

Scot · February 29

ValdemarJ said:

By demanding something from the players I bet you mean memorizing the best tab-target button rotation for your mmrpg "group content". You know, in games with no consequences, risks, or player agency where players are little Pavlov bots playing tricks for rewards. This probably surprises you, but memorizing 1, 1, 3, 4, 2, 5 isn't "demanding".

In survival crafting base builders not understanding the game will get you killed, losing your gear to the mobs that kill you. Your base, resources, and xp penalties will also be at risk. It could mean setbacks on a scale that might mean starting over to build from lower tiers back up to top tier gear, resources, and bases.

I have a feeling you've beat no boss encounters or completed the maps in games like Ark, Grounded, and Conan, but trash talking behind a keyboard is easy. Or maybe you're just so much better than everyone else that these games are super simple for you? But don't try and pretend that mmos (the lobotomies of the gaming world) are challenging and risky by comparison.

Err no I am not talking about something like that at all. In fact the dangerous element of such games is commendable. This is where I see players, not just yourself assuming volumes when I am saying one or two things. So games have become less demanding, we have players saying things like "I don't like to have read about a game before I play it". That mentality is why gaming has become so much easier. Thats why I said "its not just survival games".

That is quite separate from my aversion to some survival mechanics. They are frustrating and are my showstopper when it comes to survival games. As we know what "survival" actually means in a survival game is not always the same, so it is not an automatic "No" for me.

So you are leaping to conclusions here, MMORPGs, like all the other games (including the old MMOs) have been dumbed down over time. You mentioned raids (I think), well they are difficult and avatars do die, but not always with the consequences of a game like Ark (only one you mentioned I have played). But you have to understand I came into multiplayer in FPS, doing online deathmatches, MMORPGs were never that hard.

cheyane · February 29

Sometimes even when you have the desire to read up and discover things about a game , there is very little information out there to be had.

I encountered this when I started playing Undecember. The game many here have dismissed but I found extremely enjoyable. I spent over 655 hours on the game so I am not merely dabbling in it.

The problem with all of the videos I wanted to watch was that they were in Korean with very poorly ai translated text. While I am an avid Kdrama fan my limited understanding of everyday phrases were of no use to me in deciphering gaming lingo. I found a couple of kind souls who bothered to do their own translations which were far better.

There were many things in this complex game that were not intuitive at all and I struggled to understand things. This made it difficult for me to appreciate the combat and the way the game handled the gear and slotting of skills. After watching numerous videos and thankfully as a result of more Western players playing it more videos came out and I finally really appreciated how deep the game was.

It is easy to dismiss offhand when you're not really playing it. Saying oh this lacks depth or that looks easy means very little from a cursory glance until you have actually spent some time playing a game. Of course there are many games as shallow as a puddle but some can be surprisingly deep while initially coming across as simple and easy. I don't always make snap judgements from a book cover and neither should you. Many even dismiss games off hand looking at you @Scot by their art style and that is in my opinion a lamentable oversight.

Naturally one cannot be expected to spend 20 hours in a game before calling a spade a spade but I feel we often make snap judgements or simply assume so much by the game's appearance, monetisation or even how much clothing the female characters are wearing. None of this actually is a gauge on the depth of a game although monetisation is something I baulk at too. However I did pay for the weekly loot pet I am not really immune to the scheme either but I weigh things before deciding whether it is acceptable monetisation. I have come to the realisation that f2p has some acceptable forms of monetisation I'm willing to overlook if the game is good enough.

Scot · February 29

I will say I do dismiss games, too easily perhaps. But I know I won't be happy without a certain level of graphic quality. Just looking at MMOs, I still after many years set my bar at what Lotro looks like. Not cartoony, but hardy ultra realistic, that game came out in 2007 and I think the fact I find so many MMOs fall under that bar says more about the gaming industry than it does about me.

As people have been jumping to conclusions I will just mention that Nightingale easily passes over my graphics bar.

I think we should all spend time making our minds up about a game and unless there are any immediate show stoppers that's what I do. "Survival" is a good example, while that is a red flag for me and I expect the worst I am more than happy to hear that "eating and drinking is a buff, you don't die or have a huge penalty without it". Indeed I recommend players look at Steam scores and read reviews, Metacritic scores and gaming journalist lower scoring reviews. If you have pet hates, those low scoring reviews should find them. Then on to a gameplay video, I don't bother with video reviews.

As for us having to use monetarization in MMOs we don't like, I think all us older MMO players have come to the realisation we can't play like we used to, you either go with partly the flow or leave MMOs and to a certain degree multiplayer behind. We have players here who seem to have done that, but I hope I will never have to say I have.

Elidien_ga · February 29

I am actively playing and loving Nightingale. For me, its lore and story and background (with many gaslamp/steampunk references) combined with Shakespearean characters is a haven and heaven for me Having read Midsummer Night's Dream, it puts Puck's character and others mentioned in a whole new light). It needs work, needs some QoL for sure but it does not ever need PVP.

I actually find it refreshing in that there are puzzles and limited knowledge and its not just a simple "go here, do this, go back" routine. For one you have to be aware of portal combinations to get certain resources.

Gaming by definition is not meant to be rocket science. For many, gaming is a leisure activity and for me, for example, I will not play a game in which I need to do advanced math.

Any activity can be dumbed down. I see this a lot with people who criticize racing. Its just cars going in circles on a track. Well golf is hitting a ball in a hole and soccer (football) is kicking a ball in a square box. We do not reduce out activities to their mundaneness to enjoy them, we just simply enjoy them.

cheyane · February 29

Anyone here who has played both Enshrouded and Nightingale can please answer my question. How much of the action combat is like Enshrouded . I can handle the normal mobs in Enshrouded the bosses are hard though as I am bad at dodging and so on. So is it harder than Enshrouded the combat. Also does it have some cumbersome nonsense like pressing an extra key to use a bow or ranged attack my current pet peeve about Enshrouded is this dumb aspect.

How is the third person is it good for ranged combat because a lot of games that are originally made for first person can't seem to get the third person aim reliably well. How is the combat in third person view since I understand it was introduced relatively recently.

Elidien_ga · February 29

cheyane said:

Anyone here who has played both Enshrouded and Nightingale can please answer my question. How much of the action combat is like Enshrouded . I can handle the normal mobs in Enshrouded the bosses are hard though as I am bad at dodging and so on. So is it harder than Enshrouded the combat. Also does it have some cumbersome nonsense like pressing an extra key to use a bow or ranged attack my current pet peeve about Enshrouded is this dumb aspect.

How is the third person is it good for ranged combat because a lot of games that are originally made for first person can't seem to get the third person aim reliably well. How is the combat in third person view since I understand it was introduced relatively recently.

I cannot speak to Enshrouded but 3rd person is still experimental in Nightingale and its not smooth. I prefer 3rd person but I play 1st in Nightingale because 3rd is just off. Combat as a whole is one of the weaker areas of the game right now. Lots of just swing and hit stuff with little strategy.

cheyane · February 29

I cannot use first person makes me quite ill. Oh damn was going to buy this.

Elidien_ga · February 29

cheyane said:

I cannot use first person makes me quite ill. Oh damn was going to buy this.

I understand completely. I can get bad motion sick in games. 3rd works it just feels off as I said. Like the hitbox is messed up. It is in the game and its a toggle as well so I expect it to get more flushed out. It has made me a bit motion sick at times, mainly jumping and climbing puzzles with lots of character motion in 1st person. No where near as bad as some games (like the Souls games and Elden Ring - I cannot even attempt those).

cheyane · February 29

I played Deus X Human Revolution I set everything to max FOV and all that. 30 minutes was the longest and then massive headache for the rest of the day.

It's very important to me that third person works.

The hit box I noticed many games that start off with first person has this aiming problem which is about the hitbox. You cannot hit it properly. I've tried so many games that have mods for first person games to work in third person, it is always horrible so I stopped trying any first person game. I always just sigh and move on.

I really want to try this though. So tempted to say f it and get it anyway.

Elidien_ga · February 29

cheyane said:

I played Deus X Human Revolution I set everything to max FOV and all that. 30 minutes was the longest and then massive headache for the rest of the day.

It's very important to me that third person works.

The hit box I noticed many games that start off with first person has this aiming problem which is about the hitbox. You cannot hit it properly. I've tried so many games that have mods for first person games to work in third person, it is always horrible so I stopped trying any first person game. I always just sigh and move on.

I really want to try this though. So tempted to say f it and get it anyway.

I am biased and love it and enjoy it. Its a true early access game (i would equate it to beta for us old school players) and it needs work but it just appeals to me an what I am looking for. With it, Last Epoch, ESO, and House Flipper 2, I am content gaming right now.

Kickaxe · February 29

@cheyane, do you watch Twitch streams? I find it a nice way to get a good sense of what playing any given game might be like. There's always a few streamers that can be tolerated, or can even be entertaining.

Scot · February 29

Kickaxe said:

@cheyane, do you watch Twitch streams? I find it a nice way to get a good sense of what playing any given game might be like. There's always a few streamers that can be tolerated, or can even be entertaining.

Streamers...Scot calls for the emergency services.

cheyane · February 29

Kickaxe said:

@cheyane, do you watch Twitch streams? I find it a nice way to get a good sense of what playing any given game might be like. There's always a few streamers that can be tolerated, or can even be entertaining.

I cannot even watch first person videos. They have the same effect albeit to a lesser degree.

Kickaxe · February 29

Scot said:

Kickaxe said:

@cheyane, do you watch Twitch streams? I find it a nice way to get a good sense of what playing any given game might be like. There's always a few streamers that can be tolerated, or can even be entertaining.

Streamers...Scot calls for the emergency services.

Hey, I knew it wasn't going to be a popular suggestion in these parts. But against all my old gamer instincts, I've come to enjoy some streams.

ValdemarJ · February 29

Kickaxe said:

Scot said:

Kickaxe said:

@cheyane, do you watch Twitch streams? I find it a nice way to get a good sense of what playing any given game might be like. There's always a few streamers that can be tolerated, or can even be entertaining.

Streamers...Scot calls for the emergency services.

Hey, I knew it wasn't going to be a popular suggestion in these parts. But against all my old gamer instincts, I've come to enjoy some streams.

I don't see how watching a video for information is any worse than reading it in some fansite or wiki. It was a good suggestion.

If I am trying to understand some mechanic or tactic a video is often much more informative. Say I need to place torches in order to address the challenge.

The game wiki says, "Place the torches on the North, South, and West walls. Maybe there are screenshots or maybe not.

Watching a video I can see exactly where and how the torches are placed. I can see the surrounding environment and context. I can see what happens as torches are placed, like adds spawning or events triggered.

It's nice to find someone that is agreeable to watch, but I'm there for information not to have my sensitivities hugged.

ValdemarJ · February 29

cheyane said:

Kickaxe said:

@cheyane, do you watch Twitch streams? I find it a nice way to get a good sense of what playing any given game might be like. There's always a few streamers that can be tolerated, or can even be entertaining.

I cannot even watch first person videos. They have the same effect albeit to a lesser degree.

Have you checked out Smalland yet? It's on Xbox and Steam, that I know of. Action oriented RPG with some crude survival mechanics and freestyle building. The settings allow for quite a lot of adjustment so hunger and spoil rates can be toned down or removed entirely. There are options for hosting a multiplayer session, but I haven't investigated. It feels like an indie-jank (in that good way) version of Grounded + Valheim + Ark. It's third person by default.

Kickaxe · February 29

cheyane said:

Kickaxe said:

@cheyane, do you watch Twitch streams? I find it a nice way to get a good sense of what playing any given game might be like. There's always a few streamers that can be tolerated, or can even be entertaining.

I cannot even watch first person videos. They have the same effect albeit to a lesser degree.

I have similar issue with first person, so I know where you're coming from (though I don't think as bad as you have it). But I've seen plenty of third person view streams of Nightingale.

Maybe you meant from another gamer's perspective rather than character perspective? If so that is rough indeed.

Mensur · March 1

Scot said:

Sovrath said:

Mensur said:

yes- another survival chop chop low IQ game.

When was the last time you played a "current" mmorpg and had to actually think?

You might be able to count them on one hand though I don't even think you'd use all the fingers.

Thats true, it is not just survival that demands nothing from players in regard to knowledge about the game, gaming has drifted that way for decades.

True- last game I played and I had to think was Monsters and Memmories beta.

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