Raph releases Star's Reach Game Pillars Part 1

Slapshot1188 · July 10

Some interesting stuff to noodle on.

https://starsreach.com/stars-reach-game-pillars-part-one/

Some details on what he is thinking about planets and cities included.

Also, we need a Star's Reach forum please.

Scot · July 17

Ralph talks about simulation and stagecraft which is very alike to what I think of as Gameplay and Sleight of Hand (he sees simulation as creating emerging gameplay). There is always a trade off between pairs of factors like these, he has clearly worked that out but as he near enough says himself it will be down to the implementation.

I am also pleased to see that he realises how detrimental streamers can be to games, the community should be in game and in social media attached to the game not with streamers. But I think he misses an opportunity with guilds, playing them down by allowing multiple guild membership and well not using them. He has plans in place to stand in for guilds, but they will be too diffuse, you can't have multiple loyalties every which way without diluting them all.

Overall some solid thinking about how the sort of game he wants to make should be created, look forward to seeing how he puts that vision into practice, it won't be easy!

Sovrath · July 17

“Raph “

Tiller · July 17

Scot said:

Ralph talks about simulation and stagecraft which is very alike to what I think of as Gameplay and Sleight of Hand (he sees simulation as creating emerging gameplay). There is always a trade off between pairs of factors like these, he has clearly worked that out but as he near enough says himself it will be down to the implementation.

I am also pleased to see that he realises how detrimental streamers can be to games, the community should be in game and in social media attached to the game not with streamers. But I think he misses an opportunity with guilds, playing them down by allowing multiple guild membership and well not using them. He has plans in place to stand in for guilds, but they will be too diffuse, you can't have multiple loyalties every which way without diluting them all.

Overall some solid thinking about how the sort of game he wants to make should be created, look forward to seeing how he puts that vision into practice, it won't be easy!

Image: https://i.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExbHd6c3pxdXdoenlubmJhdGtpbXg0ZXpudzI3NzA3dmRtbnYyYTNubiZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/l0ErHS4tBuUBr25Ne/giphy.gif

cameltosis · July 18

Game Pillars part two has dropped today:

https://starsreach.com/stars-reach-game-pillars-part-two/

I'm still trying to digest everything they talk about, but if im honest, these pillars have me extremely worried. Everything sounds great on the surface, and makes total sense....

....but, my hopes for a good combat system are slipping away, very very quickly.

Ofc, as Raph himself keeps saying, "the proof is in the pudding", so I'll try to keep an open mind until I see specifics. But, despite his repeated use of the word "depth", the actual content of his design pillars seems to keep removing depth from the combat mechanics. I've never seen an action combat game with depth, action and depth are basically incompatible. They are targetting two totally different types of players, which is why combining them is basically impossible.

Tiller · July 18

cameltosis said:

Game Pillars part two has dropped today:

https://starsreach.com/stars-reach-game-pillars-part-two/

I'm still trying to digest everything they talk about, but if im honest, these pillars have me extremely worried. Everything sounds great on the surface, and makes total sense....

....but, my hopes for a good combat system are slipping away, very very quickly.

Ofc, as Raph himself keeps saying, "the proof is in the pudding", so I'll try to keep an open mind until I see specifics. But, despite his repeated use of the word "depth", the actual content of his design pillars seems to keep removing depth from the combat mechanics. I've never seen an action combat game with depth, action and depth are basically incompatible. They are targetting two totally different types of players, which is why combining them is basically impossible.

"The Ease of Nintendo Meets the Depth of the Sandbox MMO"

Honestly it sounds like he's kind of making a sci-fi Albion Online. Other MMO examples with little time commitment..Albion Online, GW2, STO, even Bit Heroes with it's lame daily energy system.

Acornia · July 18

Looking ahead with what has been posted. We will have to worry about wild animals destorying what we have built either by underground, surface or from the air?

How will we get quests? Will it be from NPCs or from quest terminals (like in SWG)?

Theocritus · July 18

Tiller said:

cameltosis said:

Game Pillars part two has dropped today:

https://starsreach.com/stars-reach-game-pillars-part-two/

I'm still trying to digest everything they talk about, but if im honest, these pillars have me extremely worried. Everything sounds great on the surface, and makes total sense....

....but, my hopes for a good combat system are slipping away, very very quickly.

Ofc, as Raph himself keeps saying, "the proof is in the pudding", so I'll try to keep an open mind until I see specifics. But, despite his repeated use of the word "depth", the actual content of his design pillars seems to keep removing depth from the combat mechanics. I've never seen an action combat game with depth, action and depth are basically incompatible. They are targetting two totally different types of players, which is why combining them is basically impossible.

"The Ease of Nintendo Meets the Depth of the Sandbox MMO"

Honestly it sounds like he's kind of making a sci-fi Albion Online. Other MMO examples with little time commitment..Albion Online, GW2, STO, even Bit Heroes with it's lame daily energy system.

Not sure I have ever heard anyone mention Bit Heroes on this site before

Tiller · July 18

Theocritus said:

Tiller said:

cameltosis said:

Game Pillars part two has dropped today:

https://starsreach.com/stars-reach-game-pillars-part-two/

I'm still trying to digest everything they talk about, but if im honest, these pillars have me extremely worried. Everything sounds great on the surface, and makes total sense....

....but, my hopes for a good combat system are slipping away, very very quickly.

Ofc, as Raph himself keeps saying, "the proof is in the pudding", so I'll try to keep an open mind until I see specifics. But, despite his repeated use of the word "depth", the actual content of his design pillars seems to keep removing depth from the combat mechanics. I've never seen an action combat game with depth, action and depth are basically incompatible. They are targetting two totally different types of players, which is why combining them is basically impossible.

"The Ease of Nintendo Meets the Depth of the Sandbox MMO"

Honestly it sounds like he's kind of making a sci-fi Albion Online. Other MMO examples with little time commitment..Albion Online, GW2, STO, even Bit Heroes with it's lame daily energy system.

Not sure I have ever heard anyone mention Bit Heroes on this site before

Yeah it's the game that came to mind when I thought of energy being a consumable in a multiplayer game lol.

edit, maybe Scot is confusing Raph with your Ralph Wiggins avatar and that's why he keeps calling him Ralph. xD

cameltosis · July 19

Acornia said:

Looking ahead with what has been posted. We will have to worry about wild animals destorying what we have built either by underground, surface or from the air?

How will we get quests? Will it be from NPCs or from quest terminals (like in SWG)?

We haven't heard much about quests, however, remember that this is a sandbox game, whilst quests are a themepark feature. So, don't expect much.

There will be some questing (hes said there will be) and I *think* there will be player-created quests too. He's spoken about player contracts before, and their use in building trust between players, but we haven't heard any specifics on this yet.

But, yeh, it's a sandbox, not a themepark. Questing is low on the agenda, especially as every planet can be changed by the players, so static questlines and story aren't really compatible.

Angrakhan · July 19

I would expect quests to be primarily if not exclusively player contracts. You put out a buy order for 5000 units of steel, for example. Maybe a planetary government puts a bounty on some dangerous predators to clear out an area to build a settlement. Clear the are of trees. Stuff like that. The only thing I expect to come from an NPC would be stuff during the tutorial portion of the game.

mikeb0817 · July 20

Angrakhan said:

I would expect quests to be primarily if not exclusively player contracts. You put out a buy order for 5000 units of steel, for example. Maybe a planetary government puts a bounty on some dangerous predators to clear out an area to build a settlement. Clear the are of trees. Stuff like that. The only thing I expect to come from an NPC would be stuff during the tutorial portion of the game.

Those sound like "tasks" and would still be Okay to most people I think. When they consider adding a monetary system to the game you'll need an injection of cash to start it up and, "tasks" seem like a reasonable way to do it without adding "Quests" but it's all how they decide to define things...

Raph · August 5

cameltosis said:

Game Pillars part two has dropped today:

https://starsreach.com/stars-reach-game-pillars-part-two/

I'm still trying to digest everything they talk about, but if im honest, these pillars have me extremely worried. Everything sounds great on the surface, and makes total sense....

....but, my hopes for a good combat system are slipping away, very very quickly.

Ofc, as Raph himself keeps saying, "the proof is in the pudding", so I'll try to keep an open mind until I see specifics. But, despite his repeated use of the word "depth", the actual content of his design pillars seems to keep removing depth from the combat mechanics. I've never seen an action combat game with depth, action and depth are basically incompatible. They are targetting two totally different types of players, which is why combining them is basically impossible.

I assume you are defining depth as richness of tactical choice, that sort of thing. We haven't gone into it publicly yet, but we do have all the usual things that go into combat systems -- status effects, comboing/chaining between different specials and effects, managing resources, etc. It's not just pew-pew, for sure.

Amaranthar · August 10

Raph said:

cameltosis said:

Game Pillars part two has dropped today:

https://starsreach.com/stars-reach-game-pillars-part-two/

I'm still trying to digest everything they talk about, but if im honest, these pillars have me extremely worried. Everything sounds great on the surface, and makes total sense....

....but, my hopes for a good combat system are slipping away, very very quickly.

Ofc, as Raph himself keeps saying, "the proof is in the pudding", so I'll try to keep an open mind until I see specifics. But, despite his repeated use of the word "depth", the actual content of his design pillars seems to keep removing depth from the combat mechanics. I've never seen an action combat game with depth, action and depth are basically incompatible. They are targetting two totally different types of players, which is why combining them is basically impossible.

I assume you are defining depth as richness of tactical choice, that sort of thing. We haven't gone into it publicly yet, but we do have all the usual things that go into combat systems -- status effects, comboing/chaining between different specials and effects, managing resources, etc. It's not just pew-pew, for sure.

PvP has always been more exciting than PvE, as far as strategies.
I don't know the status these days, but I hope Stars Reach can make PvE a lot for strategic, full of choices with each their own ramifications.

For the record, I've never enjoyed battle strategies more than UO's Magery, especially when in a one-on-one situation.
Seeing the "words of power" and recognizing them for the spell they cast, knowing the timing of casting each spell, and or effects, and thinking steps ahead, plus timing out potion use, and all that was involved, well, it was the best gaming combat I've ever experienced.

Kyleran · August 10

Raph said:

cameltosis said:

Game Pillars part two has dropped today:

https://starsreach.com/stars-reach-game-pillars-part-two/

I'm still trying to digest everything they talk about, but if im honest, these pillars have me extremely worried. Everything sounds great on the surface, and makes total sense....

....but, my hopes for a good combat system are slipping away, very very quickly.

Ofc, as Raph himself keeps saying, "the proof is in the pudding", so I'll try to keep an open mind until I see specifics. But, despite his repeated use of the word "depth", the actual content of his design pillars seems to keep removing depth from the combat mechanics. I've never seen an action combat game with depth, action and depth are basically incompatible. They are targetting two totally different types of players, which is why combining them is basically impossible.

I assume you are defining depth as richness of tactical choice, that sort of thing. We haven't gone into it publicly yet, but we do have all the usual things that go into combat systems -- status effects, comboing/chaining between different specials and effects, managing resources, etc. It's not just pew-pew, for sure.

I'm more interested to know what you are doing different from "the usual things" related to engaging combat.

cameltosis · August 11

Kyleran said:

Raph said:

cameltosis said:

Game Pillars part two has dropped today:

https://starsreach.com/stars-reach-game-pillars-part-two/

I'm still trying to digest everything they talk about, but if im honest, these pillars have me extremely worried. Everything sounds great on the surface, and makes total sense....

....but, my hopes for a good combat system are slipping away, very very quickly.

Ofc, as Raph himself keeps saying, "the proof is in the pudding", so I'll try to keep an open mind until I see specifics. But, despite his repeated use of the word "depth", the actual content of his design pillars seems to keep removing depth from the combat mechanics. I've never seen an action combat game with depth, action and depth are basically incompatible. They are targetting two totally different types of players, which is why combining them is basically impossible.

I assume you are defining depth as richness of tactical choice, that sort of thing. We haven't gone into it publicly yet, but we do have all the usual things that go into combat systems -- status effects, comboing/chaining between different specials and effects, managing resources, etc. It's not just pew-pew, for sure.

I'm more interested to know what you are doing different from "the usual things" related to engaging combat.

Well, depth in combat mechanics would be different! Especially in this era of shallow action combat!

cameltosis · August 11

Raph said:

cameltosis said:

Game Pillars part two has dropped today:

https://starsreach.com/stars-reach-game-pillars-part-two/

I'm still trying to digest everything they talk about, but if im honest, these pillars have me extremely worried. Everything sounds great on the surface, and makes total sense....

....but, my hopes for a good combat system are slipping away, very very quickly.

Ofc, as Raph himself keeps saying, "the proof is in the pudding", so I'll try to keep an open mind until I see specifics. But, despite his repeated use of the word "depth", the actual content of his design pillars seems to keep removing depth from the combat mechanics. I've never seen an action combat game with depth, action and depth are basically incompatible. They are targetting two totally different types of players, which is why combining them is basically impossible.

I assume you are defining depth as richness of tactical choice, that sort of thing. We haven't gone into it publicly yet, but we do have all the usual things that go into combat systems -- status effects, comboing/chaining between different specials and effects, managing resources, etc. It's not just pew-pew, for sure.

I'm using depth, regarding combat mechanics, as a measure of decision making. Is it difficult to make the right choice of what to use next?

More choices by itself is just complexity, but complexity is the coin you use to purchase depth. But if a new choice isnt meaningful, it's just bloat.

Are the choices meaningful? Are they impactful? Are there costs associated with making a choice?

Different options, varying cooldowns, resource costs, impact of skills are all ways that older games added depth....assuming they had much depth that is. More modern games, especially action combat games, tend not to have much depth at all. The limited amount of options makes it too easy to decide what to do next. A few skills for a rotation, then a couple of skills that are simple reactive skills, and maybe 1 bigger skill that requires a genuine decision.

Also worth stating that depth in combat mechanics is only visible in challenging content. If the content is easy, then it typically doesn't matter what choices u make, as you'll win whatever u do.

Dattelis · August 11

I guess Star Reach will be the new game to talk about for the next 5-10 years before paid alpha 1 access.

Scot · August 11

We lost Champie, not sure why, let's try to not lose more people, just a right royal pain.

Raph · August 12

Kyleran said:

I'm more interested to know what you are doing different from "the usual things" related to engaging combat.

The action-arcadey vibe definitely feels different.

madazz · August 14

Scot said:

Ralph talks about simulation and stagecraft which is very alike to what I think of as Gameplay and Sleight of Hand (he sees simulation as creating emerging gameplay). There is always a trade off between pairs of factors like these, he has clearly worked that out but as he near enough says himself it will be down to the implementation.

I am also pleased to see that he realises how detrimental streamers can be to games, the community should be in game and in social media attached to the game not with streamers. But I think he misses an opportunity with guilds, playing them down by allowing multiple guild membership and well not using them. He has plans in place to stand in for guilds, but they will be too diffuse, you can't have multiple loyalties every which way without diluting them all.

Overall some solid thinking about how the sort of game he wants to make should be created, look forward to seeing how he puts that vision into practice, it won't be easy!

I like what hes doing with guilds. Its not perfect, but it can serve a purpose and create some awesome player politics. For instance, in Ultima Online you could be a member of a guild and an alliance. But it created friction when opposing guilds were in the same alliance. Likewise, peace between alliances could be destroyed due to two warring guilds. So if hes approaching it like this, then we are in for a treat!

Wargfoot · August 16

Scot said:

We lost Champie, not sure why, let's try to not lose more people, just a right royal pain.

I read this as "Fight me in the forum using racial slurs, religious insults, and political posturing - along with a liberal sprinkling of Yo Momma jokes."

Amaranthar · August 18

Raph ( @Raph ) added a picture to their Discord site, and the art looks much better. The characters haven't been worked on yet because they are waiting on the customizations to be added first.
They're still working on a few things on it, as Raph pointed out a few glitches in this pic.

Edit...
Oooops, I guess I shouldn't have posted that image, and someone removed it.
Raph evidently wasn't satisfied with it, Ha!

Raph · August 21

Once this pass on visuals is done, we'll post about it, never fear. And we don't expect that to be the last pass on them, either.

waynejr2 · August 22

Raph said:

cameltosis said:

Game Pillars part two has dropped today:

https://starsreach.com/stars-reach-game-pillars-part-two/

I'm still trying to digest everything they talk about, but if im honest, these pillars have me extremely worried. Everything sounds great on the surface, and makes total sense....

....but, my hopes for a good combat system are slipping away, very very quickly.

Ofc, as Raph himself keeps saying, "the proof is in the pudding", so I'll try to keep an open mind until I see specifics. But, despite his repeated use of the word "depth", the actual content of his design pillars seems to keep removing depth from the combat mechanics. I've never seen an action combat game with depth, action and depth are basically incompatible. They are targetting two totally different types of players, which is why combining them is basically impossible.

I assume you are defining depth as richness of tactical choice, that sort of thing. We haven't gone into it publicly yet, but we do have all the usual things that go into combat systems -- status effects, comboing/chaining between different specials and effects, managing resources, etc. It's not just pew-pew, for sure.

How about players creating new spells in the game. Spells that don't exist in the or your database. Something original.

Wargfoot · August 22

waynejr2 said:

How about players creating new spells in the game. Spells that don't exist in the or your database. Something original.

The idea is fun, but any system will have limits - for example, once you find the "fireball" spell combo that does the most damage the players will start using only that. You could have millions of possible spell combinations, but in short order the entire player base would be using the same 10 spells.

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Raph releases Star's Reach Game Pillars Part 1

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Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

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Raph releases Star's Reach Game Pillars Part 1

Comments

Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV