As Stars Reach Heads Towards First Playtests This Weekend, Raph Koster Dives into Who the Game is Fo

System · August 15

As Stars Reach Heads Towards First Playtests This Weekend, Raph Koster Dives into Who the Game is For | MMORPG.com

Raph Koster delves into who Playable Worlds is building their community-driven sandbox, Stars Reach, for, and the guiding motivations behind their design.

Read the full story here

inmysights · August 15

Christ, I cannot wait to play this game!!!! So excited for it.

Mensur · August 15

Horizontal Progression is the way to go!

Babuinix · August 15

Eager to check the feedback on this. Think I might have gotten an invitation email somewhere.

achesoma · August 15

So only 75 invites went out for this test according to their Discord. That seems really low for an MMO, even though it's early in development.

mikeb0817 · August 15

I missed the M&M play test for work and now this. I'm jealous, to say the least. Hope we get feedback from Raph. Anyone who has access pls do your 'due diligence' and follow up with us if allowed!

Cogohi · August 15

achesoma said:

So only 75 invites went out for this test according to their Discord. That seems really low for an MMO, even though it's early in development.

For an Alpha Test? No, not at all.

Elidien_ga · August 15

I love all the information coming and thanks for sharing!

Angrakhan · August 15

I just wanted to point out I read the entire linked article on starsreach.com and never once do they actually answer the question of who the game is made for. They ask the question and then never answer it. Interesting. Is that intentional or do they have ADHD and get lost in the process of writing an article and forget what the whole point of writing the article was. Not super confidence inspiring, honestly.

Also would like to point out that they talk about horizontal progression and then use calling in an airstrike as an example. I'm sorry, but that sounds pretty vertically progressed to me! Go in mono-e-mono with your laser pistol or sit back and watch your orbital platform nuke the whole site from orbit is not what I would call horizontal progression.

Finally they talk about "classless" but that's just different lipstick on the same pig. Fact of they matter is they limit the number of abilities you can have equipped at one time. That set of abilities could be thought of as a class. Certain combinations of abilities will synergize better with others. There will be optimal combinations of abilities for certain activities. The rest will be suboptimal for the activities. There will be meta. These optimal combinations are just classes at the end of the day. The soldier, the pilot, the farmer, the scout. The fact they don't group the abilities into a class at give it a name doesn't mean the class doesn't exist.

Smoke and mirrors.

That's not to say I'm not interested. I want to check out the game. I may love it. I just scoff a bit at the marketing double speak.

Kyleran · August 15

inmysights said:

Christ, I cannot wait to play this game!!!! So excited for it.

Oh geez, please don't fall for the obvious hype.

You folks make it all too easy....

Kyleran · August 15

achesoma said:

So only 75 invites went out for this test according to their Discord. That seems really low for an MMO, even though it's early in development.

Friends and family most likely.

olepi · August 15

Angrakhan said:

Finally they talk about "classless" but that's just different lipstick on the same pig. Fact of they matter is they limit the number of abilities you can have equipped at one time. That set of abilities could be thought of as a class. Certain combinations of abilities will synergize better with others. There will be optimal combinations of abilities for certain activities. The rest will be suboptimal for the activities. There will be meta. These optimal combinations are just classes at the end of the day. The soldier, the pilot, the farmer, the scout. The fact they don't group the abilities into a class at give it a name doesn't mean the class doesn't exist.

I was thinking about this when playing CoH today. I usually have 3 bars of 10 skills each, 30 in all. I can pick any one of them at any time. The old-school MMO's were like that.

Once they started porting over to consoles, the trend towards allowing only a handful of skills at any one time took over. ESO and NW are like that. With a keyboard, using 30 skills is no big deal, on a console it becomes cumbersome.

We've gone backwards since the old days.

richrem1 · August 16

Angrakhan said:

I just wanted to point out...

Thanks for pointing out the bull shit.

Scot · August 17

Angrakhan said:

I just wanted to point out I read the entire linked article on starsreach.com and never once do they actually answer the question of who the game is made for. They ask the question and then never answer it. Interesting. Is that intentional or do they have ADHD and get lost in the process of writing an article and forget what the whole point of writing the article was. Not super confidence inspiring, honestly.

Also would like to point out that they talk about horizontal progression and then use calling in an airstrike as an example. I'm sorry, but that sounds pretty vertically progressed to me! Go in mono-e-mono with your laser pistol or sit back and watch your orbital platform nuke the whole site from orbit is not what I would call horizontal progression.

Finally they talk about "classless" but that's just different lipstick on the same pig. Fact of they matter is they limit the number of abilities you can have equipped at one time. That set of abilities could be thought of as a class. Certain combinations of abilities will synergize better with others. There will be optimal combinations of abilities for certain activities. The rest will be suboptimal for the activities. There will be meta. These optimal combinations are just classes at the end of the day. The soldier, the pilot, the farmer, the scout. The fact they don't group the abilities into a class at give it a name doesn't mean the class doesn't exist.

Smoke and mirrors.

That's not to say I'm not interested. I want to check out the game. I may love it. I just scoff a bit at the marketing double speak.

Studio's won't say who a game is for, otherwise massive groups of players will switch off. It is obfuscation, but they all do it to an extant.

Raph · August 21

Angrakhan said:

I just wanted to point out I read the entire linked article on starsreach.com and never once do they actually answer the question of who the game is made for. They ask the question and then never answer it. Interesting. Is that intentional or do they have ADHD and get lost in the process of writing an article and forget what the whole point of writing the article was. Not super confidence inspiring, honestly.

We listed the specific play motivations the game is designed to appeal to, and those that it is not going to be aimed at. That's pretty much telling people what sorts of playstyles we expect to support. We have also in other articles specifically said things like "this game is not for people who want X." We're not trying to obfuscate anything. What format would you prefer?

zyxxery · August 31

I would say I am very excited. I see so many parallels to SWG and UO, i.e. a diverse skill system, expansive crafting, a collaborative world that it leaves me hoping that this will be a game in which many MMO nomads can find a home!

Although, ever since the days of SWG - it seems to me at least that the once hardcore cadre of MMO players that'd work for things have evolved into a more casual mindset where the short term goal seems to be the only attraction. Relationships in games have become flitting at best, and the newer, younger gamer version of me doesn't want to commit to a journey that could last them many months..

I wonder if perhaps that I am now no longer the "many" and after more than 25 years of gaming, my dream game whilst possible and desired by us "mum and dad" gamers is no longer an ecomonic reality as the younger generations don't want to play!

That begs the question - if older players want to advance, and younger players want to play - how do you meet in the middle and attract a large enough market?

For me - it's that sense of wonder when you discover something new, the sense of pride when you can affect changes / or others positively in a community, and that sense of achievement in that what I've been doing all these days / weeks / months has all been worth it.

So, I watch with baited breath, and truly hope for the best

cameltosis · August 31

zyxxery said:

That begs the question - if older players want to advance, and younger players want to play - how do you meet in the middle and attract a large enough market?

This is a very good question, and I believe it is a question Raph has asked himself a lot in the design of this game. His solution, from what I can tell, is:

1) Draw in the short attention span gamers with bright colours and easily accessible action combat. This should get them into the game, get them engaged, and provide them with an activity suited to their particular style. Things like being able to teleport inbetween planets so you can join your friends quickly makes the game more accessible to those sorts of players....though you won't be teleporting crafting mats, gotta take the long way for them!

2) Provide progressively longer gameplay loops, like crafting, building, trading, and guilds, so that when they inevitably get bored with the action combat, the game has more to offer them. You'll get introduced to these things via purchasing weapons/armour off other players, which will (hopefully) inspire those players to get involved themselves.

At least, that's the way I understand things, I may have got that wrong! There is also the desire to add depth to every part of the game, so that even stuff that is accessible should still provide long term goals in terms of learning and improving personal skill.

Amaranthar · September 1

cameltosis said:

zyxxery said:

That begs the question - if older players want to advance, and younger players want to play - how do you meet in the middle and attract a large enough market?

This is a very good question, and I believe it is a question Raph has asked himself a lot in the design of this game. His solution, from what I can tell, is:

1) Draw in the short attention span gamers with bright colours and easily accessible action combat. This should get them into the game, get them engaged, and provide them with an activity suited to their particular style. Things like being able to teleport inbetween planets so you can join your friends quickly makes the game more accessible to those sorts of players....though you won't be teleporting crafting mats, gotta take the long way for them!

2) Provide progressively longer gameplay loops, like crafting, building, trading, and guilds, so that when they inevitably get bored with the action combat, the game has more to offer them. You'll get introduced to these things via purchasing weapons/armour off other players, which will (hopefully) inspire those players to get involved themselves.

At least, that's the way I understand things, I may have got that wrong! There is also the desire to add depth to every part of the game, so that even stuff that is accessible should still provide long term goals in terms of learning and improving personal skill.

Raph's probably been taking notes over the years of all the ideas and ways to make game play interesting for all the types of players.
Ya need that anyways, in my opinion, because players often have moods or even evolve in their game play desires and goals. Especially these days, after so many years of the same thing on different stages.

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As Stars Reach Heads Towards First Playtests This Weekend, Raph Koster Dives into Who the Game is Fo

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Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

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As Stars Reach Heads Towards First Playtests This Weekend, Raph Koster Dives into Who the Game is Fo

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mmorpg junkie since 1999

Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV