Warhammer 40k

Thanatosx33 · June 2006

Ok, warhammer looks realy awesome. But, you know what I would realy enjoy? A Warhammer 40,000 MMORPG, I think that would be a pretty awesome game if they were to make it. There is so much lore revolving around the warhammer 40k universe, and so much to work with. Also, since it would obviously involve a lot of PVP and different factions, world event options would be limitless. A vast universe to war over, now that would be badass.

Distortion0 · June 2006

If you want to make a Warhammer 40k MMO, it's a good idea to make a Warhammer MMO first. If you do it right, you widden your fanbase dramaticly. Most likely, more people will play Fantasy over 40k because it's famillar, people like that more(They'de rather play something innovative on an old concept than completely revolutionary). Besides, if you make 40k after fantasy, 40k will be better because the Devs will have learned from their mistakes the first time around. Like how CoV is a better game than CoH.

BadBoyOnFire · June 2006

That would be the funniest thing ever.

If they made WAR2 or something which intergrated and interacted with the original, so you had space marines taking on dragons and n00b orks from the original Warhammer.

I once played the model game of Warhammer vs Warhammer 40k... needless to say i lost 2 space marines of my entire army to spider bites and the rest of my army mowed down the enemy before they even reached my gates.

necrofanatic · June 2006

I'm sure all of us are wishing for the chance to be a space marine and go own some chaos ass or even be a guardsmen and fight for his/her very life. BUT! we need to wait so the game could at least be concepted or allow the dev to learn(hopefully Mythic) from the mistakes of their first game. As long as 40k doesnt get bashed or something by blizzard fanbois as being a copy of starcraft when it's the other way around,and also it gets released before a Starcraft mmo it should launch very succesfully if it ever does become a reality.

ELP_Spawn · June 2006

I agree.

ELP_Spawn · June 2006

I agree.

djikon02 · June 2006

I think they are doing the right thing with warhammer instead of 40k. They started with warhammer on the table top game. Be sides a MMORPG with guns I am really not a fan. I perfer the hand to hand combat.

Database82 · June 2006

If Blizzard tried to sue Mythic for copyright infringement all Mythic would have to do is slap them with a counter-suit and they would win Mythic has been around before the idea of Blizzard being a company even existed. As far as a Warhammer 40k idea goes I would love to play that but unfortunately that may never happen reasons being

A. You won't likely be able to play as a Space Marine because if at any point you choose not to obey orders you will likely be branded as a heretic, traitor etc.

B. How would you start? What chapter do you belong to?

The idea of Warhammer 40k being a mmo excites me but at the same time I doubt something like that would ever happen.

Volkmar · June 2006

Originally posted by Thanatosx33
Ok, warhammer looks realy awesome. But, you know what I would realy enjoy? A Warhammer 40,000 MMORPG, I think that would be a pretty awesome game if they were to make it. There is so much lore revolving around the warhammer 40k universe, and so much to work with. Also, since it would obviously involve a lot of PVP and different factions, world event options would be limitless. A vast universe to war over, now that would be badass.

Warhamemr 40k is not feasible to be an MMorpg period.

Not in its entirety. While in the fantasy it is possible to have elves, dwarves and humans banding together (heck! there are elves familiies living in the Empire!) the notion og an eldar, a human and a Tau going around together is ridicolous. Eldars are NOT welcome in human worlds, they are shot on sight. same for the rests. they might join up forces for a little while to fight a biggest threat, but such alliances always crumbles very fastly.

In addition, 40K "iconic" forces are all armed forces. While it is conceivable to be a middle age knight without being in the barracks all day as the middle ages idea of "standing force" was very different from nowadays, it isn't that a space marine or a eldar Aspect warrior would be allowed to go around freely, especially when carrying his ordinance. Like a modern marine cannot simply get his rifle, grenades and backpack and go for a stroll in new york city if not under direct command.

So, big chunck of what makes WH40k cool is gone, what is left is a nice Sci-Fi environment that is not described much in the table top game at all.... not a very good premise for a game now is it?

There are 2 solutions to this problem. 1) do it on a sector of the universe. Like the new Warhammer 40K RPG in production does, you do not take the whole universe, but a chunk of it. The p&p RPG, for example, will start with inquisitors and their retinue. You can become one of those. It will proceed with Rogue Traders and so on.

2) Make a MMOFPS or a MMORTS. those are much more feasible as a WH40K product.

Have a nice day

ELP_Spawn · June 2006

In addition, 40K "iconic" forces are all armed forces. While it is conceivable to be a middle age knight without being in the barracks all day as the middle ages idea of "standing force" was very different from nowadays, it isn't that a space marine or a eldar Aspect warrior would be allowed to go around freely, especially when carrying his ordinance. Like a modern marine cannot simply get his rifle, grenades and backpack and go for a stroll in new york city if not under direct command.

Well look at PlanetSide you dont need to have PvE, just get EXP from killing others.

Volkmar · June 2006

Originally posted by ELP_Spawn

In addition, 40K "iconic" forces are all armed forces. While it is conceivable to be a middle age knight without being in the barracks all day as the middle ages idea of "standing force" was very different from nowadays, it isn't that a space marine or a eldar Aspect warrior would be allowed to go around freely, especially when carrying his ordinance. Like a modern marine cannot simply get his rifle, grenades and backpack and go for a stroll in new york city if not under direct command.

Well look at PlanetSide you dont need to have PvE, just get EXP from killing others.

?? what PvE has to do with this?

Planetside is a MMoFPS. as such its model would fit WH40K very well indeed. it is the MMORPG that doesn't

Spoonthieve · June 2006

Well theres alot of ways you could get around that and make 40k an MMORPG. You could restict the player races so people can only play Imperium and Chaos, or have the player start off as a normal human and give him the options to eventually join the Imperial Guard, join a Space Marine chapter or become evil and defect to a Chaos cult.

I think a 40k MMORPG has huge amounts of potential, I can't see why they opted for the Warhammer version with so many fantasy MMORPGs out there already.

Bobtastic · June 2006

They could get around the race issue in a similar way that they did in RF Online. Just have them completely separate.

I do agree that it might be difficult to create content and keep the game 40k. I can't remember hearing/reading of any instances of regular Space Marines, or Imperial Guard wondering around or heading off on individual epic adventures. That only ever happens to major characters. But then again the same can be said in the world of Warhammer, altho it's slightly more plausible to imagine it happening it that world.

I think we'll just have to wait to see what happens with WAR, they may come up with the answers along the way!

necrofanatic · June 2006

Originally posted by Spoonthieve
Well theres alot of ways you could get around that and make 40k an MMORPG. You could restict the player races so people can only play Imperium and Chaos, or have the player start off as a normal human and give him the options to eventually join the Imperial Guard, join a Space Marine chapter or become evil and defect to a Chaos cult.

I think a 40k MMORPG has huge amounts of potential, I can't see why they opted for the Warhammer version with so many fantasy MMORPGs out there already.

Well I dont think you should limit it to those two. I would love to see all the races in the 40k universe in there on their own sides since that would be different from them always making alliances and other bs when there is this huge galaxy that is ripe in warfare with each race with it's own reason for fighting.I mean do u really believe that the alliances in WoW really should have been(tried but had to mention) ...Also it would present way more options which from what I see Mythic can handle(if it takes the game into it's helm) look at DAOC and all the classes and everything I think that they can pull it off if they do develop it.

borkks · June 2006

If you can make a Star Wars based MMO, then it's entirely possible to make a 40K-based MMO. In fact not only is it possible, but I would say not any more difficult than any other genre of MMO, at least technically. Now, pleasing all the table-top, Black Library nerds may not be possible, but then again, who really cares. You can't please them (*cough* a couple in this thread) anyway.

pearljam668 · June 2006

i would love to see a 40k mmo, but they would have to do it right, im kinda sick of fantasy games

Volkmar · June 2006

Originally posted by borkks

If you can make a Star Wars based MMO, then it's entirely possible to make a 40K-based MMO. In fact not only is it possible, but I would say not any more difficult than any other genre of MMO, at least technically. Now, pleasing all the table-top, Black Library nerds may not be possible, but then again, who really cares. You can't please them (*cough* a couple in this thread) anyway.

how Star Wars and WH40K compares exactly? In the first we have a multi-racial universe where many races are spacefarers and live on different planets. Many planets have many races coliving peacefully on the same world with no or little problems. Racial diversity is one of the strong points of the universe.

In warhammer 40k we have a handful of races (in comparison to SW hordes) that basically are all isolationists paranoid and xenophobic bastards (with the possible exception of the Tau).

In SW it is not only possible, but probable to have a wookie, a twi-lek, a human and an ithorian on the same ship acting as crew. in warhammer 40K? not from what the tabletop tells us.

Is it possible to make a WH40k MMorpg? yes, but. A setting like the one used in WAR, that permits the players to see something more than their own racial home, is even more unrealistic in a WH40k setting. At least from what i gathered in the years. A MMorpg about a certain part of the universe is possible, like a Necromunda style MMorpg, sure. Or concentrating on the human worlds, or the eldar worlds or whatever race worlds.

It is no wonder after all, that even the P&P RPG game in development will NOT follow the Warhammer Famtasy route to give you most of world available to you (recently a skaven supplement has been released permitting you to play the ratmen, yei!) but will concentrace on certain pieces of the universe.

borkks · June 2006

originally posted by Volkmar

how Star Wars and WH40K compares exactly? In the first we have a multi-racial universe much snipped...

Other than the fact that they are neither your average run of the mill hack and slash dungeon crawling, Fighter - Rogue - Mage style RPG, nothing. I think I understand what you are saying and you make sense. My point is that a MMO "based" on W40K is no more impossible than one based on a rather bad 1970's screenplay by George Lucus.

I know, I'm ducking the SW fans.

originally posted by Volkmar

In warhammer 40k we have a handful of races (in comparison to SW hordes) that basically are all isolationists paranoid and xenophobic bastards (with the possible exception of the Tau).

This is not true at least from an Orky point of view. Since we're going down this route, to quote the Warhammer 40,000 Ork codex:

But once in a generation an ork leader will rise who is powerful enough to defeat his rivals and dominate their tribes. His success will draw others and soon a great Ork Waaagh! is underway, a movement of millions; part migration, part holy jihad as the Orks seek new worlds to conquer and races to enslave. The violence of Ork warriors unleashed is truly terrifying and the ferocity of the Ork Waagh! evokes fear even amidst the holy spires of Terra.

Additionally :

The Warhammer 40,000 game world is most readily characterized as a gothic science-fantasy setting. The central and most popular elements of the Warhammer 40,000 universe are the Space Marines, anachronistic combinations of sci-fi super-soldiers and fantasy knights and the finest warriors of the Imperium of Mankind, a dystopian and degenerate galaxy-spanning empire.

The physical setting of this story is the Materium, with all action here in the Milky Way Galaxy. Much of this is controlled by the The Imperium of Man, though it is not the only galactic denizen. Other races include the Orks, a greenskinned trollike race, and the Eldar, the former rulers of a great empire. A dynamic, galaxy-spanning story line is possible because of a separate plane of existence, the Immaterium or "Warp." The Warp is described as a realm of thought, where desires and emotions can take physical form, and with currents and eddies that make traveling vast interstellar distances difficult, yet possible.

originally posted by Volkmar

In SW it is not only possible, but probable to have a wookie, a twi-lek, a human and an ithorian on the same ship acting as crew. in warhammer 40K? not from what the tabletop tells us.

Aside from the obvious fact that there are no wookies in W40k, I'm not sure I get your point? It is very possible to have more than two sides in a conflict, no?

originally posted by Volkmar

Is it possible to make a WH40k MMorpg? yes, but. A setting like the one used in WAR, that permits the players to see something more than their own racial home, is even more unrealistic in a WH40k setting.

Again, I would disagree; W40k is about the interaction of the as you eloquently put it, xenophobic tribes. It's this very sense of isolationism or rumbling toward segregation that creates tension and makes for a damn good story. Also ANY MMORPG that is "based" on the W40k or even WF series will by definition be required to digress from the original. It's a different genre, that's a given.

originally posted by Volkmar

At least from what i gathered in the years. A MMorpg about a certain part of the universe is possible, like a Necromunda style MMorpg, sure. Or concentrating on the human worlds, or the eldar worlds or whatever race worlds.

It is no wonder after all, that even the P&P RPG game in development will NOT follow the Warhammer Famtasy route to give you most of world available to you (recently a skaven supplement has been released permitting you to play the ratmen, yei!) but will concentrace on certain pieces of the universe.

Of course. I would imagine this to be a given.

Volkmar · June 2006

borkks,

What i meant is:

In WAR you have 3 factions, the Elves, Humans and Dwarves that even if with their differences can collaborate together. The Lore support this. they did it in the past and Elves and Dwarves both live in the Empire (having humans on Elves land is more a stretch, but human merchants surely travel there, dwarves? the elves have nothing against the stunties... it is the dwarves that never forget...).

In WH40K, the races that compose the universe are XENOPHOBIC. Meaning they hate everybody else that is not their own race.

It is literally impossible for an Eldar to stroll in peace on the Earth! Or of a space marine reaching one of the Eldar Craft World and be welcome in it. they simply don't. that is what i meant with paranoid and isolationist.

Of course the humans have a galactic-spanning empire of humans. aliens are not tolerated and killed on sight.

The eldar were the leader of a galactic empire of eldars. other races were not included.

So a starship crew is composed either of all humans or all eldars or all orks or all whatever.

While DAoC worked because each Realm was composed of many different races fighting together, WH40k could not. Human Empire has just humans. Eldar craftworld has just eldar, nothing else. You may think it still could work with 3 factions, but i would find it pretty limited to have just 2-3 races out of the couple dozens out there. Plus each new race you add would basically need their own chunk of the universe accessible only to them, so making adding new races a work as big as creating the whole game.

In WAR, they can add a new race to one of the 2 alliances and they know that this newcomers can freely move to the other races if they wish so, the content of the game is constantly increasing. By having lots of compartments (and they would be many more than the 3 of DAoC), content would NOT be increasing when you add a race if not for the members of the newfound race! As more races are added, increasing the total content for everybody reaches impossibility plus population would become so rarified that you would have couple dozens people playing each faction.

So, bottom line: my statement just merely meant to say that a WH40K MMorpg would not include the totality of the IP like WAR is planning to do (in time) because it is simply impossible to do so in a MMorpg. you can have pieces of such universe, yes, but not the totality. You could have totality of the world represented in a MMORTS or, maybe, a MMOFPS.

borkks · June 2006

Ah, that makes sense. Yes including the totality of the IP of 40k would be a huge challenge. I wasn't aware tht they were intending to do so with WF. I'm not 100% convinced even THAT would be possible, or desirable to be honest.

necrofanatic · June 2006

Why does it seem like everybody wants 40k to be a traditional MMORPG? I think we need another revolution since the traditional method will definitly not work with the current forumla(going out doing quests as a guradsmen just doesnt make sense....), and also to the race problems..I already said we should have a whole giant war going on since it is Warhammer and especially 40k where everyday is a war. And for those that want to see some diversity in races..easy just play Tau since they have many races incorparated into their empire.

sl4y3r6363 · June 2006

i wouldnt like 40k as much i dont like the table top game as much and i dont like future mmos as much as fantasy past ones

Coldmeat · June 2006

Well, as Necro stated, any WH40K MMO would have to deviate from the standard "get quest to kill foozles, to get better gear, to get more levels, to kill bigger foozles, to raid Khornes Temple" formula. If they did it as a strictly RvR game, with randomly generated objectives, for example, a Chaos artifact is found on some planet, and Space Marine, Eldar, etc forces clash trying to recover, or destroy it. With skill based advancement coming through successfully completing objectives and the like.

It would definitely take a company willing to break the EQ in Space/Rome/Kansas mentality taken by most companies. Of course, the success of WoW makes this all the more unlikely, but a man can dream, I suppose.

Regarding the xenophobic nature of the sides in WH40K, while it's certainly not the norm, I can recall a couple cases where two sides have created momentary alliances in the face of a greater threat. Mainly the Humans, and Eldar, though I recall Chaos having used the Orks to further their aims as well. Granted the Tyranid wouldn't, but I don't know that they'd make a very good player race either.

HuztlaMan · June 2006

I agree with their decision to develop a game that doesnt produce as much shock value. Yes the gaming community needs a change, but why change something that intrigues us all so much. Elves, dwarves, orcs...etc fantasy MMO's are whats popular because its l33t. Give them time to grab the market, then they can do what they like with it.

necrofanatic · June 2006

Originally posted by Coldmeat
Well, as Necro stated, any WH40K MMO would have to deviate from the standard "get quest to kill foozles, to get better gear, to get more levels, to kill bigger foozles, to raid Khornes Temple" formula. If they did it as a strictly RvR game, with randomly generated objectives, for example, a Chaos artifact is found on some planet, and Space Marine, Eldar, etc forces clash trying to recover, or destroy it. With skill based advancement coming through successfully completing objectives and the like.

It would definitely take a company willing to break the EQ in Space/Rome/Kansas mentality taken by most companies. Of course, the success of WoW makes this all the more unlikely, but a man can dream, I suppose.

Regarding the xenophobic nature of the sides in WH40K, while it's certainly not the norm, I can recall a couple cases where two sides have created momentary alliances in the face of a greater threat. Mainly the Humans, and Eldar, though I recall Chaos having used the Orks to further their aims as well. Granted the Tyranid wouldn't, but I don't know that they'd make a very good player race either.

see this is a pretty good idea and it would be a lot of RvR since it's war but there can still be some PvE such as the chaos artifact and as for leveling it should be something of a rank system not by how many but by the deeds u do (i.e. quests) and with these new ranks you of course get better gear have to. If u can actually get the respect of ppl and hehehe be a commisar and execute those that are annoying the fuck out of you that would be pretty cool but it of course has to have a reason otherwise some kid will go hahaha I AM L33TNESS INCARNATED !!! LOOK AT THESE NOOBS .For this they will be punished by npc's that will act as a GM of sorts. ok I think I'm done ranting critsize ideas at the fullest.

Shayde · June 2006

I'd give my left nut.

And my right.

Too many damn fantasy games already. Only playing WAR because it is freaking Warhammer. Always loved 40k universe better.

Don't kid yourselves... it CAN be done. Just takes doing it.

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