Originally posted by pkim96 Because I knew a lot of people love this game, I was really curious to try it out. I also really liked the idea that you can switch and play a different class so easily. So a week ago, I bought it, installed it (takes 3+ hours) and played it.
The first hour was siimply horrible. There is no tutorial and no handholding at all. Considering how much effort most MMO's put into helping newcomers get integrated smoothly into the game, FFXI was a shock. Frustrating and horrible to the extreme. I tried to talk to at least 20 people before someone actually helped me. Most of them didn't speak english. I had a massive headache and the sheer relief I felt at finding someone helpful was insane.
The interface is possibly the absolute worst I've ever encountered on the PC. After playing well designed games like EQ2 and WoW, I couldn't believe that FFXI's interface was such crap. It is so horrible that I can't even begin to describe it. I was swearing at the computer because the controls of this game is totally counter to every other game on my computer. It's ridiculous.
Once I did get a handle on the basics, this is the first MMO where I felt like I was grinding right from the very beginning.
WoW, EQ2, CoH, GW, etc....even SWG have great gameplay right at the beginning. FFXI was a huge disappointment and I'm so happy to trash it from my hard drive. I'm normally not so abusive, but my god, this game was just so bad and so disappointing.
I'm happy for the people who found a home here, but I just wish I could forget it already.
First, this game is MADE to be played with a ps2 style game pad. Once you understand the macro system and get a joy pad the interface is no better then the trash games you seem to like (WoW & worst game ever made ahem EQ2).
Bottom line is that FFXI is for the hardcore, serious player. its not for the guy who wants to hand in 3 rat hairs and ding. when you start the game, you are greated by a great intro, far better then any ive seen, you get a coupon and then you begin your life in ffxi. You need to figure out where to go, YOU NEED TO EXPLORE.
FFXI is my EQ2, the game has so much in common with old school eq its not even funny. Given the fact that they took so much from EQLive and some how managed to make a living breathing world that feels unique is amazing. I remember when i first played DaOC and said to myself "man, this is CHEAP", i never felt like that towards ffxi, everything in ffxi from graphics, to sound to game systems is top notch...
Since your such a big wow fan, ill put it so you understand. L2PLAY N00B.
Well, I played FFX and that was awesome, best single player RPG ever! but when i tried the online version? hmmmm, a bit disappointing, but once you get into the game, it's not bad. DEFINATELY not worth the money though
Originally posted by hyperpotato Well, I played FFX and that was awesome, best single player RPG ever! but when i tried the online version? hmmmm, a bit disappointing, but once you get into the game, it's not bad. DEFINATELY not worth the money though
FFXI isnt the "Online Version" of FFX.
FFX is one of the worst FF's ever made.. Aparently you havn't tried any of the others.
I havnt had a clunky feel to the xbox 360 yet i liek it only problem is i aint got a usb keyboard yet and thats just kills me because it takes like 5minutes to chat with the controller lol but once i get a keyboard im set.
The first 10 lvls suck but after that the game is great, it is just grinding (as i remember) but its actually fun to kill things unlike other games where killing is just trivial. and when i played (thinking about going back) the community was nice and full of mature people. im sorry, but i dont know how you can have that bad of an experience, my first few hours were great.
I'm just curious, what did you find so terrible about the interface? The only MMO's I've played for any serious amount of time (Longer than a beta or free trial) would be EQ from 99-2003, 6 months of EQOA, and about 18 months of FFXI on and off since it's release, but I've never had any real trouble with getting anything done. Can just Ctrl-(key) to bring up most menus, and moving is easy enough with WASD and a Mouse. (Tried using a Ps1 controller for it, but just didn't feel right on PC.)
The starting controls they give you are terrible, I'll admit that. When I first started playing the game, I could barely move around until I fiqured out I could turn the keyboard into compact mode to give it an actually workable control scheme. Honestly, they should've just had the default as WASD, as the mouse control is pretty terrible for anything other than running with one hand through a zone where you don't need to worry about aggro, and unless you eating or reading a book or something, it's not a big deal.
I dont see why everyone complains about the controls? I NEVER touch my mouse.
Use the number pad to move around, use your thumb on the arrow buttons to move the camera. Hit the - in the top right of the number pad to bring up the menu, and use the arrow keys to scroll through it. What's so hard about that?
Originally posted by Darktongue Id agree with op. On PC and 360 its terrible. Clunky and ugly with no real intuitive interface or controls. It looks as ugly and unweildy as it plays. Of course some fanboi will explain its our lack of intelligence that causes us to fail at this game but oh well..i wish i was stupid enough to forget this game lol
Well, I won't say it's a lack of "intelligence". I will say that it's either a plain lack of patience or interest in learning the interface. No, it's not the most obvious interface created, but it provides everything you need and you'll find most everything you need within a couple menu selections.
Also, the fact that 100s of thousands of people are playing this, some since the Japanese release (1 year before North America release) ... and we've all done just fine, having had to start from the same exact circumstances, having to learn the same things as any other player.. I'd have to say that it's certainly not impossible to learn. Far from it.
Maybe the game just isn't for you? That's always a possibility too you know :-)
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Originally posted by pkim96 Wow, considering how negative I was in my post, I expect a lot more flames. I guess the FFXI community actually is pretty good. I really do know that a lot of people love this game...that's why I was disappointed enough to post a message like that.
Yes, I do realize I'm complaining about the newbie levels and I didn't even scratch the content. But my experience was just that bad. It was so bad that I was seriously happy when I watched the progress bar of the uninstaller while it was trashing the 7 gigabytes off my hard drive.
Let me also point out that I'm a long, long, long time MMO player. UO, AO, SWG, EQ, WoW, CoH, Eve, GW, EQ2. Although I admit my tolerance for grinding is much lower than it was 5+ years ago, the FFXI combat system made it feel like a grind from the very beginning. Strangely, I think the macro system was partly to blame because it made it even more mindless.
I wasn't exaggerating about the lack of helpful people. For quite a while, I stood in a crowd by the first house entrance...maybe 10-20 people, and I asked questions in local chat. No one answered me. I moved to another group, and no one answered me. Eventually I started sending tells to everyone I ran past. Half of them ignored me. The other half replied back and said they didn't speak english.
Mentoring system? I wasn't exposed to anything like that. If it's built into the game, they should make it more obvious. Yes, I admit that I'm not the manual reading kind of person. I normally prefer to dive headfirst, but there was just so little for me to grab hold of. Much of the problem was the HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE interface. After navigating to the quest panel a hundred times, I wanted to shoot myself.
Anyways, enough complaining, heh. Sorry to bash so much, but I had a lot of steam to blow off.
FFXI has, hands down, the best MMO community I've ever seen in an MMO. Bar none.
Incidentally, I've played every MMO you listed there, as well, except UO. Love AO's game system, implants, nanos, etc.. and really liked EQII until they started to turn it into WoW.
The early levels of FFXI are intended to get you used to the game itself. The fighting is very basic, because if they were to hit you with all the complexities and dynamics that come into play later on right from the start... you'd be overwhelmed. You don't get any weapon skills (special attacks based upon the weapon you're using) until your skill with that weapon type reaches at least level 10. Those add a bit more color to the fighting..
Also, for the first 10-12 levels or so, you're best off soloing, and the mobs are scaled to that type of fight. In fact, it's unlikely that you'll even leave your own "backyard" - or the area immediately outside your home city - until you're beyond those levels. At that point, you'll notice a marked increase in mob difficulty.. as now they're scaled for a group battle, not solo. That's when you "graduate" so to speak, to the next level of gameplay.. and you begin to learn about group dynamics.. what your role is in a party.. aggro control, skill-chains, etc. etc.. And it just becomes more and more involved as you get higher in levels.. new weapon skills and job abilities (job-specific skills) are added to your arsenal...
The battle system is really among the best I've ever experienced in any MMO. It's delay-based which at first seems mindlessly automated.. but as you get higher in level and you realize the fights become harder, you can recognize that the delays are beneficial in that they allow time for the party to communicate, coordinate skill-chains etc. etc. Unlike many other MMOs I've played where the fighting barely comes to much more than hack-n-slash.. FFXI literally forces strategy and coordination... A "kill-em-all" hack-n-slash free-for-all mentality *will* get your party killed when fighting mobs comparable to your group's level. I guarantee it. Knowing your job and how to play it properly in a group is very important and, I find, too often under-appreciated by some.
Another thing to understand... There's no "hurry" in FFXI. It's a long game with easily a few years' worth of content.. quests, storyline, missions, jobs to unlock, crafting and on and on.... If you come to the game (and I'm not saying you did) with the only goal of grinding as fast as possible... it's not for you. You *will* be pulling your hair out.
The interface is difficult to get used to as it's not like the traditional MMO interface. But you'll find FFXI is not the traditional MMO. It takes getting used to, and I've played with both a controller and now a keyboard. At first I thought I couldn't play it if it didn't have the controller option.. now I'm playing with a keyboard (on the "compact" setup (which provides W,S,A,D movement, etc) and, without even needing the mouse, I find it's now much more enjoyable.. I'll never use a gamepad again.
Adding to the "FFXI is not a traditional MMO"... It is, for all intents and purposes, an online Final Fantasy game, only with real players behind each party member. It has all the depth, all the detail and all the nuance typical of a game from the series. There is pretty much *nothing* in the game that doesn't have a reason for existing. Nothing is mere eye-candy.. Weather, elements, time of day, etc. etc.. all have an impact on the game somehow. I think you'd be rather impressed - maybe even overwhelmed - by just how much FFXI offers once you get into it.
However, it is slow-starting and can be confusing... but it's not impossible to get past and once you get the basics down, you're on your way. If you were to start a character on Pandemonium, I would gladly take some time to show you around and help you out. I'm pretty sure that with a better introduction, you'd maybe develop a different opinion of it . I've had my frustrations with it... but I always come back. It's just such a rewarding game in so many ways.
As for standing in the middle of a crowd near one of the residential areas.... Were they, by chance, just standing in one spot and had brown sack icons next to their names? If so... then they were players who'd put up their personal Bazaars (private shops) and went AFK... which would explain why they didn't respond. You likely weren't being ignored :-).
In any case.. I'll make you an offer... If you would like to give it another try, send me a private message here. I will get you a worldpass to Pandemonium..so you can create a character on there... Create one, let me know who you are and when youplay and I'll take time to give you a proper "FFXI Welcome" to Vana'diel.
If not, then that's fine... You've had enough MMO experience and I'm sure you'll find something that better suits what you're seeking in an MMO. Either way, enjoy!!
/salute
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Originally posted by Awesomeo You do know that this is the eleventh Final Fantasy made, so why the hell would they put a tutorial in, thats just stupid. Also, on the 360 the grapics are by far the best on any mmo, with a few exceptions of course.
The game play may seem strange to you but thats how all Final Fantasy games play like, and they've been going for a few decades now so they must being doing something right.
ummm......yeah this game doesnt really need a tutorial...but you do know that every single final fantasy was different and ffxi being the eleventh has 2 things in common with other final fantasies...there are chocobos you can ride...and mogs... THATS IT!
I've heard that FFXI has a great community from many posts, but I rarely ever saw any evidence of it in-game in my 19 months of playing the game. It wasn't even that it started good, then declined over time, it seemed to just start out as bleh.
At best, I found that most players had the attitude if it's not against the rules of the game, it's alright to do. This was a shock to me coming from my EQ days, as in FFXI people had no respect for anything camp, be it for farming, exp, NM, or HNM. Hell, I've had people steal my mob mid fight even, just because the thing went from claimed to unclaimed for a moment. And the worst part was I expected that from the people in the game, as I'd never seen them do otherwise.
At worst, you had people doing everything they could to get ahead, from buying gil (which the game has a rather large amount of, but I guess nowadays, almost all do.) to using various hacks.
Maybe it was just my server, I played on Midger, but I never really thought the community rose above average. It wasn't better than something like WoW and some free games, but not as good as EQ and UO were to me in my their glory days.
Originally posted by Teioh I've heard that FFXI has a great community from many posts, but I rarely ever saw any evidence of it in-game in my 19 months of playing the game. It wasn't even that it started good, then declined over time, it seemed to just start out as bleh.
At best, I found that most players had the attitude if it's not against the rules of the game, it's alright to do. This was a shock to me coming from my EQ days, as in FFXI people had no respect for anything camp, be it for farming, exp, NM, or HNM. Hell, I've had people steal my mob mid fight even, just because the thing went from claimed to unclaimed for a moment. And the worst part was I expected that from the people in the game, as I'd never seen them do otherwise.
At worst, you had people doing everything they could to get ahead, from buying gil (which the game has a rather large amount of, but I guess nowadays, almost all do.) to using various hacks.
Maybe it was just my server, I played on Midger, but I never really thought the community rose above average. It wasn't better than something like WoW and some free games, but not as good as EQ and UO were to me in my their glory days.
How was your Linkshell? People will always be dicks, but sometimes the Linkshell can make all the difference. And maybe it WAS your server... I played on Asura and didn't experience half the things you described. Or maybe I wasn't aware of it... Meh. I still think the community was a lot better than other games.
Comments
First, this game is MADE to be played with a ps2 style game pad. Once you understand the macro system and get a joy pad the interface is no better then the trash games you seem to like (WoW & worst game ever made ahem EQ2).
Bottom line is that FFXI is for the hardcore, serious player. its not for the guy who wants to hand in 3 rat hairs and ding. when you start the game, you are greated by a great intro, far better then any ive seen, you get a coupon and then you begin your life in ffxi. You need to figure out where to go, YOU NEED TO EXPLORE.
FFXI is my EQ2, the game has so much in common with old school eq its not even funny. Given the fact that they took so much from EQLive and some how managed to make a living breathing world that feels unique is amazing. I remember when i first played DaOC and said to myself "man, this is CHEAP", i never felt like that towards ffxi, everything in ffxi from graphics, to sound to game systems is top notch...
Since your such a big wow fan, ill put it so you understand. L2PLAY N00B.
Rites of the Four Horsemen
http://www.rotfh.com
FFX is one of the worst FF's ever made.. Aparently you havn't tried any of the others.
The starting controls they give you are terrible, I'll admit that. When I first started playing the game, I could barely move around until I fiqured out I could turn the keyboard into compact mode to give it an actually workable control scheme. Honestly, they should've just had the default as WASD, as the mouse control is pretty terrible for anything other than running with one hand through a zone where you don't need to worry about aggro, and unless you eating or reading a book or something, it's not a big deal.
Use the number pad to move around, use your thumb on the arrow buttons to move the camera. Hit the - in the top right of the number pad to bring up the menu, and use the arrow keys to scroll through it. What's so hard about that?
Also, the fact that 100s of thousands of people are playing this, some since the Japanese release (1 year before North America release) ... and we've all done just fine, having had to start from the same exact circumstances, having to learn the same things as any other player.. I'd have to say that it's certainly not impossible to learn. Far from it.
Maybe the game just isn't for you? That's always a possibility too you know :-)
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Incidentally, I've played every MMO you listed there, as well, except UO. Love AO's game system, implants, nanos, etc.. and really liked EQII until they started to turn it into WoW.
The early levels of FFXI are intended to get you used to the game itself. The fighting is very basic, because if they were to hit you with all the complexities and dynamics that come into play later on right from the start... you'd be overwhelmed. You don't get any weapon skills (special attacks based upon the weapon you're using) until your skill with that weapon type reaches at least level 10. Those add a bit more color to the fighting..
Also, for the first 10-12 levels or so, you're best off soloing, and the mobs are scaled to that type of fight. In fact, it's unlikely that you'll even leave your own "backyard" - or the area immediately outside your home city - until you're beyond those levels. At that point, you'll notice a marked increase in mob difficulty.. as now they're scaled for a group battle, not solo. That's when you "graduate" so to speak, to the next level of gameplay.. and you begin to learn about group dynamics.. what your role is in a party.. aggro control, skill-chains, etc. etc.. And it just becomes more and more involved as you get higher in levels.. new weapon skills and job abilities (job-specific skills) are added to your arsenal...
The battle system is really among the best I've ever experienced in any MMO. It's delay-based which at first seems mindlessly automated.. but as you get higher in level and you realize the fights become harder, you can recognize that the delays are beneficial in that they allow time for the party to communicate, coordinate skill-chains etc. etc. Unlike many other MMOs I've played where the fighting barely comes to much more than hack-n-slash.. FFXI literally forces strategy and coordination... A "kill-em-all" hack-n-slash free-for-all mentality *will* get your party killed when fighting mobs comparable to your group's level. I guarantee it. Knowing your job and how to play it properly in a group is very important and, I find, too often under-appreciated by some.
Another thing to understand... There's no "hurry" in FFXI. It's a long game with easily a few years' worth of content.. quests, storyline, missions, jobs to unlock, crafting and on and on.... If you come to the game (and I'm not saying you did) with the only goal of grinding as fast as possible... it's not for you. You *will* be pulling your hair out.
The interface is difficult to get used to as it's not like the traditional MMO interface. But you'll find FFXI is not the traditional MMO. It takes getting used to, and I've played with both a controller and now a keyboard. At first I thought I couldn't play it if it didn't have the controller option.. now I'm playing with a keyboard (on the "compact" setup (which provides W,S,A,D movement, etc) and, without even needing the mouse, I find it's now much more enjoyable.. I'll never use a gamepad again.
Adding to the "FFXI is not a traditional MMO"... It is, for all intents and purposes, an online Final Fantasy game, only with real players behind each party member. It has all the depth, all the detail and all the nuance typical of a game from the series. There is pretty much *nothing* in the game that doesn't have a reason for existing. Nothing is mere eye-candy.. Weather, elements, time of day, etc. etc.. all have an impact on the game somehow. I think you'd be rather impressed - maybe even overwhelmed - by just how much FFXI offers once you get into it.
However, it is slow-starting and can be confusing... but it's not impossible to get past and once you get the basics down, you're on your way. If you were to start a character on Pandemonium, I would gladly take some time to show you around and help you out. I'm pretty sure that with a better introduction, you'd maybe develop a different opinion of it . I've had my frustrations with it... but I always come back. It's just such a rewarding game in so many ways.
As for standing in the middle of a crowd near one of the residential areas.... Were they, by chance, just standing in one spot and had brown sack icons next to their names? If so... then they were players who'd put up their personal Bazaars (private shops) and went AFK... which would explain why they didn't respond. You likely weren't being ignored :-).
In any case.. I'll make you an offer...
If you would like to give it another try, send me a private message here. I will get you a worldpass to Pandemonium..so you can create a character on there... Create one, let me know who you are and when youplay and I'll take time to give you a proper "FFXI Welcome" to Vana'diel.
If not, then that's fine... You've had enough MMO experience and I'm sure you'll find something that better suits what you're seeking in an MMO. Either way, enjoy!!
/salute
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
At best, I found that most players had the attitude if it's not against the rules of the game, it's alright to do. This was a shock to me coming from my EQ days, as in FFXI people had no respect for anything camp, be it for farming, exp, NM, or HNM. Hell, I've had people steal my mob mid fight even, just because the thing went from claimed to unclaimed for a moment. And the worst part was I expected that from the people in the game, as I'd never seen them do otherwise.
At worst, you had people doing everything they could to get ahead, from buying gil (which the game has a rather large amount of, but I guess nowadays, almost all do.) to using various hacks.
Maybe it was just my server, I played on Midger, but I never really thought the community rose above average. It wasn't better than something like WoW and some free games, but not as good as EQ and UO were to me in my their glory days.
*Cough cough* RFO. *Cough*