I don't think its a west/east thing. Look at GW its a "west" game since its made by a US company but its marketed/published by NCSoft and "east" company. It looks quite good and has an "eastern" flavor I suppose.
But I do agree Vanguard doesn't looke to different from EQ2 to me from what I have seen.
Screens from WAR look pretty good so far if that means much.
Do you honestly think the entire Korean gaming population is THAT sadistic as to subject themselves to constant grinding and ENJOY it? Sure WoW may have the largest population of all MMOs, but the Korean gaming industry is rapidly rising and expanding. Millions and millions of Asians are becoming hooked onto Korean games, and you're exposed to no more than 10% of it.
We're not the only people who hate repetition. It's human nature to want change. "Variety is the spice of life." NOT "Variety is the spice of Americans." Everyone wants change.
So amidst the gargantuan success Korean games have achieved in Asia, to say that they're all just one big grindfest is basically saying that Koreans aren't human. Or just a bunch of psycho robots.
Now, I'm not saying Korean games don't have grind. Some Korean games DO involve more grinding than others. OH NO! That alone ruins the entire game! I hate all Korean games!
It seems to me grinding is the one big thing that people hate Korean games for. Is that all you care about? Fast leveling? Reaching max level in a month? Oh dear, you've played the game for a month and you're only at level 30. You're not willing to spend the time and energy into a character that's WORTH bragging about. A max level character in Lineage II is MUCH more to brag about than a max level in WoW. (I'm not bagging or praising either games. I personally dislike both...)
Another complaint is the fact that everyone looks the same. Then make yourself different. Invest time and energy. Get to max level. Make yourself known in-game. It takes work to be different. The same goes for real life. You can try to wear different clothes or act a certain way, but isn't that's what everyone else is doing? "You non-conformists are all alike." Forgive me for sounding cheesy, but it's not the external customization that makes the character.
And this is all regarding those Korean games you HAVE played (the ones that come to America). Don't forget, there are a buttload of MMOs in Asia you HAVEN'T seen. As much as you think you know, there's a whole 'nother WORLD of MMOs out there.
Originally posted by Jodando Do you honestly think the entire Korean gaming population is THAT sadistic as to subject themselves to constant grinding and ENJOY it? Sure WoW may have the largest population of all MMOs, but the Korean gaming industry is rapidly rising and expanding. Millions and millions of Asians are becoming hooked onto Korean games, and you're exposed to no more than 10% of it.
We're not the only people who hate repetition. It's human nature to want change. "Variety is the spice of life." NOT "Variety is the spice of Americans." Everyone wants change.
So amidst the gargantuan success Korean games have achieved in Asia, to say that they're all just one big grindfest is basically saying that Koreans aren't human. Or just a bunch of psycho robots.
Now, I'm not saying Korean games don't have grind. Some Korean games DO involve more grinding than others. OH NO! That alone ruins the entire game! I hate all Korean games!
It seems to me grinding is the one big thing that people hate Korean games for. Is that all you care about? Fast leveling? Reaching max level in a month? Oh dear, you've played the game for a month and you're only at level 30. You're not willing to spend the time and energy into a character that's WORTH bragging about. A max level character in Lineage II is MUCH more to brag about than a max level in WoW. (I'm not bagging or praising either games. I personally dislike both...)
Another complaint is the fact that everyone looks the same. Then make yourself different. Invest time and energy. Get to max level. Make yourself known in-game. It takes work to be different. The same goes for real life. You can try to wear different clothes or act a certain way, but isn't that's what everyone else is doing? "You non-conformists are all alike." Forgive me for sounding cheesy, but it's not the external customization that makes the character.
And this is all regarding those Korean games you HAVE played (the ones that come to America). Don't forget, there are a buttload of MMOs in Asia you HAVEN'T seen. As much as you think you know, there's a whole 'nother WORLD of MMOs out there.
Wow... this was a lot longer than I expected.
Hmm I don't know about being pyscho but I am pretty certain that Koreans are robots. I saw one the other say and he had sparks coming out his ass.
I've been trying to tell people for months about how the new crop of Korean Games are badass; but they too busy taking a dump on my posts to even read. People on these forums are just too prejudice about anything that isn't downright and EQ clone grindfest (BTW the grind in EQ is worse then almost anything made in Korea). That video is probably closed beta/post alpha work, definetly not the finished product and it still looks like it would be fun to play with WASD control if you didn't notice and more immersive fighting. That alone should take it a notch or 2 above Lineage 2.
BTW I don't think many people understand the difference between an Asian Run company and a US Run company where they both have offices in the US. The US company is usually deadline oriented and will have whatever work is done by the deadline. The Asian run US development staff usually tries to be deadline oriented, but they will push it back if they need to make the game look just right.
Originally posted by Ashkent Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by godpuppet Cant say that Korean MMO's look better. Western MMO's definately lead the way in creativity on all MMO aspects.
But I can say MMO's in general are on the decline. Fantasy MMO's seem to all be degenerates of EQ + LOTR and Sci-fi MMO's seem largely untapped.
There are some Gems im waiting for: Conan & Fallen Earth.
I cant stand Korean MMO's, I hate the anime style.
far from it. the korean marker leads on creativity. They have MMORPG's on close about everything. every sport you can imagine, racing, shooter mmo's. everything. not even 1/3rd comes to the west. trust me mate, do some research on foreign mmo's and you will see that the koreans are far ahead of us.
but all of those games are crap or just grind fests. when you start churning out anything at that high rate, quality goes down the toilet.
Please, western games are far far from quality.
There is one big title western game that has made any headway at all in sales and thats WoW. Just about everything else has had quality issues of some sort or another.
Look on the list to the left here and find all the quality western designed games.
SWG? nope. EQII, well if they stop revamping it maybe, AC? nope - outdated they let the quality go to hell, AC2? oops nope dead, D&DO? lol not even close, Horizons? Dark and Light? Do you guys honestly think LotR is going to be a "quality" title based on Turbines record??? lol hmmmm dunno what to say here. (techically speaking Sony NA's parent company is Japanese but EQII and SWG flopped and shut down in Asia)
I'm not saying Asian games are "better" but western games have a solid problem with quality. It sucks and western companies keeping rushing out games half finished or just plain old broken.
All of the solid, quality and inovative games are not made by American companies. Or they are published by NCSoft a Korean company that ensures everything they publish at least works.
Originally posted by Torak Originally posted by Ashkent Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by godpuppet Cant say that Korean MMO's look better. Western MMO's definately lead the way in creativity on all MMO aspects.
But I can say MMO's in general are on the decline. Fantasy MMO's seem to all be degenerates of EQ + LOTR and Sci-fi MMO's seem largely untapped.
There are some Gems im waiting for: Conan & Fallen Earth.
I cant stand Korean MMO's, I hate the anime style.
far from it. the korean marker leads on creativity. They have MMORPG's on close about everything. every sport you can imagine, racing, shooter mmo's. everything. not even 1/3rd comes to the west. trust me mate, do some research on foreign mmo's and you will see that the koreans are far ahead of us.
but all of those games are crap or just grind fests. when you start churning out anything at that high rate, quality goes down the toilet.
Please, western games are far far from quality.
There is one big title western game that has made any headway at all in sales and thats WoW. Just about everything else has had quality issues of some sort or another.
Look on the list to the left here and find all the quality western designed games.
SWG? nope. EQII, well if they stop revamping it maybe, AC? nope - outdated they let the quality go to hell, AC2? oops nope dead, D&DO? lol not even close, Horizons? Dark and Light? Do you guys honestly think LotR is going to be a "quality" title based on Turbines record??? lol hmmmm dunno what to say here. (techically speaking Sony NA's parent company is Japanese but EQII and SWG flopped and shut down in Asia)
I'm not saying Asian games are "better" but western games have a solid problem with quality. It sucks and western companies keeping rushing out games half finished or just plain old broken.
All of the solid, quality and inovative games are not made by American companies. Or they are published by NCSoft a Korean company that ensures everything they publish at least works.
Ryzom, Eve, FFXI, L2, CoH, GW, CoV
Three of those titles were designed and created and made up by Western companioes. I will grant you that NCSoft is probably the most innovative MMO publisher out there, but they are not the developers.
Looking at your list its 50/50 east/west as far people actually working on the game. Well actually ryzom = french and EvE = iceland so its really 33/33/33.
Originally posted by gestalt11 Three of those titles were designed and created and made up by Western companioes. I will grant you that NCSoft is probably the most innovative MMO publisher out there, but they are not the developers.
Looking at your list its 50/50 east/west as far people actually working on the game. Well actually ryzom = french and EvE = iceland so its really 33/33/33.
Anway all this generalization r dumb.
True, all Im trying to say is before everyone gets out the Asian games suck hammer, everyone really needs to take a look at our our games.
Yes I realise GW and the CoX string are U.S. Devs but if it was a U.S. publisher, Im sure they would have been rushed out the door incomplete. No U.S. published game has NOT been run out the door complete aside from WoW.
Argue if you like but look at our track record.
Look at Turbine. Crashed 3 MMO's in a row. Do you honestly think they will pull a solid title with a track record like that? SOE is so busy pushing incomplete garbage and ripping apart what they do have the last thing they have time for is quality control. Horizons is STILL trying to iron out the launch problems two YEARS later. The reason I bring up Horizons is because it WAS one of the most anticipated games at the time.
Yes I didn't include EVE and Ryzom because they are not U.S. made. Sure they are western but they are not U.S. either. My point was the U.S. devs need to focus a bit more on quality control. Why, aren't we all tired of paying for half baked games? Paying monthly fees for games that don't work, don't have feature that where advertised or are gutted and revamped every 6 months?
vanguard copy everquest? well yeah.... some of the people from everquest developer join vanguard project. in my opinion everquest/vanguard is ugly period. in most mmorpg i always play a female toon..... i am a straight young man... i love admiring females behind. i dont look at ugly females behind tho and thats y i dont like everquest2/vanguard.
yes i agree that koreans upcumming mmo lo0k better than western developer. in my personal opinion i like korean mmorpg better than western is cuz..... korean/asian mmorpgs tend to have more fantasy in it.... and more stylish.... even if an asian mmo do a western theme... it will still lo0k awesome! for example... lo0k at granado espada.... it is a korean mmo in a euro theme.... still lo0k awesome! asian poeple knows fantasy......
dungeons and dragons series/ world of world craft ect.... those american mmo is jus plain..... not stylish not much fantasy..... jus a simple dragon and dungeon and knight and castle and dwarf and elf!
upcumming high-budget commercial mmo im lo0king foward to is SUN, Zera, Aion and archlord.
upcumming low-budget mmo im lo0king foward to are Dekaron and Rohan
I would love to see a great Asian MMORPG come along. I think people just get a sour taste in there mouth because in the U.S. when most think of Asian MMORPG's we think of Lineage 2 and Final fantasy online. Which both have a horendous grind from hell. And I cant speak for RF online, but judging from the reviews not to mention a 35% review from PC gamer magazine it seems to follow the same lines.
And I keep hearing about lack of customization in Asian games and how it has to be this way. But the problem with that is, we dont like clones, and as long as they keep pumping out games with 2 hairstyles and 2 faces its just not going to cut it compared to games to western games once you play COH, EQ2 and others. We like to look different
Anyways the video looks great and I hope it breaks the trend, because I love the Asian artstyle.
Originally posted by NewMonster mmo im lo0king foward to is SUN, Zera, Aion and archlord. upcumming low-budget mmo im lo0king foward to are Dekaron and Rohan
Originally posted by NewMonster to OP vanguard copy everquest? well yeah.... some of the people from everquest developer join vanguard project. in my opinion everquest/vanguard is ugly period. in most mmorpg i always play a female toon..... i am a straight young man... i love admiring females behind. i dont look at ugly females behind tho and thats y i dont like everquest2/vanguard.
yes i agree that koreans upcumming mmo lo0k better than western developer. in my personal opinion i like korean mmorpg better than western is cuz..... korean/asian mmorpgs tend to have more fantasy in it.... and more stylish.... even if an asian mmo do a western theme... it will still lo0k awesome! for example... lo0k at granado espada.... it is a korean mmo in a euro theme.... still lo0k awesome! asian poeple knows fantasy...... dungeons and dragons series/ world of world craft ect.... those american mmo is jus plain..... not stylish not much fantasy..... jus a simple dragon and dungeon and knight and castle and dwarf and elf! upcumming high-budget commercial mmo im lo0king foward to is SUN, Zera, Aion and archlord. upcumming low-budget mmo im lo0king foward to are Dekaron and Rohan
Thats part of the problem with the U.S. companies. They are all hung up on making the ultimate EQ version. Vanguard even brags about this fact. EQ the way it should have been or something to that effect. How old is EQ now? And we are STILL stuck on cloning the game?
We need more fantasy based grinders with raid endgame like we need............well more fantasy based grinders with raid endgame.
While some of Vanguards ideas sound interesting, the core of the gameplay sounds like just about everything else out there. Corpse runs, hey theres an inovative feature.......Long, difficult travel, while could be interesting if done correctly, what happens if you die and you are 75% of the way to your destination? Corpse run? Will they be able to fill the game with enough content and things to do since you will have slow travel and will be stuck in areas for a longer period of time? Will the "content" be basic "Kil task"? We already know it raid endgame...there inovation. What ever happened to open ended gameplay? Why do MMO's feel the need to force the players into doing something?
OK, lets talk about this customization thing. Now you see the Asian games don't have as much customization comment alot. Here what I would say to that.
While games like EQII have very good facial customization, I agree here is where it all falls down. EQII uses the same movement animations and skeletal structure for all its races. EQII (and Vanguard) plops different heads on human bodies. So you have this awsome looking face and hair on a guy that moves the same as everyone else. Now I don't know about you, but I rarely, if ever actually see another avatars face up close. Additionally in EQII all the armors and cloths all look identical on whatever race is wearing it.
What is the result? Everyone more or less looks the same to a point. If you see a human and an elf together wearing the same outfit, guess what? You can't tell the difference unless you 1) get very very close or 2) examine them and READ what race they are. This is repeated throughout. The lizard guys bodies look and move identical to a human. They just have a lizard head popping out. Same for the Cats. And their tails just sort of "appare" out of the cloths or armor. No effort at all so the devs only needed to make one model.
SWG, now why does my Ithorian, Rhodian and Wookie all move the same as my Human? Sure they look different but what almost imeadiately crashes the emersion for me is the exact same run animation throughout.
Individual Character customization in WoW is pretty poor but its a gear based game. Your looks are defined by the gear you wear. (just like an Asian game ) 10 character in the starter zone all look pretty much the same.
Now the variety of cloths and armor may be greater but again that is only because the devs only have one human model to worry about.
In a game like L2 the variention is far less. The assortment of wearables is far less, so yes you do run into people who do look the same alot. But no more then EQII. What makes the games like L2 and FFXI different is this: movement animations are different for every race. That makes a difference. Each character has a more "unique" feel to it.
Races are also genuenly different. Look at them. They are not Humans with animal heads popped on. Each race has a unique build / look / and movement. Also games like FFXI there is just as much variety of wearables as most other games.
In most U.S. made games you get fantastic facial customization but thats more or less where it ends. AC2 actually had some very good, unique races. But surprise, surprise Turbine fubar'ed the game.
I have a question, are western mmo's battle system better than asian ones?? Whatever your answers are pls explain why. I usally enjoy pvp's that will let you own a player 10 lvls higher than you because your so damn good and not so damn high of a level.
"We feel gold selling and websites that promote it damage games like Vanguard and will do everything possible to combat it." Brad McQuaid Chairman & CEO, Sigil Games Online, Inc. Executive Producer, Vanguard: Saga of Heroes www.vanguardsoh
I've never been a big fan of Korean game's graphics (like Lineage 2). They are just...so.....anime looking to me, which I'm not big on. At any rate, the games may look OK, but it's pretty much a given that the gameplay and content will suck as usual.
Par for the course for Korean MMOs. Nothing but a mindless grindfest.
Joined 2004 - I can't believe I've been a MMORPG.com member for 20 years! Get off my lawn!
it looks like hero wich i was testing wich really sucked sorry but if all koren mmo are like hero and look like it wich this one does i really don't want to click to move and keep spamming health pills while my charecter is spamming hits.
Aion will have WASD movement to start with, and it doesn't seem like a potion spam game. the combat looks like a faster and better version of WoW.its not point & click, thats for sure
Game, you totally made my day with this OMG! So cool.. I call the caster class... >.>
The reason I think there isn't much of a grind is cause you kill everything in one area. at the same time.
Siehst du mich Erkennst du mich Ganz tief in meinem Herz ist noch ein Platz f?r dich Ich suche dich Ich sehne mich nach dem was ich geliebt hab doch ich find es nicht
I am a western game player and I wish more Korean MMO's would be translated into English. I think Lineage 2 is a gorgeous looking game and I'd like to see more Asian titles.
As for leveling treadmills, you are fooling yourself if you don't think Western MMO's don't have it. Look at Wow for example. You grind to 60 in a couple of months and then if you want to PvP you face the treadmill of all treadmills. Degrading rank! Yea! sign me up. The treadmill that never ends and you get nothing out of it other than to maintain your current rank. Also WoW has world PvP with no consequence. I am PK'd on WoW servers 1000000 times more than I ever was on a Lineage 2 server. In Lineage 2 PK has consequence. You kill someone in L2 that doesn't fight back, you turn red. PK in that game means something.
The other option you have in most other western MMO's is raiding at top level. You can raid....and raid some more...then raid more....and more raiding. After all they have to have somethign for you to do because getting to top level is so damn easy. It seems Asian gamers realize a game is more about the journey than the destination.
Western gamers are so impatient to get to top level and be top dog that they can't handle any kind of wait to get there. The only problem is, once you've arrived at top level you turn around and everyone else is top level too. So, you got to the top level only to be the same as you are at level 1. Just like everyone else. In L2 everybody might look the same but I'll guarantee you there isn't a large percentage of the population sitting at level 78.
I am not at all excited about any of the upcoming Western games. Age of Conan looks interesting but I'm not holding my breath. These game companies have a way of talking up the game when in reality it is never that good.
AC was and still is a great western made game. Leveling was not easy. The character attribute and skill diversity made it wide open. I guess games like AC where its about the journey and leveling isn't easy just don't sell well in the US. I'm pretty suprised at how well WoW does in the Asian market. I hope Asian game designers don't try to make their games to simple because of WoW's success.
Originally posted by Gameloading Aion will have WASD movement to start with, and it doesn't seem like a potion spam game. the combat looks like a faster and better version of WoW.its not point & click, thats for sure
Aion looks good, yup. I think it'll be a solid albeit flawed (but what MMORPG isn't?) game. I personally am looking forward to more upcoming Korean games then I am western - ArchLord, Aion, and 9Dragons come to mind.
/ignores anyone who says Korean games are crappy grindfests, as ignorantly enough they forget that there are thousands of gamers out there who enjoy the proverbial "grind" of Korean MMOs.
Originally posted by Gameloading Well, as the title says, I personally think the upcomming wave of Korean MMO's like Archlord, Aion and SUN look far more intresting then the new wave of western MMO's like Vanguard (YES! Finally an Everquest copy!) and Lord of the rings online, and a bunch of other titles.
here, look at the Aion E3 trailer
to me, it looks far more impressive then anything vanguard has shown.
so what do you guys think?
Is there anything to do besides combat? Because that's all the trailer shows. I don't care how spiffy it looks, I need more from a RPG than that.
If it's all combat, it'd be better off as a full-twitch shooter. Or hacker, slasher, whatever. The fun of RPGs is all the peripheral interaction with the gameworld to make the combat worthwhile, even boring old-fashioned click&wait combat. Combat alone is only fun if it's takes skill, and by that, I only mean the basics - aim, reflexes, practice, etc. What I'll look to UT2007 for, not an MMORPG.
So in that respect, Korean MMOs don't look any better to me. The MMO market looks pretty stale almost all around, but Korean MMOs look even worse.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
Comments
But I do agree Vanguard doesn't looke to different from EQ2 to me from what I have seen.
Screens from WAR look pretty good so far if that means much.
Nah its something other than location/culture.
We're not the only people who hate repetition. It's human nature to want change. "Variety is the spice of life." NOT "Variety is the spice of Americans." Everyone wants change.
So amidst the gargantuan success Korean games have achieved in Asia, to say that they're all just one big grindfest is basically saying that Koreans aren't human. Or just a bunch of psycho robots.
Now, I'm not saying Korean games don't have grind. Some Korean games DO involve more grinding than others. OH NO! That alone ruins the entire game! I hate all Korean games!
It seems to me grinding is the one big thing that people hate Korean games for. Is that all you care about? Fast leveling? Reaching max level in a month? Oh dear, you've played the game for a month and you're only at level 30. You're not willing to spend the time and energy into a character that's WORTH bragging about. A max level character in Lineage II is MUCH more to brag about than a max level in WoW. (I'm not bagging or praising either games. I personally dislike both...)
Another complaint is the fact that everyone looks the same. Then make yourself different. Invest time and energy. Get to max level. Make yourself known in-game. It takes work to be different. The same goes for real life. You can try to wear different clothes or act a certain way, but isn't that's what everyone else is doing? "You non-conformists are all alike." Forgive me for sounding cheesy, but it's not the external customization that makes the character.
And this is all regarding those Korean games you HAVE played (the ones that come to America). Don't forget, there are a buttload of MMOs in Asia you HAVEN'T seen. As much as you think you know, there's a whole 'nother WORLD of MMOs out there.
Wow... this was a lot longer than I expected.
I've been trying to tell people for months about how the new crop of Korean Games are badass; but they too busy taking a dump on my posts to even read. People on these forums are just too prejudice about anything that isn't downright and EQ clone grindfest (BTW the grind in EQ is worse then almost anything made in Korea). That video is probably closed beta/post alpha work, definetly not the finished product and it still looks like it would be fun to play with WASD control if you didn't notice and more immersive fighting. That alone should take it a notch or 2 above Lineage 2.
BTW I don't think many people understand the difference between an Asian Run company and a US Run company where they both have offices in the US. The US company is usually deadline oriented and will have whatever work is done by the deadline. The Asian run US development staff usually tries to be deadline oriented, but they will push it back if they need to make the game look just right.
but all of those games are crap or just grind fests. when you start churning out anything at that high rate, quality goes down the toilet.
Please, western games are far far from quality.
There is one big title western game that has made any headway at all in sales and thats WoW. Just about everything else has had quality issues of some sort or another.
Look on the list to the left here and find all the quality western designed games.
SWG? nope. EQII, well if they stop revamping it maybe, AC? nope - outdated they let the quality go to hell, AC2? oops nope dead, D&DO? lol not even close, Horizons? Dark and Light? Do you guys honestly think LotR is going to be a "quality" title based on Turbines record??? lol hmmmm dunno what to say here. (techically speaking Sony NA's parent company is Japanese but EQII and SWG flopped and shut down in Asia)
I'm not saying Asian games are "better" but western games have a solid problem with quality. It sucks and western companies keeping rushing out games half finished or just plain old broken.
All of the solid, quality and inovative games are not made by American companies. Or they are published by NCSoft a Korean company that ensures everything they publish at least works.
Ryzom, Eve, FFXI, L2, CoH, GW, CoV
but all of those games are crap or just grind fests. when you start churning out anything at that high rate, quality goes down the toilet.
Please, western games are far far from quality.
There is one big title western game that has made any headway at all in sales and thats WoW. Just about everything else has had quality issues of some sort or another.
Look on the list to the left here and find all the quality western designed games.
SWG? nope. EQII, well if they stop revamping it maybe, AC? nope - outdated they let the quality go to hell, AC2? oops nope dead, D&DO? lol not even close, Horizons? Dark and Light? Do you guys honestly think LotR is going to be a "quality" title based on Turbines record??? lol hmmmm dunno what to say here. (techically speaking Sony NA's parent company is Japanese but EQII and SWG flopped and shut down in Asia)
I'm not saying Asian games are "better" but western games have a solid problem with quality. It sucks and western companies keeping rushing out games half finished or just plain old broken.
All of the solid, quality and inovative games are not made by American companies. Or they are published by NCSoft a Korean company that ensures everything they publish at least works.
Ryzom, Eve, FFXI, L2, CoH, GW, CoV
Three of those titles were designed and created and made up by Western companioes. I will grant you that NCSoft is probably the most innovative MMO publisher out there, but they are not the developers.
Looking at your list its 50/50 east/west as far people actually working on the game. Well actually ryzom = french and EvE = iceland so its really 33/33/33.
Anway all this generalization r dumb.
True, all Im trying to say is before everyone gets out the Asian games suck hammer, everyone really needs to take a look at our our games.
Yes I realise GW and the CoX string are U.S. Devs but if it was a U.S. publisher, Im sure they would have been rushed out the door incomplete. No U.S. published game has NOT been run out the door complete aside from WoW.
Argue if you like but look at our track record.
Look at Turbine. Crashed 3 MMO's in a row. Do you honestly think they will pull a solid title with a track record like that? SOE is so busy pushing incomplete garbage and ripping apart what they do have the last thing they have time for is quality control. Horizons is STILL trying to iron out the launch problems two YEARS later. The reason I bring up Horizons is because it WAS one of the most anticipated games at the time.
Yes I didn't include EVE and Ryzom because they are not U.S. made. Sure they are western but they are not U.S. either. My point was the U.S. devs need to focus a bit more on quality control. Why, aren't we all tired of paying for half baked games? Paying monthly fees for games that don't work, don't have feature that where advertised or are gutted and revamped every 6 months?
to OP
vanguard copy everquest? well yeah.... some of the people from everquest developer join vanguard project. in my opinion everquest/vanguard is ugly period. in most mmorpg i always play a female toon..... i am a straight young man... i love admiring females behind. i dont look at ugly females behind tho and thats y i dont like everquest2/vanguard.
yes i agree that koreans upcumming mmo lo0k better than western developer. in my personal opinion i like korean mmorpg better than western is cuz..... korean/asian mmorpgs tend to have more fantasy in it.... and more stylish.... even if an asian mmo do a western theme... it will still lo0k awesome! for example... lo0k at granado espada.... it is a korean mmo in a euro theme.... still lo0k awesome! asian poeple knows fantasy......
dungeons and dragons series/ world of world craft ect.... those american mmo is jus plain..... not stylish not much fantasy..... jus a simple dragon and dungeon and knight and castle and dwarf and elf!
upcumming high-budget commercial mmo im lo0king foward to is SUN, Zera, Aion and archlord.
upcumming low-budget mmo im lo0king foward to are Dekaron and Rohan
I would love to see a great Asian MMORPG come along. I think people just get a sour taste in there mouth because in the U.S. when most think of Asian MMORPG's we think of Lineage 2 and Final fantasy online. Which both have a horendous grind from hell. And I cant speak for RF online, but judging from the reviews not to mention a 35% review from PC gamer magazine it seems to follow the same lines.
And I keep hearing about lack of customization in Asian games and how it has to be this way. But the problem with that is, we dont like clones, and as long as they keep pumping out games with 2 hairstyles and 2 faces its just not going to cut it compared to games to western games once you play COH, EQ2 and others. We like to look different
Anyways the video looks great and I hope it breaks the trend, because I love the Asian artstyle.
In fact, the prettier the graphs, the worse the gameplay. So far anyway.
Thats part of the problem with the U.S. companies. They are all hung up on making the ultimate EQ version. Vanguard even brags about this fact. EQ the way it should have been or something to that effect. How old is EQ now? And we are STILL stuck on cloning the game?
We need more fantasy based grinders with raid endgame like we need............well more fantasy based grinders with raid endgame.
While some of Vanguards ideas sound interesting, the core of the gameplay sounds like just about everything else out there. Corpse runs, hey theres an inovative feature.......Long, difficult travel, while could be interesting if done correctly, what happens if you die and you are 75% of the way to your destination? Corpse run? Will they be able to fill the game with enough content and things to do since you will have slow travel and will be stuck in areas for a longer period of time? Will the "content" be basic "Kil task"? We already know it raid endgame...there inovation. What ever happened to open ended gameplay? Why do MMO's feel the need to force the players into doing something?
OK, lets talk about this customization thing. Now you see the Asian games don't have as much customization comment alot. Here what I would say to that.
While games like EQII have very good facial customization, I agree here is where it all falls down. EQII uses the same movement animations and skeletal structure for all its races. EQII (and Vanguard) plops different heads on human bodies. So you have this awsome looking face and hair on a guy that moves the same as everyone else. Now I don't know about you, but I rarely, if ever actually see another avatars face up close. Additionally in EQII all the armors and cloths all look identical on whatever race is wearing it.
What is the result? Everyone more or less looks the same to a point. If you see a human and an elf together wearing the same outfit, guess what? You can't tell the difference unless you 1) get very very close or 2) examine them and READ what race they are. This is repeated throughout. The lizard guys bodies look and move identical to a human. They just have a lizard head popping out. Same for the Cats. And their tails just sort of "appare" out of the cloths or armor. No effort at all so the devs only needed to make one model.
SWG, now why does my Ithorian, Rhodian and Wookie all move the same as my Human? Sure they look different but what almost imeadiately crashes the emersion for me is the exact same run animation throughout.
Individual Character customization in WoW is pretty poor but its a gear based game. Your looks are defined by the gear you wear. (just like an Asian game ) 10 character in the starter zone all look pretty much the same.
Now the variety of cloths and armor may be greater but again that is only because the devs only have one human model to worry about.
In a game like L2 the variention is far less. The assortment of wearables is far less, so yes you do run into people who do look the same alot. But no more then EQII. What makes the games like L2 and FFXI different is this: movement animations are different for every race. That makes a difference. Each character has a more "unique" feel to it.
Races are also genuenly different. Look at them. They are not Humans with animal heads popped on. Each race has a unique build / look / and movement. Also games like FFXI there is just as much variety of wearables as most other games.
In most U.S. made games you get fantastic facial customization but thats more or less where it ends. AC2 actually had some very good, unique races. But surprise, surprise Turbine fubar'ed the game.
If it's got an online store, it's gonna suck.
You can't expect a subscription for trash.
"We feel gold selling and websites that promote it damage games like Vanguard and will do everything possible to combat it."
Brad McQuaid
Chairman & CEO, Sigil Games Online, Inc.
Executive Producer, Vanguard: Saga of Heroes
www.vanguardsoh
I've never been a big fan of Korean game's graphics (like Lineage 2). They are just...so.....anime looking to me, which I'm not big on. At any rate, the games may look OK, but it's pretty much a given that the gameplay and content will suck as usual.
Par for the course for Korean MMOs. Nothing but a mindless grindfest.
Joined 2004 - I can't believe I've been a MMORPG.com member for 20 years! Get off my lawn!
it looks like hero wich i was testing wich really sucked sorry but if all koren mmo are like hero and look like it wich this one does i really don't want to click to move and keep spamming health pills while my charecter is spamming hits.
Aion will have WASD movement to start with, and it doesn't seem like a potion spam game. the combat looks like a faster and better version of WoW.its not point & click, thats for sure
only problem grinding
and we donot like to look the same at each lvl
Have no fear, Xru is here.
The reason I think there isn't much of a grind is cause you kill everything in one area.
Siehst du mich
Erkennst du mich
Ganz tief in meinem Herz
ist noch ein Platz f?r dich
Ich suche dich
Ich sehne mich
nach dem was ich geliebt hab
doch ich find es nicht
As for leveling treadmills, you are fooling yourself if you don't think Western MMO's don't have it. Look at Wow for example. You grind to 60 in a couple of months and then if you want to PvP you face the treadmill of all treadmills. Degrading rank! Yea! sign me up. The treadmill that never ends and you get nothing out of it other than to maintain your current rank. Also WoW has world PvP with no consequence. I am PK'd on WoW servers 1000000 times more than I ever was on a Lineage 2 server. In Lineage 2 PK has consequence. You kill someone in L2 that doesn't fight back, you turn red. PK in that game means something.
The other option you have in most other western MMO's is raiding at top level. You can raid....and raid some more...then raid more....and more raiding. After all they have to have somethign for you to do because getting to top level is so damn easy. It seems Asian gamers realize a game is more about the journey than the destination.
Western gamers are so impatient to get to top level and be top dog that they can't handle any kind of wait to get there. The only problem is, once you've arrived at top level you turn around and everyone else is top level too. So, you got to the top level only to be the same as you are at level 1. Just like everyone else. In L2 everybody might look the same but I'll guarantee you there isn't a large percentage of the population sitting at level 78.
I am not at all excited about any of the upcoming Western games. Age of Conan looks interesting but I'm not holding my breath. These game companies have a way of talking up the game when in reality it is never that good.
AC was and still is a great western made game. Leveling was not easy. The character attribute and skill diversity made it wide open. I guess games like AC where its about the journey and leveling isn't easy just don't sell well in the US. I'm pretty suprised at how well WoW does in the Asian market. I hope Asian game designers don't try to make their games to simple because of WoW's success.
Aion looks good, yup. I think it'll be a solid albeit flawed (but what MMORPG isn't?) game. I personally am looking forward to more upcoming Korean games then I am western - ArchLord, Aion, and 9Dragons come to mind.
/ignores anyone who says Korean games are crappy grindfests, as ignorantly enough they forget that there are thousands of gamers out there who enjoy the proverbial "grind" of Korean MMOs.
If it's all combat, it'd be better off as a full-twitch shooter. Or hacker, slasher, whatever. The fun of RPGs is all the peripheral interaction with the gameworld to make the combat worthwhile, even boring old-fashioned click&wait combat. Combat alone is only fun if it's takes skill, and by that, I only mean the basics - aim, reflexes, practice, etc. What I'll look to UT2007 for, not an MMORPG.
So in that respect, Korean MMOs don't look any better to me. The MMO market looks pretty stale almost all around, but Korean MMOs look even worse.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
People complain about grinding and clones, because that's all they're looking at.
"Hey, the game has some grind. Oh, and we kinda look the same. INSTA-SUCK."
So if a game has no grind and everyone looks completely different, does that make it INSTA-GREAT?